# Racism



## fuzzybuddy (Sep 25, 2018)

Do you really think racism is on the decline?


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## StarSong (Sep 25, 2018)

Depends what time period, region of the country (presume you're referring to the US), and age group you're asking about.


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## Gary O' (Sep 25, 2018)

StarSong said:


> Depends what time period, region of the country (presume you're referring to the US), and age group you're asking about.



I would imagine that's a fair assessment

I no longer know
I live in the sticks
where humanness is the primary challenge


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## C'est Moi (Sep 25, 2018)

Unfortunately, I do not believe so.   There is so much hate in the world today; it really brings me down sometimes.


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## Aunt Bea (Sep 26, 2018)

I honestly don't know.

It seems to bubble up more often these days.

I will say that I would rather deal with an upfront in your face racist than a pleasant acting smiler that quietly practices racism in a behind the scenes sort of way.


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## terry123 (Sep 26, 2018)

C'est Moi said:


> Unfortunately, I do not believe so.   There is so much hate in the world today; it really brings me down sometimes.


Brings me down too.


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## Keesha (Sep 26, 2018)

Unfortunately no I don’t.


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## IKE (Sep 26, 2018)

No I don't......I also don't believe that racism will ever totally disappear.


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## hollydolly (Sep 26, 2018)

of course not., but when we talk of ''racism'' then we usually think of Black / white  type of racism... but of course that only the tiny tip of the racism iceberg!!


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## ClassicRockr (Sep 26, 2018)

No, not with as many problems that go on today. What is a "racist"? Like the word "discrimination", the word "racist" is thrown around all over the place for different reasons and opinions. Seems to me that the only race that complains about racism is Blacks towards Whites and law enforcement. Wonder how Blacks get along with Black officers? I would guess, not to well. 

People in general "want what they want" and will yell "discrimination" or "racism" to get it.


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## JimW (Sep 26, 2018)

I think the "racist" tag (a long with labels in general), is thrown around too loosely these days and that seems to make problems worse than they really are. Seems any negative comment made towards a person of a different race is labeled with the racism tag whether race is actually mentioned or not. That being said, I know that racism is ever present and it's a shame that anyone has to deal with it.There's a very simple rule I follow no matter who I'm dealing with: "treat others as you would want to be treated". It seems to work pretty good for the most part.

I think that social media makes everything seem bigger than it really is because it's so easy to get the word out to the masses these days.


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## Don M. (Sep 26, 2018)

"Racism" is, and has always been, part of the Human existence.  It is only somewhat natural for those of similar ethnicity to prefer members of their own race, and feel that they are somewhat superior to others.  The problems occur when  those thoughts become extreme, and overt measures are taken against others who are Not of a given race.  In today's world, it seems that only the Whites are racist...if one listens to the often biased news reports....however, it is often the actions of those being targeted...with their "confrontational" attitudes, and propensity for engaging in criminal activities...that reinforce so much of the bias that exists today.


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## AprilT (Sep 26, 2018)

Don M. said:


> "Racism" is, and has always been, part of the Human existence.  It is only somewhat natural for those of similar ethnicity to prefer members of their own race, and feel that they are somewhat superior to others.  The problems occur when  those thoughts become extreme, and overt measures are taken against others who are Not of a given race.  In today's world, it seems that only the Whites are racist...if one listens to the often biased news reports....*however, it is often the actions of those being targeted...with their "confrontational" attitudes, and propensity for engaging in criminal activities...that reinforce so much of the bias that exists today.*



I beg to differ and will adamantly say this in total nonsense, but, only if one has a small window from which they view the world could they see things this way.  People are targeted on a daily basis for nothing more than just living their lives, walking down the street going to the store, sitting on steps outside a families house or just trying to enjoy a day at their own apartment's pool.  Nothing about these people are perpetuating anything, it's in the minds of the bigoted people who continue to cause such issues and anger individuals who want nothing more to enjoy the same rights as everyone else.  

Lets see how anyone would feel if these things were to happen to them on a daily basis

Watch the officer talk his way out of this one





Calling police for being at pool, there's more details in the second video showing just how this guy really acted lying for his reasons.




 
skip to around 3:35  The lady had a pool card, what more do you need.  





Yes he's belligerent, but, you need to understand why.  After you continually have people harass you for being places that make them uncomfortable because of your color, you start to get angry especially when you are at your on living surroundings.  I already know some will defend the actions of the people demanding this guy prove he belongs, but why should we as a people keep having to defend our presence.  Stop with the excuses based on what you see others do on the news.  We're not all the same just like not all white people are neo nazis, white nationalist what if we all made such assumptions. 






I have more videos to post when I get back from the store if you want to see them


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## squatting dog (Sep 26, 2018)

AprilT, I'm sure that I could scour the internet and post lot's of videos showing the reverse, but if I did, I'm sure I'd be labeled a racist.


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## ClassicRockr (Sep 26, 2018)

squatting dog said:


> AprilT, I'm sure that I could scour the internet and post lot's of videos showing the reverse, but if I did, I'm sure I'd be labeled a racist.



I totally agree.


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## ClassicRockr (Sep 26, 2018)

I agree with Don M. as well. 

Now, April T., do we want to discuss how many law enforcement officers have been ambushed or killed in general? 

Actually, finding out the entire story of each of your video's would be much more beneficial. Just like when a bystander starts videoing an officer dealing with a suspect. The bystander doesn't get on the video what the suspect did to make the officer do what they had to do, but no, many people only want to see the part of the video of what the cop did. 

Wife and I are very much advocates of law enforcement. They have a job to do and want to be alive and go home after their shift is over.


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## AprilT (Sep 26, 2018)

We are talking about racism existing and how it affects normal citizens, but as usual the typical response is to equate all black people with the criminal eliment. Bigots never disappoint.  None of these response surprised me some just can't help what they truly feel about other ethnic groups it's just too engrained in their subconscious. On my phone.


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## gennie (Sep 26, 2018)

Racism is taught.  Babies don't care about the color of the skin of their playmate, they only care if they play nice.  A child growing up in a racist home will probably be a racist as an adult.  I think a couple of generations down the road, we will see much less racism in the U.S. because more young people are seeing it for what it is - wrong, 

I also think that as more people are doing DNA testing, they are realizing that there are few of us whose ancestry is 'pure' anything.  We're all mutts to some degree.


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## AprilT (Sep 26, 2018)

Oh another thing my post wasn't specific to police, I know how hard most of them work, I have family who work in like law enforcement. I've also worked in an office along side them. The ones I knew were remarkable human beings. If not for the criminal element that passed through the doors I might have stayed in the job.  I couldn't ever do what they do on a daily basis.  I have great respect for law enforcement.  I do however know earn the honor of the badge


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## C'est Moi (Sep 26, 2018)

gennie said:


> Racism is taught.  Babies don't care about the color of the skin of their playmate, they only care if they play nice.  A child growing up in a racist home will probably be a racist as an adult.  I think a couple of generations down the road, we will see much less racism in the U.S. because more young people are seeing it for what it is - wrong,
> 
> I also think that as more people are doing DNA testing, they are realizing that there are few of us whose ancestry is 'pure' anything.  We're all mutts to some degree.



Racism may be taught, but it also may be learned or acquired due to life experience.   Don't make broad assumptions.


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## AprilT (Sep 26, 2018)

squatting dog said:


> AprilT, I'm sure that I could scour the internet and post lot's of videos showing the reverse, but if I did, I'm sure I'd be labeled a racist.



reverse of what, black people telling white people to leave the pool area?  Black people calling the cops on white people, really?  The thread is about racism, but you and others seem bent on some point about the criminal element as if that is the majority of the who black people are.  

