# Do you support bringing in ME refugees?



## Ralphy1 (Sep 14, 2015)

The president is being warned that this could be a bad a idea as nobody knows who these people might be and some could be terrorists.  We don't have the ability to screen them so, sorry, I say leave them out...


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## QuickSilver (Sep 14, 2015)

Thank goodness no one thought my family could have been Nazis..   as they all came from Germany.


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## Ralphy1 (Sep 14, 2015)

Com'on, you can do better than that...


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## Lara (Sep 14, 2015)

Only single mother's and their small children should be accepted first. Wait, do they even have single mothers in Syria? Is divorce allowed? Always mothers and children first on a sinking ship.


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## Ralphy1 (Sep 14, 2015)

The Arab Spring is looking like a long fall and winter.  We cannot absorb and fix all of the world's problems.  Perhaps some humanitarian help of some sort would be OK...


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## boozercruiser (Sep 14, 2015)

NO!
Germany is responsible for a lot of it by saying 'ALL WELCOME'.
So what do you know?
They are all coming.
Millions of them.
Once they settle there they will be able to go to any EU country they want.
U.K. here I come! 
Sorry chaps, but the UK is full.

Go fill your boots in the first safe country you get to just like you are supposed to.
And it certainly is NOT either Germany OR the UK!

Anyway, the vast majority are economic migrants who are not entitled to swarm to the EU like that.


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## QuickSilver (Sep 14, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> Com'on, you can do better than that...



of course MY family was white... and certainly Christian... big BIG difference


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## Ralphy1 (Sep 14, 2015)

Come on, you must still try harder.  You are really overreaching now...


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## QuickSilver (Sep 14, 2015)

I'm not "trying or reaching" for anything Ralphy..   I think you catch my drift..


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## Ralphy1 (Sep 14, 2015)

Your drift is drifting out to sea...


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## Lara (Sep 14, 2015)

That Trump Wall is looking better all the time  (it's not funny though). I'm sympathetic but afraid of the Al Qaeda video warning to the U.S. that Don M. posted in his thread.


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## Sunny (Sep 14, 2015)

I am haunted by thoughts of the Jewish refugees that were turned away by the US during WWII, and sent back to Europe to almost certain death. But I think the sheer numbers
of the Syrian refugees are overwhelming. No country can be expected to take in and absorb unlimited numbers of people. So maybe the answer is yes, but let them enter in limited
numbers. I think Germany is now realizing that they've overdone it, and will be paying the price for many years.


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## Ralphy1 (Sep 14, 2015)

We have enough problems on our streets and on ur orders with compounding the problem...


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## boozercruiser (Sep 14, 2015)

Sunny said:


> I am haunted by thoughts of the Jewish refugees that were turned away by the US during WWII, and sent back to Europe to almost certain death. But I think the sheer numbers
> of the Syrian refugees are overwhelming. No country can be expected to take in and absorb unlimited numbers of people. So maybe the answer is yes, but let them enter in limited
> numbers. I think Germany is now realizing that they've overdone it, and will be paying the price for many years.



You more or less have that Spot On Sunny.
Well said.


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## Lara (Sep 14, 2015)

…probably forever, Sunny


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## Don M. (Sep 14, 2015)

I think the U.S. has been quite generous in taking in "refugees".  Most reports place the number of Hispanic/Latino "refugees" here at over 11 million.  We have enough problems with their drug trafficking, and street gangs, without inviting the certain potential of Muslim "Jihadists" into our midst.  We have been taking in Somali refugees for years, and they are settling in around Minnesota, and causing increased problems in the Minneapolis area.  Dearborn, Michigan is becoming a Muslim enclave, and some neighborhoods almost reverting to Sharia Law.  

The U.S. and Europe can't cure all the worlds problems...and so long as Islam continues to preach "death to all infidels", the Western world would be well advised to keep these people at arms length.


