# Would you open your home to a refuge family?



## QuickSilver (Sep 14, 2015)

If you had the room and the resorces of course..  Would you take in and sponsor a Syrian Refugee and family?   I would..


----------



## Shalimar (Sep 14, 2015)

Yes, in a heartbeat. I would be honoured to have the possibility of truly making a difference in their lives. The gift goes both ways.


----------



## MaryZPA (Sep 14, 2015)

I'd love to have the opportunity to do that.


----------



## QuickSilver (Sep 14, 2015)

Aren't you afraid they will build dirty bombs in your basement... or murder you in your bed??


----------



## boozercruiser (Sep 14, 2015)

QuickSilver said:


> Aren't you afraid they will build dirty bombs in your basement... or murder you in your bed??



And doing it while shouting Ally Icky Bar ! as well! layful:

Now why didn't I think of that QuickSilver?

But my answer would be NO anyway.


----------



## Shalimar (Sep 14, 2015)

No, after all, the Vietnam war resistors I lived with for two years somehow managed to contain their homicidal urges. Jeez.


----------



## Jackie22 (Sep 14, 2015)

Yes, and I'd help them find jobs and get on their feet to have their own place.


----------



## fureverywhere (Sep 14, 2015)

Oh Quick, give it a rest...
Of course, if I had the room I'd be honored to help.


----------



## QuickSilver (Sep 14, 2015)

fureverywhere said:


> Oh Quick, give it a rest...
> Of course, if I had the room I'd be honored to help.



'suse me?   give it a rest?


----------



## fureverywhere (Sep 14, 2015)

These poor people have been through so very much. If given sanctuary, they're unlikely to put explosive vests on their children and begin Jihad...jus' sayin'


----------



## Shalimar (Sep 14, 2015)

With respect, we have far too many people "resting" as it is. We need to shout our outrage from the rooftops, and do whatever is in our power to help the refugees.


----------



## WhatInThe (Sep 14, 2015)

I don't know. I've known people who have had problems with fully documented exchange students. Just because they are foreign doesn't make them cute n cuddly or even worthy of your hospitality.


----------



## Shalimar (Sep 14, 2015)

Homegrown, ain't always cuddly either.


----------



## MaryZPA (Sep 14, 2015)

QuickSilver said:


> Aren't you afraid they will build dirty bombs in your basement... or murder you in your bed??



 That would be OK...as long as they say 'please', 'thank you', and know how to politely wait their turn.


----------



## Shalimar (Sep 14, 2015)

Mary, perhaps a new career for you? Educating the would be terrorist refugee in the finer points of polite jihad??? Lolololol.


----------



## Cookie (Sep 14, 2015)

Yes, if I had the space and resources.  I imagine the government would match up the families and the homes they go to.


----------



## MaryZPA (Sep 14, 2015)

Shalimar said:


> Mary, perhaps a new career for you? Educating the would be terrorist refugee in the finer points of polite jihad??? Lolololol.



 Right...we certainly can't put up with poorly behaved refugees, can we?


----------



## Lara (Sep 14, 2015)

Let's rephrase the question for a moment; If a single woman, living alone, had the space to take in a family but the family had no references, no background info, were not citizens, and didn't know the language, would that single woman be safe and able to help? 

My point is that there are a lot more "Ifs" than just ""IF I had the space I would absolutely do it". Even Landlords who get paid for taking people in, still protect themselves and surrounding tenants by requiring references and doing an internet background check of their criminal record. Even Hostels will turn away anyone with a criminal record. This protects the other people living there. It takes a lot of thought before saying "Yes".

I don't see any issue with taking in a mother and young child without question though (teenager could be a problem).


----------



## WhatInThe (Sep 14, 2015)

Lara said:


> Let's rephrase the question for a moment; If a 55+ single woman, living alone, had the space to take in a family but the family had no references, no background info, were not citizens, and didn't know the language, would that single woman be safe and able to help?
> 
> My point is that there are a lot more "Ifs" that just ""IF I had the space I would absolutely do it". Even Landlords who get paid for taking people in, still protect themselves by requiring references and doing an internet check of their criminal record. Even Hostels will turn away anyone with a criminal record. This protects the other people living there. It takes a lot of thought before saying "Yes".
> 
> I don't see any issue with taking in a mother and young child without question though.



But that ruins a perfectly fine politically correct warm n fuzzy moment. Logical precautions and reasons to pause and think rather than jump. Oh the humanity.


----------



## MaryZPA (Sep 14, 2015)

In times of crisis, people cannot always provide us with references and letters of recommendation. And sometimes it takes a little faith and courage on our part to help. I hope to always have some of each.


----------



## WhatInThe (Sep 14, 2015)

MaryZPA said:


> In times of crisis, people cannot always provide us with references and letters of recommendation. And sometimes it takes a little faith and courage on our part to help. I hope to always have some of each.



Some might call that a BLIND leap of faith.


----------



## QuickSilver (Sep 14, 2015)

what was that again in Matthew 25?


----------



## Lara (Sep 14, 2015)

Quick Silver, what is your answer to the opening question you posted? I haven't seen a yay or nay. What specifically did you want to know about Matthew 25?


----------



## Shirley (Sep 14, 2015)

If I could provide housing, food, clothing, medical care, transportation, interpreters, schooling in English, counseling, emotional support, and job training. I would definitely consider it.


----------



## Shalimar (Sep 14, 2015)

QS, were you referring to Mathew 25:35?


