# When will we ever learn?



## Josiah (Mar 19, 2015)

On this the twelfth anniversary of the invasion of Iraq. we might do well to remind  ourselves of some of the lying or just moronic statements made by the band of neocons (and their propaganda-catapulting enablers) who orchestrated the debacle and even today have no regrets.


On Sept. 7, 2002, [Judith Miller] and fellow New York Times reporter Michael Gordon reported that Iraq had "stepped up its quest for nuclear weapons and has embarked on a worldwide hunt for materials to make an atomic bomb." As proof, she cited unnamed "American intelligence experts" and unnamed "Bush administration officials." Subsequently, Condoleezza Rice, Colin Powell, and Donald Rumsfeld all pointed to Miller’s story as justification for war. On April 22, 2003, she told PBS’s Newshour that WMD had already been found in Iraq: "Well, I think they found something more than a ’smoking gun.’"
---Think Progress


"Facing clear evidence of peril, we cannot wait for the final proof---the smoking gun that could come in the form of a mushroom cloud."
---George W. Bush (10/7/02)


"We’re not going to have a bloodletting of trading American bodies for Iraqi bodies." "We will win this conflict. We will win it easily."
---John McCain (9/29/02 and 1/22/03)


"My colleagues, every statement I make today is backed up by sources, solid sources. These are not assertions. What we're giving you are facts and conclusions based on solid intelligence."
---Colin Powell, United Nations Speech (2/5/03)


"Simply stated, there is no doubt that Saddam Hussein now has weapons of mass destruction. There is no doubt he is amassing them to use against our friends, against our allies, and against us." ... "My belief is we will, in fact, be greeted as liberators."
---Dick Cheney (8/28/02) and (3/16/03)


And today the sentiment for war in both Iraq and Iran is on the rise. When will we ever learn?


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## QuickSilver (Mar 19, 2015)

http://www.haaretz.com/blogs/diplom...re-and-contrast-netanyahu-s-speeches-1.468213




> “There’s no question that [Saddam] has not given upon on his nuclear program, not [sic] whatsoever. There is also no question that he was not satisfied with the arsenal of chemical and biological weapons that he had and was trying to perfect them constantly…So I think, frankly, it is not serious to assume that this man, who 20 years ago was very close to producing an atomic bomb, spent the last 20 years sitting on his hands. He has not. And every indication we have is that he is pursuing, pursuing with abandon, pursuing with every ounce of effort, the establishment of weapons of mass destruction, including nuclear weapons. If anyone makes an opposite assumption or cannot draw the lines connecting the dots, that is simply not an objective assessment of what has happened. Saddam is hell-bent on achieving atomic bombs, atomic capabilities, as soon as he can.”
> 
> “Today the United States must destroy the same regime because a nuclear-armed Saddam will place the security of our entire world at risk. And make no mistake about it — if and once Saddam has nuclear weapons, the terror networks will have nuclear weapons.”
> 
> ...


............Netanyahu--2002


Sound familiar?


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## rporter610 (Mar 19, 2015)

The military-industrial complex that President Eisenhower warned us about over 50 years ago seems to me to have a firm hold on our Congress.  Millions of dollars are spent to reelect people who will vote for more wars, which means more money for weapons producers, suppliers with military contracts, and all those who profit from human misery.


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## QuickSilver (Mar 19, 2015)

rporter610 said:


> The military-industrial complex that President Eisenhower warned us about over 50 years ago seems to me to have a firm hold on our Congress.  Millions of dollars are spent to reelect people who will vote for more wars, which means more money for weapons producers, suppliers with military contracts, and all those who profit from human misery.



And Bibi is taking advantage of that mindset by goading and coercing the US to fight his perceived threats..    But I wonder  if the sons and daughters of the hawkish politicians and kids of the CEO's of the corporations making obscene profits,  were going to the "war du jour" and dying... would they be so eager?    They have no qualms about sending our loved ones.  If it were theirs... I believe it would be a different story.


