# Why is it that.....



## Davey Jones (Aug 12, 2014)

Every time a black,especially the younger ones,get killed by a white person or white police officer accidently or not there is guaranteed to be a riot the very next day.
The incident in Missouri proved just that,the blacks broke into stores and carried out everything they could.
What is the purpose of that? To honor that dead black teenager?

Its almost like they are waiting,waiting,waiting for the next incident involving the death or injury of the next black person to go get(steal) that 50 inch Sony TV or all the clothes/food they can carry.


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## MrJim (Aug 12, 2014)

Davey Jones said:


> Every time a black,especially the younger ones,get killed by a white person or white police officer accidently or not there is guaranteed to be a riot the very next day.
> The incident in Missouri proved just that,the blacks broke into stores and carried out everything they could.
> What is the purpose of that? To honor that dead black teenager?
> 
> Its almost like they are waiting,waiting,waiting for the next incident involving the death or injury of the next black person to go get(steal) that 50 inch Sony TV or all the clothes/food they can carry.



I hate to agree with you on that, but I agree with you on that.

They pretend to be all sad & upset over the death, then smash their way into stores & sell the stolen items on ebay.

Then the dead guy's family sues the police & city even if their family member who got killed was breaking the law then fought with the police to begin with.

Things are getting crazy.


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## Ralphy1 (Aug 13, 2014)

Another Trayvon Martin case?  Perhaps...


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## oldman (Aug 13, 2014)

Last week, a 12 year old black kid stabbed and killed a 9 year old white kid in Michigan. Although the cops didn't kill the white kid, nonetheless, the media has buried this story. From what I have read of this current story, the cops may have over-reacted, however, that does not give the other blacks the right to rob and steal from innocent shop owners. Reportedly, because of all the cameras in that locale, the cops are reviewing the films to find out if they recognize any of them, so the cops have stated that arrests are forth-coming.


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## Shamhat (Aug 13, 2014)

It is so unfortunate that you are absolutely right.  It is as if wrongful death justifies stealing, rioting, mayhem.  There is a self proclaimed representative info the black community who is quick to scream injustice. Right now he should be screaming mad at those who who are looting.  His next program should feature him chastising them after all, he is also a self proclaimed reverand.  Equality is equality. What we are going for here is every wrong is met with the same response.  This is the least graphic of the killings of white male by police. He had Down's syndrome. Where's the national outrage? I am a proud black American who wants nothing more than equality.

http://youtu.be/KiN7Y1ziqhs


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## Davey Jones (Aug 13, 2014)

Where the hell is Rev Jackson or Rev Al in all this?

They should be front and center with all this free publicity.


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## oldman (Aug 13, 2014)

In the YouTube video, it is obvious that this child has Downs Syndrome. I believe that police have been educated in this field to be able to recognize those people with this condition. I guess my question is, "Why did this child have to die?" Even if he did not have DS, I would think that police would use less violent methods for resolving the issue of a 14 year-old child wanting to sit through a movie for a second time without paying. 

In this situation and the fact that the child was accompanied by another individual, something went terribly wrong. I sometimes believe that not only should an officer who exceeds the duty of his position should be disciplined, but maybe also his supervisor. The supervisor is responsible for training and therefore, if it is proven that the officer was not properly trained, then his supervisor also must share some responsibility.


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## ClassicRockr (Aug 13, 2014)

Young folks, blacks and whites, do the same type of "rioting" when their major league sports team wins a National Championship. Police cars destroyed, business windows broken, fires started, etc. Some say that the kids involved with this are Gang Members who didn't even go to the game and others say it's all due to the alcohol at the games. 

As far as the event that happened in MO, there is no video of any kind that can be looked at. Actually, the local law enforcement had purchased video camera's for things like this, but these camera's hadn't been installed yet. Little late now. Who is at fault in this shooting......both the Black community and law enforcement have very different stories on what happened. The Black community make the two boys look completely innocent of anything and the police say their Officer was attacked by Brown. The boy was trying to get the Officer's gun! 

This community is extremely upset and I do hope this rioting doesn't spread to other cities! From what I've read, Ferguson has had numerous race problems before and was a keg ready to explode. Well, guess what.......explosion happened! 

Sure how this all calms down soon.