----------



## boozercruiser (Sep 14, 2015)

Shirley said:


> If I could provide housing, food, clothing, medical care, transportation, interpreters, schooling in English, counseling, emotional support, and job training. I would definitely consider it.



Sadly Shirley. 
I am afraid that in the UK we have enough problem obtaining most, if not all of those ideals  for the indigenous population.
Never mind economic migrants. 

So NO, I would not consider it at all.
The UK is Full.
End of!


----------



## QuickSilver (Sep 14, 2015)

Lara said:


> Quick Silver, what is your answer to the opening question you posted? I haven't seen a yay or nay. What specifically did you want to know about Matthew 25?



Apparently you didn't read very carefully?

As for Matthew 25?  Some "Christians" need to read it carefully too.


----------



## Lara (Sep 14, 2015)

QuickSilver said:
			
		

> What was that again in Matthew25





			
				Lara said:
			
		

> What specifically did you want to know about Matthew 25?





QuickSilver said:


> As for Matthew 25?  Some "Christians" need to read it carefully too.


I assure you that I have "carefully" read Matthew 25 and it's very easy to understand so I do understand it. What would you like to discuss about it, because I can't read your mind.


----------



## QuickSilver (Sep 14, 2015)

Shalimar said:


> QS, were you referring to Mathew 25:35?



35-40...  Too many times this very important directive is forgotten... This might be a good place to post a reminder

*Matthew 25:35-40*

*35 *For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, *36 *I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me

*37 *“Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? *38 *When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? *39 *When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

*40 *“The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’


----------



## Kitties (Sep 14, 2015)

I wouldn't. But then living with people has never been a good experience for me.

Would I help in other ways? I don't know. It seems whenever I try to do something, it bites me back.


----------



## fureverywhere (Sep 14, 2015)

*Matthew 25:35-40

**35 *For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, *36 *I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me

*37 *“Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? *38 *When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? *39 *When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

*40 *“The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’ 

Beautiful and in Judaism it's mitzvah. Especially a family with young children. I would hope they'd be there for me as a refugee and thus I would be there for them. Unfortunately our house has no more room, hubby and daughter are disabled, and our dogs would be iffy around small children and strangers.


But if I could I would welcome them.


----------



## Lara (Sep 14, 2015)

QuickSilver said:


> 35-40...  Too many times this very important directive is forgotten... This might be a good place to post a reminder
> 
> *Matthew 25:35-40*
> 
> ...


It's easy to copy and paste out of the Bible but I was hoping you'd put it in your own words to see if you understood it. It's telling us that when we provide food, water, and clothing for those in need then it's the same as if we did it for God himself (back then it was safer to "invite them in" for dinner). That's all it says…it's NOT saying to ask them to move in.

Quick Silver, you aren't giving all the good people enough credit for "remembering" that we should feed and clothe the needy. There are a lot of people who are the helpers. Look around. Rhetorical question, are you feeding and clothing the needy? (sorry, just holding you accountable since you pointed the finger at others in your first sentence).

*Caution: *A few UK News reports are saying that many of the Syrian refugees were fighting alongside the Syrian Army. Last year RT News, in Sept 2014, said US Intelligence picked up conversations that ISIS was coming up with new plans to follow the refugee trail into Europe, disguised as refugees, like a Trojan Horse. Caution is key right now. There is no way to know which is which. Why have 5 of the wealthiest Gulf Nations, Muslim neighbors of Syria, refused to take even one of the refugees? Why are the refugees wanting to take a long and treacherous journey to Hungary and Germany when it's far from their culture? 

*Here's what we can do for now:*
We can all help feed, cloth, and provide shelter for the Syrian Refugees, like the scripture you posted says, through donations to reputable organizations like Feed The Children (nutritional food, education, etc) and the Red Cross (shelter & water), etc. that know what they're doing better than we do. I always see the Red Cross on the scene first in most crisis. As you know, it's tricky getting supplies, medical care, and construction needs quickly to where they're needed. Be careful and smart as to where you send your donations.
Here's a 5-point Plan for the Syrian Refugee Crisis: http://www.savethechildren.org.uk/s...ve_the_Children_A_5_point_plan_for_Europe.pdf

No individual or family or single person, at this point, is expected to put ourselves or our families in any danger by inviting strangers to move into our homes without references, citizenship, knowledge of english, and accessibility to online criminal background checks.That's why we have many reputable organizations handling this right now in a professional and mindful way.


----------



## QuickSilver (Sep 15, 2015)

*“If this is going to be a Christian nation that doesn't help the poor, either we have to pretend that Jesus was just as selfish as we are, or we've got to acknowledge that He commanded us to love the poor and serve the needy without condition and then admit that we just don't want to do it.”*


― Stephen Colbert

By the way... the question was "Would you take a refuge family into your home"...... guess we have your answer.


----------



## Lara (Sep 15, 2015)

I already responded to this quote the last time you posted it. How ridiculous to say our nation doesn't help the poor. I repeat, we are there offering food, clothing, and shelter…but some could be Isis disguised as refugees as I mentioned above so inviting them to move in is not an option. We're not stupid. God tells us to be good stewards of our resources. 

Would YOU let a family move into your home whether it's an Isis family disguised as refugees or not? We don't know who is who yet. But we are there to offer food, water, and shelter until the processing can be intelligently worked out. Seriously, would you really? My answer is donations for food, clothing, and shelter.

It's interesting that you only use scriptural references when trying to destroy instead of building up…that will never happen.