Does racism exist is the question, not are there people of color who commit crimes, there are people who commit crimes black, white and everything in between, I would be able to raise you as many non-minorities as you could raise the opposite of crimes committed by individuals, but that wasn't the point of the videos I posted.  As I said, some just can't see beyond their own prejudices.  You went right to crimes committed to make excuses for minorities being targeted for racism.  Not a good reason, just a bigoted person's reason.

And don't blame me, I don't typically start threads about issues of this sort, as I know it's almost pointless for me to talk with some people of a certain age about such matters due to their views dating way back.  Many from an era of deep racism and deep hate towards other races didn't all just disappear; I'm sure many such people are on senior boards just like any one of the rest of us.  As can be by people here who like to keep posting certain nonsense and have since the day I first came here.  I remember a member making some post about black young men carrying guns and some crazy foolishness saying they were all like that.  I'll never forget it, but I'd have to research to find the exact post and what he said and obviously years later he's still pushing similar views.


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## ClassicRockr (Sep 26, 2018)

So, what happens when a black person absolutely resists an officer? Then, the white officer has to go to the next step to subdue the black person and, during the whole thing, the black person is calling the officer a "racist" who hates blacks. If there would have been one word, "cooperation" every thing would have been fine. 

Black people that live around us get stunned when we tell them we listen to Motown music and have movies with black stars in them, like The Shack. Heck, one of our favorite tv shows, that ended up cancelled, was The Carmichaels. Not the area we live in, but the rest of Jacksonville, FL sure has it's black-on-black crime. 

My brother doesn't like people from India and didn't have a problem telling me that. My wife's girlfriend's husband doesn't like being around blacks that much, because the park in Detroit that he went to as a young man, black drug dealers and such took over. "They destroyed my beautiful park", he told wife and I. 

We've talked to both blacks and Indians that live in our apartment complex. They were/are very, very nice folks, unlike the gangs in certain parts of this city. When we go to our local Waffle House for breakfast, there is one very, very nice older black waitress we always want to wait on our table. The lady is a terrific waitress.


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## AprilT (Sep 26, 2018)

ClassicRockr said:


> So, what happens when a black person absolutely resists an officer? Then, the white officer has to go to the next step to subdue the black person and, during the whole thing, the black person is calling the officer a "racist" who hates blacks. If there would have been one word, "cooperation" every thing would have been fine.
> 
> Black people that live around us get stunned when we tell them we listen to Motown music and have movies with black stars in them, like The Shack. Heck, one of our favorite tv shows, that ended up cancelled, was The Carmichaels. Not the area we live in, but the rest of Jacksonville, FL sure has it's black-on-black crime.
> 
> ...



You are fixated on a topic other than what this thread isn't about that is racism.  You seem to want to talk about blacks and crime; If you want to talk about your disdain for blacks, as you have done so in the past  and also discuss those who act out against officers who go to arrest people behaving badly why not start you little happy thread, I'm sure you'll get lots of hits.  Be sure to include lots of racist remarks and videos so I can counter with non-minorities behaving just as outraged.

And good grief, get over yourself, obviously you know some black people who aren't used to diversity as you aren't, big deal.  Years ago I went to a party with a group, one lady was a member of that tea party movement, she was stunned to see me jump out of my set to dance to certain songs she didn't expect any black people liked or I guess new existed, another guy on a forum was shocked to know there were black women who enjoyed rock, his words to me.  Big deal, people are sometimes out of touch with reality or just have very limited exposure to how different people out there are and based everything on the few people they come across in a particular location.

I don't have a need to point out that there's this one, Italian, Asian, Irish, Armenian or other person who is nice, when I talk about my friends I don't specify their ethnicity, nor do I specify that of the people I've dated, gone out to dinner with, camped with or anything else, I don't feel the need, why do some others feel a need to say well there's one nice black person I met.  Whooptie freckin deal it shows me the person is lacking something when they continually have to make such points.  If most of your experiences have been negative encounters, that's not my fault nor a reason to group all people in a category.  Stop labeling/grouping all people as a monolithic group.


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## GeorgiaXplant (Sep 26, 2018)

The only people who will say that racism _doesn't_ exist or isn't a problem are caucasian.


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## Manatee (Sep 26, 2018)

There is no valid way to quantify this issue.

My personal experience has taught me that it is very much a two way street.


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## AprilT (Sep 26, 2018)

........................


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## fmdog44 (Sep 26, 2018)

Racism is a worn out word. All countries/cultures express indifference to the basic differences in cultures and appearances. I think it is in our DNA.


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## StarSong (Sep 26, 2018)

GeorgiaXplant said:


> The only people who will say that racism _doesn't_ exist or isn't a problem are caucasian.



So true.


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## Wandrin (Sep 29, 2018)

I don't think that there has been a decline of racism.  In fact, recent situations seem to have emboldened some, whether they choose to call it nationalism, return to the '50s, or whatever.  I think that more of us that think have realized that we are or have been a little bit more racist than we thought we were.


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## Leonie (Sep 29, 2018)

I don't think racism is in decline, and like others have said I don't think it will ever be in decline.  Sadly I think it is human nature, and it is only a difference in degree that makes it somehow acceptable. 

I can't even begin to imagine how people who are different from the majority of others around them cope with what they probably have to put up with on a daily basis.  As a young teenager, I spent a lot of time with a cousin who was of Asian appearance.  To my shame, it was almost a relief when she went back home after visiting for a couple of weeks as there would now be no more nasty comments thrown at the pair of us from passing cars.  While I went back to my uneventful life, she could never escape the nastiness we saw. That was her life, her whole life. Even then as a young teenager I was aware that I had some sort of unearned privilege just by the accident of being born white.

The only caveat I would apply is that there is a danger of somehow diminishing the sheer horror of some of the ugliest racist attacks when some call every little slight racism.  Sadly I have seen that ugliness first hand with my cousin.

I don't know the answer to the racism problem.  Maybe if we had called out the racist comments earlier she wouldn't have become a target of one of those passing cars, or maybe that would have only infuriated them more and they may have actually killed her instead of just knocking her off her bike and breaking her leg.


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## Keesha (Sep 29, 2018)

GeorgiaXplant said:


> The only people who will say that racism _doesn't_ exist or isn't a problem are caucasian.



Not true. I’m Caucasian and I do know racism exists. 
Another myth about racism is that caucasians are the only race that don’t get prejudiced but this is also untrue. We most certainly do.


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## Gary O' (Sep 29, 2018)

GeorgiaXplant said:


> The only people who will say that racism _doesn't_ exist or isn't a problem are caucasian.






Keesha said:


> Not true. I’m Caucasian and I do know racism exists.
> Another myth about racism is that caucasians are the other race that don’t get prejudiced but this is also untrue. We most certainly do.



GX may have meant 'say that racism _doesn't_ exist' is just that...they *say it* but know better.

But, if it's believed Caucasians think racism doesn't exist;
I suggest going to jail for a bit, or living in the woods for a time.

Caucasians are the best (worst) at it.

I think ‘rife’ is the better word.

Folks will say, ‘well hell, jail contains only low lifers and only renegades live in the sticks’….

I’d argue this extensively, but, to remain direct; 
Folks in jail become polarized. 
Skin color or lifestyle being the catalysts, no matter how mild an individual may be.

Folks in the woods become free…free to express how they really feel, free to live the way they really want. 
The kindest, most civilized, being the most hard core …it’s an education.

Caucasians are the experts at it, all masked with a PC stance and verbiage.

I know, I’ve actually lived among them

Yeah, I’m Caucasian (Irish German…with a sprinkling of Mongolian…Kalmyk)


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## squatting dog (Sep 30, 2018)

Question.  would this be considered racist?


