# Next week England will begin jabbing 5-11 year olds.



## chic (Mar 29, 2022)

Title. I think this is really sad and irresponsible since children, unless compromised, probably would not catch covid anyway and if they did their immune systems could handle it with no ill effects. This is not the black death or anything similar. How do our friends in England feel about vaccinating kids? Why is this happening in an otherwise enlightened country like yours?


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## hawkdon (Mar 29, 2022)

The govenor of missouri said about the same thing as you as
the kids cannot get very sick......2yrs later the death rate of
kids is still going on.......


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## spectratg (Mar 29, 2022)

chic said:


> Title. I think this is really sad and irresponsible since children, unless compromised, probably would not catch covid anyway and if they did their immune systems could handle it with no ill effects. This is not the black death or anything similar. How do our friends in England feel about vaccinating kids? Why is this happening in an otherwise enlightened country like yours?


My four oldest grandchildren are all in this age group and received the two-dose vaccine last year.  I was greatly in favor of them doing so. None of them have gotten covid, although the parents (both vaccinated and boosted) of two of them did.  On the other hand, my 2-year old granddaughter (unvaccinated) got covid earlier this year at daycare and brought it home to her parents.  The baby barely noticed her very mild symptoms.  Her parents were both vaccinated and boosted--my son-in-law had mild to moderate symptoms; my daughter (who has a pre-existing condition) had more severe symptoms, but has recovered for the most part.  They will get the baby vaccinated as soon as she is eligible.

Life is a crap shoot.  I think that, in general, the risk from getting the vaccine is lower than the risk of not getting the vaccine, *for any age group.* This is true for any vaccine, measles-mumps-rubella for example.  Of course, if you or your child or your grandchild is one of the unlucky ones, you would probably think otherwise.  The best that we can do is a risk-benefit analysis, based on the best scientific facts available.


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## Silent Rose (Mar 29, 2022)

School age kids/Day Care Children get sick a lot mostly because they are around other kids in school with runny noses and coughing without covering their mouths and stuff like that. Honestly, I don't think any of that will change much with giving this population the Covid Vaccine. It may be something that might prevent them from getting extremely ill and possibly dying from it, I don't know, but I still see kids getting sick because children in this age range don't use the proper hygiene methods. Unless the parents/teachers are on top of it constantly they don't wash their hands properly, they always seem to have a runny nose, most don't properly cover their mouths when coughing. 

I suppose they are attempting to get as many people vaccinated as they can, but I am not sure how effective for this age group and even younger when it gets to that the vaccine will actually be.


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## chic (Mar 29, 2022)

I'm curious because I thought England was dropping all mandates. So, why are they vaccinating little kids whose immune systems will never develop properly if there are no pathogens for them to attack?


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## chic (Mar 29, 2022)

hawkdon said:


> The govenor of missouri said about the same thing as you as
> the kids cannot get very sick......2yrs later the death rate of
> kids is still going on.......


Kids 5-11 are dying in Missouri? Funny I haven't heard a thing about that.


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## jimintoronto (Mar 29, 2022)

chic said:


> Title. I think this is really sad and irresponsible since children, unless compromised, probably would not catch covid anyway and if they did their immune systems could handle it with no ill effects. This is not the black death or anything similar. How do our friends in England feel about vaccinating kids? Why is this happening in an otherwise enlightened country like yours?


Did you miss the number of Americans who DIED as a result of what you call " no big deal " ? At last count it was over 800,000 dead Americans . At what point  will you take this seriously ? Of all of the nations on this earth, your country leads in the number of dead as a result of Covid 19 and it's variants. I bet that.......as a child you were vaccinated for a whole range of diseases, were you not ? To take just ONE example, polio has been virtually wiped out around the world, through vaccinations. JimB.


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## chic (Mar 30, 2022)

jimintoronto said:


> Did you miss the number of Americans who DIED as a result of what you call " no big deal " ? At last count it was over 800,000 dead Americans . At what point  will you take this seriously ? Of all of the nations on this earth, your country leads in the number of dead as a result of Covid 19 and it's variants. I bet that.......as a child you were vaccinated for a whole range of diseases, were you not ? To take just ONE example, polio has been virtually wiped out around the world, through vaccinations. JimB.


