# When the virus dies, what kind of world will be left, after the onslought?



## fuzzybuddy (Apr 2, 2020)

I was at the grocery store yesterday. Some were wearing masks and blue gloves. At the check out people were standing 6 feet apart. And those "reusable" bags from home weren't allowed. It was on the news that restaurants in some cities were boarded up, like awaiting a hurricane. People hoard toilet paper. After, we get the all clear, I doubt we are going right back to business as usual. This crisis has cut way to deep for that to happen. When the virus dies, what kind of world will be left, after the onslought?


----------



## Pepper (Apr 2, 2020)

It depends how long this lasts.  Humans have great forgeterries.


----------



## Aunt Bea (Apr 2, 2020)

I will make some small changes to the way I live and shop but I honestly believe that things will return to normal in a few months.


----------



## Lee (Apr 2, 2020)

I know I will be sporting a lot more grey and badly in need of a haircut.....hairdressers closed. I will probably be in good company though.

Seriously though, I hope we have all learned to appreciate our freedom more.


----------



## RadishRose (Apr 2, 2020)

People will be washing their hands more often.


----------



## Judycat (Apr 2, 2020)

A barren landscape with large, hairy animals roaming about.


----------



## Gaer (Apr 2, 2020)

Aunt Bea said:


> I will make some small changes to the way I live and shop but I honestly believe that things will return to normal in a few months.


Do you?  Really?  Oh, I WANT SO BADLY to believe that!  I sure hope you are right!!!


----------



## Aunt Bea (Apr 2, 2020)

Gaer said:


> Do you?  Really?  Oh, I WANT SO BADLY to believe that!  I sure hope you are right!!!


What's the alternative?


----------



## jerry old (Apr 2, 2020)

Check us out-did you have any knowledge of the Spanish Flu
of 1918; I certainly didn't.

Polio did not remain a scare word to us that were young.
It was to our parent's, their gone now.

The Depression that lasted a decade 1929-38?
I do, only because it explained why my parent's were so 'tight,
tight, tight.'
We always had stockpile of essentials, flour, cornmeal and those damn pinto beans.

juju says we will forget:  only those of us that lived through it
will remember. 
 We will remember, and then forget because
human beings cannot retain fear.
Kids will remember the inconveniences, no more


----------



## Aneeda72 (Apr 2, 2020)

Judycat said:


> A barren landscape with large, hairy animals roaming about.


You mean men?


----------



## Aneeda72 (Apr 2, 2020)

jerry old said:


> Check us out-did you have any knowledge of the Spanish Flu
> of 1918; I certainly didn't.
> 
> Polio did not remain a scare word to us that were young.
> ...


I learned about the Spanish flu in school, but didn’t think much about it.  Polio, parents instilled a fear of polio in me, never forgot.  Depends on where you were, I suppose.  Parents are more protective these days.  Children will remember their parents fear.  The youngest will forget.  IMO.

Oh the Great Depression, always remembered it.  It effected my family a great deal.


----------



## Aneeda72 (Apr 2, 2020)

The world will never be the same In my opinion.  There will be a new norm.  Life goes on.


----------



## Don M. (Apr 2, 2020)

It all depends on when/if a vaccine is developed to treat this virus.  Until then, there will be varying levels of "isolation" and closed stores, etc.  Even if this virus slows down substantially in coming weeks...as some "experts" predict...there will still be a great deal of reluctance, by many, to engage in normal activity.  Unemployment numbers will remain high, and the economy will remain stagnant.  

Then, if a vaccine is developed, there will be questions about its effectiveness....most other vaccines are far from 100% effective....and there may be "side effects" from whatever drug is developed.  If the vaccine can be manufactured in huge quantities, there will be long lines at the doctors offices and hospitals as people try to get treated.  

"Normal"??? perhaps in another year, or two.  Then, as this issue is pushed to the back of most people's minds, most will return to their routines.


----------



## Judycat (Apr 2, 2020)

Aneeda72 said:


> You mean men?


Think Wal Mart or some other grocery retailer during the early days of the pandemic.


----------



## fmdog44 (Apr 2, 2020)

I am concerned how the "return to normal" will be. Who will give the *All Clear* and will you believe them? At what point will you personally believe it is 100% safe to function like you did before this virus? The infection predictions seem to be gradually getting longer calendar wise and add to that its predicted return this fall as the northern hemisphere begins to cool.


----------



## rgp (Apr 2, 2020)

I hope you're right Bea...probably are, but this thing has so many scared poopless . The idea of it returning might just change many folks in the way that they live for some time to come.


----------



## Aneeda72 (Apr 2, 2020)

rgp said:


> I hope you're right Bea...probably are, but this thing has so many scared poopless . The idea of it returning might just change many folks in the way that they live for some time to come.


With the run on TP, I doubt anyone is poop less


----------



## cherylpamela66 (Apr 2, 2020)

Hi Everybody: I guess it depends...I hope this virus is gone before summer...be nice to be able to do stuff again, we all can start having more fun!  Just living my life the best I can like everyone and trying to survive. Maybe folks will come up with better ways of living for everyone so these diseases will not happen or be less of. I know we humans have overcome a lot. I think this may produce new and better ways of living? Who knows. Lots of love, and Reiki hugs to ya all! We are all in this together. It's also for all of us to keep having love and compassion.     stocking up on TP and other things, sheesh!