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## squatting dog (Sep 30, 2018)

Wandrin said:


> I don't think that there has been a decline of racism.  In fact, recent situations seem to have emboldened some, whether they choose to call it nationalism, return to the '50s, or whatever.  I think that more of us that think have realized that we are or have been a little bit more racist than we thought we were.



So, are you saying Nationalism is a bad thing?  Per Wikipedia and I'm sure other sources. 

*Nationalism is a political, social, and economic system characterized by the promotion of the interests of a particular nation, especially with the aim of gaining and maintaining sovereignty (self-governance) over the homeland. The political ideology of nationalism holds that a nation should govern itself, free from outside interference and is linked to the concept of self-determination. Nationalism is further oriented towards developing and maintaining a national identity based on shared, social characteristics, such as culture and language, religion and politics, and a belief in a common ancestry. Nationalism, therefore, seeks to preserve a nation's culture, by way of pride in national achievements, and is closely linked to patriotism,*


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## Keesha (Sep 30, 2018)

Im hoping that posting this chart differently will show it off better.
Nope but it’s a great graft for demonstrative purposes.

Is this considered a political topic?


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## GeorgiaXplant (Sep 30, 2018)

Keesha said:


> Not true. I’m Caucasian and I do know racism exists.
> Another myth about racism is that caucasians are the only race that don’t get prejudiced but this is also untrue. We most certainly do.



I didn't say ALL Caucasian people deny that racism exists; I said that the only people who would say it doesn't are Caucasian.


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## StarSong (Sep 30, 2018)

GeorgiaXplant said:


> I didn't say ALL Caucasian people deny that racism exists; I said that the only people who would say it doesn't are Caucasian.



That's how I interpreted your statement.


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## C'est Moi (Sep 30, 2018)

squatting dog said:


> Question.  would this be considered racist?



Well, it's certainly one reason why "Caucasians" don't deny that racism exists.   

Which brings to mind reverse racism.    Exactly how does that work?   Is racism exclusive to one race, or two?


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## C'est Moi (Sep 30, 2018)

GeorgiaXplant said:


> I didn't say ALL Caucasian people deny that racism exists; I said that the only people who would say it doesn't are Caucasian.



Do you know anyone who denies that racism exists?   Just curious, because I certainly don't.   I don't know how you can make such a blanket statement since obviously you can't know who would or would not "say it."


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## rgp (Sep 30, 2018)

C'est Moi said:


> Do you know anyone who denies that racism exists?   Just curious, because I certainly don't.   I don't know how you can make such a blanket statement since obviously you can't know who would or would not "say it."



Well, I'm Caucasian  and and i'll say it. Yes it exist & IMO it is perfectly normal. Most folks prefer to be with 'their-own' . Wrong or right? I'm not even going to go there , it's all choice, and we are entitled to make that choice.

Hurt the others? no matter who they are? NO...

That is why i see no need for "hate" crimes. A crime against anyone is wrong ....period, shouldn't matter the color of his/her skin, his/her place of birth, or his / her ****** orientation.


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## C'est Moi (Sep 30, 2018)

rgp said:


> Well, I'm Caucasian  and and i'll say it. Yes it exist & IMO it is perfectly normal. Most folks prefer to be with 'their-own' . Wrong or right? I'm not even going to go there , it's all choice, and we are entitled to make that choice.
> 
> Hurt the others? no matter who they are? NO...
> 
> That is why i see no need for "hate" crimes. A crime against anyone is wrong ....period, shouldn't matter the color of his/her skin, his/her place of birth, or his / her ****** orientation.



The comment was that Caucasians would be more likely to DENY racism.   But thanks for playing.


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## rgp (Sep 30, 2018)

C'est Moi said:


> The comment was that Caucasians would be more likely to DENY racism.   But thanks for playing.



 Exactly....And I do not deny it. I know what I'm replying to...Thanks.


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## Keesha (Sep 30, 2018)

I don’t believe there is such a thing as reverse racism.
In my opinion, all races are discriminated against; maybe not equally but they definitely are


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## applecruncher (Sep 30, 2018)

Perhaps some answers here:

https://www.seniorforums.com/showthread.php/32415-Race-Racism-discussion?highlight=Racism


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## OneEyedDiva (Oct 3, 2018)

Seriously??!! With all the killings of Black people who are not committing serious offenses, who are running away from the police (in the event they committed a minor crime) and who are having the cops called on them for doing every day things (almost daily now), I would say hell to the no...racism is not on the decline! Just about every day there are incidences of racism occurring across this country. It's disgusting that we're living in a time where people seem to have been given permission to express their hatred of "minorities".


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## OneEyedDiva (Oct 3, 2018)

C'est Moi said:


> Well, it's certainly one reason why "Caucasians" don't deny that racism exists.
> 
> Which brings to mind reverse racism.    Exactly how does that work?   Is racism exclusive to one race, or two?


I think "reverse racism" is a misnomer. It implies that racism can only be directed at one race and that's not true. Racism is racism. There are Blacks who are racist against Caucasians. There are Hispanics who are racist against Blacks, etc. etc. Maybe this doesn't come under the term "racism" per se, but there are those who are prejudiced against Jews and of course Muslims.  All of it is hate. I am Muslim but I cringe when I hear about anti Semitic aggression just as much as any other kind of racist act.


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## peppermint (Oct 3, 2018)

I wouldn't touch this subject with a 10 foot pole....I just know my Dad was teased, fought and had a hard growing up...But, that was in the old old days....
He told me stories when I got older....He was called Blacky, because he was a dark Italian....He came from a poor Italian Family....My Dad at 18 years old
joined the National Guard....There he was respected...He had 1 eye....He had the measles when he was a tiny baby, he was one of  11 kids.....
He actual was a sharp shooter with 1 eye....When WW2 broke out he wasn't able to go to war because of his eye...He always regretted it....He did stay in
the Guard for over 40 years....
My Dad never had a prejudiced bone in his body....I remember him coming home with his Guard buddy's....Some were Mexican, Black and White....
Not telling my Mom he was bringing them for dinner, Mom had to try to gather something to eat for the man....I would not eat, because I was embarrassed
that my Mom had to do that and the poor men felt funny...So I didn't eat because I wanted my mom to have more food for the men....
I remember when my parents sold our home...I just graduated from High School and got a Secretarial job....We moved to an Armory that my Dad was the Armorer...
It was a beautiful Apartment but downstairs was the big hall for the men had there meetings....I was always so embarrassed when I had to go down the stairs from
the apartment and had to go through all the guy's in the Office....I had a boyfriend, and didn't want to meet anyone of those guy's....They would stop me and talk...
I was 18.....But anyway it was only for 2 years and Mom and Dad decided to buy a house.....Then I got married....

The Mexican friend of my Dad, also was my younger Brother's God Father....I never saw color when I was a kid.....I still don't now....


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## ClassicRockr (Oct 4, 2018)

Well, if ALL suspects, no matter the race, would obey law enforcement commands, there would be less shootings. 

As wasn't raised around "racism", because all the farmers around us were White.....no other race. From what I knew, all of the blacks lived on one side of Ft Wayne, but there sure were some great black high school basketball varsity players we played against in the Sectionals. One black family in our school, which was a "consolidated" one, meaning grade school, junior high and high school in the same building, separated by hallways. I never seen the black kids during my junior high and high school years there. Not once. We did have an Asian girl in our graduation class, but other than here, all white. 

I do believe "racism" is taught, and there are both white parents and black parents that do it. Kind of shocking, but true.


