# Gun madness but thankfully no-one killed.



## Warrigal (Jul 21, 2014)

Picture this - An Australian couple are driving on a lonely road connecting Adelaide and Perth. They are crossing the Nullabor Plain (Null arbor = without a tree). Another car comes up behind them and there is "a minor rear end collision". I'm not sure what that means because crossing the Nullabor is usually a high speed journey.

Anyhow, the second driver doesn't stop. Instead he takes off at speed without exchanging driver's licence details.

The rear ended driver, one Michael Craig Anderson, who is a 53 year old technical college teacher is angry about having his holiday spoiled. He is nervous, frustrated, and very upset that his wife, a nervous lady, is also upset.

In Anderson's own words, _"We were both really scared shitless. Here's this creep, just comes out of nowhere and ruins our perfect holiday and just drives off like it's got nothing to do with him." _So he takes off after him at 200 km per hour (124 mph) to get the registration plate details

Somewhere in this mad chase, the second car nearly sideswipes Anderson's car, although I'm finding this difficult to understand given that Anderson is the follower. Then Anderson gets mad.

Reaching under his seat he reaches for his gun bag which contains his revolver. His other guns, to be used for shooting feral goats, are in the boot (trunk to Americans). It isn't loaded so he waves it at the other driver to make him stop.

He doesn't stop. He drives away at speed, further proof of his aggression towards Anderson.

Time to load the revolver and start shooting,  meaning no harm, of course. Just a couple or rounds in the other driver's direction to calm the situation and to make him back off. 

Good plan, but the police diagreed. Anderson, a former mechanic in the Army with extensive training with guns and a gun association member, has been charged with firing five shots at another driver in July last year on the Eyre Highway, which links South Australia and Western Australia. Verdict yet to be handed down.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-07-...kes-stand-in-road-rage-shooting-trial/5612660

What's the appropriate verdict? 

*Not guilty ? *Let him off, let him keep his guns and write an article in his local paper praising him as a fearless hero.

*Guilty* of reckless endangerment of another person? Put him on a good behaviour bond of $5,000 with a suspended sentence of 3 months. Gun licences suspended for one year.

*Not guilty *on the grounds of temporary insanity ? Order anger management classes and ban him from owning guns in future.

Think up your own verdict and/or punishment. What would happen where you live.


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## JustBonee (Jul 21, 2014)

Why does this  remind me of the old Steven Spielberg movie  DUEL


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## Warrigal (Jul 21, 2014)

Haven't see that one. 
Did it end well? :excited:


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## SifuPhil (Jul 21, 2014)

Generally the way the law applies in a situation like this, at least over here, is that once the perp rear-ends you and takes off, the situation is ended. You're supposed to meekly talk to your insurance agent to fix the damage.

Pursuing the perp, especially at high speeds, and then waving a gun around is going to get you arrested. Actually discharging the firearm is going to get you even heavier sentencing.

I wouldn't say he's NOT guilty, but I also wouldn't make a big deal out it. No, he's not a hero (that term has lost most of its meaning for me), he's not an innocent and he should have had more sense than to start recklessly firing the gun like Yosemite Sam.

Slap a small fine on him and turn him loose - focus your energies on finding the clown that rear-ended him in the first place.


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## rkunsaw (Jul 21, 2014)

I would agree with Phil if I thought this was a true story. But we all know no one in Australia would ever have a gun under his seat.


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## SifuPhil (Jul 21, 2014)

Yeah, that was my first thought ... but I just went with the flow.


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## Warrigal (Jul 21, 2014)

rkunsaw said:


> I would agree with Phil if I thought this was a true story. But we all know no one in Australia would ever have a gun under his seat.


I can only assume that that is irony at work.

If not, here's the headline 





> *Michael Craig Anderson: Alleged shooter in high-speed road rage attack takes the stand*
> 
> By court reporter Loukas Founten
> Posted     3 hours 52 minutes ago
> ...



These are credible news sources.

Here's the other side of the story:



> [h=1]Driver phoned in panic for help as shots were fired in Eyre Highway road rage attack[/h]      By court reporter Loukas Founten
> Posted     Fri 18 Jul 2014, 1:24pm AEST
> 
> 
> ...



I note that the charge is now attempted murder.


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## SifuPhil (Jul 21, 2014)

Just on initial impressions it sounds like good ol' Zephatali is a liar - his little rant on the phone to the police sounds totally fabricated. If I were being shot at I wouldn't waste the breath to say "_I've never even seen a gun before_". Besides, if he truly hadn't seen a gun before how did he know that Mr. Anderson wasn't holding up a new breed of chock? 

