# Planned kitchen (could really use your help)



## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

Hoping a few here can provide me with a little guidance and direction on this.

When it comes to gas ranges and gas cook-tops, I'm at a crossroads of sorts, I definitely want gas in the kitchen this time around, but what to get, a gas cook-top, or a full gas range.

I absolutely love the idea of having two range ovens built into the cabinetry as shown in the first picture, yet having a full range appeals to me, too. 

Does anyone have any input on this based on personal experience?

Pros/Cons?


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## old medic (Jan 27, 2021)

We are currently in the same planning stages... defiantly will be gas, and already have a stove top..... got to love free stuff from the land fill
The wife is wanting a built in oven but may settle for a commercial style freestanding stove to sit outside on the rear porch kitchen.
We do alot of canning and outdoor cooking anyway. Living in a camper will do that for ya.. LOL
She says no to a microwave, we just dont use it that much. We have a toaster over that gets a regular workout...
Just wondering... do you cook enough to need 2 ovens?


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

old medic said:


> We are currently in the same planning stages... defiantly will be gas, and already have a stove top..... got to love free stuff from the land fill
> The wife is wanting a built in oven but may settle for a commercial style freestanding stove to sit outside on the rear porch kitchen.
> We do alot of canning and outdoor cooking anyway. Living in a camper will do that for ya.. LOL
> She says no to a microwave, we just dont use it that much. We have a toaster over that gets a regular workout...
> Just wondering... do you cook enough to need 2 ovens?


Appreciate hearing from you, Old Medic.

I've visited a couple of homes where gas ranges are in use, and I really like them. I do a lot of cooking, and from all that I hear, gas is the way to go. As for cooking enough to utilize two ovens, I don't anymore, but it was something I've been looking at just to have for those times of need, like around Christmas when we take turns in the family hosting Christmas Day dinner. Would be a dream to be able to put a ham in one, a turkey in the other, and have stuff going on the gas range.

We're going to keep the bones and guts in the kitchen as is, so we're just looking at cupboard, drawer, and cabinet fronts, and then of course a gas range.

It's going to be hit-and-miss as to whether we'll have the time to tackle the job this year, but I'm one of those types that likes getting on things early, that way I can see what's out there and what we're dealing with in the way of cost.

With everything being so expensive nowadays, we pick a job or two each year, that way it helps to keep costs down, but at the same time, we're still getting things accomplished and the home pulled together more and more all the time. Bit-by-bit is our adage.

How I would love to have an outdoor area where I could have a sort of barbecue/kitchen. I'd me more apt to deep-fry and make other recipes if I did.


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## Lewkat (Jan 27, 2021)

Gas range is a must for me and if you do a lot of baking and roasting, it might behoove you to go for the second picture type.


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

Lewkat said:


> Gas range is a must for me and if you do a lot of baking and roasting, it might behoove you to go for the second picture type.


Appreciate you weighing-in on this for me, Lew.

Honestly, the more and more I look at the full range, the more I'm steering towards that as my choice, and yes baking, roasting, etc, that's me.

Everyone I have spoken with regarding gas ranges are sold on them, and swear they will never go back to electric.


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## old medic (Jan 27, 2021)

We're going to keep the bones and guts in the kitchen as is... 
LMAO wanna see ours?

We have had gas cooking and heat for years and love it


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## Ruth n Jersey (Jan 27, 2021)

@Aunt Marg, my family just had this very conversation over the weekend. I said a gas stove and 2 ovens would be my top priority. My mom had two ovens in a free standing gas stove when I was growing up.  They both got a workout especially on holidays.  
Since I'm stuck with an electric stove because the hubby has some kind of aversion to gas I don't know what really is available these days. 
I have a question about gas stoves. 
If the oven is gas do they have the self cleaning feature? 
If they don't that would be the one thing that would hold me back getting gas ovens. I wouldn't want to go back to that smelly can of spray that my mom used back in the 50s and 60s.


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

old medic said:


> We're going to keep the bones and guts in the kitchen as is...
> LMAO wanna see ours?
> 
> We have had gas cooking and heat for years and love it


Love the pictures, Old Medic!

It's nice to be able to work around the existing structure.


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

Ruth n Jersey said:


> @Aunt Marg, my family just had this very conversation over the weekend. I said a gas stove and 2 ovens would be my top priority. My mom had two ovens in a free standing gas stove when I was growing up.  They both got a workout especially on holidays.
> Since I'm stuck with an electric stove because the hubby has some kind of aversion to gas I don't know what really is available these days.
> I have a question about gas stoves.
> If the oven is gas do they have the self cleaning feature?
> If they don't that would be the one thing that would hold me back getting gas ovens. I wouldn't want to go back to that smelly can of spray that my mom used back in the 50s and 60s.