----------



## Ken N Tx (Sep 15, 2015)




----------



## Lara (Sep 15, 2015)

True Ken, and our children living in poverty. Hopefully, we can do both here and abroad in the next Administration. We need someone good at management and economics…and truly loves America.


----------



## mitchezz (Sep 15, 2015)

It doesn't follow that if we refuse help to the Syrian refugees that the homeless will suddenly be better off. Nor will the children living in poverty have their circumstances improved. The BIG difference between the refugees and our own poor is that the poor are not being bombed or slaughtered or taken as sex slaves.

If people are concerned about the homeless they can always adopt someone local instead of a refugee.


----------



## QuickSilver (Sep 15, 2015)

mitchezz said:


> It doesn't follow that if we refuse help to the Syrian refugees that the homeless will suddenly be better off. Nor will the children living in poverty have their circumstances improved. The BIG difference between the refugees and our own poor is that the poor are not being bombed or slaughtered or taken as sex slaves.
> 
> If people are concerned about the homeless they can always adopt someone local instead of a refugee.





So true


----------



## Ralphy1 (Sep 15, 2015)

Please get real and stop the handwringing...


----------



## QuickSilver (Sep 15, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> Please get real and stop the handwringing...



was THAT necessary Ralphy?   Certainly you are not referring to those of us who would like to help...


----------



## Ralphy1 (Sep 15, 2015)

Absolutely necessary, as the way we can help has already been mentioned...


----------



## QuickSilver (Sep 15, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> Absolutely necessary, as the way we can help has already been mentioned...



However... Ralphy.. that was NOT the topic of the OP... The question was "would you take a Syrian refuge family into your home"   Apparently you have answered.. in a round about way... but loud and clear..


----------



## Ralphy1 (Sep 15, 2015)

At my age nothing live gets in the door, not even a pet, so, yes, loud and clear to no refugees.  Let the Clinton Foundation take care of them...


----------



## QuickSilver (Sep 15, 2015)

Bless you


----------



## Capt Lightning (Sep 15, 2015)

No way.


----------



## boozercruiser (Sep 15, 2015)

Ralphy1 said:


> At my age nothing live gets in the door, not even a pet, so, yes, loud and clear to no refugees.  Let the Clinton Foundation take care of them...



Hey Ralphy.

Perhaps change your forum name to Ralphythehermit? 

Please excuse the expletive folks, but I think this is roughly what Ralphy is saying!!!


----------



## Jackie22 (Sep 15, 2015)

Since there is so much speculation in this thread....here is mine.... One third reduction in the military budget could take care of our homeless and refugees too.


----------



## QuickSilver (Sep 15, 2015)

Amen to that!!   Plus take care of our Vets


----------



## Debby (Sep 15, 2015)

Lara said:


> I already responded to this quote the last time you posted it. How ridiculous to say our nation doesn't help the poor. I repeat, we are there offering food, clothing, and shelter…but some could be Isis disguised as refugees as I mentioned above so inviting them to move in is not an option. We're not stupid. God tells us to be good stewards of our resources.
> 
> Would YOU let a family move into your home whether it's an Isis family disguised as refugees or not? We don't know who is who yet. But we are there to offer food, water, and shelter until the processing can be intelligently worked out. Seriously, would you really? My answer is donations for food, clothing, and shelter.
> 
> It's interesting that you only use scriptural references when trying to destroy instead of building up…that will never happen.




I don't see QS's inclusion of that Bible verse as an effort to destroy anything Lara.  I think that verse is a reminder to everyone that aiding and lifting others up can be an act that benefits them and it benefits us.  I also think many people who are not card carrying Christians can also see the blessings of some of the teachings that are in the Bible and that we all do well to remember and remind one another of them.  Human memory can be spotty and selective and sometimes needs a word from the next guy to get back on track or to help engender a little courage.

I also think the Colbert quote is a humorous way that he forced all to actually think about who 'we' are and how 'we' see ourselves and to be honest about it.  Nothing wrong with that.  I sure don't see it as a suggestion that that is what America/Canada is all about.


----------



## Debby (Sep 15, 2015)

mitchezz said:


> It doesn't follow that if we refuse help to the Syrian refugees that the homeless will suddenly be better off. Nor will the children living in poverty have their circumstances improved. The BIG difference between the refugees and our own poor is that the poor are not being bombed or slaughtered or taken as sex slaves.
> 
> If people are concerned about the homeless they can always adopt someone local instead of a refugee.




Or if you're so concerned about those who are homeless or poor, you could all make it a habit to contribute at the very least to your local food bank EVERY TIME you go grocery shopping.  Those peoples needs don't only occur at Christmas or Thanksgiving!  Every week, one can for each person that lives in your household, or one can contributed on behalf of every member of your family (2 adults + your 2 kids = four cans of ???)  Just think, over the course of a year, with shopping once per week, that's 208 cans of something.


----------



## Shalimar (Sep 15, 2015)

I think part of being a good person/patriot, Christian or otherwise is to endeavour to improve ourselves and our country. Neither Canada or  America have a stellar rep. caring for our poor or homeless, vets included. Improvements are needed, not to destroy, but to raise up. The verses from Mathew are inspirational, a clear reminder that we are indeed our brother's/sister's keeper. Ultimately, the true measure of a person is their humanity, or lack of it. Also important to remember, I think, disagreement over ideology/social constructs, remains just that, it is not, nor should be, an indictment of another person worthiness.