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## SeaBreeze (Aug 13, 2014)

I agree that it doesn't take much to get people into the mob mindset by a few bad apples, and start looting, damaging property, etc.  Whether it's outrage over a senseless murder, like Martin Luther King, Jr., a blackout in a big city, a natural disaster like Katrina, etc., people are easily persuaded to take advantage for their own personal benefit.

The media loves it too, "race baiting" seems to be very popular for viewership, if it sells and gets people to watch, they'll be all over it.  They love to pit people against each other, white against black, democrats against republicans, women against men, etc.  Too bad this nonsense will be our downfall, once everyone forgets that we are all people who either get along and survive together on this earth, or die together.

It really seems also, that the news cameras are all over the violent and angry looters, but not too much coverage over the peaceful protests there, I also heard there was a memorial for the deceased.

In my opinion, that kid should still be alive.  Knowing how trigger happy some cops are nowadays, who in their right mind would tempt them to pull out the gun or taser, when they could just comply with the request.  If I was walking in the middle of the street, endangering myself and others, and a cop pulled over and told me to get on the sidewalk, I'd know I was doing wrong, and I would get on the sidewalk.  The cop would leave, and I'd be alive.  If I'm going to start acting like a punk and challenging him, saying I'll get on the sidewalk when I'm good and ready, then I would be asking for trouble.  Should he had killed the kid, probably not, he could have at least tased him, cuffed him and taken him in.  I don't know because all information about this story is very vague to me.

Martin should be alive too, if it wasn't for the hero/cop wanna-be Zimmerman.  And if Zimmerman is white, then I must be an albino...but the news was much more effective in portraying him that way, race-baiting again.  Zimmerman was definitely in the wrong, he had issues, and he should have kept his nose out of it and let the police handle the problem, if there was one.  There would have been no problem, Zimmerman created the problem.

It may not be that violence erupts every time there's a white on black killing or crime, but we definitely hear about it for weeks when it does happen.  Makes for good headlines, and the media likes to keep people fearful and angry, good ratings.


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## Ina (Aug 13, 2014)

Good points Sea, They keep everyone so fired up that we can't see the forest for the trees. :wave:


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## ClassicRockr (Aug 14, 2014)

Just like other folks in a job, the media have a job to do, whether it's done good or bad. From what I've read, the protests have went from "peaceful" to "rioting" pretty darn fast. Seems as if, the citizens of that town simply don't want to listen to law enforcement PERIOD! The citizens want to turn Ferguson into a War Zone, to prove what? The Officer involved told the boys to get out of the street and they basically "flipped him off". Ignore what a Law Enforcement Officer tells you and that's when the trouble starts. 

I have worked with (not "for") Law Enforcement before. Respect and do what they say........no problems!


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## Davey Jones (Aug 14, 2014)

My question is why are the police not using tasers to stop those coming out of the stores with everything they can carry...
Not knowing that much about the rules the cops must follow but of a cop yells ""STOP" and you dont stop I assume he has the right to use his taser ????


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## ClassicRockr (Aug 14, 2014)

From my previous medical background, taser doesn't work on everyone. If a person is on some kind of drugs or even "husky" built, a taser may do nothing or very little. AND, if the person has a medical condition that the Officer wouldn't know about, a taser shot can seriously injure or kill a person. It can be a tough call!



Davey Jones said:


> My question is why are the police not using tasers to stop those coming out of the stores with everything they can carry...
> Not knowing that much about the rules the cops must follow but of a cop yells ""STOP" and you dont stop I assume he has the right to use his taser ????


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## ClassicRockr (Aug 15, 2014)

Interesting.........new video out showing a "strong-arm" robbery that PD says 18 yr. old, Brown, done. The people of Ferguson were pretty angry that the video was released.........why? I presume "why", but what do you think? The Officer's name has been released. Just how safe will he be now???


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## Barb (Aug 15, 2014)

Whoever made the decision to release the officer's name at this time, before all investigations have been completed, has made a terrible mistake IMO.  I fear the officer and his family may be in danger from the hot headed troublemakers out there who have been screaming for revenge.


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## Happyflowerlady (Aug 15, 2014)

I think that there are a whole lot of the aspects of this story that we still haven't learned about, and probably some that we never will.
It seems pretty obvious that the government (or the media ?) wants to push the United States back into the riots of the 1960's again. Anytime that anything happens where a white person is beaten or killed; it goes on as if nothing happened, especially if the perpetrator was a black person.
 However, when a black person is injured or killed, then the news media makes it into a racist case, whether it actually was or not. 