Nice to hear from you, Ruth.

Looking at the bottom picture I posted, I do really love the double oven feature, and seeing how options are available for either a single or double oven feature, I'm gravitating towards the double oven feature range.

I've always really liked the overall design and functionality of an oven (or two) built into the wall or cabinetry at chest height, which makes me think... a single oven gas range with a single oven built-in, or a double oven gas range with no built-in.

The thing I was so surprised at is the price of gas ranges, jeepers. They don't come cheap.

I also want glass-fronted cupboards, have always loved the vintage look of glass-fronted cupboards, and with today's fancy-schmancy LED lights, we'll definitely be adding lights within the cupboards, as well as under-cabinet lighting.

One thing I have made my mind up on is the backsplash, which this time around I want to go with glass. I've seen my fair-share of tile over the years, and so now it's time for change, something different.

Yes indeed, I remember the days of the stinky oven spray cleaner, too. Used to stink and fume the entire house up.

Will definitely be inquiring about the self-cleaning feature with gas.


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## Jules (Jan 27, 2021)

After numerous gas stoves, I never want one again.  They’re dirty unless you’re absolutely diligent about turning the fan on.  They’re definitely much faster.  

My friend who was an incredible chef said there was no need for gas in the oven, but I think that was for baking.  If you want to broil something at the end, it sure is nice.  

When I had two wall ovens, the second rarely got used.  Now I’ve been wondering about the split ovens.  Lately what I’ve been cooking seems wasteful to turn the oven on for two people.  It’s larger than fits in a toaster oven.  I like to use the oven in the winter.

We put in a smooth cooktop range in this house.  Have been happy with it.  

Start recording HGTV reno shows.  You learn how to FF past their ’surprise crises’ and see the end product.  

I have oodles of opinions on what the designers on these shows choose.  They walk into a place and say how dated things are and then put in styles that will scream dated to the next designer in 5 or 10 years.

One thing I wouldn’t want is a below counter microwave.  I’m short and it would be a nuisance. We have a built in area for ours on the counter top.  

Leave the ability to put a different size fridge in when it inevitably has to be replaced.

A lot depends on the current footprint of your kitchen.  And your wallet.


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## asp3 (Jan 27, 2021)

We have a single gas range with burners at counter height and two smaller ovens below.  The top oven has a maximum height of about 6 inches clearance (from the top of the bottom rack to the top of the oven).  The bottom oven has about 10 1/2 inches clearance.  My wife has never had to cook anything taller than 10 1/2 inches so we've been fine.  She usually used the top oven because most things she cooks are only a few inches tall.

The good thing about these ovens is that they heat much more quickly because they are so much smaller and they also use much less gas because they are easier to keep at temperature.  They also reheat more quickly when one opens the oven to check on something.

If you're convinced you want two ovens you might consider getting three ovens, one large oven and one with the two ovens built into it.


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## old medic (Jan 27, 2021)

It just dawned on me... I have used multiple oven on many occasions


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

Jules said:


> After numerous gas stoves, I never want one again.  They’re dirty unless you’re absolutely diligent about turning the fan on.  They’re definitely much faster.
> 
> My friend who was an incredible chef said there was no need for gas in the oven, but I think that was for baking.  If you want to broil something at the end, it sure is nice.
> 
> ...


Lots of info, Jules, thank you so kindly for all.

I really do love the smooth glass or ceramic cooktops. One of my biggest pet-peeves is snagging dishcloths on the old-fashioned elements when wiping/cleaning the stovetop, so I'm really looking forward to getting away from that in whatever I choose.

I lost interest in watching the likes of HGTV, at least their reno shows, because of the needless waste, and unless a homeowner is filthy rich, doing what they on those shows is way out of most people's reach.

Your mention of considering a future refrigerator replacement and being able to fit that into the hard design is something I never gave any thought to, yet such an important mention. I'll bet few homeowners take that into consideration when redoing/renovating kitchens.

Not to deviate from the original intent of this thread, but something else I'm going to do at the time we're redoing our kitchen, is have a size large floor-to-ceiling, possibly wall-to-wall built-in china cabinet put in. For years I have wanted a special place to store my fine china and cutlery.

Like this or something close to, and yes, I LOVE cremone bolt cabinet doors!