----------



## Sunny (Sep 15, 2015)

In the middle of downtown Boston, there is a building with a sign above the door saying New England Center For Homeless Veterans.  I thought that was one of the saddest things I ever saw. Here's their web site:
http://nechv.org/ 

But of course, equating the needs of these two groups is like equating apples and oranges. They are not the same thing at all, and anybody who wants to help both groups can.

I believe that with a humanitarian crisis like the current one going on, we are obligated as a nation to do something to help. That is not the same thing as insisting that people personally open up their homes and families to refugees. We all have different circumstances and living arrangements; some can and some can't. Taking in complete strangers does entail a level of risk that not all are comfortable with. So in general, I agree with those here who recommend supporting the organizations dedicated to helping those in need. Those who want to go further can certainly do so, but nobody should be guilt tripped into doing it.

I am very dubious about Biblical quotes out of context being used to justify, or oppose, anything. The Bible is so full of contradictions that it can be used to make any point at all, including commanding people to commit acts of barbarism. If anyone doubts that, I suggest that they go back and read Leviticus.

As for the impact on our economy, probably they aren't enough in number for that to be significant. (Unlike Germany). They are not likely to take any more jobs away from Americans than any other immigrant group.
If we were agreeing to take in millions, my answer would be different.

Interesting discussion.


----------



## QuickSilver (Sep 15, 2015)

I'm wondering though if it will not come to people taking in refugees.   If we agree to take in thousands of families, where will the go?   Will be build refugee camps with tents or lean-to's  Of course these camps will be a thousand percent better than what these people are fleeing, but will do little to assimilate them.. not like being taken in by Americans will..   And I agree Sunny... taking in a family is not possible for everyone.. but we wouldn't need everyone to do it.. just those willing and able.


----------



## venus (Sep 16, 2015)

I'm afraid the answer is no.  There are too many in my country who need my help and support.


----------



## QuickSilver (Sep 16, 2015)

venus said:


> I'm afraid the answer is no.  There are too many in my country who need my help and support.



So you are supporting them?


----------



## boozercruiser (Sep 16, 2015)

QuickSilver said:


> So you are supporting them?



If I may answer.
I happen to know that Venus does indeed do a lot of Charity Work.
She pays her taxes.
We rely on our government to use those taxes to help and support British citizens.
But the government do a very poor job in that.
Instead they choose to .give 13 BILLION POUNDS in overseas aid.

Most of that is wasted by the despots.

Charity begins at home!


----------



## QuickSilver (Sep 16, 2015)

So Paying ones taxes and giving to or working for a few charities is sufficient...


----------



## boozercruiser (Sep 16, 2015)

QuickSilver said:


> So Paying ones taxes and giving to or working for a few charities is sufficient...



The answer to that in my opinion is YES! More than enough.

If I respectfully may mention your previous post Quicksilver...

 'I'm wondering though if it will not come to people taking in refugees. If we agree to take in thousands of families, where will the go? Will be build refugee camps with tents or lean-to's Of course these camps will be a thousand percent better than what these people are fleeing, but will do little to assimilate them.. not like being taken in by Americans will.. And I agree Sunny... taking in a family is not possible for everyone.. but we wouldn't need everyone to do it.. just those willing and able'.

I agree with all that you say there.
So may I ask what YOU are doing to make YOUR actions sufficient to help so called refugees, and economic migrants?

If you are doing anywhere near as much as Venus is doing, then good on you and all.

Perhaps you can telephone some of them offering help?
After all, a lot of them do seem to be clothed in the latest fashions, and have the latest smart phones.


----------



## QuickSilver (Sep 16, 2015)

I have no idea what venus is doing...nor do I really care..   AGAIN... the OP was if  you would or wouldn't shelter a refugee family.   I'll add to that.. IF they were brought to the States and needing someone to house them and sponsor them.    I wasn't aware we were in a contest over who does what for charity.  

My answer is.....yes I would take in a family..     It feels to me like those who say they would not, feel the need to justify that by claiming to do this or that for charity or for poor families,  or as YOU did BC... denigrate and insult the refugees...   No need to justify a NO answer...  It is what it is.   If you wouldn't then you wouldn't... Don't give a rats ass what else you do to ease your conscience.


----------



## boozercruiser (Sep 16, 2015)

QuickSilver said:


> I have no idea what venus is doing...nor do I really care..   AGAIN... the OP was if  you would or wouldn't shelter a refugee family.   I'll add to that.. IF they were brought to the States and needing someone to house them and sponsor them.    I wasn't aware we were in a contest over who does what for charity.
> 
> My answer is.....yes I would take in a family..     It feels to me like those who say they would not, feel the need to justify that by claiming to do this or that for charity or for poor families or whatever...   No need to justify a NO answer...  It is what it is.



Again if I may respectfully quote you Quicksilver..*.
*
*'I have no idea what venus is doing...nor do I really care'.
*
If that is the case, why make the comment to Venus...
*
'So you are supporting them'?

*Then to me...*

'So Paying ones taxes and giving to or working for a few charities is sufficient'...

*Judging by your above replies there it appears to be a bit hypocritical.
But then.
My guess is that you don't really care about what I think either!

But then you see, with respect, you and I are different because I care about what other people think.
Perhaps I might just learn something from them?


----------



## QuickSilver (Sep 16, 2015)

Guess I must be slow this morning... As I have no idea WHAT you are trying to argue about.... oh well.... go for it..   I'm getting another cup of coffee..