Several interesting things that i have read about this particular case, which seems to be stirring up protests and semi-riots all over the US. 
One is that it started on almost the same day as the Watts riots in California 49 years ago. (sometimes dates  seem to play a part in these things, don't they ?)
The second interesting thing, I was listening to a radio interview of a person who lived in the Ferguson area, and he said that he had seen ads placed on the area Craigslist, looking for people to participate in the looting and riots, and telling them where and when to meet to do that. 
This pretty well says that the looting and burning were not just a spontaneous happening  by a crowd of angry and frustrated people; it was a deliberately planned occurrence, designed to escalate the situation.
Once that happened, the MRAP's and other heavy military-style police officers came into the scene; and of course, by then, it certainly looked like they might be called for to stop the riots. 
People were even calling for the President to establish martial law in Ferguson.

Once again, this seems like some kind of a setup, not only to divide the races of people here; but also to accustom us to expect to see this kind of para-military force. We didn't used to have this here in America; we thought it only happened in places like Russia back then. 
Now, it is coming here, and into our very lives.

Here is a short video with an interesting interview of the teenager who was there with the one who was shot and killed. His story of what happened in Ferguson is a whole lot different than what the police are claiming happened that day. 

http://youtu.be/9_icVWKO4_o


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## Ina (Aug 15, 2014)

Wow!  When I think military action it is generally about:mad2::tongue::grrr::magnify:countries that are at war on their own soil. And that doesn't apply to America. I was in Boston in the late 60's, when they were still having protest marches, and sit ins. Although that got pretty rough, it didn't look anything like what we're seeing today.
It seems like the government law enforcement services are on training maneuvers. Think about it, where else are they going to find mass subjects to learn on.
Scary.


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## Justme (Aug 16, 2014)

It seems everyone in the US is far too trigger happy, and there does seem to be a racist element to shooting by the police. In the UK the police aren't armed, unless there is a situation where armed police are required. If someone is shot there is a full enquiry and if the police were deemed to be trigger happy they could be disciplined or charged with an offence.


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## Warrigal (Aug 16, 2014)

> The second interesting thing, I was listening to a radio interview of a person who lived in the Ferguson area, and he said that he had seen ads placed on the area Craigslist, looking for people to participate in the looting and riots, and telling them where and when to meet to do that.


This sounds like hearsay on hearsay. Has anyone checked out Craigslist to see whether it is true?


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## Davey Jones (Aug 16, 2014)

Now they are saying and with video to prove it,this kid just before he was killed,participated in a store robbery and the blacks are saying this video was photoshopped.

*
STAY TUNED MORE BREAKING NEWS.*


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## Happyflowerlady (Aug 16, 2014)

Dame Warrigal said:


> This sounds like hearsay on hearsay. Has anyone checked out Craigslist to see whether it is true?


I am sure that those ads were only placed on CL long enough to acquire as many "rioters" as they needed, and then the ads were pulled.  The possibility that whoever did this would simply just leave the ads online is very slim, in my opinion.
Only someone who actually lived in the area would likely be reading the local CL, so I don't have any reason to doubt that the person in the radio interview actually did see the ads on there.  No one was even questioning that the riots were anything except spontaneous; so there was no reason to throw this into the mix unless it were true.


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## Warrigal (Aug 16, 2014)

Out here civil disorder is organised via mobile phones.


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## Jackie22 (Aug 16, 2014)

Justme said:


> It seems everyone in the US is far too trigger happy, and there does seem to be a racist element to shooting by the police.



You are exactly correct.


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## Jackie22 (Aug 16, 2014)

Dame Warrigal said:


> This sounds like hearsay on hearsay. Has anyone checked out Craigslist to see whether it is true?



I agree, Warri, just more piling on.


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## WhatInThe (Aug 16, 2014)

The same store where the alleged strong arm robbery was looted last night. Just by coincidence??? Sounds like a how dare you call the police and describe a suspect. Side note or observation but it looks like that suspect did something like that before because I saw little or no hesitation.

http://news.msn.com/us/police-protesters-clash-again-in-ferguson

Cable news sources say the police didn't do anything to stop it. 