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## Don M. (Oct 4, 2018)

ClassicRockr said:


> Well, if ALL suspects, no matter the race, would obey law enforcement commands, there would be less shootings. .



For sure!  If people acted like a civil human being when stopped by the police, 95% of these killings would never occur.  It's the mouthy confrontational attitudes of most of these "victims" that leads to their demise.


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## applecruncher (Oct 4, 2018)

@ Classic Rockr
@ Don M

Seriously?

Reminder:
The problem of racism in the world/US goes FAR beyond people (of any race) not being civil to law enforcement and/or not obeying commands.

AND, you might want to Google JUSTIN VOLPE.  (former police officer)

After you've reviewed the Justin VOLPE case, Google JAMES BYRD JR JASPER, TX.
Not a law enforcement case - that was the Texas Dragging Murder.

Better hurry because the Pearl Clutchers don't like racism discussions and they're most likely trying to get this thread shut down and locked.:whome:


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## Sunny (Oct 4, 2018)

The term "reverse racism" became popular back in the 80's, when affirmative action was affecting many people in college admissions and hiring practices.  Many white people, particularly white men, felt that now THEY were being discriminated against.

Applecruncher, Pearl Clutchers? :rofl1:


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## StarSong (Oct 4, 2018)

To dispel any confusion about where most US racism is directed:


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## Olivia (Oct 4, 2018)

It seems to me that when talking about racism, it's only about Black and White. But then I live in a place where actual racists would die of a heart attack because of gee, no escaping from anyone not white like you. LOL Or any other color or culture for that matter.


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## applecruncher (Oct 4, 2018)

@ Sunny

One of many ironies is that the group who benefitted most from Affiry Action was/is WHITE women.  Not Black people.


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## StarSong (Oct 4, 2018)

Olivia, Hawaii may well be the least racist state in the US.  How blessed you and others there are for figuring out how to flourish with such a diverse population.


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## StarSong (Oct 4, 2018)

applecruncher said:


> @ Sunny
> 
> One of many ironies is that the group who benefited most from Affirmative Action was/is WHITE women.  Not Black people.



Not ironic because white women (indeed all women) were treated as second class citizens until fairly deep in the 1970s.  Affirmative Action improved the lot of all disenfranchised groups, including women of every race.


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## applecruncher (Oct 4, 2018)

StarSong said:


> Not ironic because white women (indeed all women) were treated as second class citizens until fairly deep in the 1970s.  Affirmative Action improved the lot of all disenfranchised groups, including women of every race.




Oh, it's definitely ironic.

You might be surprised at the number of Whites who feel AA only benefitted Black people.  Such statements have even been said here on this forum, and it's far from the truth.

While AA helped some Blacks,  the fact remains that the group.that AA benefitted most is White women.

That aside, I pretty much said all I wanted to in the other racism thread. Discussions about racial matters don't seem to accomplish much here at SF.


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## hearlady (Oct 4, 2018)

What would you like the thread to accomplish applecruncher? If you had one thing you would like as a takeaway what would it be?


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## Olivia (Oct 4, 2018)

StarSong said:


> Olivia, Hawaii may well be the least racist state in the US.  How blessed you and others there are for figuring out how to flourish with such a diverse population.



The Anthony Bourdain segment in Hawaii really explained what I have such a really difficult time expressing, and Tony was talking to a few young local guys, one of which was of Japanese ancestry, who tried to explain why it is what we think about each other includes our ethnicities as to usually where we come from as geographically, such as someone from Texas being a Texan. As the young guy said, when you live in Hawaii, unless by blood, you cannot say you're Hawaiian; you can only say you are from Hawaii or a citizen of Hawaii. Otherwise you're your ethnicity as part of yourself. My dad's dad came to Hawaii from Japan to work in plantations along with other ethnicities who spoke different languages. They were able to work with each other by creating a language that they all could understand with each other. It's called pidgin.

Defining someone as part of their ethnicity (not nationality) is just  natural here. And, also, we don't live in little ethnic villages as happens on the mainland (and, yes, someone from the mainland, we will refer to as being from the mainland--nothing derogatory implied). We live integrated with each other. And to describe each other that way is just natural--nothing racist implied. My next door neighbors are Vietnamese, the other next door neighbor is Korean. Directly across the street is a Filipino family. Across from them is a Japanese family and next door to them is a Caucasian family. Another next door neighbor from us is a Caucasian family as is a Hawaiian family in the back of us (Hawaiian by blood), and as I've said, I'm hapa haole (haole meaning White and hapa meaning half) being both Caucasian and Asian (could also be half Polynesian). My mom was from Europe so I can also be called Eurasian. 

Hawaii's population on these islands are the most isolated population on the planet. And maybe that's why we are so different from the rest of the planet.


----------



## hearlady (Oct 4, 2018)

That's interesting, Olivia.


----------



## KingsX (Oct 5, 2018)

.

When I was in college,  my sociology professor told our class that racism is the psychological equivalent of the physical body's biological defense mechanism to reject that which is foreign.


----------



## StarSong (Oct 6, 2018)

KingsX said:


> .
> 
> When I was in college,  my sociology professor told our class that racism is the psychological equivalent of the physical body's biological defense mechanism to reject that which is foreign.



An interesting rationalization that I think is mostly malarkey.


----------



## Sunny (Oct 6, 2018)

That's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard, KingsX!

If it were true, consider this for a moment:  White people come with all different colors of eyes and hair. So why wouldn't we automatically reject those who have different colors of those features from ours?  Somehow, it's only the skin that is perceived as "foreign?"  What nonsense.


----------



## KingsX (Oct 6, 2018)

Sunny said:


> That's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard, KingsX!
> 
> .




What university do  you teach ??

.


----------



## KingsX (Oct 6, 2018)

StarSong said:


> An interesting rationalization that I think is mostly malarkey.




Did you publically say things like this to your college professors ??

.


----------



## StarSong (Oct 6, 2018)

KingsX said:


> Did you publically say things like this to your college professors ??
> 
> .



Actually, yes, I did and yes, I would.


----------



## C'est Moi (Oct 6, 2018)

KingsX said:


> Did you publically say things like this to your college professors ??
> 
> .



Just curious, but why do you add those superfluous periods to your posts?


----------



## hearlady (Oct 6, 2018)

> Discussions about racial matters don't seem to accomplish much here at SF.


I see your point.


----------



## grahamg (Oct 6, 2018)

*Mostly*



StarSong said:


> KingsX wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I note you say "mostly malarkey", so not "complete malarkey" is my inference (?).

I think maybe human beings can think anything "different" could be something we might fear, so maybe we are psychologically designed to think like this, whilst at the same time a "good Samaritan" or foreigner might save our bacon at times (how many of us would refuse life saving surgery from an overseas doctor who was the best in his or her field?).

"Racism" being malarkey, or wrong is something I'd agree with, whilst having been brought up in days when it was commonplace here in the UK, and had to realise later in life how foolish or wrong it was.


----------



## StarSong (Oct 7, 2018)

grahamg said:


> I note you say "mostly malarkey", so not "complete malarkey" is my inference (?).
> 
> I think maybe human beings can think anything "different" could be something we might fear, so maybe we are psychologically designed to think like this, whilst at the same time a "good Samaritan" or foreigner might save our bacon at times (how many of us would refuse life saving surgery from an overseas doctor who was the best in his or her field?).
> 
> "Racism" being malarkey, or wrong is something I'd agree with, whilst having been brought up in days when it was commonplace here in the UK, and had to realise later in life how foolish or wrong it was.