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## Josiah (Mar 19, 2015)

QuickSilver said:


> And Bibi is taking advantage of that mindset by goading and coercing the US to fight his perceived threats..    But I wonder  if the sons and daughters of the hawkish politicians and kids of the CEO's of the corporations making obscene profits,  were going to the "war du jour" and dying... would they be so eager?    They have no qualms about sending our loved ones.  If it were theirs... I believe it would be a different story.



During WW2 every national leader both in the US and the UK who had an able bodied son was proud to announce which branch of the service they were serving in. Some how that doesn't seem to be happening much any more.


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## ClassicRockr (Mar 19, 2015)

All who enlist in the military KNOW there is a chance they can go into war/battle. Nobody makes a person enlist in the military today, it is all volunteer.


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## ClassicRockr (Mar 19, 2015)

Don't know about that. There are parents of military people who live in our complex and they will tell anyone how proud they are of their kids serving. Some dads even wear a baseball cap of ship their son is serving on. Whenever a ship comes back here from a Deployment, the local media covers it. 



Josiah said:


> During WW2 every national leader both in the US and the UK who had an able bodied son was proud to announce which branch of the service they were serving in. Some how that doesn't seem to be happening much any more.


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## QuickSilver (Mar 19, 2015)

ClassicRockr said:


> All who enlist in the military KNOW there is a chance they can go into war/battle. Nobody makes a person enlist in the military today, it is all volunteer.




This is true... however, who is more likely to "volunteer"?   The very wealthy kids?   Or the poor and middle class kids who would not get to go to college if not for the hope of the GI Bill....  or the kids that can't get a job?   Or those who need to have benefits to support a family and kids..  Unfortunately only 1% of Americans do all the fighting and dying... and it's easy to say.. "well they weren't forced to"   however, there all kinds of reasons this may be the best choice to survive.  So they are willing to take the risk.


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## 911 (Mar 19, 2015)

I enlisted in the Marines to avoid being drafted. Served 11 1/2 months in Vietnam and made it home. I was not a decorated hero or won any Purple Hearts, just fought like hell to stay alive. Again, I have no regrets.


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## charlotta (Mar 19, 2015)

And we had not even completed the war with Afganistan.  Some of the higher ups in government profited very well on that invasion - incuding the Vice President.  That is why he has no regrets.


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## Ralphy1 (Mar 20, 2015)

I always thought that W wanted to show his father how to do it as a cause for invading Iraq...


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## Jackie22 (Mar 20, 2015)

Josiah said:


> On this the twelfth anniversary of the invasion of Iraq. we might do well to remind  ourselves of some of the lying or just moronic statements made by the band of neocons (and their propaganda-catapulting enablers) who orchestrated the debacle and even today have no regrets.
> 
> 
> On Sept. 7, 2002, [Judith Miller] and fellow New York Times reporter Michael Gordon reported that Iraq had "stepped up its quest for nuclear weapons and has embarked on a worldwide hunt for materials to make an atomic bomb." As proof, she cited unnamed "American intelligence experts" and unnamed "Bush administration officials." Subsequently, Condoleezza Rice, Colin Powell, and Donald Rumsfeld all pointed to Miller’s story as justification for war. On April 22, 2003, she told PBS’s Newshour that WMD had already been found in Iraq: "Well, I think they found something more than a ’smoking gun.’"
> ...



We should always remember the invading of Iraq......all of those that were involved and how 
they went about the invasion........every time we vote.


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## QuickSilver (Mar 20, 2015)

Jackie22 said:


> We should always remember the invading of Iraq......all of those that were involved and how
> they went about the invasion........every time we vote.




And especially how eager Netanyahu was for us to invade Iraq..   I'm not convinced that Israel is as big an ally as we think it is.  They are using us for schmucks.  Taking billions in aide and wanting us to be in perpetual war for their protection.  It's getting old... especially after Netanyahu's latest folly.  He just may have screwed the pooch one to many times.