It's one thing to release the name of the officer but to release preliminary information/evidence of an associated/not associated crime was extremely risky. The only thing that matters what went on between the officer and Brown at the time of the shooting. If they had said Brown/his description matched a robbery suspect then the public demanded evidence then give it to them but that depends on Miss public and/or pretrial disclosure laws. The Police Chief or town government made a very poor decision.

Part of the problem with any city or town government job is that it is frequently who you know. A politician must give you a reference. It's not about your resume or qualifications. I get the impression this police chief is one of those political hires along with many other small town police department. Here even if you want to be receptionist or collect trash you need a political reference. At the same time since the political reference now owns the person they recommended means there are a lot of favors to be paid off-you do what they say, imply or want.


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## WhatInThe (Aug 16, 2014)

Happyflowerlady said:


> I am sure that those ads were only placed on CL long enough to acquire as many "rioters" as they needed, and then the ads were pulled.  The possibility that whoever did this would simply just leave the ads online is very slim, in my opinion.
> Only someone who actually lived in the area would likely be reading the local CL, so I don't have any reason to doubt that the person in the radio interview actually did see the ads on there.  No one was even questioning that the riots were anything except spontaneous; so there was no reason to throw this into the mix unless it were true.



Many protests have ringers. I have no doubt that the marching protests in particular had recruits. When I was member of a union we were frequently asked to go to various protests and marches along with signing form letters to local and associated political representatives.


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## SeaBreeze (Aug 16, 2014)

I really am against having cameras everywhere, recording our every move.  But they were just taking about the police wearing a camera the size of a credit card to record all of their encounters with citizens.  In a way this is an invasion of privacy for the citizens, but it seems it would at least slow down some of the police abuse that seems to be occurring nationwide nowadays.  Of course they can manipulate it if they want to, like turning it off, covering it, etc.  One city reported it cut down on police abuse, while another seemed to still have a lot of incidents. http://photographyisnotacrime.com/2...uquerque-police-regards-body-mounted-cameras/

It would be nice to see exactly what happened in this particular case, seems were being spoonfed bits of dramatic nonsense every day, what about the real story.  I don't think it should have resulted in a killing, but I'd like to know the details.  Even after the killing, there's no excuse for the rioting and theft.  I'm not for the militarization of the police department, and I definitely cringe at the suggestions of martial law.  As Phil and others have said, if we give up our freedoms for security, we'll have neither.


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## Sunny (Aug 16, 2014)

What I don't get is the looting. There probably really is an element of racism and police brutality in that town, which seems to have reached the boiling point, and the rioters are acting out of sheer frustration and anger. But wouldn't they be a lot more believable if they staged a large, but peaceful, protest, instead of rioting and looting? The minute they start looting, they lose the moral high ground. It seemed that way to me back in the 60's, and it still seems that way.


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## ClassicRockr (Aug 17, 2014)

Law enforcement HAVE to protect the peaceful marchers as well as PROTECT themselves. It seems as if EVERYTIME the Officers protect themselves, they get ridiculed for it!! Why be a law enforcement officer today......they even place their hand on their gun, they get into trouble. Shoot someone in self defense (shoot or be shot, kill or be killed), and they are placed on Admin duty.  

Heck, that Captain State Trooper was put in charge, over the Ferguson PD and what has happened now? He even said, after what happened last night (curfew violation/rioting) that he is very disappointed in the people there. The video of (supposedly) Brown doing a "strong-arm" robbery was released and then the curfew by the Governor turned everything upside down! But, the video does prove that this kid isn't the nice/kind/sweet/law-abiding person people there are making him out to be. Hate to say this, but is it time for the Army National Guard to show their force. Something has to tell these people "*WE* are the law and you will obey!"


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## WhatInThe (Aug 19, 2014)

I must say I'm still a bit confused over the purpose of "protests" in the middle of night when many people that was actually view the "protests" during the day are asleep. Also how come the 3rd shift of "protestors" seem to be much 'energetic' than first shift. I wasn't a big fan of Occupy Wall Street but they got the occupy part right. "Protesting" in the mid night hour does not accomplish what occupying round the clock does. And the occupiers went away or frequently got minimal press coverage because nothing happened.

Two weeks now and many business owners will be forced to close their doors permanently. 

Also I'm hearing/seeing reports of outside agitators so every time a non Ferguson resident is arrested during a "protest" they need to make sure their name and home town are publicized. They must show who is trying to exploit this situation.