----------



## boozercruiser (Sep 16, 2015)

QuickSilver said:


> Guess I must be slow this morning... As I have no idea WHAT you are trying to argue about.... oh well.... go for it..   I'm getting another cup of coffee..



Yes Quicksilver.
Even I have lost the plot now!layful:

So coming back to the original question.

NO, would not open my home to a so called refugee.
Apart from what I have said in earlier posts (if you can understand them)!

If I do I could also be helping one of those ICIS chappies to get established, and then either blow us up, or chop our heads off! 


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...efugees-Germany-Syrian-ISIS-infiltrators.html


*How many are genuine? As Europe locks down its borders, eye witnesses claim fewer than a third of refugees who have made it to Germany are Syrian – and some are even ISIS infiltrators*


*Refugees who are fleeing areas of **Syria** torn apart by war say they are being joined by thousands of imposters*
*Desperate **refugees** claim as many as seven in every ten migrants heading to Europe are lying about their past*
*The relentless flow of migrants has overwhelmed the EU mainland, with Germany temporarily shutting its borders with Austria, Slovakia and Holland pledging tighter border controls and Hungary completing a razor-wire fence*
By SPECIAL REPORT BY SUE REID IN BERLIN
*PUBLISHED:* 23:30, 15 September 2015 | *UPDATED:* 00:37, 16 September 2015




Chain-smoking outside a coffee bar in Germany’s capital, young Syrian Mohammad Al-Abaan bangs his hand loudly on the table as three teenage girls walk past in Islamic robes.
‘Look at them!’ he says. ‘They pretend to be migrants from my country, but they lie. Their skin is blacker than ours. I know they are Arab-speaking Muslims from Sudan in Africa. Every day, more Africans, Afghanis, Iraqis, Iranians, Lebanese, and lots of others, slip through the door opened by Germany to us Syrians.’
These are strong words, particularly as Mohammad has only just set foot in Europe himself, arriving in Berlin a week ago by train from Hungary with his friend Ismail Gannom.


----------



## QuickSilver (Sep 16, 2015)

BC....Thanks for clarifying your positions... see  I AM capable of "Understanding" many things... but they really have to make sense... 



It appears to me that Europe is bearing the brunt of this immigration thing..  I can only imagine if that happened here... We set our collective hair on fire when a few thousand children cross our southern boarder.   

I would imagine for them to get here they would have to come by boat of plane.. hard for them to do if uninvited.  Therefore I would think that those getting the privilege of coming to the States would be well vetted.


----------



## Don M. (Sep 16, 2015)

This refugee problem is certainly something that needs to be addressed.  However, the U.S. has some severe problems with its own people that should be given a far higher priority.  Here is just one example.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca...1fadb6-58c2-11e5-8bb1-b488d231bba2_story.html


----------



## QuickSilver (Sep 16, 2015)

Don M. said:


> This refugee problem is certainly something that needs to be addressed.  However, the U.S. has some severe problems with its own people that should be given a far higher priority.  Here is just one example.
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca...1fadb6-58c2-11e5-8bb1-b488d231bba2_story.html




Very sad... and I agree, we need to do something about it... so why are we cutting unemployment benefits, public aid and food stamps again?


----------



## Hanfonius (Sep 16, 2015)

Just a simple question:   Do you not think that by opening the gates for all of the political and economic refugees that wish to migrate to Europe,  we are simply transferring all of the problems to a focal point?   Economically,  all of the European countries are in a downward trend anyway,  so by allowing millions of additional people to dilute the indigenous people will make those countries even poorer.

Surely,  the more people who do migrate into Europe will only encourage those left behind to do the same.   There are billions of people who are worse off than us.   They all want a higher standard of living than what they have now,  and that is very understandable.   However,  we are looking at the possibility of major geographical relocations.


----------



## boozercruiser (Sep 16, 2015)

Don M. said:


> This refugee problem is certainly something that needs to be addressed.  However, the U.S. has some severe problems with its own people that should be given a far higher priority.  Here is just one example.
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca...1fadb6-58c2-11e5-8bb1-b488d231bba2_story.html



Very interesting link there Don M.

Well although you and I come from different counties, my general sentiments are the same as yours


----------



## QuickSilver (Sep 16, 2015)

What is unfortunate is that we DON'T take care of our homeless children and our poor..  If we did there wouldn't be so many would there..?    It's not for lack of not having the means..  we are the richest country in the world..  Just a tiny cut in our Military budget would do the trick... but we really don't want to..  We have a factor of our society and certainly a political party that begrudges anyone getting help on their tax dollar.  Food stamps, Federal assistance, and even unemployment benefits are always in the crosshairs of budget cuts..   People are denigrated and admonished for needing help....So yes... I DO tend to agree that we should help our own first..If only we would.


----------



## BobF (Sep 16, 2015)

With our current debt of $18 trillion we are not the richest country in the world at all.    We may have the power to be the richest but we are not as our debts just keep on rising every day.   We need a government willing to work to bring this debt back down and get all that borrowed money working back in the US where it started from.

This kind of debt is not party related as it has been authorized by some of both parties.   But right now we need a controlling group willing to stop more spending and to work on ending our deficit.


----------



## QuickSilver (Sep 16, 2015)

Just a tiny cut in our massive military budget would more than fund all the programs for the poor and the homeless..


----------



## BobF (Sep 16, 2015)

QuickSilver said:


> Just a tiny cut in our massive military budget would more than fund all the programs for the poor and the homeless..



And there are other places to cut spending that would be a lot less dangerous to the US and our friends around the world.