I used the modifier "mostly" because humans tend to be tentative and suspicious about all strangers, regardless of whether their physical traits are familiar.  Further , it seems reasonable that the incredibly rare person whose entire exposure has been to people of their own race, language, body type, height range, hair color, or eye color, might notice and perhaps reject, feel uncomfortable or be intrigued by someone whose appearance is different.  

On the other hand, since virtually every American alive today has had plenty of exposure to people of different races, whether by direct contact or through the media, I believe this professor's statement is his/her BS cover story for bigotry, hatred and resentment that is taught, not instinctive.


----------



## Shalimar (Oct 7, 2018)

StarSong said:


> I used the modifier "mostly" because humans tend to be tentative and suspicious about all strangers, regardless of whether their physical traits are familiar.  Further , it seems reasonable that the incredibly rare person whose entire exposure has been to people of their own race, language, body type, height range, hair color, or eye color, might notice and perhaps reject, feel uncomfortable or be intrigued by someone whose appearance is different.
> 
> On the other hand, since virtually every American alive today has had plenty of exposure to people of different races, whether by direct contact or through the media, I believe this professor's statement is his/her BS cover story for bigotry, hatred and resentment that is taught, not instinctive.


Qft.


----------



## C'est Moi (Oct 7, 2018)

StarSong said:


> ... I believe this professor's statement is his/her BS cover story for bigotry, hatred and resentment that is taught, not instinctive.



Of course, considering that KingsX is on a senior's forum and the professor in question may have been speaking ~50 years ago, mindsets have certainly changed.   I have no idea of the timing of the professor's comment but just "assuming" that time frame puts it in a slightly different light.   Still malarky, though.      (But I do think people are generally more comfortable when around others that are like themselves...whether in appearance, like-mindedness, age, etc.)


----------



## Sunny (Oct 7, 2018)

> (But I do think people are generally more comfortable when around  others that are like themselves...whether in appearance,  like-mindedness, age, etc.)



Probably true. But with most people in the modern world, as exposed as we are to people of all shapes, sizes, colors, etc. in person, on TV, or whatever, I think the similarities that mean anything in this
context are the similarities of like-mindedness, period. I couldn't care less what color anyone is, or the color of their hair or anything else... but I do care a lot about what their beliefs and values are.


----------



## grahamg (Oct 7, 2018)

Sunny said:


> C'est Moi wrote:
> 
> (But I do think people are generally more comfortable when around  others that are like themselves...whether in appearance,  like-mindedness, age, etc.)
> 
> ...



I'm put off people for all kinds of reasons these days (probably based upon unfair snap conclusions or assumptions as to what they may be like).

An organisation in the UK called Round Table states in its "aims and objects" that it is for likeminded young men (its spread worldwide since humble beginnings in the 1930s, except the USA where there is apparently "The buffalos" instead).

I can probably still remember all six of the items always used to focus people's minds at each meeting if I try hard enough, but anyway the existence of that wonderful social and charity fund raising organisation is a testament to the soundness of your argument above  .


----------



## AprilT (Oct 7, 2018)

C'est Moi said:


> Of course, considering that KingsX is on a senior's forum and the professor in question may have been speaking ~50 years ago, mindsets have certainly changed.   I have no idea of the timing of the professor's comment but just "assuming" that time frame puts it in a slightly different light.   Still malarky, though.      (But I do think people are generally more comfortable when around others that are like themselves...whether in appearance, like-mindedness, age, etc.)



Quite right and it isn't rare for some professors to bring their own prejudices into their teachings past and present as well as some entire learning institutions who have a particular leaning one way or another.


----------



## Trade (Oct 7, 2018)

I'm a 71 year old white male.  

I'm pretty sure that if I had been born a black male and had to put up with the crap they have had to I would be either dead or in prison, most likely dead.


----------



## KingsX (Oct 8, 2018)

StarSong said:


> I believe this professor's statement is his/her BS cover story for bigotry, hatred and resentment that is taught, not instinctive.




Obviously you have no qualms about personally attacking another poster and making unfounded accusations for no other reason than you disagree with what was posted.


----------



## Shalimar (Oct 8, 2018)

Trade said:


> I'm a 71 year old white male.
> 
> I'm pretty sure that if I had been born a black male and had to put up with the crap they have had to I would be either dead or in prison, most likely dead.


Or a black female, perhaps?


----------



## StarSong (Oct 8, 2018)

KingsX said:


> Obviously you have no qualms about personally attacking another poster and making unfounded accusations for no other reason than you disagree with what was posted.



I attacked the professor's stance, not yours.  I didn't think you were supporting this statement.


----------



## rgp (Oct 8, 2018)

Trade said:


> I'm a 71 year old white male.
> 
> I'm pretty sure that if I had been born a black male and had to put up with the crap they have had to I would be either dead or in prison, most likely dead.




Exactly what [crap] do they have to put up with?


----------



## Sunny (Oct 8, 2018)

Oh come on, now really, rgp! :crying:


----------



## Trade (Oct 8, 2018)

Shalimar said:


> Or a black female, perhaps?



Can't imagine myself as a female. 

Just can't.


----------



## Trade (Oct 8, 2018)

rgp said:


> Exactly what [crap] do they have to put up with?


----------



## rgp (Oct 8, 2018)

Sunny said:


> Oh come on, now really, rgp! :crying:




  Yes really!....all they need do is behave, obey the law, work & pay taxes .....just like the rest of us.

BTW your cute little emoji doesn't move me in the least.


----------



## rgp (Oct 8, 2018)

Trade said:


> View attachment 57649



 We just had a half black president, & I'm watching a program hosted by a black man now.........so what's your point?........a picture of an actor? really? What does that even mean?


----------



## Trade (Oct 8, 2018)

rgp said:


> We just had a half black president, & I'm watching a program hosted by a black man now.........so what's your point?........a picture of an actor? really? What does that even mean?



It means I'm done talking to you.


----------



## applecruncher (Oct 8, 2018)

@ Trade

:lofl: :lofl: :lofl:

The TLJ pic is perfect.


----------



## StarSong (Oct 8, 2018)

Trade said:


> View attachment 57649



Talk about a picture saying a thousand words!  Well done, Trade!


----------



## rgp (Oct 8, 2018)

Trade said:


> It means I'm done talking to you.




Great !! works for me.


----------



## CarolfromTX (Oct 8, 2018)

Look. I go out every day and see people of all colors interacting peacefully and politely. I see lots of bi-racial couples and bi-racial children. Now. Do I still see color? I do. Does my daughter.? Well, not the same way I do, for sure. It's one of the first things I see. It's probably last on her list. And here's the important thing. It really doesn't matter to either of us. AT ALL. And I don't think it's unusual. Race is being used by certain people as a  wedge, and a hammer. In my daily life, I just don't see it. Are there examples of people being unkind possibly being based on race? Maybe, especially if you're looking for it to be that. But it could just as easily be ill treatment because someone's being a jerk. So I think if we gave it half a chance, it would go away almost entirely.


----------



## Keesha (Oct 8, 2018)

Sunny said:


> Oh come on, now really, rgp! :crying:





rgp said:


> BTW your cute little emoji doesn't move me in the least.


Hummmm... works for me! :lofl:


----------



## Trade (Oct 8, 2018)

It's very easy to find a white person that will tell you there is little or no racism in America. 

There are literally millions of them.


----------



## rgp (Oct 8, 2018)

trade said:


> it's very easy to find a white person that will tell you there is little or no racism in america.
> 
> There are literally millions of them.




and it is just as easy to find a black person to tell you how unfair life is.....and how tough they have it.


----------



## applecruncher (Oct 8, 2018)

Trade said:


> It's very easy to find a white person that will tell you there is little or no racism in America.
> 
> There are literally millions of them.




Yes. And it's almost just as easy to find white people who shrug and say "everybody is racist".  