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## SifuPhil (Aug 19, 2014)

It was interesting and educational for me last night to switch back and forth between CNN and Fox News. 

CNN reported with what seemed to be a balanced view, but Fox was tilted to the far left, calling every action by the police / National Guard an "attack" and overlooking the taunts and projectiles of the "protesters". 

WhatInThe, good point on the shift work aspect. I think it's because when you don't work, you're on welfare, and have everything provided for you, your biological clock changes and you perform most of your activities in the midnight hours. That's also when the best bars and clubs are open and all the drug dealing is best.


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## WhatInThe (Aug 19, 2014)

SifuPhil said:


> It was interesting and educational for me last night to switch back and forth between CNN and Fox News.
> 
> CNN reported with what seemed to be a balanced view, but Fox was tilted to the far left, calling every action by the police / National Guard an "attack" and overlooking the taunts and projectiles of the "protesters".
> 
> WhatInThe, good point on the shift work aspect. I think it's because when you don't work, you're on welfare, and have everything provided for you, your biological clock changes and you perform most of your activities in the midnight hours. That's also when the best bars and clubs are open and all the drug dealing is best.



I think your right about Fox. They had one guy calling it "amateur hour" every time the police approached a line or bunch of protestors. I must admit for a paramilitary organization the police seem to have little discipline or knowledge of drill & ceremony ie they need to approach the protestors in a line or wedge formation. A tight formation. They need roving squads to pluck out the trouble makers.

CNN/Don Lemon has been ify. This weekend he was 100% with the protestors. He tempered his bias yesterday and actually looked at things quite objectively. He was also open and pursued the idea of outside agitators.

Another troublesum sidenote. I saw a pregnant mom protestor in a hippy tie die t shirt last night with a gas mask. Um, setting aside the tear gas and/or violent coughing that could affect her among or heat frustration from wearing the mask for long periods of time what if there is a stampede from a rush or retreat. KEEP THE KIDS out of dangerous personal endevors.


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## SifuPhil (Aug 19, 2014)

WhatInThe said:


> I think your right about Fox. They had one guy calling it "amateur hour" every time the police approached a line or bunch of protestors. I must admit for a paramilitary organization the police seem to have little discipline or knowledge of drill & ceremony ie they need to approach the protestors in a line or wedge formation. A tight formation. They need roving squads to pluck out the trouble makers.



Agreed - they have the tech but I don't think they've fully trained-up with it yet, or they're just afraid of being perceived as TOO military.



> CNN/Don Lemon has been ify. This weekend he was 100% with the protestors. He tempered his bias yesterday and actually looked at things quite objectively. He was also open and pursued the idea of outside agitators.



I wonder if someone had a little talk with him, because I noticed the same thing. 



> Another troublesum sidenote. I saw a pregnant mom protestor in a hippy tie die t shirt last night with a gas mask. Um, setting aside the tear gas and/or violent coughing that could affect her among or heat frustration from wearing the mask for long periods of time what if there is a stampede from a rush or retreat. KEEP THE KIDS out of dangerous personal endevors.



That's insane. 

I caught a 10-second clip of a group of so-called protesters looting a liquor store. They had their security line outside the front entrance all holding their hands in the air, in the so-called "Don't shoot me" position, while their cohorts were carrying out anything they could. 

And they all had smiles on their faces.

If I were there I'm afraid I would see the "Don't shoot me" position as just offering a free shot at their X-ring.


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## SeaBreeze (Aug 19, 2014)

I think that the policeman who shot the young man over-reacted.  If Brown was unarmed, and the cop felt he had to shoot for some reason, why not just shoot him in the leg to stop him like so many officers have done in the past in those circumstances.  Once on the ground he could be cuffed, or additionally tased if needed. 

 If a cop who's supposed to be trained can't handle one man who is unarmed without riddling his body with bullets, then the US is becoming an even scarier place than I ever imagined.  The whole police department handled this thing poorly, IMO.  I understand that the amount of violent protesters were no more than 200 people at best, don't know if that number is valid.  Here's the opinion of an ex-Seattle policeman...