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

asp3 said:


> We have a single gas range with burners at counter height and two smaller ovens below.  The top oven has a maximum height of about 6 inches clearance (from the top of the bottom rack to the top of the oven).  The bottom oven has about 10 1/2 inches clearance.  My wife has never had to cook anything taller than 10 1/2 inches so we've been fine.  She usually used the top oven because most things she cooks are only a few inches tall.
> 
> The good thing about these ovens is that they heat much more quickly because they are so much smaller and they also use much less gas because they are easier to keep at temperature.  They also reheat more quickly when one opens the oven to check on something.
> 
> If you're convinced you want two ovens you might consider getting three ovens, one large oven and one with the two ovens built into it.


This is great info, Asp.

I'll definitely be critiquing ever aspect of oven space when I buy, because a number of years ago we bought a side-by-side fridge, and at the time I was just so thrilled to get rid of our old fridge, which had given up the ghost, but was of the old design where it had a freezer compartment on top, with the fridge compartment on the bottom.

Needless to say, the side-by-side freezer compartment on our modern fridge, while deep, is no where wide enough for my liking, so I'm not going to make the same mistake when buying a range.

All things to consider.


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## Jules (Jan 27, 2021)

I really like all your examples of built in cabinets.  They take up less space than a china cabinet.  In hindsight I would have done similar and replaced our china cabinet (which I don’t like.).   

With the flat top stove, it’s not the same kind of mess when things boil over.


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## IrisSenior (Jan 27, 2021)

I plan on re-doing (gutting) the kitchen in the future. I have an electric stove  and have heard that they are safer than gas. My daughter has a black flat top stove and she says it is good but it shows the finger prints and needs wiping all the time. 

A new fridge with ice maker/water on the front door. New microwave and cabinet for microwave dishes. A dish washer which I at present don't have. New floor, counter, small table and 4 chairs. This will take a lot of thought, co-ordination and research.


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

Jules said:


> I really like all your examples of built in cabinets.  They take up less space than a china cabinet.  In hindsight I would have done similar and replaced our china cabinet (which I don’t like.).
> 
> With the flat top stove, it’s not the same kind of mess when things boil over.


I love built-ins, too, Jules, always have, and for the same reason as you.

As for spill-overs, etc with the glass-top stoves, I can only imagine how easy it is to clean up.

Lots for me to think about.


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

IrisSenior said:


> I plan on re-doing (gutting) the kitchen in the future. I have an electric stove  and have heard that they are safer than gas. My daughter has a black flat top stove and she says it is good but it shows the finger prints and needs wiping all the time.
> 
> A new fridge with ice maker/water on the front door. New microwave and cabinet for microwave dishes. A dish washer which I at present don't have. New floor, counter, small table and 4 chairs. This will take a lot of thought, co-ordination and research.


Please fill me in on the safety issue related to gas ranges.

I've never cared for gas myself out of fear of an explosion, etc, but our gas man has assured me that there is no need for me to fear.

Love the sounds of your planned remodel, Iris!


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## Murrmurr (Jan 27, 2021)

Gas stoves are more responsive than electric ones when you need to adjust the heat. 

For my mom's 60th birthday my dad gutted a cabinet and installed the upper/lower ovens for her because he didn't like to see her bending all the time with the full range (and she got a new cooktop). And by that time they had something like 15 or so grandchildren so holiday dinners got huge and she needed the second oven.


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

Murrmurr said:


> *Gas stoves are more responsive than electric ones when you need to adjust the heat.*
> 
> For my mom's 60th birthday my dad gutted a cabinet and installed the upper/lower ovens for her because he didn't like to see her bending all the time with the full range (and she got a new cooktop). And by that time they had something like 15 or so grandchildren so holiday dinners got huge and she needed the second oven.


That's my understanding of gas ranges as well, more responsive, and you can fine-tune the heat to perfection.

Love your dads idea for your mom!


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## Murrmurr (Jan 27, 2021)

Aunt Marg said:


> That's my understanding of gas ranges as well, more responsive, and you can fine-tune the heat to perfection.
> 
> *Love your dads idea for your mom!*


Oh man, she cried for like an hour and then called everyone in Italy.


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## IrisSenior (Jan 27, 2021)

Aunt Marg said:


> Please fill me in on the safety issue related to gas ranges.
> 
> I've never cared for gas myself out of fear of an explosion, etc, but our gas man has assured me that there is no need for me to fear.
> 
> Love the sounds of your planned remodel, Iris!


Much loss of heat: no efficient energy consumption. Cleaning is difficult due to pan supports and *burners*. You cook with an open flame and therefore cooking with *gas* is not the safest way. There are gas appliances that are better - gas water heaters (I have one) are faster to heat than electric and gas dryers dry clothes faster. I just did a google search but remember I just don't like GAS stoves.