Stop  yelling  at  me !

I never called the virus no big deal. But it's not bubonic plague that the world needs to be shut down forever over it. Yes, I was vaccinated as a child with proper vaccines that had been tested for YEARS. Not weeks. There is no comparison.


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## Silent Rose (Mar 30, 2022)

Here is huge problem that we have in just these last two posts that I read and I do not like to point out people directly, but here I will do so.

#1 over reaction and yelling at someone should never happen. Sure Covid has caused the death of many people in the world and that is horrible. I believe everyone is aware of that. There is no need to yell at somewhat over that.

#2 misrepresentation of some facts. Covid has been around way before Covid was a huge issue in this world and has been researched as such not for just weeks but for many years. So to think that all these vaccines came out of research in weeks is not true at all.

I think the bottom line with all of this is people need to just start looking at this and judging it for themselves what they want to do and leave it at that. They need to leave the other person out of it and the confrontations and just stick to their plan of action.


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## jimintoronto (Mar 30, 2022)

chic said:


> Stop  yelling  at  me !
> 
> I never called the virus no big deal. But it's not bubonic plague that the world needs to be shut down forever over it. Yes, I was vaccinated as a child with proper vaccines that had been tested for YEARS. Not weeks. There is no comparison.


You mentioned the bubonic plague twice. Perhaps you should read about it. This link is informative. The FIRST bubonic plague ran from 1346 to 1353 and it killed an estimated 75 million people, to perhaps as many as 200 million people in Asia, Africa, and Europe. link     Black Death - Wikipedia JImB.


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## hollydolly (Mar 30, 2022)

chic said:


> I'm curious because I thought England was dropping all mandates. So, why are they vaccinating little kids whose immune systems will never develop properly if there are no pathogens for them to attack?


I hadn't heard they were vaccinating kids from next week...


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## Murrmurr (Mar 30, 2022)

chic said:


> I'm curious because I thought England was dropping all mandates. So, why are they vaccinating little kids whose immune systems will never develop properly if there are no pathogens for them to attack?


Chic, I don't believe the kids vaccine is mandated. They announced that it's available, they strongly recommend it for children with comorbidities, and they said you should discuss it with your child's pediatrician. 

There's an article in the British Medical Journal that shows all the child vaccine injury data and analyses, and they recommend it only for children w/comorbidity and/or under age 11.


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## Murrmurr (Mar 30, 2022)

hawkdon said:


> The govenor of missouri said about the same thing as you as
> the kids cannot get very sick......2yrs later the death rate of
> kids is still going on.......


Kids also die from the flu every year, and those numbers were higher last year if I remember right.


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## Remy (Mar 30, 2022)

Murrmurr said:


> Kids also die from the flu every year, and those numbers were higher last year if I remember right.


I hadn't had the flu in years and the way I felt Monday (gratefully this was rather short for the worst of it) I was wondering if it's the flu that will get me someday.


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## Murrmurr (Mar 30, 2022)

Remy said:


> I hadn't had the flu in years and the way I felt Monday (gratefully this was rather short for the worst of it) I was wondering if it's the flu that will get me someday.


Same here. I caught the flu once when I was 30-something and had to take a few days off work. I've never had a flu shot.

I've read that the covid vaccine also protects you from the flu, but I forget where I read it so not sure if it was a reliable source.


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## Remy (Mar 30, 2022)

Murrmurr said:


> Same here. I caught the flu once when I was 30-something and had to take a few days off work. I've never had a flu shot.
> 
> I've read that the covid vaccine also protects you from the flu, but I forget where I read it so not sure if it was a reliable source.


I wear a mask at work and work part time. The flu was going around work and I guess it still is. I got stuck with a double shift Saturday and we've been able to go down to the blue surgical masks. At this point I wish I'd kept wearing the n95.

I hadn't heard about the covid shot protection. I'm vaxed and boosted and probably won't get the second one unless it becomes required by work which it eventually could be. All the others are.


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## Don M. (Mar 30, 2022)

chic said:


> Kids 5-11 are dying in Missouri? Funny I haven't heard a thing about that.


