# An embarassing admission



## Josiah (Apr 25, 2015)

I would say that my memory of the distant past was maybe a little sub par, but not grossly defective. Still I was really chagrined when I tried to recall proposing to my first wife. I couldn't come up with thinking about the decision to do it. I'm not the kind of guy who would propose marriage on a whim. I mean I would have thought about it. And you would certainly think I'd remember actually doing it? Where did it take place? Did I get down of one knee? Did I have a ring? I can't remember anything. I mean this is scary. What's wrong with me?


----------



## hollydolly (Apr 26, 2015)

Nothing is wrong with you at all Josiah IMO..I understand you would think you'd remember it due to agonising over it for a long time..however I actually don't remember my present o/h proposing to me either..I know he did, and what's worse it was only 15 years ago, and I can't even remember what songs we had played at our wedding ceremony, and neither can he isn't that awful. ? we know they were Folk songs, but what they were we can't remember., although we can remember the registrar saying how beautiful they were .. Yours was much much longer ago than that, so I wouldn't go fretting  about your forgetfulness if I were you..


----------



## Ameriscot (Apr 26, 2015)

Don't worry about it Josiah.  I'm trying not to beat myself up over forgetting many things.  Husband is even worse.  He swears up and down we did not to the cinema to see The Book Thief last year.


----------



## merlin (Apr 26, 2015)

Ameriscot said:


> Don't worry about it Josiah.  I'm trying not to beat myself up over forgetting many things.  Husband is even worse.  He swears up and down we did not to the cinema to see The Book Thief last year.



Memories are notoriously unreliable. I often swear something did or didn't happen only to find out later I was wrong. I can't remember my proposal either Josiah or even if it was me   I wouldn't worry at all, I even have trouble remembering my grandchildren's birthdays and they are much more recent.


----------



## Josiah (Apr 26, 2015)

Thanks Holly and Annie for telling me I'm not the only amnesiac out there. My suspicion it that there is a psychological explanation to the effect that my mind decided that this life episode should be encased in concrete and dropped off the end of a pier.


----------



## ndynt (Apr 26, 2015)

Josiah, like all the others, there are segments of my life that I cannot remember.  Despite trying very hard.  Never read of it being substantiated, yet I believe after a certain age we have so many memories that our mind becomes selective and only retains only a portion of them. For, as we age the recent memories do become more difficult to bring up....yet those long term memories, that we have run through our minds numerous times, are very vivid.    
What kind of alarms me is the inability to remember words/names at times.  And the spelling of words.   Early dementia?


----------



## NancyNGA (Apr 26, 2015)

ndynt, when I was a kid I read _A Study in Scarlet _(Sherlock Homes) and there was a passage in there about what you describe that scared me and stuck with me all these years.  

Arthur Conan Doyle quote:

_“I consider that a man's brain originally is like a little empty attic, and you have to stock it with such furniture as you choose. A fool takes in all the lumber of every sort that he comes across, so that the knowledge which might be useful to him gets crowded out, or at best is jumbled up with a lot of other things, so that he has a difficulty in laying his hands upon it. Now the skillful workman is very careful indeed as to what he takes into his brain-attic. He will have nothing but the tools which may help him in doing his work, but of these he has a large assortment, and all in the most perfect order. It is a mistake to think that that little room has elastic walls and can distend to any extent. Depend upon it there comes a time when for every addition of knowledge you forget something that you knew before. It is of the highest importance, therefore, not to have useless facts elbowing out the useful ones. (A Study in Scarlet)” 
_
I don't think I buy that theory now, though.


----------



## Cookie (Apr 26, 2015)

I began to remember so much more after I did an exercise that took a while, but seemed to have worked.

I went through my entire life with a timeline, outlining everything that happened and significant events by date and place.  It was hard because I had moved around so much and everything was like a big mess like a ball of twisted wool.  It seems to have done the trick, because now I can pretty much go back anywhere in my life, time or place have a complete movie of that time.  

Memoir writing exercises help too.... so many techniques and methods -- find a word, any word and associate everything you know about it.... and write a page or two in a journal.  I recommend reading some books on memoir writing for anyone interested.  Amazing.... but  at your own risk if there are things you'd rather not think about. This is the way it is with my sister, who claims she doesn't remember anything about anything and doesn't like thinking about the past.  I love reading memoirs written by regular people, like us, not famous.... and how they view their lives.