It just _sounds_ all wrong ...


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## Warrigal (Jul 21, 2014)

Additional detail



> Police eventually caught up with both drivers separately.
> 
> They allegedly found a 0.357 Smith and Wesson Magnum revolver under the driver's seat in Anderson's car along with two other guns in the boot. Also in the boot, in a suitcase and wrapped in a handkerchief, was a speed loader, used to quickly load a firearm.
> 
> The speed loader had in it five spent cartridge cases and one live round, each compatible with the revolver.The court was told six other live rounds were found in a separate speed loader in the car's console. Mr Pearce said swabs taken from Anderson's hands by forensic experts showed traces of three chemical compounds that are emitted when a gun is fired.



I have no idea what a speed loader is but it must be useful when you are shooting feral goats with a revolver. :dunno:


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## Warrigal (Jul 21, 2014)

SifuPhil said:


> Just on initial impressions it sounds like good ol' Zephatali is a liar - his little rant on the phone to the police sounds totally fabricated. If I were being shot at I wouldn't waste the breath to say "_I've never even seen a gun before_". Besides, if he truly hadn't seen a gun before how did he know that Mr. Anderson wasn't holding up a new breed of chock?
> 
> It just _sounds_ all wrong ...


The trial will take about 6 days. I'll try to find the verdict and sentence for you.


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## JustBonee (Jul 21, 2014)

Dame Warrigal said:


> Haven't see that one.
> Did it end well? :excited:



Re the movie ... the rear ended driver wins.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0067023/synopsis?ref_=ttpl_pl_syn


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## SifuPhil (Jul 21, 2014)

Dame Warrigal said:


> The trial will take about 6 days. I'll try to find the verdict and sentence for you.



Thanks, Warri - I'd be real interested in knowing how this turns out. It seems to be a case of "He Said / He Said", so I guess it's all up to the courts now.


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## Warrigal (Jul 21, 2014)

SifuPhil said:


> Just on initial impressions it sounds like good ol' Zephatali is a liar - his little rant on the phone to the police sounds totally fabricated. If I were being shot at I wouldn't waste the breath to say "_I've never even seen a gun before_". Besides, if he truly hadn't seen a gun before how did he know that Mr. Anderson wasn't holding up a new breed of chock?
> 
> It just _sounds_ all wrong ...



It's not just snakes and spiders that are dangerous in the outback. If you've seen the movie Wolf Creek, it was based on a real outback serial killer, Bradley John Murdoch. Then there is Ivan Milat, the backpacker murderer. He disposed of his victims in a lonely forest in NSW.


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## hollydolly (Jul 21, 2014)

Sorry but as far as I'm concerned reading all this Anderson is the aggressor. Sure he was rear ended, and the first guy was totally at fault for that and leaving the scene, but suddenly we have this other guy who promotes not just himself but also his wife as  timid nervous, and scared shitless (his words)... creatures, yet he takes off like a bat out of hell after the other driver, waving a gun at him ...yeah right!! Exactly the type of response a nervous , terrified, timid person does all the time.

There can't have been much wrong with his car either after it had been rear ended otherwise he wouldn't have been able to chase the other driver at speeds of 124mph!! I think Anderson is unhinged to be honest with you!!


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## Warrigal (Jul 21, 2014)

Here's the reason why the revolver was under the seat.



> Giving evidence today, Anderson said he and his wife were on the third day of a planned three-day trip from WA to SA, to meet their granddaughter and “shoot feral goats” with her father.
> 
> He agreed he had three guns in his car that day, but insisted all were being carried in strict adherence “to WA and SA gun laws”.
> Anderson, a member of the Sporting Shooters Association of Australia, said his rifle and one of his handguns were locked in the boot of his car.
> ...



I have to keep emphasising that this man is an ex soldier and a member of the Sporting Shooters Assoc. And he teaches kids at TAFE. A conviction should result in him losing his job.


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## Davey Jones (Jul 21, 2014)

re:“The Smith & Wesson, or the baby if you like, she’s precious and she was under the seat,” he said. “Of an evening I would take her into the hotel room with me (so that) if the car got stolen I didn’t lose all my firearms.”

This man has serious issues.IMO

"her"?? how does he know its a female.