----------



## Gardenlover (Apr 2, 2020)

Deleted


----------



## peppermint (Apr 2, 2020)

I like your attitude, cherylpaela66....We are in a place that we can't  go home to our State...It's oK, we are retired, but our kids are worried...
Even though they are in a different State, where it's Number 2 in the Country …..So we cannot go home....Number 1 is NYC....
Who would ever think..  
 I had pneumonia   in August....I thought I was going to die...We were at my grandson's Graduation Party..
I was seeing people I haven't seen in a long long time...So Me, the hugger, was hugging....The next 2 days I came down with the Croup...
I couldn't talk...Husband took me to the doctor and told me I had Pneumonia..
..When I retired, I would just get a little cold in the winter..
Always went to the Doctor every 6 months...And always good....So I am so nuts about the name of the drug my Doctor gave me...It was only
2 days when it cleared up....Now if anyone can tell me the name of the drug, that were saving some people...It's a very long name...
I didn't bring that bottle,, anyway I took  all of the drug...but I usually keep the bottle...I cannot remember what that drug was...
I'm not home...And can't get home right now...I'm just wondering if that drug they showed on Fox news, the other day, were giving
that meds to people in hospital.... and living.....It's an old time Drug....It's driving me crazy...I looked up some names but couldn't find..
Anyway, we sit on the porch when it's nice out....people come by to talk, but stay far away....Not many people are here anyway...
This took me to long to type....Hope all are well.....♥


----------



## fuzzybuddy (Apr 2, 2020)

We use to laugh at the pics of Asian cities where people are wearing masks. I saw that in Stroudsburg, PA yesterday. I reaaly don't see us at baseball games, concerts etc after this. It's going to be a while for the dust to settle. I don't see many restaurants getting through this period. There are way too many businesses that can't afford to be nonexistant for a couple of months. Even if the death rate is happily low, it is going to be traumatic to our economy. If the death rate is high, it will cause a huge emotional scar on all of us.


----------



## Gary O' (Apr 2, 2020)

Judycat said:


> A barren landscape with large, hairy animals roaming about.





Aneeda72 said:


> You mean men?,



Well now.....whudya know....all this time I've been prepped and didn't know


----------



## Gary O' (Apr 2, 2020)

fuzzybuddy said:


> When the virus dies, what kind of world will be left, after the onslought?





Pepper said:


> It depends how long this lasts.


Yup

If this bug don't last too long, there's one good thing out of it all;

The US will actually be manufacturing again


----------



## Devi (Apr 2, 2020)

Gary O' said:


> If this bug don't last too long, there's one good thing out of it all;
> 
> The US will actually be manufacturing again



Agreed. And we can ensure that essential items, medicines and parts thereof are made here, or in locations that are not antithetical to the U.S. Who knew? Well, we know now.


----------



## RadishRose (Apr 2, 2020)

Rich corporations won't like paying off shore salaries to domestic workers. They won't like kicking in for medical insurance like they don't have to do for off shore workers.


----------



## win231 (Apr 2, 2020)

Nasal swabs & lab test results will be required before first dates.


----------



## Devi (Apr 2, 2020)

RadishRose said:


> Rich corporations won't like paying off shore salaries to domestic workers. They won't like kicking in for medical insurance like they don't have to do for off shore workers.



You have a point, RadishRose. It's possible that some (all?) things may cost more, but that's the cost of doing business properly. Fair is fair. Assuming that it will be fair.


----------



## Butterfly (Apr 3, 2020)

Aneeda72 said:


> I learned about the Spanish flu in school, but didn’t think much about it.  Polio, parents instilled a fear of polio in me, never forgot.  Depends on where you were, I suppose.  Parents are more protective these days.  Children will remember their parents fear.  The youngest will forget.  IMO.
> 
> Oh the Great Depression, always remembered it.  It effected my family a great deal.




I remember the fear of polio as well.  One of my friends got it.  I was glad when the polio vaccines came out.

The Great Depression affected my family a great deal as well, and I well remember my mother's mantra, "NEVER waste food."


----------



## Butterfly (Apr 3, 2020)

Don M. said:


> It all depends on when/if a vaccine is developed to treat this virus.  Until then, there will be varying levels of "isolation" and closed stores, etc.  Even if this virus slows down substantially in coming weeks...as some "experts" predict...there will still be a great deal of reluctance, by many, to engage in normal activity.  Unemployment numbers will remain high, and the economy will remain stagnant.
> 
> Then, if a vaccine is developed, there will be questions about its effectiveness....most other vaccines are far from 100% effective....and there may be "side effects" from whatever drug is developed.  If the vaccine can be manufactured in huge quantities, there will be long lines at the doctors offices and hospitals as people try to get treated.
> 
> "Normal"??? perhaps in another year, or two.  Then, as this issue is pushed to the back of most people's minds, most will return to their routines.



I remember standing in long lines to get the polio vaccine when it first came out.  We got the shots first, and then, when it came out, the one on the sugar cubes.


----------



## Butterfly (Apr 3, 2020)

cherylpamela66 said:


> Hi Everybody: I guess it depends...I hope this virus is gone before summer...be nice to be able to do stuff again, we all can start having more fun!  Just living my life the best I can like everyone and trying to survive. Maybe folks will come up with better ways of living for everyone so these diseases will not happen or be less of. I know we humans have overcome a lot. I think this may produce new and better ways of living? Who knows. Lots of love, and Reiki hugs to ya all! We are all in this together. It's also for all of us to keep having love and compassion.     stocking up on TP and other things, sheesh!