I haven't seen any data related to "deaths by age", but the highest number by age of those "getting" Covid seems to be children between the ages of 10 to 19.....probably due to their interactions with each other.

https://health.mo.gov/living/healthcondiseases/communicable/novel-coronavirus/cases-by-age.php


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## Sunny (Mar 30, 2022)

Isn't there some kind of heart disease that it can cause in children?


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## win231 (Mar 30, 2022)

chic said:


> I'm curious because I thought England was dropping all mandates. So, why are they vaccinating little kids whose immune systems will never develop properly if there are no pathogens for them to attack?


^^^^ Good question from a thinking person.


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## win231 (Mar 30, 2022)

Sunny said:


> Isn't there some kind of heart disease that it can cause in children?


Yes, much like some kids who died of an infection after scraping their knee.
And that woman who swam in a lake & had to have her leg amputated at the hip when some type of bacteria in the water infected her leg & caused necrosis.
There are rare things that do happen sometimes.  That doesn't justify a useless vaccine.


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## Silent Rose (Mar 30, 2022)

win231 said:


> That doesn't justify a useless vaccine.


By chance are you a Doctor or a Retired Doctor or a Medical Expert in the field of Infectious Diseases?


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## Tish (Mar 30, 2022)

@chic over here they are recommending that children aged between 5 - 11 be vaccinated but as far as I know it is not mandated.

My daughter has all her children vaccinated including her 10-year-old, as he is Asthmatic.
We have had a few young people die from covid over here between the ages of 18 months old and 5 years old. 

The latest young death was a 2-year-old a week ago.


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## chic (Mar 30, 2022)

Remy said:


> I wear a mask at work and work part time. The flu was going around work and I guess it still is. I got stuck with a double shift Saturday and we've been able to go down to the blue surgical masks. At this point I wish I'd kept wearing the n95.
> 
> I hadn't heard about the covid shot protection. I'm vaxed and boosted and probably won't get the second one unless it becomes required by work which it eventually could be. All the others are.


It won't be mandated where I live. Is it different in CA.?


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## chic (Mar 30, 2022)

I'm curious because England said they were moving forward from covid and then dropped all mandates etc. BUT they are proceeding with vaxxing kids below the age of consent. How is this moving forward  from covid? To my mind moving forward would be treating covid as endemic. Not by vaccinating healthy children at little risk from the disease.


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## chic (Mar 30, 2022)

hollydolly said:


> I hadn't heard they were vaccinating kids from next week...


Yes, they are Hols.


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## win231 (Mar 30, 2022)

Silent Rose said:


> By chance are you a Doctor or a Retired Doctor or a Medical Expert in the field of Infectious Diseases?


Your question reminds me of a time years ago when TV Repairmen made house calls.  They'd pick up your TV, take it to their shop & bring it back repaired.
One electrician picked up our TV & when he brought it back, I turned it on & the picture was still bad.  I showed him the picture & he asked me, _"Are you an electrician?"_
I said, "No, but I don't have to be;  I have two eyes that work fine & I can see that you didn't repair it."

Thinkers use logic - which doesn't require a degree.


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## chic (Mar 30, 2022)

Silent Rose said:


> Here is huge problem that we have in just these last two posts that I read and I do not like to point out people directly, but here I will do so.
> 
> #1 over reaction and yelling at someone should never happen. Sure Covid has caused the death of many people in the world and that is horrible. I believe everyone is aware of that. There is no need to yell at somewhat over that.
> 
> ...


The so called vaccines, mRNA technology, has been around for some time but not intended to treat aerosol viruses through mass inoculations of entire populations as we are seeing.

It's not the same as vaccines of old at all. This "vaccine" is more of a gene therapy whose name was changed to make it more appealing to the masses.


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## win231 (Mar 30, 2022)

Silent Rose said:


> Here is huge problem that we have in just these last two posts that I read and I do not like to point out people directly, but here I will do so.
> 
> #1 over reaction and yelling at someone should never happen. Sure Covid has caused the death of many people in the world and that is horrible. I believe everyone is aware of that. There is no need to yell at somewhat over that.
> 
> ...


