# A new COVID-19 mutation more contagious than Delta



## Aneeda72

A new variant-just in time for Christmas found in many places, but from what I saw mostly Africa. Resistance to the vaccines, possibly completely resistance.  More contagious than Delta.

What I saw reported was a man, with this virus, in a hotel room, “gave” the virus to a man in a room next to him.    The hotel might have been in the UK.  In any event, it seems this variant has made its way to the UK.

What have you all heard?


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## win231

It's all those anti-vaxxer's fault, dammit!


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## Don M.

They've given this variant a new name.....Omicron....people are probably tired of hearing Covid.

https://news.yahoo.com/coronavirus


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## Aneeda72

Don M. said:


> They've given this variant a new name.....Omicron....people are probably tired of hearing Covid.
> 
> https://news.yahoo.com/coronavirus


I only found numbers for a name so thanks


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## Aneeda72

win231 said:


> It's all those anti-vaxxer's fault, dammit!


@win231 i am curious and may have missed this, is there anyone you care about, family, friends, aliens, or are you all alone now?  Just, you know, you and you?  The deaths of hundreds of thousands of people is not amusing.

Unavoidable-maybe, tragic-certainly, heartbreaking to their relatives-for sure.  But amusing?  Nope.


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## win231

Aneeda72 said:


> @win231 i am curious and may have missed this, is there anyone you care about, family, friends, aliens, or are you all alone now?  Just, you know, you and you?  The deaths of hundreds of thousands of people is not amusing.
> 
> Unavoidable-maybe, tragic-certainly, heartbreaking to their relatives-for sure.  But amusing?  Nope.


Nope.  Don't care 'bout nobody.


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## MrPants

Worries over this variant appear to be significant enough to have kicked the crap outta financial markets today. Huge losses on the Dow, S&P 500 and other exchanges around the globe.


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## Uptosnuff

Blah, blah, blah, here we go again.  We are going to keep hearing this stuff for the rest of our lives.


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## Aneeda72

win231 said:


> Nope.  Don't care 'bout nobody.


And I suspect the opposite is true as well.


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## Aneeda72

MrPants said:


> Worries over this variant appear to be significant enough to have kicked the crap outta financial markets today. Huge losses on the Dow, S&P 500 and other exchanges around the globe.


Yup, saw that as well.  It’s a roller coaster ride.


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## Aneeda72

Uptosnuff said:


> Blah, blah, blah, here we go again.  We are going to keep hearing this stuff for the rest of our lives.


Yup, good thing most of our lives are nearly over


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## hollydolly

Aneeda72 said:


> A new variant-just in time for Christmas found in many places, but from what I saw mostly Africa. Resistance to the vaccines, possibly completely resistance.  More contagious than Delta.
> 
> What I saw reported was a man, with this virus, in a hotel room, “gave” the virus to a man in a room next to him.    The hotel might have been in the UK.  In any event, it seems this variant has made its way to the UK.
> 
> What have you all heard?


as I posted earlier there has been no cases diagnosed in the UK ...yet!!


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## hollydolly

Aneeda72 said:


> Yup, good thing most of our lives are nearly over


well I sincerely hope that mine isn't nearly over....


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## PamfromTx




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## Don M.

We've resigned ourselves to getting numerous "boosters" in coming years.  Just as the flu vaccines change every year, so will the treatments for this virus, IMO.   I don't see this illness going away anytime soon, so it's something we will just have to live with, and take any/all measures to avoid becoming a victim.


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## OneEyedDiva

I told ya'll when COVID first hit, this virus is going to mutate, that's what viruses do and that "they" don't know everything yet so there's no way we can. What's going to happen now? Monthly COVID shots and boosters? People talk about anti-vaxxers and those of us who are not vaccinated (we are not all "anti-vaxxers") being the ones who spread the virus but IMO, *some* of those who have been vaccinated let their guards down, stopped wearing masks, mingle in large, maskless crowds, so they share the blame in spreading the virus.

Aneeda from what I saw on the news the new variant has been found in Hong Kong, Israel and Belgium. Wouldn't be surprised if more countries are added to the list in the next couple of days despite new travel restrictions.


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## hollydolly

_At least 61 new cases of Covid have entered the Netherlands from South Africa, the Dutch health ministry has revealed as fears mount over the spread of the new super mutant variant Omicron.

Around 600 passengers arrived on two planes in Schipol Airport, near Amsterdam, from Johannesburg — the epicentre for the new strain that experts fear is 40 per cent more vaccine evasive than Delta — hours after travel bans were put in place. 

Europe's first case of the variant was spotted in Belgium yesterday — despite the unvaccinated woman who caught it having travelled to Turkey and Egypt, not souther Africa where the strain emerged.

And Germany today confirmed its first suspected case, with initial sequencing suggests a traveler from South Africa was carrying the virus with several mutations shared by Omicron. Officials are awaiting full sequencing later today. 

South Africa recorded 2,828 new Covid cases yesterday, more than double the 1,374 recorded last Thursday, but infection levels have yet to skyrocket in the country and no hospitalisations with the new variant have occurred so far.

And Professor Sir Andrew Pollard, one of the Oxford scientists behind the AstraZeneca vaccine, today expressed cautious optimism that existing vaccines could be effective at preventing serious disease from the variant.  

The US has joined the growing list of countries to close their borders, with President Joe Biden saying the pandemic will not end until global vaccinations are in place. And Australian authorities — who also banned travel to nine countries in the region — fear the variant may have already entered the country. 

It comes as Boris Johnson prepares to implement fresh travel bans on a host of countries, after Britain halted flights to South Africa, Namibia, Lesotho, Botswana, Eswatini and Zimbabwe yesterday.

Experts warned Britain could face restrictions being reintroduced in the country this Christmas but the Prime Minister hopes travel bans could prevent the need for another lockdown.

England's Chief Medical Officer Professor Chris Whitty said he fears Britons will not accept lockdown rules to fight off the variant over the winter because of 'behavioural fatigue' caused by two years of restrictions. 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...Holland-South-Africa-test-positive-Covid.html_


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## Aneeda72

OneEyedDiva said:


> I told ya'll when COVID first hit, this virus is going to mutate, that's what viruses do and that "they" don't know everything yet so there's no way we can. What's going to happen now? Monthly COVID shots and boosters? People talk about anti-vaxxers and those of us who are not vaccinated (we are not all "anti-vaxxers") being the ones who spread the virus but IMO, *some* of those who have been vaccinated let their guards down, stopped wearing masks, mingle in large crowds also unmasked, so they share the blame in spreading the virus.
> 
> Aneeda from what I saw on the news the new variant has been found in Hong Kong, Israel and Belgium. Wouldn't be surprised if more countries are added to the list in the next couple of days despite new travel restrictions.


I do remember, now that you brought it up , Israel was also mentioned


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## Aneeda72

Yup, 2 cases in UK.  Boris on CNN talking about it.  UK adds 4 countries to red list from Southern Africa. Probably too late as usual for the world.


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## win231

Uptosnuff said:


> Blah, blah, blah, here we go again.  We are going to keep hearing this stuff for the rest of our lives.


Or, at least until they sell all the vaccines they want to.


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## Flaneuse

Aneeda72 said:


> A new variant-just in time for Christmas found in many places, but from what I saw mostly Africa. Resistance to the vaccines, possibly completely resistance.  More contagious than Delta.
> 
> What I saw reported was a man, with this virus, in a hotel room, “gave” the virus to a man in a room next to him.    The hotel might have been in the UK.  In any event, it seems this variant has made its way to the UK.
> 
> What have you all heard?


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## Flaneuse

Pfizer says it will know in 2 weeks if the current vaccine is effective against the Omicron variant and could have a targeted vaccine in 100 days.  Apparently this variant has 50 mutations, most of which affect the spike protein.


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## Mizmo

Now I am wondering if I should get booster shot...????
just to lighten up for a moment


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## Becky1951

Flaneuse said:


> Pfizer says it will know in 2 weeks if the current vaccine is effective against the Omicron variant and could have a targeted vaccine in 100 days.  Apparently this variant has 50 mutations, most of which affect the spike protein.


How can they know in 2 weeks?

This variant is new, a large number of vaccinated people would have to be infected with it and then be exposed to it to know if it works or not.


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## Devi

Becky1951 said:


> How can they know in 2 weeks?
> 
> This variant is new, a large number of vaccinated people would have to be infected with it and then be exposed to it to know if it works or not.


Exactly. Has to give one pause. ;-)


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## Aneeda72

Becky1951 said:


> How can they know in 2 weeks?
> 
> This variant is new, a large number of vaccinated people would have to be infected with it and then be exposed to it to know if it works or not.


What?  Cause it spreads faster than Delta so they figure, I guess, at the rate of spread they will know in two weeks by seeing how many unvaccinated vs how many vaccinated have it.  Very, very, scary situation.

Since it’s spreading in Southern Africa, those doctors will be able to give statistics.  It was those doctors that warned the other countries; which is how the UK found it in two people there, and are now testing everyone that enters the country, and making everyone, who enters, quarantine for two weeks.

Cause that worked so well last time.


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## Sunny

They are not permitting people to enter the US from those countries that are infected by the new variant, except for US citizens. (I guess they have to allow them to return home.)

But probably, that's how it will get into this country.


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## Aneeda72

Sunny said:


> They are not permitting people to enter the US from those countries that are infected by the new variant, except for US citizens. (I guess they have to allow them to return home.)
> 
> But probably, that's how it will get into this country.


It probably is already here, just hasn’t been “found” yet


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## Sylkkiss

C19, wherever it came from is surely a bringer of sorrow. Today my son-in-law had the memorial service for his parents. They died of C-19 on the same day a half hour apart, in two different hospitals. They were married more than 50 years.

Today I can't seem to laugh about any of it.


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## Aneeda72

Sylkkiss said:


> C19, wherever it came from is surely a bringer of sorrow. Today my son-in-law had the memorial service for his parents. They died of C-19 on the same day a half hour apart, in two different hospitals. They were married more than 50 years.
> 
> Today I can't seem to laugh about any of it.


I am so sorry for your family’s loss.


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## Pinky

Sylkkiss said:


> C19, wherever it came from is surely a bringer of sorrow. Today my son-in-law had the memorial service for his parents. They died of C-19 on the same day a half hour apart, in two different hospitals. They were married more than 50 years.
> 
> Today I can't seem to laugh about any of it.