I very seriously doubt that it gone before summer.  In fact, I believe it will be endemic, like measles, just waiting to strike again when people get complacent.


----------



## Ferocious (Apr 3, 2020)

*When the virus dies, what kind of world will be left, after the onslought?*

*Millions of people wanting to dance on it's grave, perhaps...*


----------



## Em in Ohio (Apr 3, 2020)

jerry old said:


> Check us out-did you have any knowledge of the Spanish Flu
> of 1918; I certainly didn't.
> 
> Polio did not remain a scare word to us that were young.
> ...


My folks were born in 1913 and 1915.  They never forgot.  They drummed their lessons into me.  Frugal to a fault.


----------



## Fyrefox (Apr 3, 2020)

I've heard projections that unemployment may reach 34% in the U.S. following the Coronavirus as many simply will not have jobs or businesses that survived to return to.  Travel and service professions will be especially hard hit. This will rival if not exceed the American Great Depression of the 1930's, and may usher in a time of scarcity, deprivation, and hardship for many...


----------



## Lakeland living (Apr 3, 2020)

I don't see the virus leaving or being beaten down anytime soon. 
 As for the future, nature has the best route. 
Already animals are checking out the cities more than they were before.


----------



## Em in Ohio (Apr 3, 2020)

Watching Sci-Fi:  Star Trek Deep Space 9. Season 3, Episode 11 (different catalyst, perhaps similar outcome):  Really hope it doesn't come to this...


----------



## Liberty (Apr 3, 2020)

Fyrefox said:


> I've heard projections that unemployment may reach 34% in the U.S. following the Coronavirus as many simply will not have jobs or businesses that survived to return to.  Travel and service professions will be especially hard hit. This will rival if not exceed the American Great Depression of the 1930's, and may usher in a time of scarcity, deprivation, and hardship for many...


Surely it will be better than the last plague of the century...the Spanish Flu.  My mom's grandma told her she kept taking the kids back from the doctor as they lived longer when she cared for them.  She had 10 kids and lost 4 or 5 to the plague.  Eventually  life returned to some kind of normal so guessing that is what will happen after this plague weakens.


----------



## Aneeda72 (Apr 3, 2020)

Fyrefox said:


> I've heard projections that unemployment may reach 34% in the U.S. following the Coronavirus as many simply will not have jobs or businesses that survived to return to.  Travel and service professions will be especially hard hit. This will rival if not exceed the American Great Depression of the 1930's, and may usher in a time of scarcity, deprivation, and hardship for many...


I agree!  I for sure think the cruise ship industry is done.


----------



## MarciKS (Nov 26, 2020)

i think i will be remaining isolated for a long time after.


----------



## Ruthanne (Nov 26, 2020)

win231 said:


> Nasal swabs & lab test results will be required before first dates.


I hear that--and I was already  very cautious!  The heck with dating now!


----------



## Ruthanne (Nov 26, 2020)

I don't think hardly anyone foresaw how long this virus would last when this thread was started.  Everyone, practically, now has covid fatigue, the economy is bad, some of us living in terror of catching it because they have many preexisting conditions.  People have made their wills out, nearly 260,000 US deaths, some real craziness going on with some who refuse to wear masks or believe how bad the virus can be.  

Who knows when it will be contained?  I'm hoping the vaccine makers will do well with making a real viable vaccine.  

All I know now is that people have better hygiene now.  For the future, I really don't know for sure...but hopefully things will get much better than they are now, in many ways.


----------



## Marie5656 (Nov 26, 2020)

Butterfly said:


> I remember standing in long lines to get the polio vaccine when it first came out.  We got the shots first, and then, when it came out, the one on the sugar cubes.


I remember the sugar cubes. We got ours at school. Not sure why.


----------



## win231 (Nov 26, 2020)

Marie5656 said:


> I remember the sugar cubes. We got ours at school. Not sure why.


After I got a sugar cube, I got in line 3 more times for more sugar.


----------



## Liberty (Nov 27, 2020)

Think after the virus is in our rear view mirror, many more "employees" will be opting to work at home and ditch the long commutes, which hopefully would help free up some drive time traffic....if you have a business that can be worked from home you will have ditched your rented office which also saves money.  Son closed their office and now saves 10 grand a month.

Some habits won't linger of course, but the ones found more time saving, convenient and cost saving are liable to be enough to change daily lives for an ongoing length of time, like ordering food and more goods by mail.  Also think travel will kick in big time...many do miss that change of scenery.


----------



## Sunny (Nov 27, 2020)

I think it will take no time at all for us to return to "normal."  The year 2020 will go down in history as one of the worst; we'll be glad it is over, and will be happy to forget it as much as possible.

Most of us, that is. For those who have lost loved ones, the world will never be the same. It will feel like surviving a war.


----------



## hollydolly (Nov 27, 2020)

Sunny said:


> I think it will take no time at all for us to return to "normal."  The year 2020 will go down in history as one of the worst; we'll be glad it is over, and will be happy to forget it as much as possible.
> 
> Most of us, that is. For those who have lost loved ones, the world will never be the same. It will feel like surviving a war.


...I agree, but those who have lost their jobs , and their businesses small and large will never recover.. at least not in this small country


----------



## hollydolly (Nov 27, 2020)

Marie5656 said:


> I remember the sugar cubes. We got ours at school. Not sure why.


It had drops of the live virus on it


----------



## Nosy Bee-54 (Nov 27, 2020)

One definite change for me is that I no longer bring groceries home and stick them in the fridge and pantry. Nasty, nasty and nasty! I don't find it a burden to sanitize them as soon as I get home.


