# Let's legalize prostitution now!



## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

With everything else being legalized we should decriminalize this oldest of professions.  We could tax it, license it, and provide health inspections.  The time has come to stop arresting everybody involved; twenty-two men were arrested over the weekend in a sting operation here.  Couldn't the police be spending their time on more important activities?  Makes sense to me and I'm sure to you...


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## hollydolly (Apr 7, 2015)

It does to me too..

In countries such as Holland, Germany and Switzerland   licensed prostitutes have to undergo regular medical checks, and pay taxes on their earnings.


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## QuickSilver (Apr 7, 2015)

I'm sure there are those... like you... Ralphy, who feel it's a "victimless crime"  however, it's not..   Women are often brutalized and taken advantage of particularly by pimps.. not to mentiion sex slave trafficing of underage girls.  Simply not arresting them will not fix all the problems related to prostitution


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

QS, a lot of the issues that you mentioned would be removed by government intervention...


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## Ameriscot (Apr 7, 2015)

I agree it should be legalized but only in regulated places where the ladies are well taken care of and safe.


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## Ms Sam (Apr 7, 2015)

I'm for legalizing.  . EVERYTHING.


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

Even child porn?


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## Ms Sam (Apr 7, 2015)

No.....of course not.


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## Ken N Tx (Apr 7, 2015)

Hmmmm..Someplace else to go if it lasts more than 4 hours...

Covered by Medicare?????


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## Ms Sam (Apr 7, 2015)

"Ralphy" ,,,  no child porn, no beastiality, everything must be with CONSENTING ADULTS.  OVER 21.

Would you consider participating in child porn in any way shape or form?  Ewwwww.......


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

Glad to see we are looking at legalization realistically.  Now, what about flashers?


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## QuickSilver (Apr 7, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> QS, a lot of the issues that you mentioned would be removed by government intervention...




Oh... you mean issues like poverty, poor education, and addiction?   COOL!!!

Because it's THESE issues that drive women to prostitution.   I hardly think anyone aspires to be a prostitute, but the hopeless situations of their lives make them easy prey.   I would say ONLY the women who ENJOY prostitution and feel wonderful about their profession should be legalized.   Find some of those..


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

There are a lot women that like prostitution as the pay is good and the hours are reasonable...


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## QuickSilver (Apr 7, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> There are a lot women that like prostitution as the pay is good and the hours are reasonable...




I suppose there are some of those.... but hardly enough to meet the demand I'm sure.


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## Ameriscot (Apr 7, 2015)

QuickSilver said:


> I suppose there are some of those.... but hardly enough to meet the demand I'm sure.



I have to agree there are probably very few who actually like having sex with guys they wouldn't go near if it wasn't for money.


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

Well, probably, as men have their needs that have to be satisfied that are much stronger than women's...


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## QuickSilver (Apr 7, 2015)

Ameriscot said:


> I have to agree there are probably very few who actually like having sex with guys they wouldn't go near if it wasn't for money.



That was my point...  legalization does nothing to alleviate the conditions that drive women to prostitution. Hopelessness, poverty, illiteracy, addiction..  In fact, legalizing it may draw even more women to it..  It will not solve the abuse these women get on a daily basis, from pimps.. AND from Johns.   It may solve the disease transmission,  however addicts make bad decisions.. use dirty needles etc.. so contract HIV and Hepatitis  at a larger number.   Pulling their prostitute membership card won't stop them from being prostitutes and spreading diseases..    I still contend these women are victims... It's not a victimless crime. 

NOW don't get me wrong...  I'm far from a puritan or religious zealot...  I'm thinking of the realities of prostitution... not the glamorized Irma L'Duece portrayal


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

If I had been born a woman I might have made it a career choice...


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## Ameriscot (Apr 7, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> If I had been born a woman I might have made it a career choice...



Not surprised.


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

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## Ameriscot (Apr 7, 2015)

QuickSilver said:


> That was my point...  legalization does nothing to alleviate the conditions that drive women to prostitution. Hopelessness, poverty, illiteracy, addiction..  In fact, legalizing it may draw even more women to it..  It will not solve the abuse these women get on a daily basis, from pimps.. AND from Johns.   It may solve the disease transmission,  however addicts make bad decisions.. use dirty needles etc.. so contract HIV and Hepatitis  at a larger number.   Pulling their prostitute membership card won't stop them from being prostitutes and spreading diseases..    I still contend these women are victims... It's not a victimless crime.
> 
> NOW don't get me wrong...  I'm far from a puritan or religious zealot...  I'm thinking of the realities of prostitution... not the glamorized Irma L'Duece portrayal



I don't really know the answer.  I know the reasons most become prostitutes that you stated are not going away anytime soon, unfortunately.  I don't really know what has happened to street prostitutes in places where it's legal and well regulated.  Amsterdam, somewhere near Vegas, etc.