My deepest condolences, @Sylkkiss


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## Nosy Bee-54

Sunny said:


> They are not permitting people to enter the US *from those countries that are infected* *by the new variant, *except for US citizens. (I guess they have to allow them to return home.)
> 
> But probably, that's how it will get into this country.


Not sure the bolded is true. US banned only countries in Southern Africa but I believe flights are still allowed from Belgium, UK, Hong Kong, Israel and a few others that have infections.


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## Lewkat

Well, it seems that according to a few South African doctors who have been treating this variant, it is nothing more than like a very bad cold.  Very mild symptoms indeed and are perplexed at the reaction of the rest of the world over all this.  Me too.


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## dseag2

Unfortunately, less developed continents like Africa don't have nearly enough access to the vaccine, which means they just continue to spread Covid from person to person, causing it to mutate.  That is why it was first discovered in South Africa.  As of the end of October, only 6% of Africa's population had been vaccinated.  India has their own vaccine, ZyCoV-D, and over 50% have had one dose.  Their Covid cases are down significantly.

Continents without access to the vaccine will continue to cause it to mutate and it will most decidedly spread to North America and Europe.  There are already cases in the UK.  I'm sure there are cases in the US, but they haven't been identified yet.  I feel like it is mid-2020 all over again.


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## dseag2

Lewkat said:


> Well, it seems that according to a few South African doctors who have been treating this variant, it is nothing more than like a very bad cold.  Very mild symptoms indeed and are perplexed at the reaction of the rest of the world over all this.  Me too.


I certainly hope that is the case and that this is all hype.  I had the original Covid variant and it was much worse than a bad cold.  Took me months just to get rid of the congestion.


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## Tish

Still waiting this way to see if two passengers have brought it into Australia last night.


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## win231

Becky1951 said:


> How can they know in 2 weeks?
> 
> This variant is new, a large number of vaccinated people would have to be infected with it and then be exposed to it to know if it works or not.


Dr. Fauci & the CDC are in constant communication with the Covid virus & have warned it that it has 2 weeks to decide whether or not to allow the vaccine to work.
Just as 6 feet is the magic social distance.  Covid understands that, which is why the virus only infects people who are 5 ft, 11.9 inches apart or less.
Some people actually believe that.


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## chic

Lewkat said:


> Well, it seems that according to a few South African doctors who have been treating this variant, it is nothing more than like a very bad cold.  Very mild symptoms indeed and are perplexed at the reaction of the rest of the world over all this.  Me too.


That's what I've heard also. Our leaders seem to be drunk on terrifying everyone. But I still suspect this was done because of the backlash against Austria for being the first Western European country to pass a law requiring all citizens to be vaxxed by Feb.1, 2022. That has created a storm. None of our leaders are speaking against it, but journalists sure are! If Austria can scare enough people into getting vaxxed before the deadline, it takes the pressure off them. It's all just too convenient.


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## Tish

The two cases here in NSW are confirmed as being Omicron.
Considering they were on a plane, I dare say all crew and passengers will be in isolation.


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## win231

Tish said:


> The two cases here in NSW are confirmed as being Omicron.
> Considering they were on a plane, I dare say all crew and passengers will be in isolation.


Gives new meaning to the phrase:  "Enjoy your flight."


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## Furryanimal

Another over reaction.
England has joined the rest of the UK in reintroducing masks.
Absolutely pointless.
As ever better to seek out the non hysterical reactions to this.
like those from Chris Whitty and SAGE.


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## StarSong

Seems to me that many countries are gathering information on Omicron and exercising caution until more is known.  A prudent course of action by my reckoning.  Most public health specialists are paying attention, learning, gathering evidence, and investigating but not panicking.  

The good news- so far there aren't any indications that Omicron is deadlier or more dangerous than other variants.
More good news - existing vaccines may be effective against it.
The bad news - so far it does appear to be more transmissible.

Sorry to disappoint those who relish the sport of Fauci-bashing, but he is decidedly not overreacting.

_But Dr. Anthony Fauci told NBC Saturday that he would "not be surprised" if the Omicron variant was already in the US.
"We have not detected it yet, but when you have a virus that is showing this degree of transmissibility and you're having travel-related cases they've noted in other places already, when you have a virus like this, it almost invariably is going to go all over," Fauci said.

Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, noted that travel restrictions allow health experts to have additional time to study the variant and understand it in a more significant capacity -- including whether the current vaccines are effective against Omicron._
*
"The vaccines we use may very well be able to contain this. And then it won't be as serious as some people are surmising it might be. A lot of unknowns," Fauci told NBC. "You don't want people to panic, but you want to know we're doing everything we can to stay ahead of this."*

_https://www.cnn.com/2021/11/28/health/us-coronavirus-sunday/index.html_


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## Aneeda72

win231 said:


> Dr. Fauci & the CDC are in constant communication with the Covid virus & have warned it that it has 2 weeks to decide whether or not to allow the vaccine to work.
> Just as 6 feet is the magic social distance.  Covid understands that, which is why the virus only infects people who are 5 ft, 11.9 inches apart or less.
> Some people actually believe that.


Well, you believe that and you are a person sooo, what is your point?  Wait.  Do you actually know someone that will let you get as close as 5 ft 11.9 inches?  That would be remarkable for you


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## Flaneuse

Becky1951 said:


> How can they know in 2 weeks?
> 
> This variant is new, a large number of vaccinated people would have to be infected with it and then be exposed to it to know if it works or not.


They are doing lab tests to determine if the current vaccine works.  News reports say two weeks.  I'm not a scientist so I'm not going to challenge what they say.  I figure the people doing the work know more than I do on the subject.


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## CarolfromTX

What I hear is that it’s very contagious but also quite mild. No need for hospitalization. I’ll take my chances. But y’all go ahead and panic.


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## Aneeda72

CarolfromTX said:


> What I hear is that it’s very contagious but also quite mild. No need for hospitalization. I’ll take my chances. But y’all go ahead and panic.


No one is panicking, hospitalization depends, as always, on the condition of the patient at the time they catch the virus, any virus.  A regular cold can be life threatening if the wrong person catches one.  I am sure you know this.


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## win231

Aneeda72 said:


> Well, you believe that and you are a person sooo, what is your point?  Wait.  Do you actually know someone that will let you get as close as 5 ft 11.9 inches?  That would be remarkable for you


They wait in line outside when it's 30 below, baby.


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## StarSong

win231 said:


> They wait in line outside when it's 30 below, baby.


Since you live in So Cal, I'm guessing that's a rarity.


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## chic

CarolfromTX said:


> What I hear is that it’s very contagious but also quite mild. No need for hospitalization. I’ll take my chances. But y’all go ahead and panic.


I refuse to panic any more over this. I am so done with it all.


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## John cycling

Aneeda72 said:


> Cause it spreads faster than Delta



They know this because it's so small that they've never been able to find it, just like all of the others.  Therefore it must have supersonic jet propulsion because there's no other explanation even though none of it makes any sense, just like none of the others made any sense either.


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## AnnieA

StarSong said:


> The good news- so far there aren't any indications that Omicron is deadlier or more dangerous than other variants.    ....The bad news - so far it does appear to be more transmissible.


It's too early to say for sure but possibly it's milder.  Best case scenario for naturally conferred immunity is that it is both more transmissible and mild.


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## AnnieA

dseag2 said:


> Unfortunately, less developed continents like Africa don't have nearly enough access to the vaccine, which means they just continue to spread Covid from person to person, causing it to mutate.



That or another theory I've seen that it mutated when a person with comorbid HIV couldn't shake it off.

I've beat the drum so many times that it's a wonder that my sticks haven't snapped, but we should have been administering vaccines ...not to mention boosters... to people who have no naturally conferred immunity from prior infection.  I was heartened to learn in the last few weeks that the Netherlands sensibly implemented that principle early on into their Covid passes, but many first world countries promoted Vaccinate!!!Everyone!!! fear and policies that led to vaccine resource hoarding.   Follow the money on that one....right back to the greed of people who throw the most money at politicians and don't stand to profit from third world charity.

.


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## Flaneuse

Lewkat said:


> Well, it seems that according to a few South African doctors who have been treating this variant, it is nothing more than like a very bad cold.  Very mild symptoms indeed and are perplexed at the reaction of the rest of the world over all this.  Me too.


According to today's NY Times it's too early to draw conclusions:  
"In the rush to understand the threat posed by the Omicron variant, the worrisome new version of the coronavirus, some experts are pointing hopefully to early signs that it may cause only mild illness, without some of the trademark symptoms of Covid.

But it is far too early to assume that the variant will not cause severe illness, too, warned Dr. Richard Lessells, who coordinates clinical and epidemiological data for the South African Covid Variant Research Consortium."  The article goes on to explain why we can't conclude based on early cases that this variant is mild.


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## WhatInThe

Some are saying this may have come from an untreated AIDs patient which might account for the 30 mutations. Some of the mutations have made it more transmissible by making binding to ACE2 receptors easier.

https://www.news18.com/news/india/n...to-know-about-its-mutation-cases-4487138.html


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## Pepper

It's not panicking to take precautions in life and to be careful.  No need to be hysterical, and no one on this forum displays that.  I have not met one person who is panicked by this situation.  Maybe they don't like it, and it's normal not to, but panic?


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## Aneeda72

win231 said:


> They wait in line outside when it's 30 below, baby.


Awesome, baby


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## Nosy Bee-54

Is it "a storm in a teacup?"

"Notably, only about 36% of the adult population in South Africa has been vaccinated against COVID-19. To this end, only about 65% of the South African patients who have recently been admitted are not vaccinated, whereas Mathivha states that most of the remaining patients have only received one dose of the COVID-19 vaccines."

https://www.news-medical.net/news/20211128/SARS-CoV-2-Omicron-variant-What-we-know-so-far.aspx


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## Shero

The excitement among the anti vaxxers is contagious! 
Don't worry, the sensible approach aways wins!!


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## Shero

Good News !!  Omicron is milder than Delta and no cases reported of a vaccinated person getting it.


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## Aneeda72

Shero said:


> Good News !!  Omicron is milder than Delta and no cases reported of a vaccinated person getting it.