----------



## RadishRose (Nov 27, 2020)

When 2020 is over it in no way means the problems will be over.


----------



## Packerjohn (Nov 27, 2020)

The more the world changes; the more it will stay the same:  drunks will still keep drinking booze, young people will still take up smoking, women unfortunately will still be abused by abusive men, the rich will stay rich, the poor will stay poor.  Gamblers will continue gambling & Amazon will keep getting richer & richer.  I think the big issues in the future will be climate change & over population.  We will always have wars where innocent women & children get slaughtered.  Praying for world peace is a total waste of time.  As the world's population increases, there are more & more demands on decreasing resources.  The US will start looking to Canada for it's water supply.  Crime in the cities will increase as our population grows. More traffic accidents, more illegal drugs being used.  I am basing this rather grim prediction on history.  There have always been wars so why should they stop in 2021?  Technology will increase more and more with robots taking over most menial jobs that we do today.  This paints a rather grim forecast for future employment.  Your privacy will be gone as government/police surveillance will be all over if it's not here now.  I wish I could see the world with rose-coloured glasses but I can't.  Maybe there are advantages to being a senior because "we ain't gonna be around that long."


----------



## MarciKS (Nov 27, 2020)

Packerjohn said:


> The more the world changes; the more it will stay the same:  drunks will still keep drinking booze, young people will still take up smoking, women unfortunately will still be abused by abusive men, the rich will stay rich, the poor will stay poor.  Gamblers will continue gambling & Amazon will keep getting richer & richer.  I think the big issues in the future will be climate change & over population.  We will always have wars where innocent women & children get slaughtered.  Praying for world peace is a total waste of time.  As the world's population increases, there are more & more demands on decreasing resources.  The US will start looking to Canada for it's water supply.  Crime in the cities will increase as our population grows. More traffic accidents, more illegal drugs being used.  I am basing this rather grim prediction on history.  There have always been wars so why should they stop in 2021?  Technology will increase more and more with robots taking over most menial jobs that we do today.  This paints a rather grim forecast for future employment.  Your privacy will be gone as government/police surveillance will be all over if it's not here now.  I wish I could see the world with rose-coloured glasses but I can't.  Maybe there are advantages to being a senior because "we ain't gonna be around that long."


if this virus keeps going at the speed it is and taking a bunch of folks with it we won't have to worry about overpopulation.


----------



## StarSong (Nov 27, 2020)

Covid is likely to be with us until at least summer 2021.  It's going to take a long time to vaccinate enough people to diminish its impact.  

Staunch anti-vaxxers with ideological or political aversions to vaccines (rather than medical issues) may greatly affect the timeline of how long it takes various countries to return to normal and to be back on the tourism welcome list.        

Covid has hit virtually every country on the planet and current worldwide population is nearly nine billion.  That's a whole lotta vaccines.


----------



## MarciKS (Nov 27, 2020)

StarSong said:


> Covid is likely to be with us until at least summer 2021.  It's going to take a long time to vaccinate enough people to diminish its impact.
> 
> Staunch anti-vaxxers with ideological or political aversions to vaccines (rather than medical issues) may greatly affect the timeline of how long it takes various countries to return to normal and to be back on the tourism welcome list.
> 
> Covid has hit virtually every country on the planet and current worldwide population is nearly nine billion.  That's a whole lotta vaccines.


you think it's gonna go away by next summer? may i ask why just out of curiosity?


----------



## Sunny (Nov 27, 2020)

Well, she did say, "at least until."  That's probably an optimistic estimate.


----------



## StarSong (Nov 27, 2020)

MarciKS said:


> you think it's gonna go away by next summer? may i ask why just out of curiosity?


It's wishful thinking, to be honest, Marci. 

I do think it will be dramatically reduced in the US, Canada, Japan, S. Korea, Hong Kong, AU, NZ, the UK, most European countries and some others that I haven't yet brought to mind.  Maybe Russia, too.

Vaccines are going to be very much in demand by people who want some semblance of normalcy back in our lives.


----------



## Sunny (Nov 27, 2020)

Nosy Bee-54 said:


> One definite change for me is that I no longer bring groceries home and stick them in the fridge and pantry. Nasty, nasty and nasty! I don't find it a burden to sanitize them as soon as I get home.


There's certainly nothing wrong with doing whatever you feel necessary with your groceries. But it's my understanding that the disease doesn't spread that way. The experts keep telling us that the virus doesn't last long on hard surfaces, it is transported in much greater quantities in liquid drops. That's why we are much more of a danger to each other than our grocery packages or the mail.

But who knows? Nobody has 100% of the answers.


----------



## Manatee (Nov 27, 2020)

2020 is the lost year.  Too early to tell about 2021.

Both my "kids" work from home.  They save on office clothes as well as the commute.  They are in their late 50s.


----------



## StarSong (Nov 27, 2020)

On the other hand, nobody over the age of seven will ever forget 2020.  Ask me what happened in 2009 and I'd really have to think hard about what distinguished that year from any other.  But 2020 will be galvanized in my brain.