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

Of course I would only be a high class escort...


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## Ameriscot (Apr 7, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> Of course I would only be a high class escort...



Of course.  One of those $1,000 a night ones.


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## QuickSilver (Apr 7, 2015)

I think that when a lot of people think of prostitution, they tend to think of the high priced Call Girls... the Escorts... and the Hollywood Madam.  The $1,000 a night club..  not the poor woman degraded in an alley for $2.     I'm not totally against legalization, but the proceeds need to go toward helping the women, not into the tax coffers or some politicians campaign fund.


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

Well we have legalized gambling with the casinos donating some of their profits to help organizations that help gambling addicts.  This model could work with prostitution too it would seem...


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## Ameriscot (Apr 7, 2015)

QuickSilver said:


> I think that when a lot of people think of prostitution, they tend to think of the high priced Call Girls... the Escorts... and the Hollywood Madam.  The $1,000 a night club..  not the poor woman degraded in an alley for $2.     I'm not totally against legalization, but the proceeds need to go toward helping the women, not into the tax coffers or some politicians campaign fund.



True.  The income taxes paid on the earnings of legal prostitutes and the business they work from could go into education or training in something else.  

Yes, I usually think of the ones on the street like runaway teenagers who can't do anything else.  They are the ones that really suffer.


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## QuickSilver (Apr 7, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> Of course I would only be a high class escort...



Why do I think the $2 in the alley wouldn't be without consideration either.


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

Because I would have been fabulously beautiful and, therefore, would have been in demand by fabulously wealthy clients...


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## QuickSilver (Apr 7, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> Because I would have been fabulously beautiful and, therefore, would have been in demand by fabulously wealthy clients...



Oh ok.... glad you've cleared that up


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

Imagine me as Julia Roberts in her prime...:love_heart:


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## Warrigal (Apr 7, 2015)

Brothels operate legally in NSW. I haven't seen girls standing on street corners for years now.
The brothels are discreet but I suspect there are a lot of Asian girls trafficked into the country.
They think they are going to work in restaurants until they get here, then their passports are confiscated 
and they have to service many men per day to pay off what they owe their traffickers.

It's nothing more than ****** slavery for a lot of vulnerable women.


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## Debby (Apr 7, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> Glad to see we are looking at legalization realistically.  Now, what about flashers?





No because one (or more) of the individuals involved are not consenting.


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

Dame, why aren't your gendarmes working to stop this?


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

Deb, you are right.  Flashers should get permission before they open their raincoats...


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## QuickSilver (Apr 7, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> Deb, you are right.  Flashers should get permission before they open their raincoats...


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## Warrigal (Apr 7, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> Dame, why aren't your gendarmes working to stop this?



We have a great system. 
If the girls make a complaint to the police, the brothel is raided but the girls are deported before any trial can take place.
Local councils try to prevent the brothels opening but they are overridden by state laws and regulations.

It's largely out of sight, out of mind but behind the closed doors all is not well.


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## Shalimar (Apr 7, 2015)

After working with traumatized former sex workers one of whom was a high priced escort, I don't have a ready answer. As a woman, rather than a counselor, I struggle with the rage I feel toward some men who feel entitled to do unspeakable things to their rented "toy".


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

It all has to be consensual.  Otherwise, it should be prosecuted...


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## QuickSilver (Apr 7, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> It all has to be consensual.  Otherwise, it should be prosecuted...




Just because it's consensual does not mean there isn't a victim.


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## Shalimar (Apr 7, 2015)

Agreed, Ralphy, I just don't see any effective way of monitoring some of it except after the fact, when it is too late.


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

How could there be a victim if both choose to participate?


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## Shalimar (Apr 7, 2015)

I think the idea that working girls enjoy what they do is largely a myth. I think it probably makes many of their clients rest easy. In my work, I have met two women who stated they enjoyed what they did. I only believed one of them.


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

Many wives probably don't enjoy their "work" either...


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## Ameriscot (Apr 7, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> Many wives probably don't enjoy their "work" either...



That would be the man's fault in most cases.


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## Shalimar (Apr 7, 2015)

Ralphy, broken people make many choices based on their personal pain. They are  vulnerable to predators who convince them of the glamour of party life, expensive lifestyle, and mixing with the rich and powerful. The reality is usually vastly different. The further down the scale one goes, usually the greater the risk of regular degradation. No matter how some men wish to perpetuate the myth of the courtesan with the heart of gold who loves her work, the reality is much grittier. I have looked into these women's eyes and wept. As a child, I was one of them. It was not pretty.