Well, not exactly, good news, maybe hopeful news @Shero 

Dr Karin, on CNN, this morning says it’s TOO EARLY for severe cases to appear.  He said we will know about severe cases in another two to three weeks.  Meanwhile, the virus had been found in a lot more countries, including our neighbor Canada.

Pretty sure it must be here as well.  He said it was very contagious.  Said it was not worth a no fly policy against South Africa since it will spread anyway and it has.  In several countries now.

He also said it probably can evade the vaccine.  Said they won’t know anything much for another 2 to 3 weeks.


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## CarolfromTX

A perfect excuse for governors and political leaders to make another Draconian power grab.


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## CarolfromTX

New York has cancelled all elective surgery.  If that’s not panic, I don’t  know what is.


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## StarSong

Shero said:


> Good News !!  Omicron is milder than Delta and no cases reported of a vaccinated person getting it.


Fingers crossed that this is so.  Please cite your source.


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## Aneeda72

CarolfromTX said:


> New York has cancelled all elective surgery.  If that’s not panic, I don’t  know what is.


Because there is a Covid spike and the beds might be needed, remember, elective surgery is just that, elective-it can wait.


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## Becky1951

There have been some reported Omicron breakthrough infections among vaccinated people in southern Africa, but scientists don’t yet know if the B.1.1.529 breakthrough infections are more or less common than breakthrough infections from other variants.

https://nymag-com.cdn.ampproject.or...w-about-the-omicron-b11529-covid-variant.html


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## Shero

StarSong said:


> Fingers crossed that this is so.  Please cite your source.


.
On the news for the past few days. No written links, but I am sure there is one.


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## Warrigal

Furryanimal said:


> Another over reaction.
> England has joined the rest of the UK in reintroducing masks.
> Absolutely pointless.
> As ever better to seek out the non hysterical reactions to this.
> like those from Chris Whitty and SAGE.


Hubby and I haven't stopped wearing masks when out and about whether or not we are required to and we won't for the foreseeable future. IMO it is madness not to take simple precautions when unable to social distance.

Yesterday we both had a Covid swab test because we have dental appointments on Thursday. The dentist requested it and I don't blame him. He has no desire to catch Covid from his patients and take it home to his family. Living with Covid isn't about doing whatever you please without taking into consideration the people around you. It is about doing all you can to avoid becoming infectious and infecting others.

I am amazed that people who object to being vaccinated for whatever reason are also adamant that they will not wear a mask. Surely that is not a major assault on personal freedom. IMO it is just being bloody minded and stubborn. My mother would have described it as just "being agin the gov'ment".


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## CarolfromTX

Aneeda72 said:


> Because there is a Covid spike and the beds might be needed, remember, elective surgery is just that, elective-it can wait.


If? If? If cows learned to fly, we’d all have to carry umbrellas. Has there actually been a spike? No? But you get out your umbrella.  

on a side note, my husband’s hip surgery was “elective.” Delayed during the first lockdown.  So he got to live in excruciating pain for an extra three months. There‘s elective surgery, snd then there’s surgery that’s technically elective, but totally urgent.


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## chic

CarolfromTX said:


> New York has cancelled all elective surgery.  If that’s not panic, I don’t  know what is.


They've cancelled elective surgery in my state also. I don't believe it's reason to panic though.


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## Aneeda72

CarolfromTX said:


> If? If? If cows learned to fly, we’d all have to carry umbrellas. Has there actually been a spike? No? But you get out your umbrella.
> 
> on a side note, my husband’s hip surgery was “elective.” Delayed during the first lockdown.  So he got to live in excruciating pain for an extra three months. There‘s elective surgery, snd then there’s surgery that’s technically elective, but totally urgent.


Well, I have had two hip replacements and my last one was delayed more than 6 months, yes it hurt but it was not urgent.  Heart valve replacement is urgent, hip replacement is not.

As for getting out my umbrella cause cows might learn to fly, cow pies are fairly thick and heavy, you should know this since you are in Texas; so the cow pies would break an umbrella.

Best you just stay indoors.  @CarolfromTX  You will be safe from Covid and falling cow pies


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## Ladybj

Becky1951 said:


> How can they know in 2 weeks?
> 
> This variant is new, a large number of vaccinated people would have to be infected with it and then be exposed to it to know if it works or not.


EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!


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## Ladybj

Flaneuse said:


> They are doing lab tests to determine if the current vaccine works.  News reports say two weeks.  I'm not a scientist so I'm not going to challenge what they say.  I figure the people doing the work know more than I do on the subject.


You Think???  How will they know in two weeks????  WOW!!! That should go in the Guinness Book of World records... just trying to understand


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## Ladybj

Shero said:


> The excitement among the anti vaxxers is contagious!
> Don't worry, the sensible approach aways wins!!


Whats the excitement Shero - I missed that memo???


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## win231

Don M. said:


> They've given this variant a new name.....Omicron....people are probably tired of hearing Covid.
> 
> https://news.yahoo.com/coronavirus


At first, they named it after the doctor who discovered it, but they decided _"Faucicron" _didn't sound appropriate.


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## Ruthanne

Hearing about this "new" variant doesn't even phase me any more.  I know the media will keep up the non-ending coverage about it just like all the other variants.  I really don't give a #hi* about it.  I've done all I can to be supposedly safe and I know what to do around people so I'll just be tuning the news out for awhile until it dies down-the news dies down that is.


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## Warrigal

Aneeda72 said:


> Well, I have had two hip replacements and my last one was delayed more than 6 months, yes it hurt but it was not urgent.  Heart valve replacement is urgent, hip replacement is not.
> 
> As for getting out my umbrella cause cows might learn to fly, cow pies are fairly thick and heavy, you should know this since you are in Texas; so the cow pies would break an umbrella.
> 
> Best you just stay indoors.  @CarolfromTX  You will be safe from Covid and falling cow pies


I am in need of a hip replacement and the pain level is increasing, but I agree that it is not urgent. I have the added complication that I have to work around Covid, the Summer holidays and the requirement of needing to fit in with our children's work schedules. Hubby cannot look after himself properly and is in danger from falls so the daughter and son are making themselves available to come and stay with him while I am in hospital and respite for a further 2 weeks. I plan to contact the surgeon in the next couple of days and I'll let you all know how long I may have to wait.


----------



## chic

Ruthanne said:


> Hearing about this "new" variant doesn't even phase me any more.  I know the media will keep up the non-ending coverage about it just like all the other variants.  I really don't give a #hi* about it.  I've done all I can to be supposedly safe and I know what to do around people so I'll just be tuning the news out for awhile until it dies down-the news dies down that is.


And this is how the pandemic will truly come to an end IMO, when people become bored and angry instead of afraid.


----------



## Aneeda72

Ladybj said:


> You Think???  How will they know in two weeks????  WOW!!! That should go in the Guinness Book of World records... just trying to understand


Nope, I disagree.  I think you are trying to be sarcastic.  But I could be wrong, in which case, if you don’t truely don’t understand it, you could have early dementia and you should see a doctor.


----------



## Aneeda72

Warrigal said:


> I am in need of a hip replacement and the pain level is increasing, but I agree that it is not urgent. I have the added complication that I have to work around Covid, the Summer holidays and the requirement of needing to fit in with our children's work schedules. Hubby cannot look after himself properly and is in danger from falls so the daughter and son are making themselves available to come and stay with him while I am in hospital and respite for a further 2 weeks. I plan to contact the surgeon in the next couple of days and I'll let you all know how long I may have to wait.


About hip surgery, just because the hip gets replaced that doesn’t mean you will be out of pain, it just means the hip works better and the pain will be less, or not as constant.  A lot of people are out of pain, but some, like me, remain in pain.  And my husband has occasional pain with his hips.  Just letting you know the reality of it.


----------



## Aneeda72

chic said:


> And this is how the pandemic will truly come to an end IMO, when people become bored and angry instead of afraid.


What?

People might stop talking about it if they become bored with the never ending death count but I can not see that happening.  Angry people, in my experience, stay angry, and therefore aware of the focus of their anger.  And the pandemic will not “end” if people stop recognizing that it exist.

So, I find your comment odd.


----------



## Liberty

Get ready for a bumpy ride.  Moderna is telling us the forecast:

https://www.thestreet.com/markets/moderna-omicron-warning-hits-dow-futures-hard-stock-market-today


----------



## Aneeda72

The problem is not necessarily the virus.  The problem is “our” reaction to the virus.  The government’s reaction to the virus.  If the virus symptoms become worst and shut downs start again it could be horrendous for our economy.


----------



## CarolfromTX

Aneeda72 said:


> About hip surgery, just because the hip gets replaced that doesn’t mean you will be out of pain, it just means the hip works better and the pain will be less, or not as constant.  A lot of people are out of pain, but some, like me, remain in pain.  And my husband has occasional pain with his hips.  Just letting you know the reality of it.



My husbands pain was excruciating. He was horribly uncomfortable all the time, probably because he stubbornly refused to consider it until the pain was so great.  He was out of pain, hip wise, immediately after surgery. Still is.  Maybe he just had a really good surgeon, but that’s his reality.


----------



## Sunny

Don M. said:


> They've given this variant a new name.....Omicron....people are probably tired of hearing Covid.
> 
> https://news.yahoo.com/coronavirus


Omicron is not a new name to replace Covid, Don.  It's a variant of Covid. Just as leukemia and lymphoma didn't replace "cancer;" they are types of cancer.


----------



## SeaBreeze

Sunny said:


> Omicron is not a new name to replace Covid, Don.  It's a variant of Covid. Just as leukemia and lymphoma didn't replace "cancer;" they are types of cancer.


Of course.  Here's an article for those who may be confused.
https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsa...riant-spreads-so-quickly-infectious-mutations



> "Everyone is afraid that omicron will be significantly more transmissible than delta. Upon first impression, it looks like it could be," he says. "But that could be totally wrong. Right now, nobody knows. The problem is that our data is very limited."
> 
> At the moment, the only data scientists have to estimate omicron's transmissibility comes largely from the cluster of cases at a university in Pretoria. The rapid rise in cases there could be due, in part, to a superspreading event.
> 
> However, some specific mutations in omicron do suggest it will be quite transmissible, Luban says.
> 
> *As a result, the vaccines will likely be less effective against this variant, he predicts. But his research so far also suggests that people can boost their protection — against any variant — by having three exposures to the virus. So that means either three doses of the vaccine or two doses after a natural infection.
> 
> That seems to broaden your defenses, says Shi, the virologist at the University of Texas Medical Branch. "After the third dose of the vaccine, our antibody profile inside our body becomes more capable of blocking the variants," he says. "Our bodies create different antibodies that are much more able to push back on the variants."*


----------



## StarSong

chic said:


> And this is how the pandemic will truly come to an end IMO, when people become bored and angry instead of afraid.