----------



## fmdog44 (Nov 27, 2020)

Awkward times are ahead after the COVID passes. Remember a great number of people are not willing to get the vaccine. Examples: You see someone you know an that person extends their hand to shake. You are in line and the person behind you is one foot away. The door to an elevator opens and it is crowded. The coworker that works next to you does not show up and you hear that person is "sick". You want to go to the indoor movies or to a concert. No one in your dentist office wears a mask. You are in a long line at the grocery store that is packed with people and only a few wear masks. Your spouse works a job along with many coworkers and they are all serving the public in person every day. Even with the vaccine new cases are showing up just not as many.


----------



## LindaB (Nov 27, 2020)

I am looking forward to stress relief after Covid vaccines kick in and  the presidential inauguration is over. Maybe things will return to some kind of normal. One can only hope for some relief from depression.


----------



## MarciKS (Nov 27, 2020)

someone else on this site (can't recall who exactly) said they believed this would continue to return all the time like the flu. let's suppose what this will look like if it can come back year round. i just don't believe we will every truly be free of it now that it's hooks are in.


----------



## win231 (Nov 27, 2020)

MarciKS said:


> you think it's gonna go away by next summer? may i ask why just out of curiosity?


The power of positive thinking.  _ "I'm giving this virus until next summer to go away, or else I'll make it sorry it was ever born!"_  
And if that doesn't work, just blame non-conforming, non robots.


----------



## Sunny (Nov 27, 2020)

fmdog44 said:


> Awkward times are ahead after the COVID passes. Remember a great number of people are not willing to get the vaccine. Examples: You see someone you know an that person extends their hand to shake. You are in line and the person behind you is one foot away. The door to an elevator opens and it is crowded. The coworker that works next to you does not show up and you hear that person is "sick". You want to go to the indoor movies or to a concert. No one in your dentist office wears a mask. You are in a long line at the grocery store that is packed with people and only a few wear masks. Your spouse works a job along with many coworkers and they are all serving the public in person every day. Even with the vaccine new cases are showing up just not as many.


fmdog, a lot of the things you are describing have obvious answers.

You don't HAVE to shake hands with anybody.
You don't HAVE to get on that elevator. Most people that I see just choose to wait for the next one.
We all want to go to indoor movies or concerts. But I don't think there are any to go to right now, even if we were foolish enough to try it.
The grocery stores in my state require that everyone wear a mask. I would certainly avoid one that didn't require that.
About the people who are forced to interact with the public in their jobs, I do feel for them. Most of them have no choice.

And your last sentence leaves me very puzzled. What vaccine?  New cases are showing up, only not as many?  Not true. There are more new cases showing up now than ever before! No one has had the vaccine yet. They may start distributing it in December, but only to a very limited group.


----------



## Marie5656 (Nov 27, 2020)

*I agree with others here who say it while be a while before we are totally rid of this. I think the 1918 flu took time to go away.  Things I think of that will change, is many people being more aware of  keeping distant from others, keeping hands and personal spaces clean and stuff.  
I am sure we will lose the all you can eat buffets (or they will be less around), 24 hours big box stores (like the grocery chains) may not go back. While a minor inconvenience, I think the loss of 24 hour shopping will be an adjustment for folks like shift workers. When I used to work second shift, I often did my shopping after work. So there I was at midnight in the grocery stores...along with all the evening news guys (for some reason, several shopped at my local store)*


----------



## MarciKS (Nov 27, 2020)

Marie5656 said:


> *I agree with others here who say it while be a while before we are totally rid of this. I think the 1918 flu took time to go away.  Things I think of that will change, is many people being more aware of  keeping distant from others, keeping hands and personal spaces clean and stuff.
> I am sure we will lose the all you can eat buffets (or they will be less around), 24 hours big box stores (like the grocery chains) may not go back. While a minor inconvenience, I think the loss of 24 hour shopping will be an adjustment for folks like shift workers. When I used to work second shift, I often did my shopping after work. So there I was at midnight in the grocery stores...along with all the evening news guys (for some reason, several shopped at my local store)*


it says on bing that lasted one or 2 yrs.

How Long Did the Flu Pandemic of 1918 Last? | Britannica


----------



## Butterfly (Nov 27, 2020)

Marie5656 said:


> I remember the sugar cubes. We got ours at school. Not sure why.


I think the schools were used because that was the best way to get it to as many children as possible as quickly as possible.  I got the Sabin (sugar cube) vaccine at school, too.  I don't remember where we got the Salk vaccine shots, but I remember being in line.  It might have been a school, too.  Probably was.  For the shots, parents had to come with us.  For the sugar cube, we had to bring a permission slip.


----------



## Butterfly (Nov 27, 2020)

hollydolly said:


> ...I agree, but those who have lost their jobs , and their businesses small and large will never recover.. at least not in this small country



Many here won't, either. Many small businesses in this city have already closed down for good.  A lot of those were small restaurants and cafes.


----------



## Butterfly (Nov 27, 2020)

MarciKS said:


> someone else on this site (can't recall who exactly) said they believed this would continue to return all the time like the flu. let's suppose what this will look like if it can come back year round. i just don't believe we will every truly be free of it now that it's hooks are in.


It wouldn't surprise me if that's what happens, particularly if a good size percentage of the population refuses the vaccine.  And, of course, there's still a lot of uncertainty about how long immunity lasts from getting the virus itself.  If it's true about the immunity not lasting, seems to me it might be true of the immunity from vaccines as well.  So we might have to be re-vaccinated every year or so.