And, it's also relatively easy to find white people who say "if you black people would just do as you're told there wouldn't be a problem.".   Many think it, but quite a few come out and say it...here at SF and elsewhere.


----------



## rgp (Oct 8, 2018)

applecruncher said:


> Yes. And it's almost just as easy to find white people who shrug and say "everybody is racist".
> 
> And, it's also relatively easy to find white people who say "if you black people would just do as you're told there wouldn't be a problem.".   Many think it, but quite a few come out and say it...here at SF and elsewhere.



And if they would indeed follow the law...their reported problems would be fewer.


----------



## Keesha (Oct 8, 2018)

rgp said:


> And if they would indeed follow the law...their reported problems would be fewer.



Really? :shrug: If it were only this simple. 
Unfortunately it’s not.


----------



## Keesha (Oct 8, 2018)

Trade said:


> It's very easy to find a white person that will tell you there is little or no racism in America.
> 
> There are literally millions of them.



Unfortunately this is a true fact. 
Sometimes it’s embarrassing being white.


----------



## Gary O' (Oct 8, 2018)

rgp said:


> ....all they need do is behave, obey the law, work & pay taxes .....just like the rest of us.



It would be true…in a nice world

Unfortunately, here on earth, some behind the badge, or in authority, interpret _*‘the law’ *_a bit differently for those of another color.
I found this so in the south, over fifty years ago.

I could be quite explicit as to events I witnessed, but it serves no purpose here.

As this thread has proved my take on threads concerning race issues;
Nobody does a forehead slap, and reverses their thinking.
They just state their stance….over…and over….and over again.

I would like to think there are less racists these days
…I would like to

Can't


----------



## applecruncher (Oct 8, 2018)

Newsflash:  racism has little to do with obeying what a cop says.

As I've said before, it goes way beyond that.  Those pretending they don't realize that does not change diddly squat.

btw most welfare recipients and tax evaders are WHITE.  :whome:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-welfare-black-white-780252?amp=1


----------



## rgp (Oct 8, 2018)

Keesha said:


> Really? :shrug: If it were only this simple.
> Unfortunately it’s not.



Really?....why isn't it?


----------



## rgp (Oct 8, 2018)

applecruncher said:


> Neswflash:  racism has nothing to do with obeying what a cop says.
> 
> As I've said before, it goes way beyond that.  Blockheads pretending they don't realize that does not change diddly squat.
> 
> ...




    "racism has nothing to do with obeying what a cop says."

   Never said it did...I said if they would obey the LAW...their problems would be far fewer. 

   "btw most welfare recipients and tax evaders are WHITE."


 I never said that either, I merely said that we all should .

  "Blockheads pretending they don't realize that does not change diddly squat."

 And if the 'blockhead' remark is aimed at me?.....Let's talk about morons that refuse to see that behaving does indeed matter.


----------



## rgp (Oct 8, 2018)

Gary O' said:


> It would be true…in a nice world
> 
> Unfortunately, here on earth, some behind the badge, or in authority, interpret _*‘the law’ *_a bit differently for those of another color.
> I found this so in the south, over fifty years ago.
> ...




 I repeat my stance because it is what I see daily & have seen all my life.

   "Unfortunately, here on earth, some behind the badge, or in authority, interpret _*‘the law’ *_a bit differently for those of another color.
I found this so in the south, over fifty years ago."

   I couldn't disagree more....


----------



## Keesha (Oct 8, 2018)

Gary O' said:


> It would be true…in a nice world
> 
> Unfortunately, here on earth, some behind the badge, or in authority, interpret _*‘the law’ *_a bit differently for those of another color.
> I found this so in the south, over fifty years ago.
> ...


I don’t live  in the U.S. and don’t really follow the news  but I think one would have to have their head in the sand to not acknowledge extreme racism the further south you go. I’ve got a friend who lives in Oklahoma and from what she tells me, racism down there is off the charts. Some of the stories she tells me are like movie themes but they are really happening. 

I feel very fortunate to live in a less racist part of the world and really feel for those who have to deal with racism on  a daily base. My in laws are black and deal with racism. It’s VERY real.


----------



## rgp (Oct 8, 2018)

Keesha said:


> I don’t live  in the U.S. and don’t really follow the news  but I think one would have to have their head in the sand to not acknowledge extreme racism the further south you go. I’ve got a friend who lives in Oklahoma and from what she tells me, racism down there is off the charts. Some of the stories she tells me are like movie themes but they are really happening.
> 
> I feel very fortunate to live in a less racist part of the world and really feel for those who have to deal with racism on  a daily base. My in laws are black and deal with racism. It’s VERY real.




 Just what is racism too you / your in laws?


----------



## applecruncher (Oct 8, 2018)

Whites are and always have received most govt welfare benefits.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-whites/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.a49b53a1685b

Sad that some are too ashamed to admit it.


----------



## DaveA (Oct 8, 2018)

I'm not sure that whites or minorities receive most govt. welfare benefits, but I think rather that most poor people do.  

Along with huge corporations that also siphon off billions in government give-a-ways, always by our bought and paid for legislators.  The latter being the more criminal in my mind as that is pure greed and has nothing to do with family survival.


----------



## rgp (Oct 8, 2018)

applecruncher said:


> Whites are and always have received most govt welfare benefits.
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-whites/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.a49b53a1685b
> 
> Sad that some are too ashamed to admit it.



 No shame at all, there are more of us...what's ratio/percentage ?


----------



## Keesha (Oct 8, 2018)

rgp said:


> Just what is racism too you / your in laws?



What is racism to me? 
It means that one race believes their race to be superior to another’s  race so treat them with this judgement in mind. 
What racism means to my in laws you’d have to ask them. My own parents are prejudiced against my own sister in law and it’s most certainly based on her colour. The things she says I’m embarrassed by and since she’s starting to become a bit lucid I almost feel like I’ve got to be extra careful what she might let slip out. My mother has kicked a Pakistan woman in the behind at a store before because the person was in front of her at the cash register line up. I’ve told her she’s lucky she wasn’t charged with assault which she laughs at. 

I try very hard not to be prejudice against any race but at times I fail too. 
Its sometimes difficult to be completely unbiased but that’s the brutal truth about humanity. 
We’re FAR from perfect.


----------



## Keesha (Oct 8, 2018)

I will also say that I’m exceptionally proud of my biracial niece who is an airplane mechanic. She is the only woman working at the airport and she is consistently getting promoted. She doesn’t allow racism to interfere with her life’ goals & plans. She’s a real trouper; has more power tools than her dad. YES!!! :yes: Did I mention just how PROUD I am of her? Lol


----------



## Linda (Oct 9, 2018)

I believe that racism is NOT on the decline.


----------



## KingsX (Oct 9, 2018)

.

As Jesus said about the end of this age... society today is a repeat of the evil "days of Noah" and "days of Lot"... and will share the same fate.


----------



## JimW (Oct 9, 2018)

applecruncher said:


> Newsflash:  racism has little to do with obeying what a cop says.
> 
> As I've said before, it goes way beyond that.  Those pretending they don't realize that does not change diddly squat.
> 
> ...





applecruncher said:


> Whites are and always have received most govt welfare benefits.
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-whites/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.a49b53a1685b
> 
> Sad that some are too ashamed to admit it.



The racism issue aside, using the numbers this way is misleading. In the US the majority of people are white, so it stands to reason that white's would be at the top of most any category you want to use. The only way to make these numbers a true view of each segment of the population is to use "per capita"  numbers for each group involved.