Pandemic level viruses don't care if we become bored and angry.  They continue wreaking havoc apace until eventually herd immunity diminishes their ability to find new hosts or they settle into non-lethal variants.  

We all learned as children that gravity doesn't give a crap how we feel about it. It does its thing whether or not we believe in it. Same with this virus. 

People who remain unvaccinated, don't wear masks in public, mingle in large crowds, etc. do so at their own risk. Also, unfortunately at the risk of the immune compromised. 

The vaccine has helped me to have a  much more relaxed life than  a year ago.  Yes, I still wear masks in stores, but I freely visit with (vaxxed) friends and family, eat at outdoor restaurants, travel locally, and am generally less concerned than I was.  

Should a quite lethal variant arise that isn't covered by current vaccines, I'll return to a more restricted life until a booster is developed.


----------



## AnnieA

EU's tracking so far show mild to asymptomatic cases but sample size is small.

Link to follow ECDC Omnicron Covid varient updates:  https://www.ecdc.europa.eu/en/news-events/epidemiological-update-omicron-data-30-november-2021


----------



## Don M.

The "news" surrounding this new variant is all over the place.  I think it's far too early for anyone to know just how dangerous this version will be, so it would be wise for everyone to exercise some "caution", until more is known.  In all likelihood, this will ultimately lead to another "booster", and/or modifications of the existing vaccines.  

No matter what, with the holidays and more people getting together indoors, etc., I fully expect the numbers of people infected will rise, and our hospitals/medical personnel will be very busy.


----------



## win231

StarSong said:


> Pandemic level viruses don't care if we become bored and angry.  They continue wreaking havoc apace until eventually herd immunity diminishes their ability to find new hosts or they settle into non-lethal variants.
> 
> We all learned as children that gravity doesn't give a crap how we feel about it. It does its thing whether or not we believe in it. Same with this virus.
> 
> People who remain unvaccinated, don't wear masks in public, mingle in large crowds, etc. do so at their own risk. Also, unfortunately at the risk of the immune compromised.
> 
> The vaccine has helped me to have a  much more relaxed life than  a year ago.  Yes, I still wear masks in stores, but I freely visit with (vaxxed) friends and family, eat at outdoor restaurants, travel locally, and am generally less concerned than I was.
> 
> Should a quite lethal variant arise that isn't covered by current vaccines, I'll return to a more restricted life until a booster is developed.



_"The vaccine has helped me to have a  much more relaxed life than  a year ago.  Yes, I still wear masks in stores, but I freely visit with (vaxxed) friends and family, eat at outdoor restaurants, travel locally, and am generally less concerned than I was."_

Quite telling.  Indicates that (for you), the vaccine has helped you _emotionally_, rather than _physically_ protecting you.


----------



## chic

win231 said:


> _"The vaccine has helped me to have a  much more relaxed life than  a year ago.  Yes, I still wear masks in stores, but I freely visit with (vaxxed) friends and family, eat at outdoor restaurants, travel locally, and am generally less concerned than I was."_
> 
> Quite telling.  Indicates that (for you), the vaccine has helped you _emotionally_, rather than _physically_ protecting you.


That's what the purpose was. Mask too. It makes some people less afraid at the expense of others.


----------



## StarSong

win231 said:


> _"The vaccine has helped me to have a  much more relaxed life than  a year ago.  Yes, I still wear masks in stores, but I freely visit with (vaxxed) friends and family, eat at outdoor restaurants, travel locally, and am generally less concerned than I was."_
> 
> Quite telling.  Indicates that (for you), the vaccine has helped you _emotionally_, rather than _physically_ protecting you.


The vaccines do physically protect me.  That said, I don't want even a mild breakthrough case, even though the vaccine and booster are excellent protection from severe illness.      

I avoid unvaccinated relatives (my friends have all been vaxxed).  To be blunt, if they don't care enough about themselves and others to get vaccinated, I'd rather not be around them.  

Note:  No one in my circle is medically prohibited from getting a vaccine.


----------



## Aunt Bea

chic said:


> View attachment 196705


So is loss of life!


----------



## Flaneuse

Ladybj said:


> You Think???  How will they know in two weeks????  WOW!!! That should go in the Guinness Book of World records... just trying to understand


They are targeting two weeks.  Are you reading news reports about what they are doing and how? It's really quite interesting and I highly recommend.  They have apparently developed a synthetic version of Omicron with all the mutations and are lab-testing it with the vaccines.  It's reported in most of the responsible new media.


----------



## win231

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/1-moderna-ceo-says-vaccines-055048321.html

And that's what he's admitting to.  He doesn't want to admit the vaccine is completely ineffective.


----------



## Ladybj

Flaneuse said:


> They are targeting two weeks.  Are you reading news reports about what they are doing and how? It's really quite interesting and I highly recommend.  They have apparently developed a synthetic version of Omicron with all the mutations and are lab-testing it with the vaccines.  It's reported in most of the responsible new media.


No, I don't watch the News media.  But thank you for the explanation. Much appreciated.


----------



## Ladybj

win231 said:


> https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/1-moderna-ceo-says-vaccines-055048321.html
> 
> And that's what he's admitting to.  He doesn't want to admit the vaccine is completely ineffective.


Well from what I gather so far, no the vaccine don't seem to be effective as they believed it would be because people are now having to take the Booster.  I am sure they are learning as they go along...jmo.


----------



## Flaneuse

Ladybj said:


> Well from what I gather so far, no the vaccine don't seem to be effective as they believed it would be because people are now having to take the Booster.  I am sure they are learning as they go along...jmo.


The Moderna and Pfizer vaccines initially had a 90-95% effectiveness, but the effectiveness wanes over time, something that is no surprise.  That's why boosters were needed - to bring the effectiveness back up.    The booster has nothing to do wth the Omicron variant.


----------



## Ladybj

Aneeda72 said:


> Nope, I disagree.  I think you are trying to be sarcastic.  But I could be wrong, in which case, if you don’t truely don’t understand it, you could have early dementia and you should see a doctor.


I love you Aneeda.  If that was an insult, I do not accept it - so I will give it back to you.  Just as if you give someone a gift and they refuse it, you take it back right - therefore, I give it back to you?  Maybe you can give it to someone else.


----------



## Ladybj

Ruthanne said:


> Hearing about this "new" variant doesn't even phase me any more.  I know the media will keep up the non-ending coverage about it just like all the other variants.  I really don't give a #hi* about it.  I've done all I can to be supposedly safe and I know what to do around people so I'll just be tuning the news out for awhile until it dies down-the news dies down that is.


Same here.. I am sure a lot of people are over it. My hubby has been vaccinated and he is over it as well.  I am not a fan of News media either..never have been.  I watch the weather and that's about it.  I read somewhere that someone made a comment "I will be glad when the Vaccine bubble burst".


----------



## Aneeda72

Ladybj said:


> I love you Aneeda.  If that was an insult, I do not accept it - so I will give it back to you.  Just as if you give someone a gift and they refuse it, you take it back right - therefore, I give it back to you?  Maybe you can give it to someone else.


It was not an insult.  I have early dementia, was diagnosed in my 50’s.  It is not Alzheimer’s.  It a type of dementia that abused children get due to the fact that the abuse causes their brains not to grow correctly.  The diagnosis was made by a neurologist at the UofU.

Having said that, which matters not to you, I don’t take it back. You said you didn’t understand something that was easy to understand.  If your comment was part of your sarcasm, then it should have been clearer than it was.  I took you seriously.

I told a friend at the apartment who I saw almost fall while walking that she should use a walker or cane.  She explained that she had an ankle issue and didn’t need either.    I offered to give her one of mine, either one or both.  She refused.  

I said she was being another stubborn old woman.  Yup, she was insulted.  So what?  We talked a little more, she agreed she was being stubborn (and she is old and a woman ).  I had her best interest in mind when I suggested she needed a walking aid.  I had your best interest in mind when I suggested you might get checked out.


No apology to her.  No apology to you.  But feel free to insult me, husband does it all the time-it’s water off a duck‘s back.  And if I didn’t like you, I wouldn’t have suggest you see someone, just saying.


----------



## Aneeda72

chic said:


> That's what the purpose was. Mask too. It makes some people less afraid at the expense of others.
> 
> View attachment 196705


Actually loss of freedom is not forever.  There was a lot of loss of freedom during WWII and a lot of freedom restored.  Just one of many examples.


----------



## John cycling

Aneeda72 said:


> the pandemic will not “end” if people stop recognizing that it exist.



Actually, that's the ONLY way it will end.


----------



## Warrigal

CarolfromTX said:


> My husbands pain was excruciating. He was horribly uncomfortable all the time, probably because he stubbornly refused to consider it until the pain was so great.  He was out of pain, hip wise, immediately after surgery. Still is.  Maybe he just had a really good surgeon, but that’s his reality.


I know that pain. It is very sharp and it is hard to get into a position that relieves it. Hard to sleep as well. Over the counter meds can only do so much. When I was waiting for shoulder replacements my GP prescribed analgesic patches but you can't stay on them very long. I'm glad to hear that his surgeon was competent.


----------



## SeaBreeze

StarSong said:


> Pandemic level viruses don't care if we become bored and angry.  They continue wreaking havoc apace until eventually herd immunity diminishes their ability to find new hosts or they settle into non-lethal variants.
> 
> We all learned as children that gravity doesn't give a crap how we feel about it. It does its thing whether or not we believe in it. Same with this virus.
> 
> People who remain unvaccinated, don't wear masks in public, mingle in large crowds, etc. do so at their own risk. Also, unfortunately at the risk of the immune compromised.
> 
> The vaccine has helped me to have a  much more relaxed life than  a year ago.  Yes, I still wear masks in stores, but I freely visit with (vaxxed) friends and family, eat at outdoor restaurants, travel locally, and am generally less concerned than I was.
> 
> Should a quite lethal variant arise that isn't covered by current vaccines, I'll return to a more restricted life until a booster is developed.