----------



## ndynt (Apr 26, 2015)

Nancy, interesting....but, seems so self limiting. Like going to a banquet, with a McDonald's hamburger sack.  So much in the world to think about and relish.   Personally, I am too curious to prevent my mind from exploring. 
Cookie, I too would prefer not to remember portions of my life.  Even though they still invade my memories.   I have always loved auto-biographies vs novels.  For the same reasons you love memoirs.   Why Margaret Meade became my idol, at a very young age.


----------



## Cookie (Apr 26, 2015)

Nona, that's a very good way of putting it - invade my memories.  That happens to me all the time - sometimes like re-runs of a bad tv show.  I never read Margaret Meade, but now I'm curious to try her.  Thanks.


----------



## merlin (Apr 26, 2015)

ndynt said:


> I have always loved auto-biographies vs novels.  For the same reasons you love memoirs.   Why Margaret Meade became my idol, at a very young age.



I love Diana Athill's books I have read them all starting with "Somewhere near the End" a recent one, Her life has been amazing and quite adventurous.

http://is.gd/a4IQPj


----------



## ndynt (Apr 26, 2015)

Interesting lady, Merlin. Thanks.  I shall have to see if my library or Kindle has her books.  Her saying, when she was young....forty was old.  So true.  If still so, some of us are not old.  We must be considered ancient. ops1:


----------



## merlin (Apr 26, 2015)

ndynt said:


> Interesting lady, Merlin. Thanks.  I shall have to see if my library or Kindle has her books.  Her saying, when she was young....forty was old.  So true.  If still so, some of us are not old.  We must be considered ancient. ops1:



I believe many would consider us beyond the grave Nona  :angel:

Regarding the books, the best one is a compilation of five of her books, available on Kindle http://is.gd/AYsTaT they are an amazing read, full of life, love and tragedy and at times risque


----------



## Josiah (Apr 26, 2015)

Thank's Merlin for for introducing us to Diana Athill.


----------



## hollydolly (Apr 26, 2015)

I've just ordered that book from Amazon after watching that amazing video Merlin..I can hardly believe she's 97 years old.. wow!!


----------



## Shalimar (Apr 26, 2015)

What an amazing woman, Ms Athill is  Merlin. Now I must buy her books!


----------



## Glinda (Apr 26, 2015)

NancyNGA said:


> ndynt, when I was a kid I read _A Study in Scarlet _(Sherlock Homes) and there was a passage in there about what you describe that scared me and stuck with me all these years.
> 
> Arthur Conan Doyle quote:
> 
> ...



OMG, Nancy, I remember reading the same passage and it stuck in my mind as well, especially the part about the "elastic walls".


----------



## Cookie (Apr 26, 2015)

I love Conan Doyle's Sherlock Holmes works, but ..... since that is a quote from his A Study in Scarlet, they would be the words of Sherlock Holmes, his character, who I believe was also addicted to, was it morphine? or was it Conan Doyle himself addicted to the drug -- in which case, not a theory I would take seriously about the amount of knowledge humans can retain.  The human brain is capable of retaining much much more information than we can ever imagine, something probably not known to Arthur Conan Doyle at the time he wrote his books.


----------



## hollydolly (Apr 27, 2015)

I have read every Conan Doyle Sherlock Holmes Novels, several times.. I got addicted to them in my teens. Holmes was addicted to Cocaine and sometimes Morphine, there is no evidence to suggest Doyle himself ever dabbled in drugs but he did have a broad knowledge of them having studied as a Physician and surgeon of which he was highly qualified .

However Cocaine was not the condemned  substance it is today.. way back in the 19th century and early 20th centuries. In fact it was often actively supported by many in the medical field as a drug which could be used for it's fatigue reducing and mood elevating properties and even considered for use as a cure for  alcoholism.

Interesting of course that Arthur Conan Doyles' own father was an alcoholic who eventually succumbed to pathological psychosis and died in a mental asylum, so it would be reasonable to presume that Doyle may have experimented with cocaine and Morphine, but there is absolutely no evidence to suggest that he became a habitual user. 