----------



## Toyboyroy (Sep 16, 2015)

If I may come in here,  and please put me straight if I got this totally wrong.

These immigrants that are escaping their war torn countries are hell bent on getting to Britain for safety of their families yet their passing through just as safe countries to reach us.

Now its a fact that our government have put some of these refugees in 5* hotels for months whilst sorting out free housing and benefits to the tune that they never need work again. Others they have housed  in council houses as top priority yet neglected our own citizens that have been waiting to be housed for months on end. 

In their eyes no country is suitable to their needs save ours as they know our government is an easy touch, OH yes they do talk the talk but their afraid to walk the walk.

They also play the racial card when it comes to ask them to respect our laws instead they demand that our laws are changed to suit them, yet if we visit their country they ensure their laws are abided or face jail or even in some extreme cases a death penalty.

Can I ask our American friends who are in favour of offering housing to these people, Have the American government actually offered these immigrants safe passage into your country offering them a better life.??

My answer to the original Question is definitely no,  We have enough destitute people of our own that need helping without an insurmountable influx of immigrants.

Roy


----------



## Lon (Sep 16, 2015)

With my two bedroom two bath apartment I could take in one person and would be glad to do it.


----------



## Butterfly (Sep 16, 2015)

QuickSilver said:


> I'm wondering though if it will not come to people taking in refugees.   If we agree to take in thousands of families, where will the go?   Will be build refugee camps with tents or lean-to's  Of course these camps will be a thousand percent better than what these people are fleeing, but will do little to assimilate them.. not like being taken in by Americans will..   And I agree Sunny... taking in a family is not possible for everyone.. but we wouldn't need everyone to do it.. just those willing and able.



How 'bout opening up some of the closed military installations around the country to house them.  A lot of them have quarters, including family quarters, on the installation.


----------



## QuickSilver (Sep 16, 2015)

Butterfly said:


> How 'bout opening up some of the closed military installations around the country to house them.  A lot of them have quarters, including family quarters, on the installation.




That's a good idea..


----------



## Don M. (Sep 16, 2015)

QuickSilver said:


> Very sad... and I agree, we need to do something about it... so why are we cutting unemployment benefits, public aid and food stamps again?



If we can believe most of the Pundits, and reports, almost 40% of our own people are so poor that they do not pay any income taxes.  Either they are unemployed, or working some low level Minimum Wage job that doesn't come close to letting them lead a decent life.  $7 an hour...and even $15/hr, is insufficient to let a person or family become independent.  Then, to make matters worse, we constantly see reports of companies like GE and HP, recently, announcing even more jobs cuts.  We seem to be caught in a spiral where the Disparity of Wealth is showing no signs of slowing down.  

Given these kinds of conditions, I see nothing but more problems for the nation if we open our doors to large numbers of these refugees.  Some may have skills and a good grasp of English that might allow them to assimilate into our society....but the vast majority will just become dependent upon our governments social/welfare programs, and reduce the "base" for our own people.


----------



## BobF (Sep 16, 2015)

That has already happened to the US with all these South, Central, Mexican, Americas folks slinking into the US for protection, clothing, schools, health systems, housing.   They have been coming for years and not bothering to be honest about where they will be living and asking for acceptance into the US system.   But they do depend on the US system to help them raise their families.   And actually they do get plenty of help.   

We have tried on occasion to end their mob scene ways of entering the US not far from where I live.   Why won't our politicians allow us to go back to the rules that worked  50 years ago.   It was mostly work access for 9 months or so and then they had to return to where ever they were from for a month or two before re entering the US.   That worked for many years, why not now.   Or they can go get a permit to live here while they work on getting a US citizenship acceptance.

The number of illegal immigrants in the US runs about 11 million to 12 million.


----------



## boozercruiser (Sep 16, 2015)

I see on our BBC News that Donald Trump is shouting about building a wall right across the Mexican Border.
I wish that the UK could do that!


----------



## Hanfonius (Sep 16, 2015)

Benefits offered to asylum seekers in European Countries.

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/fatcbox-b...ean-countries-121632417--finance.html#603TBiV


----------



## Hanfonius (Sep 16, 2015)

Butterfly said:


> How 'bout opening up some of the closed military installations around the country to house them.  A lot of them have quarters, including family quarters, on the installation.



Maybe some of the old people's homes that are being closed down to lack of finance?
Some of the mental institutes that are closed down for the same reason?


----------



## boozercruiser (Sep 16, 2015)

Hanfonius said:


> Maybe some of the old people's homes that are being closed down to lack of finance?
> Some of the mental institutes that are closed down for the same reason?



Your winding me up Hanf.
Your winding me up!

I go mental when I think along those lines!


----------



## boozercruiser (Sep 16, 2015)

Coming to a Bed and Full Board near YOU!
Your neighbour has been kind!
Please take one in. If you dare !