----------



## MarciKS (Nov 27, 2020)

Butterfly said:


> It wouldn't surprise me if that's what happens, particularly if a good size percentage of the population refuses the vaccine.  And, of course, there's still a lot of uncertainty about how long immunity lasts from getting the virus itself.  If it's true about the immunity not lasting, seems to me it might be true of the immunity from vaccines as well.  So we might have to be re-vaccinated every year or so.


i'm guessing every year for sure. some folks won't be able to take it which is understandable. i'm more worried about what will take place between vaccines once the masks come off. then there's no way that virus won't have a host.


----------



## chic (Nov 27, 2020)

Butterfly said:


> Many here won't, either. Many small businesses in this city have already closed down for good.  A lot of those were small restaurants and cafes.


Same here. Our local yoga center closed its doors for good this week. How sad for everyone who enjoyed it so. It wasn't the one where I worked, that was in another community. But I fear the same fate will befall so many small businesses in coming months.


----------



## fmdog44 (Nov 27, 2020)

Sunny said:


> fmdog, a lot of the things you are describing have obvious answers.
> 
> You don't HAVE to shake hands with anybody.
> You don't HAVE to get on that elevator. Most people that I see just choose to wait for the next one.
> ...


My entire post was hypothetical meaning what the future _may_ be like. Read the first sentence. The underlying premise is the awkward adjustment to life assuming the virus will be reduced in numbers but not completely gone. Don't lose sight of the fact that a huge number of people will not take the vaccine when released in including bout 36% of healthcare workers.


----------



## hollydolly (Nov 28, 2020)

Butterfly said:


> Many here won't, either. Many small businesses in this city have already closed down for good.  A lot of those were small restaurants and cafes.


yes, but here and I don't know if it's the same there..Huge Chain stores and businesses have hit the wall too...


----------



## Tommy (Nov 28, 2020)

Oh how humans love to speculate on what the future holds!  In truth nobody knows, but I'm confident about a few things.

In time, this pandemic will pass into our collective memory.  Human nature, however, won't change - those who were fearful before this started will still be fearful afterward, the brave will still be brave, greedy will still be greedy, the generous will still be generous, the foolish will still be foolish, the wise will still be wise . . . .

Every time the world faces a major challenge we see some technological advances that carry forward to our benefit.  Perhaps in the area of medicine or manufacturing or communications.

And Almighty God will still be in control, weaving the foibles and foolishness of mankind into His perfect plan.


----------



## MarciKS (Nov 28, 2020)

Tommy said:


> Oh how humans love to speculate on what the future holds!  In truth nobody knows, but I'm confident about a few things.
> 
> In time, this pandemic will pass into our collective memory.  Human nature, however, won't change - those who were fearful before this started will still be fearful afterward, the brave will still be brave, greedy will still be greedy, the generous will still be generous, the foolish will still be foolish, the wise will still be wise . . . .
> 
> ...


Meanwhile we'll still be speculating.


----------



## fmdog44 (Nov 28, 2020)

Tommy said:


> Oh how humans love to speculate on what the future holds!  In truth nobody knows, but I'm confident about a few things.
> 
> In time, this pandemic will pass into our collective memory.  Human nature, however, won't change - those who were fearful before this started will still be fearful afterward, the brave will still be brave, greedy will still be greedy, the generous will still be generous, the foolish will still be foolish, the wise will still be wise . . . .
> 
> ...


Is this "Almighty God" the same one killing millions all over the planet with this virus?


----------



## chic (Nov 28, 2020)

fmdog44 said:


> Is this "Almighty God" the same one killing millions all over the planet with this virus?


That's the devil killing people.


----------



## Sunny (Nov 28, 2020)

But why is the devil allowed to exist at all?


----------



## Sunny (Nov 28, 2020)

fmdog44 said:


> My entire post was hypothetical meaning what the future _may_ be like. Read the first sentence. The underlying premise is the awkward adjustment to life assuming the virus will be reduced in numbers but not completely gone. Don't lose sight of the fact that a huge number of people will not take the vaccine when released in including bout 36% of healthcare workers.


Sorry, you're right, fmdog, your whole series of questions make a lot more sense when viewed as being about the future.

I have no answers, except that those who refuse to take the vaccine (for other than medical reasons) will reap what they sow. For those who can't take it for medical reasons, they will unfortunately be at risk.  

And the first group can validly be held responsible for putting the second group at risk. However, at that point, herd immunity might kick in.


----------



## chic (Nov 28, 2020)

Sunny said:


> But why is the devil allowed to exist at all?


Good question. One many WWII concentration camp survivors have asked. Maybe because he's immortal too.


----------



## Murrmurr (Nov 28, 2020)

Butterfly said:


> ..I don't remember where we got the Salk vaccine shots, but I remember being in line.  It might have been a school, too.


I got mine at a city hall annex. There must have been about 200 kids there. They were also being shot at the city libraries.


----------



## Sunny (Nov 28, 2020)

chic said:


> Good question. One many WWII concentration camp survivors have asked. Maybe because he's immortal too.


Actually, it's a very good theological question. We should open up a new subject.

I remember hearing that many survivors of the camps stopped believing in God. To me, it's amazing that anyone surviving an experience like that could still believe in a kind, loving God.  And I don't think the devil is really a part of Jewish theology, so he didn't figure in for most of them, except maybe as a symbol. (Of course, they weren't all Jewish.)


----------



## chic (Nov 28, 2020)

Sunny said:


> Actually, it's a very good theological question. We should open up a new subject.
> 
> I remember hearing that many survivors of the camps stopped believing in God. To me, it's amazing that anyone surviving an experience like that could still believe in a kind, loving God.  And I don't think the devil is really a part of Jewish theology, so he didn't figure in for most of them, except maybe as a symbol. (Of course, they weren't all Jewish.)