Very well said, thank you.


----------



## SeaBreeze

StarSong said:


> The vaccines do physically protect me.  That said, I don't want even a mild breakthrough case, even though the vaccine and booster are excellent protection from severe illness.
> 
> I avoid unvaccinated relatives (my friends have all been vaxxed).  To be blunt, if they don't care enough about themselves and others to get vaccinated, I'd rather not be around them.
> 
> Note:  No one in my circle is medically prohibited from getting a vaccine.


I'm not around many people, but everyone in my circle of friends has been wise and responsible enough to get fully vaccinated.   They also wear masks when needed, as I and my husband do.  I wouldn't socialize with anyone indoors who was not fully vaccinated.  Hopefully soon they won't be permitted to fly on planes or frequent any business establishments unless they have a vaccine card.  This is the pandemic of the unvaccinated, and until these people act responsibly, instead of fretting about losing their freedumb, we won't get back to normal in this country.


----------



## Aneeda72

SeaBreeze said:


> I'm not around many people, but everyone in my circle of friends has been wise and responsible enough to get fully vaccinated.   They also wear masks when needed, as I and my husband do.  I wouldn't socialize with anyone indoors who was not fully vaccinated.  Hopefully soon they won't be permitted to fly on planes or frequent any business establishments unless they have a vaccine card.  This is the pandemic of the unvaccinated, and until these people act responsibly, instead of fretting about losing their freedumb, we won't get back to normal in this country.


Isn’t it funny that those who claim to have lost their freedom can never state exactly what freedom they lost?


----------



## Pepper

Well, Aneeda, I guess restaurants & football games & concerts?


----------



## Shero

Ladybj said:


> Whats the excitement Shero - I missed that memo???


Look around, look around, the excitement is all around


----------



## Aneeda72

Pepper said:


> Well, Aneeda, I guess restaurants & football games & concerts?


Really?  

The things you mention are not freedoms.  These things are privileges, not rights.  You have the freedom to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.  Happiness is constrained by budget issues.

Constrained freedom of speech-you actually can curse the President of the United States and not be shot.  Try cursing the President of Russia-see what happens to you.  Freedom of the press-one of our more important freedoms.  Freedom of religion.  Freedom to bear arms-a biggie to some.  Freedom of assembly.  These are freedoms.

Btw, do you go to football games?  Cause I can go to one now, but it’s too cold.  Do you go to restaurants?  I’ve been able to do that for months, why can’t you?  And Broadway opened a while back.  Concerts are up and running in some places.  Las Vegas is open .

Edited:  There are actually 27 freedoms listed under the constitution-none of them mention the right to go to restaurants, football games, or concerts.


----------



## win231

SeaBreeze said:


> I'm not around many people, but everyone in my circle of friends has been wise and responsible enough to get fully vaccinated.   They also wear masks when needed, as I and my husband do.  I wouldn't socialize with anyone indoors who was not fully vaccinated.  Hopefully soon they won't be permitted to fly on planes or frequent any business establishments unless they have a vaccine card.  This is the pandemic of the unvaccinated, and until these people act responsibly, instead of fretting about losing their freedumb, we won't get back to normal in this country.


_ "This is the pandemic of the unvaccinated." _


----------



## win231

Aneeda72 said:


> Isn’t it funny that those who claim to have lost their freedom can never state exactly what freedom they lost?


No complaints from me.  I haven't lost any freedom.


----------



## Warrigal

win231 said:


> _ "This is the pandemic of the unvaccinated." _


The stats seem to confirm that statement when it comes to hospitalisations and deaths.
At least it does in Australia. This is from a publication from the Royal Australian College of General Practioners   RACGP - Unvaccinated patients dominate COVID deaths and ICU

If you want more recent reports I suggest you use use a search engine using "covid vaccinated vs unvaccinated" Look for medical reports. 



> Unvaccinated patients dominate COVID deaths and ICU​Most people who have died from COVID-19 in NSW had not received a vaccine, while no one under 70 has died having received two doses. Less than 2% of people admitted to intensive care in New South Wales in the first 11 weeks of the recent outbreak were fully vaccinated, the latest NSW Health weekly surveillance report shows.
> 
> The document, which gives a breakdown of the vaccination status of all those who enter the hospital system with COVID-19, also shows that none of the 15 fully vaccinated patients who died of the disease were under 70.
> 
> The latest report covers the week from 29 August until 4 September, the most recent period for which official data has been released in the state at the centre of the largest COVID-19 outbreak so far in Australia. It indicates 4654 people were hospitalised due to COVID-19 from the beginning of the outbreak in June until that time, of which around 9% (441) were treated in ICU.
> 
> Of the total admitted to hospital, 153 (3.3%) were confirmed as fully vaccinated, while 844 (18.1%) were partially vaccinated and the rest (3657) were unvaccinated, or their vaccination status was unable to be established.
> 
> In total 284 unvaccinated people (64.4%) had been treated in ICU during the latest outbreak up to 4 September. Seventy patients (15.9%) who received intensive care were categorised as partially vaccinated, while eight (1.8%) were fully vaccinated. The remaining 79 people treated in ICU had an undetermined vaccination status.
> 
> Professor Dimity Pond, an honorary professor of general practice at the University of Newcastle, said the figures in the surveillance reports correspond with expectations about the vaccines.
> 
> ‘That’s the kind of pattern that we’ve been seeing where the deaths are very largely in people who aren’t vaccinated,’ Professor Pond told _newsGP_.  ‘It’s really hard data. It can’t be interpreted in any way other than vaccination means that you’re less likely to die.’
> 
> Until 4 September, there were 129 confirmed COVID deaths within NSW – again mostly among the unvaccinated. Of those deaths, 15 (11.6%) were confirmed as fully vaccinated, including six people in their 70s, five in their 80s and four in their 90s.
> 
> For Professor Pond, the data underlines the importance of caution even when the protection from the vaccines is deemed strongest.
> 
> ‘The lesson I take from that is for older people, you can still get COVID if you are vaccinated, particularly if you’ve got underlying conditions,’ she said. ‘And it’s still worth, therefore, social distancing and wearing the mask and being careful.’


----------



## Becky1951

Pepper said:


> Well, Aneeda, I guess restaurants & football games & concerts?


Those who used to have a job they went to daily for years, no longer have the freedom to do so unless they are vaccinated.

They are being or were forced out of employment, now have loss of income, children of those families are or will be receiving less food or lesser quality of food due to parent/parents loss of income.

They can no longer pay their rent or mortgage, insurance etc.

I doubt any of them gives a sh*t about not going to dine in restaurants, concerts or football games. 

Yes their are some jobs that have always required some vaccinations, *Not All jobs. *


----------



## SeaBreeze

Warrigal said:


> The stats seem to confirm that statement when it comes to hospitalisations and deaths.
> At least it does in Australia. This is from a publication from the Royal Australian College of General Practioners   RACGP - Unvaccinated patients dominate COVID deaths and ICU
> 
> If you want more recent reports I suggest you use use a search engine using "covid vaccinated vs unvaccinated" Look for medical reports.


It does in the United States also, or I wouldn't have repeated that.  Some people are still denying the pandemic and condemning the vaccines, for no valid or realistic reason.


----------



## win231

Warrigal said:


> The stats seem to confirm that statement when it comes to hospitalisations and deaths.
> At least it does in Australia. This is from a publication from the Royal Australian College of General Practioners   RACGP - Unvaccinated patients dominate COVID deaths and ICU
> 
> If you want more recent reports I suggest you use use a search engine using "covid vaccinated vs unvaccinated" Look for medical reports.


Yes, the stats seem to confirm that statement......provided you swallow everything you're fed by people who are required to be on the same page as far as selling vaccines - one after another, endlessly.
And that photo of someone supposedly dying of Covid who just happens to be morbidly obese?  At that weight, he would already have trouble breathing - Covid or not.  Vaccinated or not.

What's the recovery rate of COVID-19?
Experts don't have information about the outcome of every infection. However, early estimates predict that _*the overall COVID-19 recovery rate is between 97% and 99.75%. *_ Aug 7, 2021

https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1...X0KHbdfBL0Qzmd6BAgQEAU&biw=1440&bih=757&dpr=1


----------



## Ladybj

win231 said:


> _ "This is the pandemic of the unvaccinated." _


Win - gotta blame somebody.  I guess we are the cause of the new variant as well...smh.


----------



## win231

Ladybj said:


> Win - gotta blame somebody.  I guess we are the cause of the new variant as well...smh.


And all the future variants that are sure to follow - with a new vaccine for each one.
Forever.


----------



## Ladybj

SeaBreeze said:


> It does in the United States also, or I wouldn't have repeated that.  Some people are still denying the pandemic and condemning the vaccines, for no valid or realistic reason.


People have valid reasons not to get vaccinated... no one is listening.  Just as people have valid reasons for others to get vaccinated.


----------



## SeaBreeze

Ladybj said:


> People have valid reasons not to get vaccinated... no one is listening.  Just as people have valid reasons for others to get vaccinated.


The _only _valid reason not to get vaccinated is a medical reason documented by that person's physician.


----------



## Warrigal

win231 said:


> Yes, the stats seem to confirm that statement......provided you swallow everything you're fed by people who are required to be on the same page as far as selling vaccines - one after another, endlessly.
> And that photo of someone supposedly dying of Covid who just happens to be morbidly obese?  At that weight, he would already have trouble breathing - Covid or not.  Vaccinated or not.
> 
> What's the recovery rate of COVID-19?
> Experts don't have information about the outcome of every infection. However, early estimates predict that _*the overall COVID-19 recovery rate is between 97% and 99.75%. *_ Aug 7, 2021
> 
> https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS894US894&q=What's+the+recovery+rate+of+COVID-19?&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiU1diBxMH0AhWBMX0KHbdfBL0Qzmd6BAgQEAU&biw=1440&bih=757&dpr=1


This link has an explanation of how covid death rates are calculated using simple graphics..

It then goes on to provide the official mortality data by vaccination status published by the United States, England, and Chile. The data is updated weekly. You can examine it for different ages.