> Many local law enforcement agencies are now outfitted and behave like small armies. This is not good, and the federal government shares much of the blame. With the advent of the drug war and especially since 9/11, the Department of Defense has been more than generous in gifts of surplus military items to the locals: armored personnel carriers, MRAPs (mine-resistant, ambush protected vehicles), and a wide assortment of military weaponry.
> 
> The causes of the continuing unrest in Ferguson are many: the shooting death of an unarmed teenager, of course, along with persistent racial bigotry and discrimination, crushing poverty, failing schools, high unemployment… But it was the police department’s precipitous, militarized response last weekend that transformed peaceful vigils and protests into a siege of proportions never before seen in that St. Louis suburb.
> That, and an abiding, preexisting condition of deep distrust of the city’s police officers.
> ...


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## SifuPhil (Aug 19, 2014)

SeaBreeze said:


> I think that the policeman who shot the young man over-reacted.  If Brown was unarmed, and the cop felt he had to shoot for some reason, why not just shoot him in the leg to stop him like so many officers have done in the past in those circumstances.  Once on the ground he could be cuffed, or additionally tased if needed.



Unless I'm very badly mistaken, cops are *not* trained to shoot at arms or legs - they're taught to aim for "center of mass". Shooting the gun out of an opponent's hand or hitting them in the leg is just Hollywood stuff, especially in a critical scenario. A leg, especially one that is moving, is a MUCH smaller target than a torso. 



> If a cop who's supposed to be trained can't handle one man who is unarmed without riddling his body with bullets, then the US is becoming an even scarier place than I ever imagined.  The whole police department handled this thing poorly, IMO.  I understand that the amount of violent protesters were no more than 200 people at best, don't know if that number is valid.  Here's the opinion of an ex-Seattle policeman...



A 300-pounder can absorb an amazing amount of trauma and just keep going. There are a myriad of cases where Tazers, pepper spray and even batons have had little or no effect on these guys. In my bouncing days I ran across a few big boys like this and my entire plan of attack was nullified, because I couldn't apply the usual pressure points / restraining holds on them due to their size. 

I'm not excusing the six shots that the officer took - I'm just saying that he might not have had any options _except_ lethal force. It WAS the decision of Brown to mix it up, however, so in the end if he had just followed the officer's orders he might still be alive.


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## WhatInThe (Aug 19, 2014)

The beauty of a tight military formation is that everyone is in sync. All weapons including batons would be in the same position-hopefully lowered. Everyone would move/step at the same time. They way the police are moving or approaching protestors is too loosey goosey. If they make an it an order only raise their weapons when told to do so you wouldn't have a lone wolf cop pointing at something that might not be there and setting off a crowd. You remind those in formation they are protected by snipers which are probably there and a roving squads outside the formation. If a military formation approached a crowd with batons across their body without the room to even swing them they could literally push a crowd where ever they wanted. If you have sticks in the mud you have the roving squads pluck them out of the way. BUT it does take discipline to resist the temptation to raise or use a weapon or stay in formation no matter what's going on around or in front of you.


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## SeaBreeze (Aug 19, 2014)

Well Phil, I guess I would like to see the video of what really happened at the time of the shooting, and know if it really was a critical situation that required a shoot to kill response.  The whole thing sounds so fishy to me, I have a hard time believing anything I'm hearing about this incident.  I also think the cop could have called some backup in on the radio in seconds, I know where I live, there'll be 4 cop cars surrounding vehicles that were just stopped for traffic violations.  They all seem to be awfully bored with lack of real work to do, overstaffed IMO.


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## WhatInThe (Aug 19, 2014)

SeaBreeze said:


> I think that the policeman who shot the young man over-reacted.  If Brown was unarmed, and the cop felt he had to shoot for some reason, why not just shoot him in the leg to stop him like so many officers have done in the past in those circumstances.  Once on the ground he could be cuffed, or additionally tased if needed.
> 
> If a cop who's supposed to be trained can't handle one man who is unarmed without riddling his body with bullets, then the US is becoming an even scarier place than I ever imagined.  The whole police department handled this thing poorly, IMO.  I understand that the amount of violent protesters were no more than 200 people at best, don't know if that number is valid.  Here's the opinion of an ex-Seattle policeman...



I agree but it comes down to the cop being in the car and/or somewhat restricted. But so should an unarmed attacker. Another but but I heard some of the so called talking head experts say that a larger attacker is considered a legitimate threat.