DaveA said:


> *I'm not sure that whites or minorities receive most  govt. welfare benefits, but I think rather that most poor people do.  *
> 
> Along with huge corporations that also siphon off billions in government  give-a-ways, always by our bought and paid for legislators.  The latter  being the more criminal in my mind as that is pure greed and has  nothing to do with family survival.



You hit the nail on the head Dave, it's more about economics than it is anything else. Poor people receive the most welfare benefits, have higher crime rates, lower levels of education, etc. Until this aspect is corrected, the cycle will keep repeating itself.


----------



## Gary O' (Oct 9, 2018)

rgp said:


> I repeat my stance because it is what I see daily & have seen all my life.
> 
> "Unfortunately, here on earth, some behind the badge, or in authority, interpret _*‘the law’ *_a bit differently for those of another color.
> I found this so in the south, over fifty years ago."
> ...



Somehow that makes me feel good


----------



## rgp (Oct 9, 2018)

JimW said:


> The racism issue aside, using the numbers this way is misleading. In the US the majority of people are white, so it stands to reason that white's would be at the top of most any category you want to use. The only way to make these numbers a true view of each segment of the population is to use "per capita"  numbers for each group involved.
> 
> 
> 
> You hit the nail on the head Dave, it's more about economics than it is anything else. Poor people receive the most welfare benefits, have higher crime rates, lower levels of education, etc. Until this aspect is corrected, the cycle will keep repeating itself.



 Much of what you say revolves around education, as you noted. So just how do we correct this? 

 {We} cannot change a persons self respect / self esteem . Only they can do that , and until [they] do....nothing will change. 

 We have kids that admire the local drug dealer as being successful. They even emulate them in their behavior & dress. As long as that continues , nothing changes. 

There is a mood in this country that continues to take a 'softer' approach to law enforcement. IMO that is exactly the reverse of what is needed . 

Two improvements IMO, either legalize most wanted drugs, which will remove their street value, which will make the dealers look for another way. Or YES I'll say it, make drug dealing a capital punishment crime....and DO NOT let them sit in prison for decades, filling appeals....put the needle in their arm.


----------



## JimW (Oct 9, 2018)

rgp said:


> Much of what you say revolves around education, as you noted. So just how do we correct this?
> 
> {We} cannot change a persons self respect / self esteem . Only they can do that , and until [they] do....nothing will change.
> 
> ...



There is no easy answer to this problem and it cannot be done quickly, if at all. I believe (as you stated) it all starts with better education, which eventually leads to better jobs and more income. It will also require a mindset change for an entire class of people who have been born into poverty and see no way out. I know one thing for sure, to have any chance at achieving this goal it will require an enormous sum of taxpayer money and that will be a very large stumbling block right out of the gate. Sadly, it's cheaper (short term) to keep people poor than it is to attempt to remedy the situation.

The drug problem is another complex situation with no easy answers. I do not agree that drug dealing should be a capital crime.


----------



## applecruncher (Oct 9, 2018)

> The racism issue aside



No.  The thread topic is racism.  Trying to inject economics doesn't change the facts.

Smoke and mirrors.  :whome:


----------



## peppermint (Oct 9, 2018)

I agree, except, most of us have had an unfair life sometime or another...So, I wouldn't make only Black people that have been unfair.....

Just my opinion.....


----------



## JimW (Oct 9, 2018)

applecruncher said:


> No.  The thread topic is racism.  Trying to inject economics doesn't change the facts.
> 
> Smoke and mirrors.  :whome:



It doesn't matter what topic is being discussed. When you attempt to show which demographic of people use more of a certain gov't subsidy, you must use per capita numbers to have any realistic outcome. If you don't use per capita numbers, then most of the outcomes will go to the demographic with the highest population. 

To say that white's as a whole have received the most welfare benefits in the US is no different than saying people that have a drivers license have the most auto accidents. Both are very obvious because they have the highest percentages of people in that category. When you break it down into per capita numbers, the outcomes can be very different. When white's make up over 76% of the US population and blacks make up almost 14% of the US population, it's pretty much a no brainer that white's will use more of just about anything over blacks as a whole.


----------



## rgp (Oct 9, 2018)

JimW said:


> There is no easy answer to this problem and it cannot be done quickly, if at all. I believe (as you stated) it all starts with better education, which eventually leads to better jobs and more income. It will also require a mindset change for an entire class of people who have been born into poverty and see no way out. I know one thing for sure, to have any chance at achieving this goal it will require an enormous sum of taxpayer money and that will be a very large stumbling block right out of the gate. Sadly, it's cheaper (short term) to keep people poor than it is to attempt to remedy the situation.
> 
> The drug problem is another complex situation with no easy answers. I do not agree that drug dealing should be a capital crime.




  "I know one thing for sure, to have any chance at achieving this goal it will require an enormous sum of taxpayer money"

 Why?....why should [we] be required to pay even more? Why can't they go to the same schools we did?

 How'bout we bring back truancy regulations? And truancy officers? And truancy punishment that INCLUDES the parents? Go to school , or go to juvenile detention. Sentence the parents to community service? Or after hours service [in] the school.


----------



## JimW (Oct 9, 2018)

rgp said:


> "I know one thing for sure, to have any chance at achieving this goal it will require an enormous sum of taxpayer money"
> 
> *Why?....why should [we] be required to pay even more? Why can't they go to the same schools we did?*
> 
> How'bout we bring back truancy regulations? And truancy officers? And truancy punishment that INCLUDES the parents? Go to school , or go to juvenile detention. Sentence the parents to community service? Or after hours service [in] the school.



I'm not saying this as an insult, so please don't take it that way. I think your mindset towards the problem (which is a popular one) _is_ part of the problem. You are discounting the problem right from the start by thinking everyone has the same opportunities that you or I had, they simply don't. We are talking about changing the socioeconomic status of approx 43 million people that have lived in poverty for multiple generations. There is no template for this and there is no "one size fits all". To say "they should do it like we did" would keeping the status quo and that's not working.


----------



## AprilT (Oct 9, 2018)

Interesting how a thread on the question of does racism still exist becomes a thread targeted toward one particular group of people as being less than and needing assistance from the govt.

We could easily turn this into asking about hill people or slap labels of lowest levels of humanity as those being some of the worst drug users and how much govt assistance must be used to clean up these communities to set many youth and adults back on track.  Places where crime lurks around many corners or quietly in homes where it's only whispered about as not to shame rich families, areas where you won't see hardly one person of color.   But still where horrendous crimes are committed to procure these drugs by sellers and users. 

We can go all kinds of ways off topic, but, it won't change the fact that racism exist no matter how much a few want to skirt the issue to blame those who experience for no reason other than the skin their in and nothing else.  The reasons vary from person to person, are there some people who bring on problems to themselves, nobody denies that, but the overall issues of racism started and continue for reasons other that the reasons some are trying to deflect the topic to.  But good try.


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## JimW (Oct 9, 2018)

AprilT said:


> Interesting how a thread on the question of does racism still exist becomes a thread targeted toward one particular group of people as being less than and needing assistance from the govt.
> 
> We could easily turn this into asking about hill people or slap labels of lowest levels of humanity as those being some of the worst drug users and how much govt assistance must be used to clean up these communities to set many youth and adults back on track.  Places where crime lurks around many corners or quietly in homes where it's only whispered about as not to shame rich families, areas where you won't see hardly one person of color.   But still where horrendous crimes are committed to procure these drugs by sellers and users.
> 
> We can go all kinds of ways off topic, but, it won't change the fact that racism exist no matter how much a few want to skirt the issue to blame those who experience for no reason other than the skin their in and nothing else.  The reasons vary from person to person, are there some people who bring on problems to themselves, nobody denies that, but the overall issues of racism started and continue for reasons other that the reasons some are trying to deflect the topic to.  But good try.