B-B-B-But some people's confidence is threatened when others don't do as they do - especially when their confidence was already shaky to begin with.  That's where the anger comes from.
And, (for some people), being a put-down artist is the only way for them to feel good about themselves.


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## Remy (Mar 30, 2022)

chic said:


> It won't be mandated where I live. Is it different in CA.?


The mandate was with my employer. When the first covid vaccine mandate (at work) went into place we lost about 5 employees. Two eventually got vaxed. Then my employer mandated the booster. I won't get another booster unless and/or until they mandate that.


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## Silent Rose (Mar 30, 2022)

win231 said:


> Your question reminds me of a time years ago when TV Repairmen made house calls.  They'd pick up your TV, take it to their shop & bring it back repaired.
> One electrician picked up our TV & when he brought it back, I turned it on & the picture was still bad.  I showed him the picture & he asked me, _"Are you an electrician?"_
> I said, "No, but I don't have to be;  I have two eyes that work fine & I can see that you didn't repair it."
> 
> Thinkers use logic - which doesn't require a degree.


Not exactly the response I was thinking I was going to get in a story form as my question was not being some smart ass question or anything. I was honestly seriously inquiring because that is a rather bold statement you made. Regardless, from your response I get what you are saying and respect that. 



win231 said:


> B-B-B-But some people's confidence is threatened when others don't do as they do - especially when their confidence was already shaky to begin with.  That's where the anger comes from.
> And, (for some people), being a put-down artist is the only way for them to feel good about themselves.


But did not you just do the same thing with this said post towards the person who originally yelled by saying they were a put down artist?


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## Silent Rose (Mar 30, 2022)

chic said:


> The so called vaccines, mRNA technology, has been around for some time but not intended to treat aerosol viruses through mass inoculations of entire populations as we are seeing.
> 
> It's not the same as vaccines of old at all. This "vaccine" is more of a gene therapy whose name was changed to make it more appealing to the masses.


But you do not not feel that they have been working on these sorts of vaccines for like you stated a "few weeks" before that and just revised things from the research that they had been doing on these sorts of vaccines all that time? That is certainly your choice to believe that and  it is understandable to be concerned if you feel that way about that. I am not disputing that at all. I know if I felt that something came out without adequate research and trials done then I would be very suspect as well. So I am once again going to say this,  that this is your view and it is not my place to say you are wrong. The same that I have my view on it as well.


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## spectratg (Mar 30, 2022)

Just got word today that the retirement community where I live will be offering the fourth Pfizer shot (aka second booster) Friday of next week (April 7).  I hope to be first in line!   

We all need to do our own risk benefit analysis.  So this is my decision.


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## Warrigal (Mar 30, 2022)

spectratg said:


> Just got word today that the retirement community where I live will be offering the fourth Pfizer shot (aka second booster) Friday of next week (April 7).  I hope to be first in line!
> 
> We all need to do our own risk benefit analysis.  So this is my decision.


I  will be eligible for the second booster soon and as we are moving into Winter I will line up for my 'flu booster and Covid shot as soon as my GP has them available.

After a late start the campaign to have school children 6 - 11 years vaccinated is under way. (Australia).
Schools are struggling because so many children are at home isolating and the same goes for the teaching staff. After 2 years of disruption of education, any action to bring things back to normal is important. 

Preschool children are still unvaccinated. 
My 2 yo great grandson has been infected but recovered well. 
Both of his parents were also infected but both are fully vaccinated and had only mild symptoms.


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## Sunny (Mar 31, 2022)

I don't think the second booster is available yet where I live. But there was an interesting article in the paper about it. It seemed to be saying that no one is sure when is the best time to get the second booster. Some people are waiting for a new surge, maybe next winter, when the booster will be much more needed. 

If we've had both vaccine shots, plus a booster, we are pretty well protected against the life-threatening form of the disease, at least for a while. It may turn out to be a required yearly booster every winter, and people will just automatically get it yearly, as many of us do with a flu shot.