However Conan Doyle himself tired very quickly of Holmes, and really felt his his calling apart from Medicine was to write Historical Novels, but having had a taste of the Sherlock Holmes Novel the public were not interested in his Historical Novels and begged for more SH..eventually CD decided that the only way he could be rid of Holmes was to kill him off which he did along with Moriarty in the reichenbach Falls.. unfortunately he still didn't manage to make his historical novel writings pay as well as his SH novels so amid an uproar from his fans and the lack of interest in his HN's he figuratively  raised Holmes from the dead in the Hound of the Baskervilles ( supposedly set before the Final Problem) then resurrected him properly in The Adventure of the Empty House!!


----------



## merlin (Apr 27, 2015)

hollydolly said:


> I have read every Conan Doyle Sherlock Holmes Novels, several times.. I got addicted to them in my teens. Holmes was addicted to Cocaine and sometimes Morphine, there is no evidence to suggest Doyle himself ever dabbled in drugs but he did have a broad knowledge of them having studied as a Physician and surgeon of which he was highly qualified .
> 
> However Cocaine was not the condemned  substance it is today.. way back in the 19th century and early 20th centuries. In fact it was often actively supported by many in the medical field as a drug which could be used for it's fatigue reducing and mood elevating properties and even considered for use as a cure for  alcoholism.
> 
> ...



Same here Holly, I remember in my teens borrowing them all from the local library in their red hardback covers, I also remember being very disappointed when I had read them all. I did go on to read all his other novels and works, but can't remember what they were about or if I liked them 
I did the same with Agatha Christie, ...read all her books and was disappointed when they ran out, .......all these teenage addictions we used to have...


----------



## Shalimar (Apr 27, 2015)

Agatha Christie! Poirot! Miss Marple! Partially responsible for my logical mind I think. Loved them.


----------



## Ralphy1 (Apr 27, 2015)

And don't forget Mickey Spillane...


----------



## Shalimar (Apr 27, 2015)

That must be before my time Ralphy.:love_heart:


----------



## Pappy (Apr 27, 2015)

Mickey Spillane.....haven't hear of him in years, Ralphy. My mom was hooked on all his books. Maybe I'll have to read a couple as I am into mysteries big time.


----------



## Cookie (Apr 27, 2015)

Holly, you are very knowledgeable on Conan Doyle. Yes, I agree cocaine was not illegal back then and it actually was an ingredient in coca cola at the turn of the last century. But I was addressing the human brain's capacity to retain much more information than was believed in Conan Doyle's time, on the subject of remembering. 

I have read a fair amount of Conan Doyle and Agatha Christie and Dashiel Hammett, and every one of Sue Grafton's books (A is for Alibi, B is for Burgler, etc.) and lots of others, and am an avid detective/mystery/crime fiction fan. There is so much out there.  I particularly enjoy the Dashiel Hammett Thin Man movies from the 40s, all the Poirior (sp?) television and Miss Marples too.  Sadly they ran out and we only re-runs left.


----------



## hollydolly (Apr 27, 2015)

OH yes I did exactly the same with the Agatha Christie Novels as you Merlin..about the same time too, I couldn't get enough of them, they were so easy to read...and they were my first real interest in Detective fiction. However I didn't stop at just reading the books over and over..I was hungry for information on the authors too, so I researched everything I could find about Both Arthur CD and Agatha Christie too...all much harder to to back in those pre internet days but fascinating and enjoyable. 

I lost my interest in fiction some years later and no longer enjoy  anything other than factual reading material...but I still watch  Sherlock Holmes  occasionally on TV..


----------



## Josiah (Apr 27, 2015)

Goodness Holly, saying you've lost your interest in fiction is like cutting yourself off from most of the cultural heritage of the English language.


----------



## Cookie (Apr 27, 2015)

I'm sorry to hear that you lost the ability to enjoy literature, Holly, that's a big one.  I was unable to read much after I became depressed some time ago, after a traumatic event, but it's back now, thank goodness.  I wasn't brought up with books or literature and discovered the joy of reading at school and from friends and it has been with me ever since.


----------



## hollydolly (Apr 27, 2015)

Josiah said:


> Goodness Holly, saying you've lost your interest in fiction is like cutting yourself off from most of the cultural heritage of the English language.