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

The exploitation side of the sex industry is certainly disturbing and tragic.  But like all human behavior there can be a plus side, such as with gambling and drinking when employed responsibly as entertainment...


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## QuickSilver (Apr 7, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> How could there be a victim if both choose to participate?



In the same way child ****** abuse can be.  You do realize that many times this is consensual too..  A child, while a child is still a ****** being.. AND the child feels powerless to stop the advances of a more powerful adult.. especially an adult who they depend on for survival.   These women, in a way,  feel they are powerless to pull themselves out of their circumstances.. they feel dependent on pimps and Johns for money to survive.  So while they are not fighting or opposing the ****** contact, one can hardly call it truly consensual if one party feels they have no choice.


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

Wal-Mart is an alternative...


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## Shalimar (Apr 7, 2015)

Q.S. you are right, many of these women, some stats, state 80%, began as survivors of child ****** abuse. How could they as adults possibly find the clarity to clearly choose prostitution? Add that shame-helplessness mind-set to financial dependence, and fear of retaliation from pimps etc. choice is questionable at best.


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## Shalimar (Apr 7, 2015)

Wal-mart is an alternative to living in a cardboard box, not much else,


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## QuickSilver (Apr 7, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> Wal-Mart is an alternative...



Ralphy... it's much more complicated than choosing employment at Wal-Mart over prostitution.  See Shalimar's post


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## Warrigal (Apr 7, 2015)

There's one way to decide whether this is acceptable as a career choice for women - would any of us suggest it to our grand daughters as a way to pay for their college education or as a means of social advancement?

I used to shudder at the thought that any of my students would fall into this trap, even though some of them seemed like they might be naturals.

One of them did.

She was a beautiful child when I first knew her but her mother had terminal cancer and became violent towards the girl. The relationship with her father seemed a little unnatural but it could have been all on the girl's side. She was desperate to be loved. She was adopted and her little brother was a natural child. When the mother became very sick, her relatives came and took the brother away to care for but refused to take the girl. By this time she was acting out at school in a fairly outrageous fashion but we were managing her pretty well. Each day she would report to the Principal who would go over her timetable with her and negotiate which lessons she could behave in and for those she couldn't, she would come and camp in either her office or mine. She was OK for the women but really gave the men hell. Significant? Personally I think it could have been an indicator of something wrong with her relationship with the father, but again, it needn't have been anything ******.

Eventually she ran away from home and ended up in a youth refuge. Still attended school every day. Then the refuge ran out of funding and closed. All the kids in it made a pact to go downtown and get into trouble with the police so that they would all go into Minda (a juvenile remand centre) together.

When she appeared before the court she was given 2 weeks to find somewhere to live or go into detention. She was 14 at the time. She came up with a 22 year old woman with a baby who was a drug addict and the court allowed her to move in with her. She could no longer come to our school because it was much too far away.

She became addicted and hit the streets. It was heart breaking but the story didn't end there.

After a couple of years she was picked up from the gutter by a local clergyman who took her into his home with his own family. Quite brave in the circumstance IMO. The next time I saw her she was clean and studying at Bible college and she was engaged to be married. She had even reconciled with her father. The lovely child I had first known had come back and she was still beautiful and fully alive.

I wish someone would rescue all of the damaged children before they enter the sex trade with all its associated evils.


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

Can we get past the abuse of children and just admit that many women choose to prostitute without any coercion or as the the result of any precipitating factors?


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## Shalimar (Apr 7, 2015)

D.W. so do I. Sometimes, all we can do is try to help them afterward. I was fortunate my hell ceased before adulthood. Many of my fellow children of both sexes did not fare so well. The invisibility of this insidious crime against the most helpless and innocent continues, largely unabated, especially among the wealthy. Money buys depravity limited only by imagination.


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## Shalimar (Apr 7, 2015)

No Ralphy, we can't, because much as you wish to subscribe to this fantasy, the facts make a mockery of it.


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## QuickSilver (Apr 7, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> Can we get past the abuse of children and just admit that many women choose to prostitute without any coercion or as the the result of any precipitating factors?




Ralphy... you are oversimplifying the topic by insinuating it's about SEX and the enjoyment it can provide.   It seldom is..  not for the women.


While biology makes sex a pleasurable thing.. and necessary for the survival of the species... sex for men and sex for women can be two different animals  Ralphy.   Sex and the enjoyment of it is more complex for women.  Perhaps because the act of being entered is more submissive than the act of entering, which is far more powerful.  Sex is much  more personal for women in some regards.. and through the ages, women have had more at stake concerning sex.