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## Silent Rose (Mar 31, 2022)

Sunny said:


> I don't think the second booster is available yet where I live. But there was an interesting article in the paper about it. It seemed to be saying that no one is sure when is the best time to get the second booster. Some people are waiting for a new surge, maybe next winter, when the booster will be much more needed.
> 
> If we've had both vaccine shots, plus a booster, we are pretty well protected against the life-threatening form of the disease, at least for a while. It may turn out to be a required yearly booster every winter, and people will just automatically get it yearly, as many of us do with a flu shot.


I also live in Maryland and have not seen anything about the 2nd booster. 

I also agree that this one is a wait and see for me. I also have the first two vaccines and the first booster so I feel like I am pretty covered right now. If another surge comes about than I will think about getting the 2nd booster. I also think you are correct with this becoming a yearly vaccine.


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## spectratg (Mar 31, 2022)

Silent Rose said:


> I also live in Maryland and have not seen anything about the 2nd booster.
> 
> I also agree that this one is a wait and see for me. I also have the first two vaccines and the first booster so I feel like I am pretty covered right now. If another surge comes about than I will think about getting the 2nd booster. I also think you are correct with this becoming a yearly vaccine.


My ACTS retirement community in Maryland contracts directly with CVS for the Pfizer vaccine.  As soon as the FDA approved a second booster, they were ready to start signing us up.


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## win231 (Mar 31, 2022)

spectratg said:


> Just got word today that the retirement community where I live will be offering the fourth Pfizer shot (aka second booster) Friday of next week (April 7).  I hope to be first in line!
> 
> We all need to do our own risk benefit analysis.  So this is my decision.


^^^^ Bingo.  I support anyone's decision, even though I chose not to have any Covid vaccines.  I drove elderly friends to get their vaccines.
It shouldn't be any different for those who do choose the vaccines, but unfortunately, it isn't.  Some people need to put others down to feel good about themselves.  Too bad......for them.


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## Silent Rose (Mar 31, 2022)

win231 said:


> ^^^^ Bingo.  I support anyone's decision, even though I chose not to have any Covid vaccines.  I drove elderly friends to get their vaccines.
> It shouldn't be any different for those who do choose the vaccines, but unfortunately, it isn't.  Some people need to put others down to feel good about themselves.  Too bad......for them.


I agree with you about helping people, but you seem to make a lot of accusations and stereotypes wrapping people into a group when that is not the case for everyone. I have chosen to receive the vaccine and booster and I also have chosen to not pass judgment on others who have not. So your statement does not include me and I imagine many others as well. 

I feel these sorts of comments add just as much to the problem as anything else. If people would just accept one another's decisions and leave it be whether it is making these accusations and stereotypes that you are making or putting people down or whatever than a lot of this tension over all of this wouldn't be here.


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## win231 (Mar 31, 2022)

Silent Rose said:


> I agree with you about helping people, but you seem to make a lot of accusations and stereotypes wrapping people into a group when that is not the case for everyone. I have chosen to receive the vaccine and booster and I also have chosen to not pass judgment on others who have not. So your statement does not include me and I imagine many others as well.
> 
> I feel these sorts of comments add just as much to the problem as anything else. If people would just accept one another's decisions and leave it be whether it is making these accusations and stereotypes that you are making or putting people down or whatever than a lot of this tension over all of this wouldn't be here.


I suggest you read my comments more carefully.  You'll note that I said "_Some_ people need to put others down to feel good about themselves." 
_"Some"_ does not mean _"All."_
And, since you're rather new to the group, you may not have had a chance to review some posts from _some_ members here who are the put-down artists I'm referring to.


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## chic (Mar 31, 2022)

Silent Rose said:


> But you do not not feel that they have been working on these sorts of vaccines for like you stated a "few weeks" before that and just revised things from the research that they had been doing on these sorts of vaccines all that time? That is certainly your choice to believe that and  it is understandable to be concerned if you feel that way about that. I am not disputing that at all. I know if I felt that something came out without adequate research and trials done then I would be very suspect as well. So I am once again going to say this,  that this is your view rand it is not my place to say you are wrong. The same that I have my view on it as well.