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-Hungary-seals-Serbian-border-razor-wire.html

*Storming the barricades: Hundreds of migrants smash their way through Hungary's razor-wire border with Serbia after hurling rocks at riot police who hit back with tear gas and water cannon *


*Frustrated refugees finally lost their patience and demanded to be allowed to cross Serbia's border into Hungary*
*They have been stuck on the Serbian side of the crossing since Hungary finished erecting its razor wire fences *
*Several hundred refugees stormed the fences on Wednesday, throwing rocks and bottles at Hungarian police*
*Riot officers responded by firing tear gas and water cannon, sparking a stampede among panicked refugees *
*Last night many were seen breaking through the barricade while outnumbered riot police sheltered behind shields*
*Hungary's heavy-handed approach has been condemned by the UN Secretary-General and human rights groups*
By HANNAH ROBERTS IN HORGOS ON THE SERBIA-HUNGARY BORDER FOR MAILONLINE and JOHN HALL and COREY CHARLTON and SAM TONKIN FOR MAILONLINE
*PUBLISHED:* 08:53, 16 September 2015 | *UPDATED:* 00:37, 17 September 2015




*Hundreds of migrants smashed their way through razor-wire fences and into Hungary after chaos at the country's border yesterday saw them hurl rocks at riot police who hit back with tear gas and water cannon.
After an afternoon of battles in which Hungarian riot police launched tear gas and unleashed water cannon on the thousands of migrants gathered along the country's border with Serbia, many finally managed to break through the new 13ft-high fences.
Yesterday evening the crowd were seen pouring through the border crossing while Hungarian police reinforcements sheltered behind their riot gear. However, fresh batches of tear gas sent panic into the crowd - with the refugees either beaten back or held in 'no man's land' between the two countries.
The confrontation has threatened to cause a political row, with the United Nations Secretary-General and Serbian government officials joining human rights groups in condemning Hungary's actions.
Last night Serbia's prime minister Aleksandar Vucic accused Hungary of 'brutal' and 'non-European' behaviour towards migrants and warned the neighbouring country not to fire tear gas onto its territory again. He also urged the European Union to respond.
Refugees were locked in a standoff with about 400 Hungarian riot police, while Serbian police officers were deployed between the two groups in a bid to persuade the desperate migrants to back down. Three Hungarian military Humvees, mounted with guns, also arrived at the border.*


----------



## Zante (Sep 16, 2015)

It was said in a local paper here today that there are terrorists being smuggled in with all the thousands of genuine people seeking sanctuary ( and why wouldn't we not be surprised about that) so it is possible that you may harbour a 'sleeper' terrorist and these  'wooden horse' attacks from seemingly ordinary people within our societies are the saddest thing because as much as we - or me anyway - would like to give to give wholeheartedly support that little niggle will not leave the back of my mind. 
and fureverywhere it has been known before for a bomb to be strapped to a child!


----------



## boozercruiser (Sep 17, 2015)

Zante said:


> It was said in a local paper here today that there are terrorists being smuggled in with all the thousands of genuine people seeking sanctuary ( and why wouldn't we not be surprised about that) so it is possible that you may harbour a 'sleeper' terrorist and these  'wooden horse' attacks from seemingly ordinary people within our societies are the saddest thing because as much as we - or me anyway - would like to give to give wholeheartedly support that little niggle will not leave the back of my mind.
> and fureverywhere it has been known before for a bomb to be strapped to a child!



And please think on Zante.
How many refugees/migrants have we ALREADY let into the UK, and the next thing they are doing is to try and blow us all up. Or get on a plane back to Syria or wherever so as to join ISIS. Or change our Country to suit THEM!

Only recently we had to send out a drone (along with America) in order to blow up Jihadees who had done just that.

No thanks from them there then!

Not that I have any sympathy for them, as they are supposed to have 20 Virgins waiting for them in Icky Ackybar land.

I hope that you are enjoying yourselves guys!


----------



## Shalimar (Sep 17, 2015)

Actually, the majority of Muslim scholars now believe that the passages once thought to promise virgins in paradise to believers, instead refers to an abundance of food and drink. Arabic, like Hebrew, is a complex language open to multiple meanings.


----------



## boozercruiser (Sep 17, 2015)

Shalimar said:


> Actually, the majority of Muslim scholars now believe that the passages once thought to promise virgins in paradise to believers, instead refers to an abundance of food and drink. Arabic, like Hebrew, is a complex language open to multiple meanings.



And that is the problem Shalimar.
We can all read multiple meanings into almost everything.
I mean. You won't believe this, but people have been know to misunderstand even ME! 

I found this interesting off WikiIslam though! (I see that it is 72 Virgins)! Bring it on! 

Sensual Paradise[edit]
In Islam, the concept of 72 virgins (houri) refers to an aspect of Jannah (Paradise). This concept is grounded in Qur'anic text which describe a sensual Paradise where believing men are rewarded by being wed[SUP][1][/SUP] to virgins with "full grown", "swelling" or "pears-shaped" breasts.[SUP][2][3][/SUP] Conversly, women will be provided with only one man, and they "will be satisfied with him".[SUP][4][/SUP]
Contemporary mainstream Islamic scholars, for example; Gibril Haddad, have commented on the erotic nature of the Qur'anic Paradise, by saying some men may need ghusl (ablution required after ****** discharge) just for hearing certain verses.[SUP][5][/SUP]
Orthodox Muslim theologians such as al-Ghazali (died 1111 CE) and al-Ash'ari (died 935 CE) have all discussed the sensual pleasures found in Paradise, relating hadith that describe Paradise as a slave market where there will be "no buy and sale, but... If any man will wish to have ****** intercourse with a woman, he will do at once."[SUP][6][7][/SUP]
It is quoted by Ibn Kathir, in his Qur'anic Commentary, the Tafsir ibn Kathir,[SUP][8][/SUP] and they are graphically described by Qur'anic commentator and polymath, al-Suyuti (died 1505), who, echoing a hasan hadith[SUP][9][/SUP] from Ibn Majah,[SUP][10][/SUP] wrote that the perpetual virgins will all "have appetizing vaginas", and that the "penis of the Elected never softens. The erection is eternal".[SUP][11][/SUP]
The sensual pleasures between believers and houri in Paradise are also confirmed by the two Sahih collections of hadith, namely Sahih Bukhari[SUP][12][/SUP] and Sahih Muslim, where we read that they will be virgins who are so beautiful, pure and transparent that "the marrow of the bones of their legs will be seen through the bones and the flesh",[SUP][13][/SUP] and that "the believers will visit and enjoy them".[SUP][14][/SUP]