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

I am glad that some overcome horrible experiences as children and didn't intend this aspect of prostitution as part of this thread...


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## Warrigal (Apr 7, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> Can we get past the abuse of children and just admit that many women choose to prostitute without any coercion or as the the result of any precipitating factors?



I don't know this and neither do you, Ralphy, but I'm sure the customers like to take the smiles at face value.


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 7, 2015)

Doesn't say much for many men does it...


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## QuickSilver (Apr 7, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> I am glad that some overcome horrible experiences as children and didn't intend this aspect of prostitution as part of this thread...



Well... you have learned..  Sex and the circumstances surrounding it... particularly the exploitation of it... is a really different type of topic for women.. than men.


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## tnthomas (Apr 7, 2015)

Ameriscot said:


> I agree it should be legalized but only in regulated places where the ladies are well taken care of and safe.



In the state of Nevada prostitution is legal in a licensed brothel; "street walking" is not legal though.

PS. Many women choose to turn to prostitution to finance their drug habit.


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## Ameriscot (Apr 7, 2015)

tnthomas said:


> In the state of Nevada prostitution is legal in a licensed brothel; "street walking" is not legal though.
> 
> PS. Many women choose to turn to prostitution to finance their drug habit.



Yes, that's what I meant.  A legal brothel.  Streetwalking is never safe.


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## Ameriscot (Apr 7, 2015)

DW, glad your story about the girl had a happy ending.  Most stories like that don't.


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## SeaBreeze (Apr 7, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> With everything else being legalized we should decriminalize this oldest of professions.  We could tax it, license it, and provide health inspections.  The time has come to stop arresting everybody involved; twenty-two men were arrested over the weekend in a sting operation here.  Couldn't the police be spending their time on more important activities?  Makes sense to me and I'm sure to you...



I agree it should be legalized.  Nothing more pathetic than women cops who could be doing something constructive to earn their pay, dressing up like whores just to bust some poor sap with fifty bucks in his pocket looking for a thrill.  Making it legal would also take care of all the pimps who cause more abuse than the customers, those are the ones who should be arrested.


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## AZ Jim (Apr 7, 2015)

QuickSilver said:


> I think that when a lot of people think of prostitution, they tend to think of the high priced Call Girls... the Escorts... and the Hollywood Madam.  The $1,000 a night club..  not the poor woman degraded in an alley for $2.     I'm not totally against legalization, but the proceeds need to go toward helping the women, not into the tax coffers or some politicians campaign fund.



Hey!  You trying to price some of us out  of the market?    I hope she knows I'm kidding....


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## AZ Jim (Apr 7, 2015)

tnthomas said:


> In the state of Nevada prostitution is legal in a licensed brothel; "street walking" is not legal though.
> 
> PS. Many women choose to turn to prostitution to finance their drug habit.



The funny part of that story is it is NOT legal in Clark County where Las Vegas is.  I lived in Nevada new the bunny ranch years ago.  The advertised and that was not a cheap operation.


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## AZ Jim (Apr 7, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> Because I would have been fabulously beautiful and, therefore, would have been in demand by fabulously wealthy clients...



I notice you don't post your pic as a man Ralphy.  How do we know what would have to change to make you a Julia Roberts?


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## Ameriscot (Apr 7, 2015)

AZ Jim said:


> I notice you don't post your pic as a man Ralphy.  How do we know what would have to change to make you a Julia Roberts?



I think Ralphy is an alien from some strange world in another universe.


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## Ameriscot (Apr 7, 2015)

AZ Jim said:


> The funny part of that story is it is NOT legal in Clark County where Las Vegas is.  I lived in Nevada new the bunny ranch years ago.  The advertised and that was not a cheap operation.



I thought it was just a certain of Nevada where it was legal?


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## AZ Jim (Apr 7, 2015)

Strange is the key.  But harmless.


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## Ameriscot (Apr 7, 2015)

AZ Jim said:


> Strange is the key.  But harmless.



Yes, harmless.


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## Cookie (Apr 7, 2015)

I don't think it's about the women, who are desperate in my opinion, and  get trapped into it (drugs, money).  I think men want it. It has always filled a need for men who don't have access to women for some reason.  I think it should be legalized everywhere, and regulated, since it's not going anywhere and the women are endangered.


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## QuickSilver (Apr 7, 2015)

Yes....  fulfill mens' needs.... that's all that counts.


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## SifuPhil (Apr 7, 2015)

QuickSilver said:


> Yes....  fulfill mens' needs.... that's all that counts.



Wiser words have never been spoken ...