The Pfizer clinical trial data was 20,000 people for 2 weeks. (Someone correct me if I'm wrong) but it's hard to get info because of all the censorship on this issue. Moderna, J&J, and Astra Zenica have not released any data that I have heard of.


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## Silent Rose (Mar 31, 2022)

chic said:


> The Pfizer clinical trial data was 20,000 people for 2 weeks. (Someone correct me if I'm wrong) but it's hard to get info because of all the censorship on this issue. Moderna, J&J, and Astra Zenica have not released any data that I have heard of.


I don't doubt the trial and time frame that you are stating. What I am saying is prior to that do you believe these companies were not working on something knowing that these sorts of viruses could easily pop up? These people are experts on these infectious diseases and couldn't have just started something and in 2 weeks time had it all together. They might be experts in this field, but I don't know if coming up with something from scratch that quickly and then testing it out is even possible. I am far from an expert on this as I can probably assume you are as well so this is all just going on opinions or what you may have read from something else and as you stated a lot of this is censored.


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## Silent Rose (Mar 31, 2022)

win231 said:


> I suggest you read my comments more carefully.  You'll note that I said "_Some_ people need to put others down to feel good about themselves."
> _"Some"_ does not mean _"All."_
> And, since you're rather new to the group, you may not have had a chance to review some posts from _some_ members here who are the put-down artists I'm referring to.


I also did not say anything about all as well. I am just one of those people not everyone. If you are referring to me saying it is not the case of everyone, I was not referring to you as saying all people who wear masks put down people. I knew exactly what you meant that some do, but I am some of those people who do not choose to do such that and when comments are made such as the one you made all it does is stir up tension with this entire thing. That was the purpose of my post. 

I also never said that putting down people is the correct way to handle this sort of situation because it is not and I pointed that out in another post I made in another thread. I even mentioned in this thread in the previous post that sort of action is not right. It seems you overlooked that as well. 

Like I have been saying since the day I arrived on this site, I do not have any problems with people who wear masks or elect not to wear them. People who are vaccinated or who elect not to be vaccinated. The major problem with all of this is these sort of comments that continue the tension between the two groups whether it is the sort of comment you have made or the put down comments made by someone else. It does no good for the situation.


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## win231 (Mar 31, 2022)

Silent Rose said:


> I also did not say anything about all as well. I am just one of those people not everyone. If you are referring to me saying it is not the case of everyone, I was not referring to you as saying all people who wear masks put down people. I knew exactly what you meant that some do, but I am some of those people who do not choose to do such that and when comments are made such as the one you made all it does is stir up tension with this entire thing. That was the purpose of my post.
> 
> I also never said that putting down people is the correct way to handle this sort of situation because it is not and I pointed that out in another post I made in another thread. I even mentioned in this thread in the previous post that sort of action is not right. It seems you overlooked that as well.
> 
> Like I have been saying since the day I arrived on this site, I do not have any problems with people who wear masks or elect not to wear them. People who are vaccinated or who elect not to be vaccinated. The major problem with all of this is these sort of comments that continue the tension between the two groups whether it is the sort of comment you have made or the put down comments made by someone else. It does no good for the situation.


I overlooked nothing.  Here's where the problem is:  (your quote)  _"You seem to make a lot of accusations and stereotypes wrapping people into a group when that is not the case for everyone."   _
And that's also what causes the tension.
Just a FYI:  It would be better to admit that you misread or misinterpreted.


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## Silent Rose (Mar 31, 2022)

win231 said:


> I overlooked nothing.  Here's where the problem is:  (your quote)  _"You seem to make a lot of accusations and stereotypes wrapping people into a group when that is not the case for everyone."   _
> And that's also what causes the tension.
> Just a FYI:  It would be better to admit that you misread or misinterpreted.


It isn't that difficult to comprehend what the first statement meant. Wrapping people into a group and it is not the case for everyone. Meaning not everyone. All I was stating is I am not in that statement that you made. Plain and Simple.

The next line you once again left out a major part of what I posted. The entire statement was this, "If people would just accept one another's decisions and leave it be whether it is making these accusations and stereotypes that you are making *or putting people down* or whatever than a lot of this tension over all of this wouldn't be here."


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