----------



## Shalimar (Sep 17, 2015)

Hmmm. A Christian could find many passages in the Bible, particularly the Old Testament pertaining to incest, selling one's daughter, killing concubines, rape etc. that are extremely sexist and unsavory. Women were chattels, nothing more. In some sects they remain so. As John Lennon said, woman is the world's ******.


----------



## boozercruiser (Sep 17, 2015)

Shalimar said:


> Hmmm. A Christian could find many passages in the Bible, particularly the Old Testament pertaining to incest, selling one's daughter, killing concubines, rape etc. that are extremely sexist and unsavory. Women were chattels, nothing more. In some sects they remain so. As John Lennon said, woman is the world's ******.



For me the Bible is like reading Grims Fairy Tails, and I don't believe a word of it.
I could say a lot more on that, but I know that I would offend some people.
That is not what I am about.


----------



## venus (Sep 18, 2015)

QuickSilver said:


> So you are supporting them?


Morning quicksilver just catching up with this thread.  The little bit of volunteering I do for disadvantaged families and domestic violence victims also feeding the homeless when I can does make a little difference to their lives.  It is not a competition just charities which are close to my heart.  No need for your sarcastic remarks, a question was asked and I answered.   I am proud to work for these charities who incidentally have hundreds of volunteers all giving help in countless ways.

May I take the opportunity of asking "Why are all these young men not standing together and fighting for their country".   Most of the people I have seen on television, internet and papers look fit, healthy and well dressed.  They are certainly not afraid to attack the Hungarian police.


----------



## boozercruiser (Sep 18, 2015)

venus said:


> Morning quicksilver just catching up with this thread.  The little bit of volunteering I do for disadvantaged families and domestic violence victims also feeding the homeless when I can does make a little difference to their lives.  It is not a competition just charities which are close to my heart.  No need for your sarcastic remarks, a question was asked and I answered.   I am proud to work for these charities who incidentally have hundreds of volunteers all giving help in countless ways.
> 
> May I take the opportunity of asking "Why are all these young men not standing together and fighting for their country".   Most of the people I have seen on television, internet and papers look fit, healthy and well dressed.  They are certainly not afraid to attack the Hungarian police.



Thank you for that clarification Venus.
And I agree with every word!


----------



## Butterfly (Sep 18, 2015)

Good point, Venus, about why aren't they fighting to make their own country better.


----------



## boozercruiser (Sep 18, 2015)

Butterfly said:


> Good point, Venus, about why aren't they fighting to make their own country better.



That is right Butterfly.
After all, in the news the young men look a very fit lot.
They certainly know how to break down border controls.
Anyway.
Arn't they supposed to stay in the first safe country they arrive at?
Well, that ain't either Germany, OR the UK!

PS. I hope that you were never like this Butterfly, Butterfly!!! (Charlie Gracie).


----------



## boozercruiser (Sep 18, 2015)

I never doubted this for a minute...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ars-85-year-just-one-five-war-torn-Syria.html


*Four out of five migrants are NOT from Syria: EU figures expose the 'lie' that the majority of refugees are fleeing war zone*

*

Some 44,000 of the 213,000 refugees who arrived in Europe were from Syria
A further 27,000 new arrivals on the continent came from Afghanistan
Britain received one in 30 of all the asylum claims made by new applicants
David Cameron has offered to take in 20,000 refugees but none from the EU


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...st-one-five-war-torn-Syria.html#ixzz3m8ILLaX0 
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook*

Only one in every five migrants claiming asylum in Europe is from Syria.
The EU logged 213,000 arrivals in April, May and June but only 44,000 of them were fleeing the Syrian civil war.
Campaigners and left-wing MPs have suggested the vast majority of migrants are from the war-torn state, accusing the Government of doing too little to help them.
'This exposes the lie peddled in some quarters that vast numbers of those reaching Europe are from Syria,' said David Davies, Tory MP for Monmouth. 'Most people who are escaping the war will go to camps in Lebanon or Jordan.
'Many of those who have opted to risk their lives to come to Europe have done so for economic reasons.'


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...st-one-five-war-torn-Syria.html#ixzz3m8IYwe73 
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook


----------



## Hanfonius (Sep 19, 2015)

So if I agree to take in a refugee,  do I get a  choice in advance..?




I might well think I would be giving this little girl a chance of a decent future.




... or perhaps this chap?


I think  shall pass on this opportunity of being a caring Christian.


----------



## venus (Sep 19, 2015)

Yes the images we are seeing speak volumes.  These worn out people are showing a lot of respect for the countries they are hoping will shelter them...litter left behind, sitting on windows of trains and already fighting amongst themselves (somehow they have managed to find the energy for this) but most worrying to me is seeing no respect for security forces/authorities.  This will cost europe millions if not billions.  My heart goes out to Greece who are suffering great financial hardship.  As usual governments have been slow to act.  Rant over!


----------



## Manatee (Sep 19, 2015)

No way jose!


----------