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## Ralphy1 (Sep 14, 2015)

Enough with this feel good approach to another international crisis.  These are not Jews fleeing Hitler.  We don't know who they are and we shouldn't let one in...


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## QuickSilver (Sep 14, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> Enough with this feel good approach to another international crisis.  These are not Jews fleeing Hitler.  We don't know who they are and we shouldn't let one in...



'scuse me ralphy...  haven't you been the on harping that ISIS is worse than or at least as bad as Hitler..  and we should "go get 'em"..   So what exactly is your criteria for who we should give refuge to and who we should not?    Is it the Muslim thing?


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## Ralphy1 (Sep 14, 2015)

We absolutely should go get them and that might put an end to the flood of refugees...


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## MaryZPA (Sep 14, 2015)

I sincerely hope that our fear of terrorists won't lead us to turn our backs on desperate human beings.


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## QuickSilver (Sep 14, 2015)

MaryZPA said:


> I sincerely hope that our fear of terrorists won't lead us to turn our backs on desperate human beings.



I'm pretty sure that it will..


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## Shalimar (Sep 14, 2015)

These people? These people? For most of us of immigrant or working class stock, it is scant years indeed since we were referred to by established/more upwardly mobile residents as "those people." I am appalled that we seem to have learned so little. I refuse to countenance any philosophy that permits cruelty/indifference toward innocent children, using the threat of terrorism as a convenient excuse. How many terrorist babies have you met? It is this capacity for self-serving inhumanity that permitted our countries to deny entry to  many Jewish refugees during the Hitler horror.


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## QuickSilver (Sep 14, 2015)

It's a matter of We are here... we have ours... to hell with everyone else... and certainly to hell with.. 

"Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame, 

 With conquering limbs astride from land to land; 

 Here at our sea-washed, sunset hates shall stand 

 A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame 

 Is the imprisoned lighting, and her name 

 Mother of Exiles. From her beacon hand 

 Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command 

 The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame. 

 "Keep, ancient lands, your storied pomp!" cries she 

 With silent lips. "Give me your tired, your poor, 

 Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, 

 The wretched refuse of your teeming shore, 

 Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me, 

 I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"


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## WhatInThe (Sep 14, 2015)

Bring in all the immigrants you want in an orderly fashion that includes applying for LEGAL status and vetting.  But NO I don't want to hold them in a camp and cut them lose. Resources are already stressed.

http://www.hngn.com/articles/128225...ke-up-75-percent-of-immigrant-welfare-use.htm

Too much uncontrolled immigration from any country will saturate and dilute an already stressed economy. And immigrants/refugees need to taught and trained how to fix or changes things in their own country. Fleeing or running away from problems doesn't accomplish anything.

Give a man a fish he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish he eats forever.


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## MaryZPA (Sep 14, 2015)

WhatInThe said:


> And immigrants/refugees need to taught and trained how to fix or changes things in their own country. Fleeing or running away from problems doesn't accomplish anything.
> 
> Give a man a fish he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish he eats forever.



 The refugees fleeing Syria have no power to change anything! Their homes are gone, their jobs are gone, their communities are gone. So is all their fishing equipment.


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## QuickSilver (Sep 14, 2015)

But they still have "bootstraps"  don't they?


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## WhatInThe (Sep 14, 2015)

MaryZPA said:


> The refugees fleeing Syria have no power to change anything! Their homes are gone, their jobs are gone, their communities are gone. So is all their fishing equipment.



They have the ability to ASK for help don't they?


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## QuickSilver (Sep 14, 2015)

I may be wrong... but isn't that what they are doing?  But I guess when you are fleeing for your life "pretty please"  doesn't really cut it.


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## WhatInThe (Sep 14, 2015)

QuickSilver said:


> I may be wrong... but isn't that what they are doing?



I don't think the herds, hordes or mobs of refugees sometimes running across borders are stopping to ask 'Where's the visa guy?' or 'Who do I talk to about help to get my land/home back?'