Also a lot of automatic or semi automatic pistols is that they have a fast rate of fire meaning if you have a pistol that can fire at 2-4 rounds per second at least. So just a two second struggle or decision to fire can result in the 6 hits Brown received. Theoretically the shooter skill/reaction time and trigger sensitivity play a bigger role than the weapon itself. This is why you have cases like police firing at a suspect or vehicle like a hundred times. It wasn't over kill so much as the time it took the suspect or vehicle to stop which is seconds. But if you have a half dozen cops on scene you can get those numbers real fast, too fast.


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## SifuPhil (Aug 19, 2014)

That's true - like in most of these cases since we weren't there we'll probably never be sure of what happened, and I agree that the video would be a great help.

I believe they said that this cop has 12 years experience, so I can't put it down to jitters. He may very well have over-reacted, but he also may have had enough experience to realize that nothing short of bullets would stop this guy IF he were threatening him. That's the part that's tough to figure without the video.

He (the cop) may also have just snapped - it's happened before. 

Calling for backup ... yeah, he could have / should have done that, but it's conceivable that he just didn't have time. 

Eh ... World War I was started by the shooting of an insignificant political figure, so it's not surprising that these riots are happening.


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## WhatInThe (Aug 25, 2014)

Recently saw a movie Battle In Seattle about the 1999 WTO or World Trade Organization protests-brutal. It was surreal especially after seeing the Furguson protests.

Ironically the mayor in charge Paul Schell who was in charge in 1999 just passed away late July. The riots and response were so brutal he couldn't even get past a re-election primary 2 years later and the police chief Norm Stamper resigned shortly after(Stamper commented that Ferguson should've learned from the 1999 WTO protests). Excessive use of tear gas came up then too, they used so much they ran out. The police were just as disorganized. And there was a leadership disconnect.

The movie is an interesting take on the protests/ors. Takes swipes at the WTO but focuses on the protestors and some of their tactics and internal politics.


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## Ralphy1 (Aug 25, 2014)

The initial video of Brown intimidating the convenience store clerk still makes me think that officer probably acted in self-defense...


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## ClassicRockr (Nov 13, 2014)

I think I have the perfect solution to the "black teens (or black adults) killings by white officers" unrest..........make the entire PD of a predominately black town/area black officers. From the Chief all the way down to a patrol officer. I know that sounds "discriminating" to have an all black PD, but it sure (hopefully) would stop the unrest of white officer/black teen (or adult) killings. If there was a black only PD, in these areas, obviously white officers couldn't be blamed for anything. 

Just a thought.


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## Butterfly (Nov 13, 2014)

Well, speaking as one who was involuntarily in the great big middle of the Martin Luther King riots in Washington, DC in '68, complete with fires and looting and violent chaos, and which caused me to be the most terrified I have ever been in my entire life (I did not think I was going to get out of there alive)-- once this kind of thing starts and gets out of hand, I don't believe there is much the police can realistically do about it.  The violence feeds on itself, and when you throw drugs and alcohol into the mix, you've got a murderous situation.  That night in Washington (I was just trying to get home from work downtown and back to Maryland), I don't think Julius Caesar with Roman legions in tight formation could have done anything to stop the violence and looting.  "Shoot the looters" isn't a bad idea, but there were countless looters, and there were violent mobs setting fires, and people busting up things just for the hell of it, and people being dragged out of cars and attacked and there simply weren't enough police.  The only thing that stopped those riots in Washington was ordering Federal tanks into Washington to clear the streets, two days later.  Meantime the looters and rioters had destroyed most of THEIR OWN neighborhoods.  The riots in Maryland (primarily Baltimore) stopped more quickly, as soon as Gov. Agnew put out a shoot to kill order as to looters.

Allegedly the rioters were rioting because MLK had been shot -- *WHAT??! *  MLK was the ultimate man of peace -- for mobs to loot and burn and kill as a remembrance of him is absolutely insane.  IMHO, the riots didn't have anything to do with Martin Luther King's death, except to use it as an excuse.  I suspect the Ferguson situation is the same.  Rioting and looting and burning doesn't get you anything but burned out neighborhoods and more hate and violence.  I could almost understand it if the MLK mob violence was directed against the person/persons who had him killed, but it wasn't -- it was directed at the rioters' own neighborhoods and innocent civilians passing through.  No sense to it at all.  Just hate and violence.


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