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## SifuPhil (Jul 21, 2014)

Davey Jones said:


> re:“The Smith & Wesson, or the baby if you like, she’s precious and she was under the seat,” he said. “Of an evening I would take her into the hotel room with me (so that) if the car got stolen I didn’t lose all my firearms.”
> 
> This man has serious issues.IMO
> 
> "her"?? how does he know its a female.



LOL!

I used to refer to my cars as my "precious babies" until my team of psychiatrists cured me.

This guy sounds a little too gung-ho ...


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## SeaBreeze (Jul 21, 2014)

I think if somebody rear-ended me, then took off in a hit-and-run, I'd focus on getting the description of the car and driver to report it to the authorities.  Hopefully the authorities would do their job and seek out the offender.  Did the guy who initially ran into the back of his car get any kind of a ticket or fine at all?  I agree, the use of the gun was irresponsible and uncalled for, he should be fined and let go with warning.


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## Falcon (Jul 21, 2014)

I think it's a novelty that some folks assign a gender to their possessions (cars, guns etc.)

However, I've noticed that all large ships at sea are FEMALE.  SHE/HER.

Even WHALES, as in, "Thar she blows !"


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## SifuPhil (Jul 21, 2014)

Falcon said:


> However, I've noticed that all large ships at sea are FEMALE.  SHE/HER.



Except in Russia - there they call them HE/HIM.


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## Denise1952 (Jul 21, 2014)

I just think the whole thing is nuts!  I think the guy with his wife that got hit by the other driver, should have stopped, reported it and left it to the law.  That vigilante stuff is taking the law into our own hands, and as tempting as it might be, I don't think it's smart.  Plus the fact Anderson was putting his wife in danger.  He made himself "worse" then the guy that hit him.

By the same token, too many people are getting away with murder.


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## Warrigal (Jul 21, 2014)

> I think the guy with his wife that got hit by the other driver, should have stopped, reported it and left it to the law.


That's what might happen on an ordinary road but out on the Nullabor plain there's nothing much to break up very long stretches of empty road. What surprises me is that there was any telephone signal down there. Perhaps an emergency call is all that is possible to make because I've found the signal between outback towns disappears completely.

http://www.australia.com/explore/itineraries/crossing-nullarbor.aspx


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## Denise1952 (Jul 21, 2014)

Dame Warrigal said:


> That's what might happen on an ordinary road but out on the Nullabor plain there's nothing much to break up very long stretches of empty road. What surprises me is that there was any telephone signal down there. Perhaps an emergency call is all that is possible to make because I've found the signal between outback towns disappears completely.
> 
> http://www.australia.com/explore/itineraries/crossing-nullarbor.aspx



Well, that is not too far from out in our mountains around here, no cell signals up there, but still, report the guy when you get to where you do have a signal.  And as I think I mentioned, people are getting away with things, and I can't blame people for "feeling" like they need to take the law into their own hands, I think it might be coming to that one day.  Maybe it is here, ok, I'm going to get my gun.  Damn it's a scarey world:help1:


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## Warrigal (Jul 21, 2014)

Plainly, the young man was very scared. He made the mistake of setting out without extra fuel and was running out of petrol. That's why he was driving slowly. He thought it would save fuel. Any decent person who came across him in those circumstances would offer help but the 53 yr old nut case played silly buggers by overtaking him, slowing down, then hitting the brakes, thereby causing the rear end collision himself. For whatever reason the young man panicked and drove away at speed, only to be pursued down a lonely road by a man waving a pistol. Eventually bullets started to fly. This is a Mad Max scenario in real life. 

Luckily so-one was hurt. I will try to keep up with the trial but it happened in South Australia and our newspapers in NSW are not likely to give it much coverage. However, Mr Google will reveal all if I ask nicely.


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## Denise1952 (Jul 21, 2014)

Dame Warrigal said:


> Plainly, the young man was very scared. He made the mistake of setting out without extra fuel and was running out of petrol. That's why he was driving slowly. He thought it would save fuel. Any decent person who came across him in those circumstances would offer help but the 53 yr old nut case played silly buggers by overtaking him, slowing down, then hitting the brakes, thereby causing the rear end collision himself. For whatever reason the young man panicked and drove away at speed, only to be pursued down a lonely road by a man waving a pistol. Eventually bullets started to fly. This is a Mad Max scenario in real life.
> 
> Luckily so-one was hurt. I will try to keep up with the trial but it happened in South Australia and our newspapers in NSW are not likely to give it much coverage. However, Mr Google will reveal all if I ask nicely.