The devil, Lucifer, was an archangel who, along with other archangels, rebelled against the will of God, and were defeated by other, loyal, archangels. 

In the O.T. book of Job, Job confronts God for his treatment of him, (Job), and God lashes back telling him he's just a mortal and doesn't see the whole picture, which is not comforting when you think of it. But Job is eventually reinstated in God's favor and his good fortune restored. It's a story of resilience, I think, which can be a good thing in life. But I don't understand how God and Lucifer could be making bets on the loyalty of a human when such cost to said human is at stake. Since we can't see the whole picture and our mortal lives are stake we're bound to make decisions based upon emotion and temporal and immediate needs, while God may want his followers to follow a different path. But how God would even allow Satan to approach Him at all is my question and it confuses me.

Yes, a thread on this would be fun.


----------



## fmdog44 (Nov 28, 2020)

I saw on the news United has started flying one of the vaccines to Chicago so at least it's a sign they are getting ready. No waiting to transport after the green light to vaccinate instead it will be there to start dosing immediately. Recall how organized the U.S. was after Pearl Harbor. It was an incredible success and saved thousands of lives. Let's hope after all this miserable crap the distribution goes smoothly.


----------



## Tommy (Nov 29, 2020)

fmdog44 said:


> Is this "Almighty God" the same one killing millions all over the planet with this virus?


I honestly don't know fmdog; I'm not privy to that information.  If so, it's His prerogative to do so.  I suspect, however, that it's more likely the foolish, self-serving, and greedy decisions of billions of others that are leading to those deaths.  Chic's point about Satan's role is well taken as well.


----------



## gennie (Nov 29, 2020)

I believe there are some things that we humans are not supposed to know.  The future is one of them.


----------



## Liberty (Nov 29, 2020)

chic said:


> The devil, Lucifer, was an archangel who, along with other archangels, rebelled against the will of God, and were defeated by other, loyal, archangels.
> 
> In the O.T. book of Job, Job confronts God for his treatment of him, (Job), and God lashes back telling him he's just a mortal and doesn't see the whole picture, which is not comforting when you think of it. But Job is eventually reinstated in God's favor and his good fortune restored. It's a story of resilience, I think, which can be a good thing in life. But I don't understand how God and Lucifer could be making bets on the loyalty of a human when such cost to said human is at stake. Since we can't see the whole picture and our mortal lives are stake we're bound to make decisions based upon emotion and temporal and immediate needs, while God may want his followers to follow a different path. But how God would even allow Satan to approach Him at all is my question and it confuses me.
> 
> Yes, a thread on this would be fun.


Think if you understand the book of Job you understand the whole Bible.


----------



## Sunny (Nov 29, 2020)

gennie said:


> I believe there are some things that we humans are not supposed to know.  The future is one of them.


That's probably the first reply to the original question of this thread that really addresses the question.  Although I don't particularly agree with the "not supposed to know" part of it, at least it is an answer.


----------



## Sunny (Nov 29, 2020)

Liberty said:


> Think if you understand the book of Job you understand the whole Bible.


I think a new thread about this would be appropriate. I'll start one.


----------



## StarSong (Nov 29, 2020)

Liberty said:


> Think if you understand the book of Job you understand the whole Bible.


Let us not forget that in the Book of Job, Satan is only an operative with God's permission and with constraints ordained by God.  As such, in the story he is an agent of God, not an autonomous being.


----------



## Liberty (Nov 29, 2020)

StarSong said:


> Let us not forget that in the Book of Job, Satan is only an operative with God's permission and with constraints ordained by God.  As such, in the story he is an agent of God, not an autonomous being.


If "all is one" then there is no Satan...only a name for the the dark side of energy that needs to be brought back into the whole.

Think when we get some more grey cells we'd be able to understand more, so until then, the belief mantra is "by faith"...that propels us onward and upward.


----------



## fmdog44 (Dec 3, 2020)

Tommy said:


> I honestly don't know fmdog; I'm not privy to that information.  If so, it's His prerogative to do so.  I suspect, however, that it's more likely the foolish, self-serving, and greedy decisions of billions of others that are leading to those deaths.  Chic's point about Satan's role is well taken as well.


I always laugh when I hear people say "It's God's will" when they are speaking of a tragic death and in the same breath say it when someone escapes death. So my child dies in a fire that another child escaped from. God's will?


----------



## Nosy Bee-54 (Dec 4, 2020)

fmdog44 said:


> I always laugh when I hear people say "It's God's will" when they are speaking of a tragic death and in the same breath say it when someone escapes death. So my child dies in a fire that another child escaped from. *God's will?*


I know what you mean. I read a book recently about the church shooting back in 2017 in Sutherland Springs, Texas. When interviewed afterwards, the pastor and some of the surviving members said that God wanted it that way. Wow, I thought it was the shooter that caused the damage. I am just puzzled by why they believe that their God would want 24 of his faithful followers to be gunned down like sitting ducks?


----------



## StarSong (Dec 4, 2020)

I want to scream with fury when people whose children have survived a school shooting say things like, "I'm so blessed that God protected my son and brought him through safely."  

What does that statement mean anyway? The inconsolable mother weeping in agonized despair over her lost child was somehow less loved by God? Less worthy? Her child was less worthy? Was there a limit on how many children God could spare and yours made the cut but hers didn't? 