How do death rates from COVID-19 differ between people who are vaccinated and those who are not? - Our World in Data


----------



## Aneeda72

Becky1951 said:


> Those who used to have a job they went to daily for years, no longer have the freedom to do so unless they are vaccinated.
> 
> They are being or were forced out of employment, now have loss of income, children of those families are or will be receiving less food or lesser quality of food due to parent/parents loss of income.
> 
> They can no longer pay their rent or mortgage, insurance etc.
> 
> I doubt any of them gives a sh*t about not going to dine in restaurants, concerts or football games.
> 
> Yes their are some jobs that have always required some vaccinations, *Not All jobs. *


Having a job, unfortunately is not a freedom or an entitlement, or a right.  Going to a job is not a freedom or a right.  Employers have a dress code and apparently a vaccination code.  Employers get to make the rules.  It has always been this way.  Follow the rules or find another job.  Freedom of choice still exist.  Take the vaccine or don’t.  Your choice.

Yes, life is hard.  During the Great Depression there was no pandemic, but there was a massive loss of jobs, mortgages, homes, lives, and no access to food for many.  Farmers plowed crops under while Americans by the thousands starved and waited in food lines for a cup of soup.

JC said something to the effect that “the poor will always be among us”.  . Well, he nailed that one.

And I am not the one who brought up football games etc.  @Becky1951


----------



## StarSong

Aneeda72 said:


> Having a job, unfortunately is not a freedom or an entitlement, or a right. Going to a job is not a freedom or a right. Employers have a dress code and apparently a vaccination code. Employers get to make the rules. It has always been this way. Follow the rules or find another job. Freedom of choice still exist. Take the vaccine or don’t. Your choice.


Exactly

People can choose their actions but they cannot choose the consequences of those actions.


----------



## win231

Aneeda72 said:


> Having a job, unfortunately is not a freedom or an entitlement, or a right.  Going to a job is not a freedom or a right.  Employers have a dress code and apparently a vaccination code.  Employers get to make the rules.  It has always been this way.  Follow the rules or find another job.  Freedom of choice still exist.  Take the vaccine or don’t.  Your choice.
> 
> Yes, life is hard.  During the Great Depression there was no pandemic, but there was a massive loss of jobs, mortgages, homes, lives, and no access to food for many.  Farmers plowed crops under while Americans by the thousands starved and waited in food lines for a cup of soup.
> 
> JC said something to the effect that “the poor will always be among us”.  . Well, he nailed that one.
> 
> And I am not the one who brought up football games etc.  @Becky1951


The difference is, a dress code does not have an effect on an employee's health.  A vaccine does.


----------



## win231

Ladybj said:


> People have valid reasons not to get vaccinated... no one is listening.  Just as people have valid reasons for others to get vaccinated.


That is due to _Sheep Mentality._
Those who choose to get vaccinated gain confidence in their decision by others who make the same decision.  Consequently, those who don't choose to get vaccinated shake the confidence of those who do.
Realistically, those who are vaccinated don't have much confidence in the vaccine, though they don't _directly _admit it.  They do _indirectly _admit it by criticizing those who don't get vaccinated.   If they had confidence in the vaccines, they wouldn't be concerned because their vaccine would protect them from others who are not vaccinated.


----------



## StarSong

AGREE that this is due to _Sheep Mentality._
Those who choose to* not* get vaccinated gain confidence in their decision by others who make the same decision. Consequently, those who do choose to get vaccinated shake the confidence of those who do.

*Realistically, those who are unvaccinated don't have much confidence in the decision*, though they don't _directly _admit it.  They do _indirectly _admit it by criticizing those who do get vaccinated. If they had confidence in being unvaccinated they wouldn't be concerned because their unvaccinated status would be adequate protection against this virus.


----------



## Alice November

Ladybj said:


> I love you Aneeda.  If that was an insult, I do not accept it - so I will give it back to you.  Just as if you give someone a gift and they refuse it, you take it back right - therefore, I give it back to you?  Maybe you can give it to someone else.


Sounds like a virus, no?


----------



## win231

StarSong said:


> AGREE that this is due to _Sheep Mentality._
> Those who choose to* not* get vaccinated gain confidence in their decision by others who make the same decision. Consequently, those who do choose to get vaccinated shake the confidence of those who do.
> 
> *Realistically, those who are unvaccinated don't have much confidence in the decision*, though they don't _directly _admit it.  They do _indirectly _admit it by criticizing those who do get vaccinated. If they had confidence in being unvaccinated they wouldn't be concerned because their unvaccinated status would be adequate protection against this virus.


The proof that you are 100% mistaken is as obvious as a neon sign:
Most people who choose not to get vaccinated (like myself) have no problem with those who choose to get vaccinated.  I have driven elderly friends to get their vaccinations.  I don't feel threatened by anyone who chooses to be vaccinated.


----------



## Nathan

Mizmo said:


> Now I am wondering if I should get booster shot...????
> just to lighten up for a moment
> 
> View attachment 196346


Lol, I used to buy a Norton anti-virus disc every year until 2004, that's when I dumped Windows and switched to using Linux on my computers.
...no more virus worries, no more "anti-virus" expenses and headache.  I guess that makes me a [computer]anti-vaxxer!


----------



## StarSong

win231 said:


> The proof that you are 100% mistaken is as obvious as a neon sign:
> Most people who choose not to get vaccinated (like myself) have no problem with those who choose to get vaccinated.  I have driven elderly friends to get their vaccinations.  I don't feel threatened by anyone who chooses to be vaccinated.


You are entitled to your opinion.  As am I.
The usual suspects align in the usual ways.  

Peace out.


----------



## Alice November

I wouldn't call myself an anti-vaxer by any definition. I decided to isolate in January 2020 when I read the first medical papers coming out of Wuhan about what SarsCov2 is. 

We don't have medical insurance or a doctor here in France which is becoming impossible to get, as so many have quit practicing or have stopped taking on any new patients. 

My husband went to the military hospital nearby when he needed treatment for his infected ingrown toenail and we just paid for it when they billed us by mail. We are not in the free gov. medical system here either. My understanding is that we don't qualify to get a vaccination because we aren't registered in the government medical system. 

So I have done due diligence, we don't have people in and I never go out, not snce January of 2020. Groceries are delivered. We did have one month or so of no groceries over first lockdown, I had predicted that and so we survived on canned, dried foods and powdered milk. It wasn't too bad. 

So, not everyone can have a vaccine and I in no way feel intimidated or blame those who do have it.

Everyone stay safe please, vaxed or unvaxed. Bless you all.


----------



## Nathan

StarSong said:


> You are entitled to your opinion.  As am I.
> The usual suspects align in the usual ways.
> 
> Peace out.


@StarSong , I see you're getting the _I-know-it-all-and you're-wrong_ treatment from one of the usual suspects.  It's like hitting your thumb with a hammer, feels much better when you stop!        I'm taking a couple days off, so it's all up to you.


----------



## StarSong

My "Peace Out" remark was an indicator that I no longer choose to engage on the subject.  

People are gonna do what they're gonna do. 

Enjoy your sabbatical.  

p.s.  A while back I unsubscribed from all Covid threads.  Might be time to do that again.


----------



## Becky1951

Aneeda72 said:


> Having a job, unfortunately is not a freedom or an entitlement, or a right.  Going to a job is not a freedom or a right.  Employers have a dress code and apparently a vaccination code.  Employers get to make the rules.  It has always been this way.  Follow the rules or find another job.  Freedom of choice still exist.  Take the vaccine or don’t.  Your choice.
> 
> Yes, life is hard.  During the Great Depression there was no pandemic, but there was a massive loss of jobs, mortgages, homes, lives, and no access to food for many.  Farmers plowed crops under while Americans by the thousands starved and waited in food lines for a cup of soup.
> 
> JC said something to the effect that “the poor will always be among us”.  . Well, he nailed that one.
> 
> And I am not the one who brought up football games etc.  @Becky1951


"JC said something to the effect that “the poor will always be among us”. . Well, he nailed that one."

Yes and those pushing the vaccine mandate is happy to help it along.


----------



## win231

StarSong said:


> My "Peace Out" remark was an indicator that I no longer choose to engage on the subject.
> 
> People are gonna do what they're gonna do.
> 
> Enjoy your sabbatical.
> 
> p.s.  A while back I unsubscribed from all Covid threads.  Might be time to do that again.


Great idea!  Ya probably heard, _"If ya can't stand the heat.........."   _


----------



## Becky1951

StarSong said:


> Exactly
> 
> People can choose their actions but they cannot choose the consequences of those actions.


"People can choose their actions but they cannot choose the consequences of those actions."

When someone refuses to be vaccinated and knows they will lose their job, how is that not choosing the consequences of their actions?


----------



## Becky1951

StarSong said:


> You are entitled to your opinion.  As am I.
> The usual suspects align in the usual ways.
> 
> Peace out.


"The usual suspects align in the usual ways."

That works both ways.


----------



## Becky1951

Nathan said:


> @StarSong , I see you're getting the _I-know-it-all-and you're-wrong_ treatment from one of the usual suspects. It's like hitting your thumb with a hammer, feels much better when you stop!  I'm taking a couple days off, so it's all up to you.


"_I-know-it-all-and you're-wrong_ treatment"

Amazing how that works both way isn't it!


----------



## Sunny

Becky1951 said:


> "The usual suspects align in the usual ways."
> 
> That works both ways.


It certainly does.

Way #1:  The intelligent, the educated (oh dear, Win, I said the e word again!), the realistic, sane, considerate, caring, non-suicidal people who are living in the current century, and want to see the world return to normal ASAP, or

Way #2: Those who have managed to convince themselves to reject the dangers we are living in the midst of, tauntingly inviting a plague to come and get them, denying the truth, making up ridiculous statistics that nobody in their right mind would believe, because they would rather have this pandemic continue forever, and think they are impressing anybody by strutting around proclaiming how superior they are.


----------



## Nathan

Becky1951 said:


> "_I-know-it-all-and you're-wrong_ treatment"
> 
> Amazing how that works both way isn't it!


That struck a chord with you, didn't it @Becky1951 ?   Truly amazing!