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## QuickSilver (Sep 14, 2015)

Reminds me of a scene from "A Christmas Carol"


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## Shalimar (Sep 14, 2015)

Somewhat difficult to fish in an empty dried up pond, unless you believe in miracles. As for bootstraps, hmm. First you need boots. Sophistry aside, this is all about fear and greed. Primarily greed. "These people" just might lower my standard of living by some minuscule amount, or wipe their foreign Muslim feet all over my prejudices. This is xenophobia at it's finest, aren't we proud? What a marvelous example to set for our children.


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## Shalimar (Sep 14, 2015)

You bet QS. Next time a woman/child is raped/beaten/tortured due to the conflict, they better be certain they have all the necessary forms filled out in triplicate. Plus a comprehensive plan on rescuing their country from the dogs of war. Pleeeez,
smoke and mirrors, to hide a dark agenda. There is no viable excuse for systematic inhumanity.


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## MaryZPA (Sep 14, 2015)

WhatInThe said:


> I don't think the herds, hordes or mobs of refugees sometimes running across borders are stopping to ask 'Where's the visa guy?' or 'Who do I talk to about help to get my land/home back?'



  Perhaps the refugees can attend etiqutte classes in the detention camps.


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## WhatInThe (Sep 14, 2015)

MaryZPA said:


> Perhaps the refugees can attend etiqutte classes in the detention camps.



Etiquette should be part of assimilation which is part of a formal immigration policy in which one has to wait their turn and complete an actual meaningful immigration process.


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## QuickSilver (Sep 14, 2015)

WhatInThe said:


> Etiquette should be part of assimilation which is part of a formal immigration policy in which one has to wait their turn and complete an actual meaningful immigration process.




Sooo...  tell me.... when you have lost your home and all your possessions,  You have nothing but the shirt on your back.  your wife and daughter have been raped or murdered.  You scoop up your younger kids and run for your life from ISIS...  exactly WHAT line do you get into to "wait your turn"?   where do you live... what do you eat... while you are waiting and filling out your papers???


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## WhatInThe (Sep 14, 2015)

QuickSilver said:


> Sooo...  tell me.... when you have lost your home and all your possessions,  You have nothing but the shirt on your back.  your wife and daughter have been raped or murdered.  You scoop up your younger kids and run for your life from ISIS...  exactly WHAT line do you get into to "wait your turn"?   where do you live... what do you eat... while you are waiting and filling out your papers???



Revolutions have been motivated by less. And I doubt every single refugee border hoping has experienced all those event. They're coming from a war zone, you fight, stay or flee.  They seem to have enough energy and where with all to sneak and/or cross entire countries and borders after conspiring with a criminal smuggler. Those efforts should been put into conspiring revolution, retribution, justice, organization, recruitment, weapons procurement etc.


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## QuickSilver (Sep 14, 2015)

I'd do all those things too if I were trying to protect my kids and get out of harms way...  wouldn't you?


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## WhatInThe (Sep 14, 2015)

QuickSilver said:


> I'd do all those things too if I were trying to protect my kids and get out of harms way...  wouldn't you?



I'd try to keep them out of the way, not countries or continents away until they could chose to fight or flee. And I would be training them to fight along with staying hidden. Entire governments have been overthrown by the local population including families.


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## QuickSilver (Sep 14, 2015)

So these families should just stay and fight ISIS?   And if they or their kids are killed?  oh well....  that's the breaks?


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## WhatInThe (Sep 14, 2015)

QuickSilver said:


> So these families should just stay and fight ISIS?   And if they or their kids are killed?  oh well....  that's the breaks?



I would be a sad fate but not one of running or fleeing. The washed body of the boy on the beach says there is no sure thing or right answer for all families. Nor does one want to be seeing those same kinds of pictures years from now.


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## Hanfonius (Sep 20, 2015)

This film (below) is quite a good analysis on the effectiveness of the economic migration of people into the United States.