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## SeaBreeze (Apr 7, 2015)

Cookie said:


> It has always filled a need for men who don't have access to women for some reason.  I think it should be legalized everywhere, and regulated, since it's not going anywhere and the women are endangered.



I agree.  I'd much rather have a man who wants sex to pay a hooker $20 for a quickie in the back seat, than grab a woman jogger off the path in a park and rape her.  It's the woman who is raped by these types of men that are the victims, not the prostitutes who are doing it willingly with strangers for money.


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## QuickSilver (Apr 7, 2015)

Since rape is NOT about sex.. but about power and control, men that are going to pull joggers off a path and rape them are going to do so whether prostituion is legal or not.   They don't WANT a willing partner... the fear is what they are after and the act of overpowering is what thrills them.   Legalizing prostitution is NOT going to stop rape.


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## Shalimar (Apr 7, 2015)

Q.S. you are right, of course, but the idea that Prostitution is somehow a willing venture for most women is still systemic in our culture, thank you for speaking out on behalf of so many invisible, supposedly non-existent victims. Rape is a crime of violence, And has nothing whatsoever todo with prostitutes. I am so weary of the whole
 Culture of blame thing. Why don't people believe women?


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## Cookie (Apr 7, 2015)

*In Psychology Today Magazine: FYI

****** gratification or control over women?*
Stranger  rape takes different forms, including a political version and a  sadistic version but the majority of ****** assaults are more about  ****** gratification than control over women per se. But what can one  say about date rape? Is this extremely common form of rape consistent  with the feminist pattern of men controlling women, or does it fit more  neatly within the evolutionary psychological perspective where rape is  primarily a ****** crime?

 The inherent conflict in date rape is not really about consent to  some level of ****** intimacy because some degree of consent is implied  by a woman agreeing to go out with the man. The real issue is not a  difference over whether to engage in physical intimacy but rather as to  the degree of intimacy and its timing.

 In other words, it is not an either/or situation. Date rape is a  ****** crime but it is also about who controls the interaction, an issue  of great concern for feminists, and for women in general. In other  words, date rape mixes up the feminist perspective on rape with the  evolutionary one.


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## Glinda (Apr 7, 2015)

I'd like to point out that prostitution is practiced by males as well as females, usually for homosexual sex.  Some are young boys who are desperate victims comparable to the girls.  It would be nice if legalizing would solve all the issues involved in prostitution but I'm afraid it's just not that simple.


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## Shalimar (Apr 7, 2015)

I am saddened that a reputable scientific magazine chooses to perpetuate the alarming stereotype that a woman agrees to a certain level of ****** intimacy/consent merely by going out with a man? Really? I can  N ame at least three psychologists a d one psychiatrist, all male, whose professional opinion of that statement is not printable on this forum. I also do not believe that any normal man could sustain an erection while attempting to rape a woman.


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 8, 2015)

I agree that it is difficult to understand how a normal man could have an erection during a rape but the evidence for so many is that they can if one considers the massive rape of German women by Russian soldiers at the end of WW2.


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## QuickSilver (Apr 8, 2015)

What are you saying Ralphy?  Germans are ugly?


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 8, 2015)

This was a terrible period, especially in Berlin.  Mothers hid their young daughters and allowed themselves to be serially raped.  Manyy women committed suicide either to avoid being raped or after being raped.  Stalin allowed the rapes to take place for a couple of weeks before having them stopped due to the concern of world outrage if they went on too long...


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## QuickSilver (Apr 8, 2015)

Oh... Your sentence was just confusing the way it was worded..


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 8, 2015)

Sorry, probably the fault of falling asleep during English classes in my school daze...


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## Shalimar (Apr 8, 2015)

Ralphy, when I was eighteen, I worked with a German lady who had been raped by the Russians. She was still traumatized decades later. She was only sixteen when it happened. Rape has always been a weapon of war.


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## QuickSilver (Apr 8, 2015)

My Great Grandfather took his family out of Germany before WWI....  He said the Kaiser was crazy...


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## Shalimar (Apr 8, 2015)

Male rape victims also exist, their reaction closely resembles that of female ones, with perhaps an added layer of shock, men are not supposed to be vulnerable in that fashion, are they?  Some are prostitutes, a surprising number are not. Even more surprising, by no means are all of these men interested in engaging in homosexual activity!


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## Ralphy1 (Apr 8, 2015)

All these men?  I don't think the numbers would support that many men that are interested in homosexual activity...


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## Shalimar (Apr 8, 2015)

Ralphy, perhaps I should have worded things differently. '"All the men" referenced the percentage of male rape victims interested in homosexual activity, rather than the percentage of men in society who are interested in homosexual activity.


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