----------



## Nathan

Sunny said:


> It certainly does.
> 
> Way #1:  The intelligent, the educated (oh dear, Win, I said the e word again!), the realistic, sane, considerate, caring, non-suicidal people who are living in the current century, and want to see the world return to normal ASAP, or
> 
> Way #2: Those who have managed to convince themselves to reject the dangers we are living in the midst of, tauntingly inviting a plague to come and get them, denying the truth, making up ridiculous statistics that nobody in their right mind would believe, because they would rather have this pandemic continue forever, and think they are impressing anybody by strutting around proclaiming how superior they are.


It's hard to tell which side of the fence you're sitting on.   To coin a worn out phrase:  _Amazing how that works both way isn't it!_


----------



## Nosy Bee-54

Ladybj said:


> People have valid reasons not to get vaccinated... no one is listening.  Just as people have valid reasons for others to get vaccinated.


John Eyers thought he had a valid reason for not getting the vaccine. He was a fitness nut (bodybuilding & mountain climbing) and no underlying conditions at age 42.

She [his sister] can’t remember how the argument about the Covid vaccine started. “John started saying really crazy things that didn’t make sense,” she says. “About how people were only getting the vaccine for free McDonald’s, and there was formaldehyde in it.” The rest of the family remonstrated with him, pulling out their phones to factcheck what he was saying. But John was unmoving. “He kept saying: ‘I won’t be a guinea pig.’”

https://www.theguardian.com/society...ers-fitness-fanatic-who-refused-covid-vaccine

Then to his surprise he got infected.

And John had no choice but to accept the Herman Cain Godfather Pizza Award.


----------



## Mizmo

Nathan said:


> Lol, I used to buy a Norton anti-virus disc every year until 2004, that's when I dumped Windows and switched to using Linux on my computers.
> ...no more virus worries, no more "anti-virus" expenses and headache.  I guess that makes me a [computer]anti-vaxxer!



Well Nathan guess I'm a computer anti vaxxer too...I have Mac for six years now..
No probs at all....touch wood..... (that would be my head)


----------



## win231

Sunny said:


> It certainly does.
> 
> Way #1:  The intelligent, the educated (oh dear, Win, I said the e word again!), the realistic, sane, considerate, caring, non-suicidal people who are living in the current century, and want to see the world return to normal ASAP, or
> 
> Way #2: Those who have managed to convince themselves to reject the dangers we are living in the midst of, tauntingly inviting a plague to come and get them, denying the truth, making up ridiculous statistics that nobody in their right mind would believe, because they would rather have this pandemic continue forever, and think they are impressing anybody by strutting around proclaiming how superior they are.


Only programmed robots need to strut around.


----------



## Aneeda72

win231 said:


> The difference is, a dress code does not have an effect on an employee's health.  A vaccine does.


You are wrong.  Dress codes, in certain occupations, can and do have an effect on an employees health, usually for the better; as in hard hats in a construction zone, ear guards in a war zone, spike boots when climbing trees and on and on and on.

Ballerinas must wear toe shoes and toe shoes have a negative effect on feet, high heel shoes are usually worn by models and are very negative on a woman’s feet.  Carrying a full pack while running five-ten miles in any military can wreak your back.

You are wrong @win231 so wrong.


----------



## Aneeda72

win231 said:


> The proof that you are 100% mistaken is as obvious as a neon sign:
> Most people who choose not to get vaccinated (like myself) have no problem with those who choose to get vaccinated.  I have driven elderly friends to get their vaccinations.  I don't feel threatened by anyone who chooses to be vaccinated.


So nice to hear that you have friends


----------



## Shero

The anti vaxxers are in the minority. They will have no choice but to comply with sensibility if they wish to participate in communities where they live.

On the other hand, they can build a wall around themselves and live in their homes, for the rest of their lives! See how long they last!!!
.


----------



## Nosy Bee-54

Another denier who peddled misinformation about the vaccine has succumbed to COVID-19. Sounds familiar? Like many birds of a feather, he called it "experimental" even though it had full approval of the FDA.

"Prominent Christian televangelist and anti-vaccine advocate Marcus Lamb died after being hospitalized with Covid-19, his family announced Tuesday."

Marcus Lamb often spoke out against the Covid-19 vaccines on his show. In an episode earlier this year featuring anti-vaccine activists Robert F. Kennedy Jr. and Del Bigtree, Lamb said the Covid-19 vaccine was *"not really a vaccine," but an "an experimental shot"* that was "dangerous. Marcus Lamb alleged that people were dying or having neurological disorders from the vaccine.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/12/01/media/marcus-lamb-covid-death/index.html

He had "good" reasons for not getting the vaccine.


----------



## win231

Nathan said:


> @StarSong , I see you're getting the _I-know-it-all-and you're-wrong_ treatment from one of the usual suspects.  It's like hitting your thumb with a hammer, feels much better when you stop!        I'm taking a couple days off, so it's all up to you.


Still smarting from the Rittenhouse chat, huh?    Don't feel bad.  Nobody is always right.


----------



## Ladybj

Shero said:


> The anti vaxxers are in the minority. They will have no choice but to comply with sensibility if they wish to participate in communities where they live.
> 
> On the other hand, they can build a wall around themselves and live in their homes, for the rest of their lives! See how long they last!!!
> .


I think that all the variants on the horizon may keep unvax and vax people home.  There are signs at some stores I go to require mask for vaccinated and un-vaccinated shoppers.  I highly doubt I will be home bound and if so, I'm ok with that.


----------



## Ladybj

Aneeda72 said:


> It was not an insult.  I have early dementia, was diagnosed in my 50’s.  It is not Alzheimer’s.  It a type of dementia that abused children get due to the fact that the abuse causes their brains not to grow correctly.  The diagnosis was made by a neurologist at the UofU.
> 
> Having said that, which matters not to you, I don’t take it back. You said you didn’t understand something that was easy to understand.  If your comment was part of your sarcasm, then it should have been clearer than it was.  I took you seriously.
> 
> I told a friend at the apartment who I saw almost fall while walking that she should use a walker or cane.  She explained that she had an ankle issue and didn’t need either.   I offered to give her one of mine, either one or both. She refused.
> 
> I said she was being another stubborn old woman.  Yup, she was insulted.  So what?  We talked a little more, she agreed she was being stubborn (and she is old and a woman ).  I had her best interest in mind when I suggested she needed a walking aid.  I had your best interest in mind when I suggested you might get checked out.
> 
> 
> No apology to her.  No apology to you.  But feel free to insult me, husband does it all the time-it’s water off a duck‘s back.  And if I didn’t like you, I wouldn’t have suggest you see someone, just saying.


I don't need to see anyone...my mind is sharper than a razor blade   
 Sorry to hear your hubby insults you - you don't deserve it.


----------



## Sunny

Shero said:


> The anti vaxxers are in the minority. They will have no choice but to comply with sensibility if they wish to participate in communities where they live.
> 
> On the other hand, they can build a wall around themselves and live in their homes, for the rest of their lives! See how long they last!!!
> .


Shero, I have watched the anti-vaxxers shrink down to a tiny minority on this forum. Back around March, 2021, there were a lot more opinions about there really being no such thing as a horrible disease killing thousands of people (which turned into millions).  All the numbers published by the government were lies designed to fool the people. The "big pharma" companies (boo, hiss) were only interested in profits and were pushing their useless snake oil to get even richer. And the masks didn't work, and when the vaccine finally came along, that didn't work either. Every setback was greeted with glee, apparently.

It still goes on, but the number of people following the demagogues, opportunists, medical quacks and just plain nut cases seem to be shrinking, both on this forum and out there in the world. Partly this is because many of them have died of Covid, but I have a feeling that many of them have just quietly accepted the obvious truth.  

And you're right, those who are pathologically scared of this vaccine will just be stuck living in their homes for the rest of their lives. Maybe a new psychiatric specialty will pop up, to treat vaccine phobia.


----------



## dseag2

Aneeda72 said:


> So nice to hear that you have friends


I love reading the back-and-forth between you and Win.  It really does remind me of the exchanges between Larry David and Susie Greene.  (Sorry for the language.)


----------



## Don M.

Even though my wife and I are vaccinated, we have taken a "hit" in the past few days, as a result of the news surrounding this latest Covid variant.  That "Hit" is the Stock Market.  Our investments have been on a huge "roller coaster" in the past week as all this Covid Panic has rattled investors....even though there are very few of these cases, if any, in the US...yet.  

If just the "suggestion" of another major spike in Covid can upset the markets so drastically, What is going to happen to our economy IF we go into another "crisis mode"?  

I think we may go to the store this week and buy a Ton of Toilet Paper.


----------



## dseag2

Boy, isn't that the truth?  The stock market has been a blood bath this week.  I think I have lost almost everything I gained during the "run up".  I was always expecting a correction, but...

My father was a stock broker in the old days.  Stock valuations were always based on company fundamentals.  Now they are based on emotion and bad/good news.  You have to have a strong stomach to stay invested.


----------



## win231

dseag2 said:


> I love reading the back-and-forth between you and Win.  It really does remind me of the exchanges between Larry David and Susie Greene.  (Sorry for the language.)


Aneeda loves it too.


----------



## Shero

Sunny said:


> Shero, I have watched the anti-vaxxers shrink down to a tiny minority on this forum. Back around March, 2021, there were a lot more opinions about there really being no such thing as a horrible disease killing thousands of people (which turned into millions).  All the numbers published by the government were lies designed to fool the people. The "big pharma" companies (boo, hiss) were only interested in profits and were pushing their useless snake oil to get even richer. And the masks didn't work, and when the vaccine finally came along, that didn't work either. Every setback was greeted with glee, apparently.
> 
> It still goes on, but the number of people following the demagogues, opportunists, medical quacks and just plain nut cases seem to be shrinking, both on this forum and out there in the world. Partly this is because many of them have died of Covid, but I have a feeling that many of them have just quietly accepted the obvious truth.
> 
> And you're right, those who are pathologically scared of this vaccine will just be stuck living in their homes for the rest of their lives. Maybe a new psychiatric specialty will pop up, to treat vaccine phobia.


Looks like the next big thing to study at university  Sunny will be treating the fallout from the anti vaxxers brought on by themselves!
.


----------



## Liberty

dseag2 said:


> Boy, isn't that the truth?  The stock market has been a blood bath this week.  I think I have lost almost everything I gained during the "run up".  I was always expecting a correction, but...
> 
> My father was a stock broker in the old days.  Stock valuations were always based on company fundamentals.  Now they are based on emotion and bad/good news.  You have to have a strong stomach to stay invested.