There are now 320 million people living in the USA,  compared to 62.5 million in the UK.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDJbShXX_sQ


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## BobF (Sep 20, 2015)

I had seen this film before and do fully agree with allowing all so called victims stay near their home lands and working with those governments to fix the problems there.


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## boozercruiser (Sep 20, 2015)

BobF said:


> I had seen this film before and do fully agree with allowing all so called victims stay near their home lands and working with those governments to fix the problems there.



I had never seen that particular film before and I urge YOU to watch it.
I didn't know that the US takes in around one MILLION migrant people a year?
With congress possibly voting to allow in more.

I agree with the presenter there, as he gets it spot on for me!


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## tnthomas (Sep 20, 2015)

We(all of "we" in North America) should do everything we can to aid the refugees.    I am not sure that hearding them into our slums is going to be doing them a huge favor, but I guess it's better than being 

slaughtered by the ISIS monsters.

I am not a "hawkish" person...perhaps since "we" contributed the rise of ISIS(thank you GWB) by removing Saddam Hussein from power  maybe we should

do more militarily to quash  ISIS.    I hate the idea of being pulled further into mddle east politics, but there is definitely unfinished business to be taken care of there.    For better or for worse, the NATO members 

all have middle eastern blood on their hands, and will have to deal with it, now or at some time in the future.


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## Hanfonius (Sep 20, 2015)

I would like us all to remember that there is a difference between economic refugees and those who are being displaced through military actions.

The film was,  I think,  talking only of economic refugees.


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## boozercruiser (Sep 20, 2015)

Hanfonius said:


> I would like us all to remember that there is a difference between economic refugees and those who are being displaced through military actions.
> 
> *The film was,  I think,  talking only of economic refugees.*



Yes Hanf.
That is the way I read it too.


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## Davey Jones (Sep 20, 2015)

Lara said:


> Only single mother's and their small children should be accepted first. Wait, do they even have single mothers in Syria? Is divorce allowed? Always mothers and children first on a sinking ship.



Maybe you haven't read this yet but 70% of those refuges are grown males, makes you go hmmmmmmm.


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## tigrunner (Sep 20, 2015)

I have to vote no this time, as I believe we have taken in and given away too many free benefits already. only to have the recipients turn around and demand more and more.

I would hope that this country would do it's best to take care of the ones we already have and to quit running around the world looking for the next PR/ feel good movement to throw more money and rescources at.

There are plenty of people in the USA that are homeless,hungry and struggling to take care of FIRST before we go looking for more, not much PR in that I guess!

I am sorry but I for one am sick and tired of the feel good police looking around the world for more problems to fix when it is right in front of them!!


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## boozercruiser (Sep 20, 2015)

tigrunner said:


> I have to vote no this time, as I believe we have taken in and given away too many free benefits already. only to have the recipients turn around and demand more and more.
> 
> I would hope that this country would do it's best to take care of the ones we already have and to quit running around the world looking for the next PR/ feel good movement to throw more money and rescources at.
> 
> ...



From the UK.
I would just like to say that I agree with every single word that you say there Tigrunner.


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## Hanfonius (Sep 20, 2015)

Just a thought on American overseas aids.

If the States were to donate ONE BILLION dollars a WEEK to all of the people earning less than two dollars a week,
... and if ALL of that money went to the poor people,  and NOT the greedy and grasping administrators,

Then each poor person would receive just under SIX DOLLARS A YEAR.....

All overseas donations must be in the form of development projects,  ie,  to provide drinkable water,  power,  agricultural and so on.
...   It must be down to the governments of those countries to maximise on these funds,  but sadly,  many are spending them on arms deals - with the USA,  UK,  France,  China and Russia.

Why isn't there an agreement that weapons are not sold to underdeveloped countries?

I know that weapons are sold via the 'backdoor' method.   The supplying country will sell them to a 'friendly' country who then forward them to a poor country.
...   The selling country know damned well where their weapons are going to end up, but they turn a blind eye to it.   It's all down to money.
Surely the United Nations could stop this from happening?


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