The implied arrogance and lack of empathy shown by survivors can be astounding.


----------



## tbeltrans (Dec 4, 2020)

There seem to be a number of different beliefs within the Christian belief system about "God's will".  The two extremes that I know of (and I am only mildly exposed to this stuff at this point, so I am not implying I know much about it at all) are:

1. God is involved in every single thing we do and what happens to us, making it all happen for a reason.
2. God is not involved in micro managing us, in that He set the laws (not man made laws, but the laws of physics and that sort of thing) of everything in place and just let it go.  The analogy I heard about this was that it is like having a sloped surface on which you release a ball to let it roll down according to whatever path it takes, following the laws of physics that apply to that situation.

To me, the second view would be an easier one to swallow in the face of some of the tragedies that have been mentioned in this thread.  The first view would, understandably, raise the kinds of challenging questions posted by some in this thread in response to those tragedies. 

I am sure, with my limited knowledge of the belief system as a whole, that there are many more possible views on these things that I am not aware of.

Tony


----------



## rgp (Dec 5, 2020)

fmdog44 said:


> I always laugh when I hear people say "It's God's will" when they are speaking of a tragic death and in the same breath say it when someone escapes death. So my child dies in a fire that another child escaped from. God's will?




  Just the same when after a bad storm [tornado] they get on the news and say they thank God that they survived ! I always wonder, do they also thank God that the people down the street died ? I mean he did it all did he not ?


----------



## StarSong (Dec 5, 2020)

rgp said:


> Just the same when after a bad storm [tornado] they get on the news and say they thank God that they survived ! I always wonder, do they also thank God that the people down the street died ? I mean he did it all did he not ?


Exactly.


----------



## win231 (Dec 5, 2020)

Sunny said:


> Sorry, you're right, fmdog, your whole series of questions make a lot more sense when viewed as being about the future.
> 
> I have no answers, except that those who refuse to take the vaccine (for other than medical reasons) will reap what they sow. For those who can't take it for medical reasons, they will unfortunately be at risk.
> 
> And the first group can validly be held responsible for putting the second group at risk. However, at that point, herd immunity might kick in.


^^^ That's an indication of what kind of world will be left.
A world of brainwashed programmed robots playing the blame game.


----------



## StarSong (Dec 5, 2020)

win231 said:


> ^^^ That's an indication of what kind of world will be left.
> A world of brainwashed programmed robots playing the blame game.


Looks like you're already playing the blame game: "A world of brainwashed programmed robots..."


----------



## MarciKS (Dec 5, 2020)

Is it wrong to blame God? Is blaming God a sin? | GotQuestions.org


----------



## MarciKS (Dec 5, 2020)

Why do people die? | GotQuestions.org


----------



## Irwin (Dec 5, 2020)

There's a lot of evidence that God hates Broncos fans.


----------



## Murrmurr (Dec 5, 2020)

Irwin said:


> There's a lot of evidence that God hates Broncos fans.


Right? And after sending them a quarterback who practically walks on water!


----------



## chic (Dec 5, 2020)

This.


----------



## win231 (Dec 5, 2020)

chic said:


> This.
> 
> View attachment 137496


Touch my toilet paper & you're dead!


----------



## Lakeland living (Dec 5, 2020)

Below is a page where they outline what some of these vaccines do. How they work if I read it correctly does not attack the virus, it keeps it from hurting the host.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...d-vaccine-heres-what-we-know-them/6308571002/


----------



## Irwin (Dec 5, 2020)

Murrmurr said:


> Right? And after sending them a quarterback who practically walks on water!



Who, Elway? That was 20 years ago! He was a great quarterback, but he sucks as GM.


----------



## Mat (Dec 5, 2020)

jerry old said:


> Check us out-did you have any knowledge of the Spanish Flu
> of 1918; I certainly didn't.
> 
> Polio did not remain a scare word to us that were young.
> ...


You forgot that mason jar full of buttons, my Grandmother kept that jar and I still have it today, old buttons from the 20s and 30s and a few other odds and ends.  Now people today would never think about sewing a button on a piece of clothing, they did not have the money to buy buttons.


----------



## chic (Dec 6, 2020)

win231 said:


> Touch my toilet paper & you're dead!


I've been thinking of TWD since this whole virus started and what the world will be like afterwards.


----------



## StarSong (Dec 6, 2020)

Lakeland living said:


> Below is a page where they outline what some of these vaccines do. How they work if I read it correctly does not attack the virus, it keeps it from hurting the host.
> https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...d-vaccine-heres-what-we-know-them/6308571002/


From my understanding, the jury remains out as to whether people can contract the virus (and not get sick but possibly be infectious) after being vaccinated.  

Being vaccinated will not immediately end the need for people to wear masks, socially distance themselves, and avoid large indoor gatherings.


----------



## MarciKS (Mar 19, 2021)

i find it amusing that anyone thinks this is going to die out or be over with. i personally think this thing will stick around and kill millions more because we are enabling it to do so.


----------



## Lakeland living (Mar 19, 2021)

Another flu bug to add to the list. I agree, it is not going anywhere. We feed it regularly and in Ontario Canada. 
Toronto to be more precise, they are now allowing outdoors, restaurants, at this time it is -5. Would you like fries with that???   
   NO, not kidding, it was announced today for Toronto...


----------



## SetWave (Mar 19, 2021)

We'll stumble along creating more problems for ourselves and muddle through. Ever read "Earth Abides"? Highly recommend you give it a go.


----------