I need to re-read it Dame, I am confused now.  I apologize, I misread a lot of things. denise


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## Denise1952 (Jul 21, 2014)

Dame Warrigal said:


> Plainly, the young man was very scared. He made the mistake of setting out without extra fuel and was running out of petrol. That's why he was driving slowly. He thought it would save fuel. Any decent person who came across him in those circumstances would offer help but the 53 yr old nut case played silly buggers by overtaking him, slowing down, then hitting the brakes, thereby causing the rear end collision himself. For whatever reason the young man panicked and drove away at speed, only to be pursued down a lonely road by a man waving a pistol. Eventually bullets started to fly. This is a Mad Max scenario in real life.
> 
> Luckily so-one was hurt. I will try to keep up with the trial but it happened in South Australia and our newspapers in NSW are not likely to give it much coverage. However, Mr Google will reveal all if I ask nicely.



So the 53 year old is the one with the wife and gun, right?  They are ass-ended by a guy that is low on fuel, and driving slowly?  How is the 53 year old supposed to help him if he takes off at high speed, like hit and run?  I missed something in this thread.  I didn't see where the 53 year old came up behind him first, and passed him, then hit his breaks to cause the rear-end.  Ok, I'll go read some more.  Maybe it was in that "second" scenario.  This second one I am still not in favor of the 53 year old though.  If the other story is what happened, he is an ass for sure.  Have I succeeded in confusing anyone else?  I hope so cause I hate to be confused alone, LOL!!


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## Denise1952 (Jul 21, 2014)

Bonnie said:


> Why does this  remind me of the old Steven Spielberg movie  DUEL



Now there was "an edge of your seat" movie!!  Dennis Weaver right?


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## Warrigal (Jul 21, 2014)

NWlady said:
			
		

> So the 53 year old is the one with the wife and gun, right?



Right, it's the 53 year old that the police have charged with attempted murder, not the young man. 
I've posted several links earlier and there are differences in the reports but the case is before the High Court of SA now and most of what I've posted earlier is supposedly from the mouth of the 53 yo with the gun. Make that 3 guns.

I was particularly intrigued by him saying that he never meant to hurt the young man because then he would have an out of control car in front of him. Very strange morality in that sentence although you can't fault his logic.


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## Denise1952 (Jul 21, 2014)

You did have everything posted Dame I just didn't read it all, or read it all right.  Even in the instance where he said someone pulled up and smacked him and his wife, he was wrong imo.  I mean, he says the guy took off, ok, so report it, but he added to the "alleged" crime by chasing the guy down.  You know it may have been one of those tailgate things too, man, people, including me get pissed off when someone tailgates you.  The guy could have been trying to stay close so he wouldn't be stranded out there alone, or trying to get the guys attention.

Keep us posted on the case, I am curious what comes out in the trial etc.?? denise


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## SifuPhil (Jul 22, 2014)

On the day that my wife and I were leaving New York for Pennsylvania we were coming down Route 9 through a lot of small towns. Now, Rt. 9 is single-lane each way through these towns, with a solid yellow line indicating "Do Not Pass".

I was driving, wife sitting in passenger seat, and this yahoo comes barreling down behind me on my bumper, blowing his horn like he was Gabriel. I guess he was in a big hurry, because I was doing the speed limit and it must have offended some sense of freedom or right to exceed the speed limit that he had, because I could see him getting all worked up, cursing and gesticulating with his hands.

Well, me being me, I soon became tired of him tailgating and I tapped the brakes. I saw the hood of his car take a nosedive as he slammed on _his_ brakes, then he accelerated to tailgate me again.

There we are driving at 35MPH through the quaint little towns bordering the Hudson River - Tarrytown, Ossining, Dobbs Ferry - and the pedestrians are treated to the spectacle of a red Toyota seeming to be attached to a black Corvette like a pilot fish to a whale. Mr. Yahoo finally can't take it anymore and decides to power around in front of me and cut me off.

Although my car was a convertible I had the top up and the windows rolled up (it was November and a little brisk), and Mr. Y came stomping back to my window huffing and puffing and cursing and screaming. I sat serenely staring at him, further enraging him in the process (ain't I a stinker?) until he totally lost it and performed the ONE action that I could never, ever forgive.

He spit on my Corvette. Right on the driver's-side window. 