Like "Saint John" Bogle said... "only two reasons to get out of the market:
1.  You have a better investment
2. You need the money

Otherwise hang tight - it'll bounce back.  Interesting chart:


----------



## Aneeda72

Ladybj said:


> I don't need to see anyone...my mind is sharper than a razor blade
> Sorry to hear your hubby insults you - you don't deserve it.


My mother, at 96, has a razor blade mind as well that is just starting to get a few nicks in it.  My mind is starting to slip a bit more, but my husbands mind is really slipping and he’s aware of that which seems to make him even more nasty.


----------



## Aneeda72

dseag2 said:


> I love reading the back-and-forth between you and Win.  It really does remind me of the exchanges between Larry David and Susie Greene.  (Sorry for the language.)


I really like win and our back and forth are in great fun, hopefully he agrees.  (I didn’t watch the media.)


----------



## Aneeda72

win231 said:


> Aneeda loves it too.


Come on @win231 you know you love it!  You’re like the older (or younger) brother I wish I had instead of the one I was stuck with.


----------



## Tom 86

I don't know about this new one.  It's not in our State.  My Problem is I need a right knee replacement ASAP.  I talked to my surgeon's nurse yesterday.  She said, "Tom I have no idea when you will get your surgery."  Our hospital is filling up again but this time it's with people that have HAD BOTHS SHOTS.  Out infectious disease, Drs are trying to figure out why a person gets both shots then 2 to 4 months later end up in the hospital. 

  She said we were down to only 8 to 10 people a week being admitted NO SHOTS.  Now we are getting 20+ a day that had their shots but not a bad case of the virus.  They only stay 3 to 4 days.   

  I did find a special Orthopedic hospital that only does orthopedic surgeries no Conav.   The problem is they will not take my insurance.  & if I want the surgery it would cost me $20,00.00+ for me to pay after Medicare paid their part.


----------



## Alice November

@Tom 86  That info is very telling. I see in the news from Uk and Ireland(the most vaxed country in the world) similar, how most people coming to hospitals have had the full series of vaccinations now.

So sorry about your situation with knee surgery. I really am hoping this thing is over sooner than the dire predictions we get from the news recently. especially in light of situations like your own.


----------



## Warrigal

What vaccines are available in US? 
We have AstraZeneca and Pfizer so far and they seem to be doing the job.

The Chinese vaccine seems to be working pretty well in some third world countries but there is not enough of any vaccine to really protect these countries.


----------



## Tom 86

We have Pfizer, Mederma & one other that's not mentioned much.  I had the one shot of Mederma on Jan 12th of this year. 
Pfizer is the main one being used now.  Even the booster shots are all Pfizer that can be mixed with the others.


----------



## Aneeda72

Tom 86 said:


> I don't know about this new one.  It's not in our State.  My Problem is I need a right knee replacement ASAP.  I talked to my surgeon's nurse yesterday.  She said, "Tom I have no idea when you will get your surgery."  Our hospital is filling up again but this time it's with people that have HAD BOTHS SHOTS.  Out infectious disease, Drs are trying to figure out why a person gets both shots then 2 to 4 months later end up in the hospital.
> 
> She said we were down to only 8 to 10 people a week being admitted NO SHOTS.  Now we are getting 20+ a day that had their shots but not a bad case of the virus.  They only stay 3 to 4 days.
> 
> I did find a special Orthopedic hospital that only does orthopedic surgeries no Conav.   The problem is they will not take my insurance.  & if I want the surgery it would cost me $20,00.00+ for me to pay after Medicare paid their part.


“Not a bad case. . . . .  they only stay 3 or 4 days.”  Hmm, talk to someone who has had it that bad and ask if they think it wasn’t a “bad case”.  Cause it is a bad case.  My son is still on oxygen, he’s been on oxygen since October 19, and will be on oxygen another month at least.  He was in the hospital 4 days.

It was a bad case and still is-according to his lungs.


----------



## win231

Shero said:


> Looks like the next big thing to study at university  Sunny will be treating the fallout from the anti vaxxers brought on by themselves!
> .


When do we get to hear a pro-vax song from Dolly Parton?


----------



## Remy

I just heard there is a second omicron variant case is in the U.S.. I'm not good with timing but I'm glad I got the booster a week ago Tuesday.


----------



## Aneeda72

win231 said:


> When do we get to hear a pro-vax song from Dolly Parton?


Well, when it comes out someone can post it here and dedicate it to you


----------



## Aneeda72

Remy said:


> I just heard there is a second omicron variant case is in the U.S.. I'm not good with timing but I'm glad I got the booster a week ago Tuesday.


Exactly.  I asked about my sons booster and it’s a three month after Covid wait.  The antibodies start to lessen at 3 months so that is the current suggested time for his booster-otherwise the shot would be wasted, according to his doctors.


----------



## Liberty

Hoping this just turns into a "snotty nose" variant.


----------



## Becky1951

Omicron Covid variant now detected in three U.S. states after Minnesota and Colorado officials confirm new cases​
All 3 were fully vaccinated. 

https://www-cnbc-com.cdn.ampproject...vid-case-in-resident-who-traveled-to-nyc.html


----------



## Remy

Becky1951 said:


> Omicron Covid variant now detected in three U.S. states after Minnesota and Colorado officials confirm new cases​
> All 3 were fully vaccinated.
> 
> https://www-cnbc-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.cnbc.com/amp/2021/12/02/minnesota-reports-second-us-omicron-covid-case-in-resident-who-traveled-to-nyc.html?amp_js_v=a6&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQKKAFQArABIIACAw==#aoh=16384829082635&referrer=https://www.google.com&amp_tf=From %1$s&ampshare=https://www.cnbc.com/2021/12/02/minnesota-reports-second-us-omicron-covid-case-in-resident-who-traveled-to-nyc.html


Yes, heard about the third within the last hour. I'd say, it's here in the U.S. everywhere. Or very soon to be.


----------



## win231

Remy said:


> Yes, heard about the third within the last hour. I'd say, it's here in the U.S. everywhere. Or very soon to be.


But Biden said, _"Bottom line - If you're vaccinated, you can  *do   more   stuff!*"_


----------



## Sunny

Becky1951 said:


> Omicron Covid variant now detected in three U.S. states after Minnesota and Colorado officials confirm new cases​
> All 3 were fully vaccinated.
> 
> https://www-cnbc-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.cnbc.com/amp/2021/12/02/minnesota-reports-second-us-omicron-covid-case-in-resident-who-traveled-to-nyc.html?amp_js_v=a6&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQKKAFQArABIIACAw==#aoh=16384829082635&referrer=https://www.google.com&amp_tf=From %1$s&ampshare=https://www.cnbc.com/2021/12/02/minnesota-reports-second-us-omicron-covid-case-in-resident-who-traveled-to-nyc.html


Gosh, Becky, you never give up.  I have to give you credit for persistence.

BUT...

How many "fully vaccinated" people have been made seriously ill by this disease?  How many have died of it?  (As compared with the number  of UNvaccinated people made seriously ill or dying of it?)

I would be very interested in your answer.

P.S. No one knows yet how serious this Omicron variant is. It could be serious, or it could be one of the many Covid variants that just amount to a sniffle.  Either way, its inevitable appearance in the U.S. gives us even more reason to be vaccinated. 

By now, anyone in their right mind (without medical prohibitions) has received the vaccine.


----------



## hawkdon

Just now got a call from my home health aide, she sez that
over weekend she was in contact with friends one of which
has tested positive for covid...so my gal isn't gonna be here 
on monday, out of caution....great.....


----------



## Ladybj

Sunny said:


> Shero, I have watched the anti-vaxxers shrink down to a tiny minority on this forum. Back around March, 2021, there were a lot more opinions about there really being no such thing as a horrible disease killing thousands of people (which turned into millions).  All the numbers published by the government were lies designed to fool the people. The "big pharma" companies (boo, hiss) were only interested in profits and were pushing their useless snake oil to get even richer. And the masks didn't work, and when the vaccine finally came along, that didn't work either. Every setback was greeted with glee, apparently.
> 
> It still goes on, but the number of people following the demagogues, opportunists, medical quacks and just plain nut cases seem to be shrinking, both on this forum and out there in the world. Partly this is because many of them have died of Covid, but I have a feeling that many of them have just quietly accepted the obvious truth.
> 
> And you're right, those who are pathologically scared of this vaccine will just be stuck living in their homes for the rest of their lives. Maybe a new psychiatric specialty will pop up, to treat vaccine phobia.


I don't think its a matter of being scared of the Vaccine...information change as quick as you can change the channel.  Also, there are those informed by their physician not to take the vaccine due to medical reasons.  And look what is on the horizon - Pills to treat Covid will be at your nearest pharmacy soon - moving in the right direction.


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## Sunny

Sure, Ladybj, you can go on waiting for the pill, which may or may not arrive. And hope that in the meantime, you don't die of the disease/


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## Nosy Bee-54

Ladybj said:


> I don't think its a matter of being scared of the Vaccine...information change as quick as you can change the channel.  Also, there are those informed by their physician not to take the vaccine due to medical reasons.  And look what is on the horizon - Pills to treat Covid will be at your nearest pharmacy soon - moving in the right direction.


I see that you are a proponent for ingesting experimental COVID-19 pills.


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## CarolfromTX

Well, so far Omicron hasn’t proven to be much of a threat. So I’m not sure a new vaccine is warranted.


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## Ladybj

Nosy Bee-54 said:


> I see that you are a proponent for ingesting experimental COVID-19 pills.


Awwwww.....NOOOOO.   I don't even take a Tylenol if I have a headache.  Wait, what's the difference in injecting an experimental vaccine as oppose to a pill??  I prefer neither.  However, if the pill save lives and the vaccine cause more harm than good.. the pill trumps the vaccine and vice versa...jmo.  However, we all do what is BEST for US.


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## Ladybj

Sunny said:


> Sure, Ladybj, you can go on waiting for the pill, which may or may not arrive. And hope that in the meantime, you don't die of the disease/


Trust.. I am not waiting on a pill..I was thinking of others that it MAY help.  I won't die of the disease..  I hope you don't either.  Is it a virus or disease?  I think its a virus??


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