I was an avid reader all my life Josiah and Cookie from the time I learned to read I devoured books like the water of life. I read literature most of my young life probably right up until my 40;s, I was my American English teachers' star pupil at High School , she was a poet herself  who adored  the American poets Robert frost and Mark Van Doren  and introduced me to them, along with our own Poets, Wordsworth, Burns , Browning, Byron etc  ..but now I have no stomach for poetry nor Fiction ..just give me the facts  in my reading material .( although that said I do love Memoirs/ letters/ Diaries  and some biographies and many of them have more than a little touch of fiction in them) but that aside no, I'm uninterested now in fictional literature.


----------



## Cookie (Apr 27, 2015)

Holly, that is OK.  Tastes change and there's no law that says you have to read fiction. I don't care for poetry myself, but do love autobiographical writing.  Sometimes too much of something will really put a person off it forever.


----------



## hollydolly (Apr 27, 2015)

That's so true Cookie.. 

I read every day to this day, Books music and photography are my passion. I don't go one day without reading. Sadly these days if I read a book during the day it puts me to sleep , so I only read when I go to bed. I couldn't possibly not, it would be like not breathing!!


----------



## Cookie (Apr 27, 2015)

You are a very cultured lady, Holly, don't let anyone tell you otherwise.


----------



## hollydolly (Apr 27, 2015)

That's very kind,  thank you cookie..


----------



## AZ Jim (Apr 27, 2015)

*Holly, Holly with the Mona Lisa smile.*


----------



## hollydolly (Apr 27, 2015)

Just for you Jim..


----------



## AZ Jim (Apr 27, 2015)

hollydolly said:


> Just for you Jim..
> 
> 
> View attachment 17477



You have ruined a wonderful vision and Nat King Coles best song all in one post.


----------



## merlin (Apr 27, 2015)

hollydolly said:


> I lost my interest in fiction some years later and no longer enjoy  anything other than factual reading material...but I still watch  Sherlock Holmes  occasionally on TV..



I am the same as you Holly, I only read memoirs and factual stuff, the fiction attraction faded a few years ago, I am also drifting to more documentary movies, but still enjoy some drama and comedy at the moment.
I have several friends who have also stopped reading fiction. I seem to remember Diana Athill, (see above) mentioning somewhere that she gave up reading fiction in her later years.


----------



## AZ Jim (Apr 27, 2015)

I think one of the most beautiful features of our mind is how it dims the memories of the horror and sad events while enhancing our good memories.


----------



## merlin (Apr 27, 2015)

AZ Jim said:


> I think one of the most beautiful features of our mind is how it dims the memories of the horror and sad events while enhancing our good memories.



That is so true Jim, and what a nightmare our present life would be if it didn't :uncomfortableness:


----------



## Shalimar (Apr 27, 2015)

I still enjoy literature, be it the classics, poetry, or science fiction fantasy. Often my own life is hyper-real, I need an alternative to the more gritty aspects of the human condition.


----------



## Ameriscot (Apr 27, 2015)

I like to read biographies and history, but I'll always love a good mystery. 

My husband much prefers nonfiction, especially biographies, which was why I was very surprised when he read A Casual Vacancy by J K Rowling. 

Holly, which Sherlock Holmes do you prefer?  For me, Jeremy Brett IS Sherlock Holmes.


----------



## oakapple (Apr 28, 2015)

Ameriscot said:


> I like to read biographies and history, but I'll always love a good mystery.
> 
> My husband much prefers nonfiction, especially biographies, which was why I was very surprised when he read A Casual Vacancy by J K Rowling.
> 
> Holly, which Sherlock Holmes do you prefer?  For me, Jeremy Brett IS Sherlock Holmes.


I would agree with you there, Brett made a wonderful Holmes, and also the actor who played John Watson, they were both excellent.I don't like the recent Holmes and Watson, Benedict Cumberbatch and the hobbit.


----------



## oakapple (Apr 28, 2015)

I think that the mind  does have loads of storage, but that it is stored in layers, the top layer being the things you really need to remember, also want to remember.When we are at a party, we remember the names of the people we like, but not those we are not interested in and so on.


----------



## Cookie (Apr 28, 2015)

Oakapple, below is a website about short term memory and long term memory.  
Very interesting, and not all that complex if anyone cares to peruse it. Lots more other similar information online too.

http://www.human-memory.net/types_long.html


----------



## AZ Jim (Apr 28, 2015)

Talk about a scare.  When at first glance I saw the title of this thread, my mind read it as "an embarrassing *emission*" !!  I thought maybe the OP referred to flatulence...


----------