I think it depends on what you want to take away from this thread. I see mostly positive comments about the racism issue in this tread, most people including myself have agreed that racism exists and is still a problem. There will always be detractors for any issue, but they are certainly not the majority here. To think that a thread about racism would not break off into sub-topics and/or turn negative at some point is a bit naive imo.


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## AprilT (Oct 9, 2018)

JimW said:


> I think it depends on what you want to take away from this thread. I see mostly positive comments about the racism issue in this tread, most people including myself have agreed that racism exists and is still a problem. There will always be detractors for any issue, but they are certainly not the majority here. To think that a thread about racism would not break off into sub-topics and/or turn negative at some point is a bit naive imo.



And if that's your only take away from what I wrote , then I would say I'm not the one who's naive.  However, you are as welcome to your opinion as any other.


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## Trade (Oct 9, 2018)

AprilT said:


> Interesting how a thread on the question of does racism still exist becomes a thread targeted toward one particular group of people as being less than and needing assistance from the govt.



Which pretty much proves that racism exists.


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## AprilT (Oct 9, 2018)

Trade said:


> Which pretty much proves that racism exists.



Exactly!


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## JimW (Oct 9, 2018)

AprilT said:


> And if that's your only take away from what I wrote , then I would say I'm not the one who's naive.  However, you are as welcome to your opinion as any other.



What I took away from your post was that you are choosing to focus on the few negative posts in this thread, rather than seeing the many positive ones.


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## StarSong (Oct 9, 2018)

Sad to say, but racism is endemic in this country.  It's so pervasive that most whites barely even notice it.  Many of us desperately wish it weren't so, but there's not getting around the truth.  

Conquerors slaughter, enslave, marginalize and exploit people by convincing themselves that they are superior to those who get in their way.  European Americans have been doing this since Columbus sailed in.  The ways in which our country legally permitted its citizenry to treat indigenous populations, Africans, Hispanics, Asians and various ethnic groups is beyond shameful.  America continues to pay for its ugly past (and not so attractive present) and likely will do so for many generations to come.            

We cannot begin to fix what we don't acknowledge.


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## JimW (Oct 9, 2018)

AprilT said:


> Interesting how a thread on the question of does racism still exist becomes a thread targeted toward one particular group of people as being less than and needing assistance from the govt.



After re-reading pages 1 & 2 of this thread, the person who targeted one particular group (blacks) and steered the conversation that way was you. There was only one mention of blacks in any of the posts until you started on it. And the one mention of blacks before you was only in reference to what most people think of when racism is mentioned, ie: white and black. And I don't see any reference to blacks needing gov't assistance in any post.


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## Trade (Oct 9, 2018)

I've probably posted this before, but I really love this clip by Louis CK. 

He really captures the way I feel about this issue.


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## Keesha (Oct 9, 2018)

I don’t see anyone using code words here


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## StarSong (Oct 9, 2018)

I think most would agree that the most egregious racism in America is focused toward Blacks and Hispanics.  Whether or not anyone typed in those words, it's certainly been the undercurrent of this thread.

@Trade - I LOVE this clip.  Haven't seen it in a while, but oh how true it is.


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## Keesha (Oct 9, 2018)

In our neck of the woods I ‘think’ the Muslins are the race most judged, but I honestly don’t know since I live in a rural area where racial problems aren’t an issue. I’m not saying they don’t exist but here in Canada we are internationally known to be multicultural so are used to sharing with many different cultures.


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## Olivia (Oct 9, 2018)

We know that racism will one day be no more as we start to live more and more among all of us by color and culture. I know it will happen, many years down the road for most of the world, but I know it's possible because I'm living it.


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## Olivia (Oct 9, 2018)

Olivia said:


> We know that racism will one day be no more as we start to live more and more among all of us by color and culture. I know it will happen, many years down the road for most of the world, but I know it's possible because I'm living it.



And I want to add something, too, about what some posters here say about the American Black race. There are, yes, Black Americans who do live in very poor areas of the U.S. but there are also the majority of Black Americans who live middle class and higher demographics just like the  White middle class and higher people. I say STOP! always trying to relate your opinions to those in the poverty and and high crime areas. That is NOT the norm, so dammit, STOP that!


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## Olivia (Oct 9, 2018)

I'm not sure, but I think I posted something.


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## rgp (Oct 9, 2018)

JimW said:


> I'm not saying this as an insult, so please don't take it that way. I think your mindset towards the problem (which is a popular one) _is_ part of the problem. You are discounting the problem right from the start by thinking everyone has the same opportunities that you or I had, they simply don't. We are talking about changing the socioeconomic status of approx 43 million people that have lived in poverty for multiple generations. There is no template for this and there is no "one size fits all". To say "they should do it like we did" would keeping the status quo and that's not working.




   "I think your mindset towards the problem (which is a popular one) _is part of the problem. You are discounting the problem right from the start by thinking everyone has the same opportunities that you or I had, they simply don't."


_   You, nor anyone will ever convince me of that....

  They are born the same as we are, when age appropriate they can apply for school the same as we do, once educated they can apply for a vocation / profession, career the same as we did & do. 

 We no longer live in, will never again live in, a Jim Crow / KKK supporting society. 
 If they choose to live on, blaming something from 150 +/- years ago for their self-felt short comings ? That's on them. If they want to succeed and make a decent life for themselves? It's out there, all they need do is go get it.


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## john19485 (Oct 9, 2018)

The only solution to this problem is, drop the bomb, then we can all eat lunch together in heaven.


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## Olivia (Oct 9, 2018)

john19485 said:


> The only solution to this problem is, drop the bomb, then we can all eat lunch together in heaven.



No, the solution is for these old fart asses to die out. The rest of us (the younger minded ones) don't need to. So don't go making us all die from The Bomb.


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## rgp (Oct 9, 2018)

Olivia said:


> No, the solution is for these old fart asses to die out. The rest of us (the younger minded ones) don't need to. So don't go making us all die from The Bomb.




 So......you have no problem wishing death on a segment of our society? The same segment that you seem to see as vile for promoting better behavior....interesting.


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## Olivia (Oct 9, 2018)

rgp said:


> So......you have no problem wishing death on a segment of our society? The same segment that you seem to see as vile for promoting better behavior....interesting.



I asked no such wish of death, except for natural death, for anyone. Read it again.


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## rgp (Oct 9, 2018)

Olivia said:


> I asked no such wish of death, except for natural death, for anyone. Read it again.




 No need to read it again....

    "the solution is for these old fart asses to die out"

you are offering the death of a segment of society,as a solution to a problem.

 And you seem to favor it over a change in behavior.


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## Trade (Oct 9, 2018)

Keesha said:


> I don’t see anyone using code words here



Is that in response to a post of mine? 

If so, please be advised that I have since edited it.


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## Olivia (Oct 9, 2018)

rgp said:


> No need to read it again....
> 
> "the solution is for these old fart asses to die out"
> 
> ...



Read the post again.


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## Keesha (Oct 9, 2018)

Trade said:


> Is that in response to a post of mine?
> 
> If so, please be advised that I have since edited it.
> 
> View attachment 57694



Well at least you have a sense of humour about it .:laugh: :thumbsup:


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## applecruncher (Oct 9, 2018)

Olivia said:


> And I want to add something, too, about what some posters here say about the American Black race. There are, yes, Black Americans who do live in very poor areas of the U.S. but there are also the majority of Black Americans who live middle class and higher demographics just like the  White middle class and higher people. I say STOP! always trying to relate your opinions to those in the poverty and and high crime areas. That is NOT the norm, so dammit, STOP that!



:clap:


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