Now even though a 'Vette's body is made of fiberglass, the underlying framework is good ol' American steel. Recalling this, I slammed my door into Mr. Y's legs and was out of the car in a flash. Unfortunately he chose to stop his attack at that point as he was rolling around in the middle of Rt. 9, wailing and moaning about his poor legs. I got back into my car and drove off without comment, my wife's pale face the only indication that anything had ever happened.

It was a fitting goodbye to New York, a reminder of what daily life on the roads there was like.


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## Denise1952 (Jul 22, 2014)

SifuPhil said:


> On the day that my wife and I were leaving New York for Pennsylvania we were coming down Route 9 through a lot of small towns. Now, Rt. 9 is single-lane each way through these towns, with a solid yellow line indicating "Do Not Pass".
> 
> I was driving, wife sitting in passenger seat, and this yahoo comes barreling down behind me on my bumper, blowing his horn like he was Gabriel. I guess he was in a big hurry, because I was doing the speed limit and it must have offended some sense of freedom or right to exceed the speed limit that he had, because I could see him getting all worked up, cursing and gesticulating with his hands.
> 
> ...



You're divorced now right Phil  I can't say I would have done it differently, I wasn't there.  The one difference would have been, unlike you, I would not have gotten away with it, and I'd probably be writing you all from my prison cell.  Would I still get my internet in jail?  That's a biggy I'd be thinking about before I pulled something like that


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## SifuPhil (Jul 22, 2014)

nwlady said:


> You're divorced now right Phil



I prefer to think of it as _emancipation_, but yes, I am. :angel:



> I can't say I would have done it differently, I wasn't there.  The one difference would have been, unlike you, I would not have gotten away with it, and I'd probably be writing you all from my prison cell.  Would I still get my internet in jail?  That's a biggy I'd be thinking about before I pulled something like that



Well, perhaps oddly enough my martial arts teacher (my _Sifu_) used to teach us self-defense from some very odd positions, and sitting in a car was thankfully one of them. 

I wouldn't do a crime unless they had better than 5MB/sec. available in jail ...


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## Warrigal (Jul 29, 2014)

The verdict is guilty of attempted murder.
The jury took 4 hours to arrive at this decision.

Anderson has been remanded in custody.
Sentencing will take place on September 9.

http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/wes...004416529?nk=89f216272bdec6912d950102a3ba588b


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## SifuPhil (Jul 29, 2014)

I'm actually surprised by this verdict. I would have thought they'd give him attempted manslaughter or misadventure or something like that. And now the story seems to have changed - that Anderson was doing the tailgating and ramming, not Walsh.

Thanks for the update, Warri.


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## Ralphy1 (Jul 29, 2014)

I won't be renting a car on my OZ vacation...


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## Warrigal (Jul 29, 2014)

:danger: Just avoid the Nullabor Plain, the Birdsville track and any road in the Northern Territory and you should be OK.

On second thoughts, fly everywhere. :bigwink:


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## SifuPhil (Jul 29, 2014)

Your Nullabor Plain sounds like our South Bronx ...


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## Warrigal (Jul 29, 2014)

:lofl:


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## SifuPhil (Jul 29, 2014)




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## Warrigal (Jul 29, 2014)

Speaking of gun madness. Our laws may have been successful in curtailing gun massacres, they aren't much use against crazy old men with a licence to own a gun, like this 79 yo farmer at Croppa Creek near Moree in NSW

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/ne...-at-croppa-creek/story-fni0cx12-1227006466791

*



			A STATE government environmental worker has been shot dead on a property at Croppa Creek, 65km north-east of Moree.
		
Click to expand...

*


> Police said the man, 51, believed to be a father-of-six, was gunned down after he was serving a notice on an elderly man believed to be illegally clearing vegetation. Another worker was with the victim from the NSW Office of Environment and Heritage was understood to be in shock but is otherwise uninjured.
> 
> The elderly man had been served previous notices for illegal clearing on his property and around the Croppa Creek area.
> 
> ...


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## Warrigal (Jul 30, 2014)

He had been charged with murder and remanded without bail.



> *Man, 79, charged with murdering environment officer after alleged shooting at Moree, NSW*
> 
> By Lucy McNally
> 
> ...


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## SifuPhil (Jul 30, 2014)

See? SEE?!? 

You folks are just as crazy as us!


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## Warrigal (Jul 30, 2014)

:coffeelaugh: Never said we weren't.


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## SifuPhil (Jul 30, 2014)

Dame Warrigal said:


> :coffeelaugh: Never said we weren't.



Oh.

...

... okay.


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