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## DoItMyself (Mar 20, 2015)

Josiah said:


> On this the twelfth anniversary of the invasion of Iraq. we might do well to remind  ourselves of some of the lying or just moronic statements made by the band of neocons (and their propaganda-catapulting enablers) who orchestrated the debacle and even today have no regrets.
> 
> 
> On Sept. 7, 2002, [Judith Miller] and fellow New York Times reporter Michael Gordon reported that Iraq had "stepped up its quest for nuclear weapons and has embarked on a worldwide hunt for materials to make an atomic bomb." As proof, she cited unnamed "American intelligence experts" and unnamed "Bush administration officials." Subsequently, Condoleezza Rice, Colin Powell, and Donald Rumsfeld all pointed to Miller’s story as justification for war. On April 22, 2003, she told PBS’s Newshour that WMD had already been found in Iraq: "Well, I think they found something more than a ’smoking gun.’"
> ...



You left out a few.

This is a very difficult vote, this is probably the hardest decision I've ever had to make.  Any vote that might lead to war should be hard, but I cast it with conviction.
--Hillary Clinton, addressing the US Senate, October 10, 2002

If we fail to respond today, Saddam and all those who would follow in his footsteps will be emboldened tomorrow by the knowledge that they can act with impunity, even in the face of a clear message from the United Nations Security Council and clear evidence of a weapons of mass destruction program.
--President Clinton, Address to Joint Chiefs of Staff and Pentagon staff, February 17, 1998 

I think that we were right to go.  I think we couldn't let those who could veto in the Security Council hold us hostage. I stand behind my support of that.
--Senator John Edwards, MSNBC interview, October 13, 2003

With respect to whose responsibility it is to disarm Saddam Hussein, I do not believe that given the attitudes of many people in the world community today that there would be a willingness to take on very difficult problems were it not for United States leadership.  And we did it alone as the United States, and we had to do it alone. 
--Hillary Clinton, US capital meeting, March 6, 2003.

Saddam Hussein certainly has chemical and biological weapons.  There's no question about that.
--Nancy Pelosi, Meet the Press, November 17, 2002

I applaud the President on focusing on this issue and on taking the lead to disarm Saddam Hussein.  Others have talked about this threat that is posed by Saddam Hussein.  Yes, he has chemical weapons, he has biological weapons, he is trying to get nuclear weapons.
--Nancy Pelosi, Addressing the US House of Representatives, October 10, 2002

There's no question that Saddam Hussein is a threat to the United States and to our allies.
--Howard Dean, Face the Nation, September 29, 2002

We stopped the fighting [in 1991] on an agreement that Iraq would take steps to assure the world that it would not engage in further aggression and that it would destroy its weapons of mass destruction.  It has refused to take those steps.  That refusal constitutes a breach of the armistice which renders it void and justifies resumption of the armed conflict.
--Harry Reid, Addressing the US Senate, October 9, 2002

It is the duty of any president, in the final analysis, to defend this nation and dispel the security threat.  Saddam Hussein has brought military action upon himself by refusing for 12 years to comply with the mandates of the United Nations.  The brave and capable men and women of our armed forces and those who are with us will quickly, I know, remove him once and for all as a threat to his neighbors, to the world, and to his own people, and I support their doing so.
--John Kerry, Statement on eve of military strikes against Iraq, March 17, 2003

There is no doubt that Saddam Hussein's regime is a serious danger, that he is a tyrant, and that his pursuit of lethal weapons of mass destruction cannot be tolerated.  He must be disarmed. We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction.
--Edward Kennedy, Speech at John Hopkins Advanced International Studies, September 27, 2002

Having reached the conclusion I have about the clear and present danger Saddam represents to the U.S., I want to give the president a limited but strong mandate to act against Saddam.
--Joseph Lieberman, WSJ editorial "Why Democrats Should Support the President on Iraq", October 7, 2002

We are confident that Saddam Hussein retained some stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons, and that he has since embarked on a crash course to build up his chemical and biological warfare capability.  Intelligence reports also indicate that he is seeking nuclear weapons.
--Robert Byrd, former KKK recruiter and chapter leader, Addressing the US Senate October 3, 2002


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## QuickSilver (Mar 20, 2015)

Sure... and all because of a LIE!  A very clever and well crafted one... but a LIE all the same..


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