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

IrisSenior said:


> Much loss of heat: no efficient energy consumption. Cleaning is difficult due to pan supports and *burners*. You cook with an open flame and therefore cooking with *gas* is not the safest way. There are gas appliances that are better - gas water heaters (I have one) are faster to heat than electric and gas dryers dry clothes faster. I just did a google search but remember I just don't like GAS stoves.


All things for me to carefully consider.

I appreciate all, Iris.


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## MarciKS (Jan 27, 2021)

Aunt Marg said:


> Hoping a few here can provide me with a little guidance and direction on this.
> 
> When it comes to gas ranges and gas cook-tops, I'm at a crossroads of sorts, I definitely want gas in the kitchen this time around, but what to get, a gas cook-top, or a full gas range.
> 
> ...


So are those big gas cooking burners on top or a bunch of little ones? I would definitely go with the ranges.


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

MarciKS said:


> So are those big gas cooking burners on top or a bunch of little ones? I would definitely go with the ranges.


I believe the top picture with the gas cook-top is a mix of 5 burners, and the picture below it, the gas range had 4 burners on the far side, with two more on the right, and then controls for the two ovens.

If I do decide on a gas range, I won't get anything less than a 6 burner range.


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## MarciKS (Jan 27, 2021)

I would definitely go with the bottom one if you do that much cooking. The other one looked like just a stove top. No oven?


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## J.B Books (Jan 27, 2021)

My preference is Gas cook top and electric ovens.

I have a 6 burner cook top and two wall ovens.

Also if you are redoing the whole kitchen, consider two dishwashers!


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

MarciKS said:


> I would definitely go with the bottom one if you do that much cooking. The other one looked like just a stove top. No oven?


Exactly, just a cook-top in the top picture, not oven.


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## J.B Books (Jan 27, 2021)

IrisSenior said:


> Much loss of heat: no efficient energy consumption. Cleaning is difficult due to pan supports and *burners*. You cook with an open flame and therefore cooking with *gas* is not the safest way. There are gas appliances that are better - gas water heaters (I have one) are faster to heat than electric and gas dryers dry clothes faster. I just did a google search but remember I just don't like GAS stoves.


With gas stove top you can regulate the heat much faster. With electric the heat takes a long time to cool or heat up.
Plus the visual of the flame helps me.
I have 20,000 BTU burners


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## MarciKS (Jan 27, 2021)

Aunt Marg said:


> Exactly, just a cook-top in the top picture, not oven.


Do you still like to have that option? Do you still do a lot of cooking? Do you still hope to entertain again?


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## MarciKS (Jan 27, 2021)

J.B Books said:


> With gas stove top you can regulate the heat much faster. With electric the heat takes a long time to cool or heat up.
> Plus the visual of the flame helps me.
> I have 20,000 BTU burners


The only thing I don't like about gas stoves is that it's easier to burn something and a lot quicker to burn. LOL


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

J.B Books said:


> My preference is Gas cook top and electric ovens.
> 
> I have a 6 burner cook top and two wall ovens.
> 
> Also if you are redoing the whole kitchen, consider two dishwashers!


J.B., I'm really steering towards your advice thanks to both you and Ruth n Jersey, suggesting such.

I just love the setup in the first picture with the two ovens built-into the cabinets/wall, and up higher for ease of use.


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

MarciKS said:


> Do you still like to have that option? Do you still do a lot of cooking? Do you still hope to entertain again?


It's an option for now, with my preference definitely steering towards the cook-top with two additional ovens built-in (off to the side) as shown in the first picture.

Not only is it a clean setup, it will allow for more below counter space below.

As for cooking, I do a ton of cooking and baking... always in the kitchen, and as for entertaining, everyone in the family takes turns hosting Christmas Day dinner in their homes, and I'd be thrilled to be able to do two separate dishes at a time, or a turkey in one oven while baking a dessert in the other.

Would afford me options and add to the overall flexibility of my kitchen and time.


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## J.B Books (Jan 27, 2021)

Aunt Marg said:


> J.B., I'm really steering towards your advice thanks to both you and Ruth n Jersey, suggesting such.
> 
> I just love the setup in the first picture with the two ovens built-into the cabinets/wall, and up higher for ease of use.


Electris heat in oven regulates better than gas. 
I love a gas cook top.
You want high heat? Bam! you got it. No waiting for electric elements to heat up.
Too hot? Bam! just turn back the flames. Takes forever for electric to cool down.


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

J.B Books said:


> Electris heat in oven regulates better than gas.
> I love a gas cook top.
> You want high heat? Bam! you got it. No waiting for electric elements to heat up.
> Too hot? Bam! just turn back the flames. Takes forever for electric to cool down.


I agree, that is exactly my experience with such, so easy and quick to fine-tune and tailor to perfection.


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## MarciKS (Jan 27, 2021)

Aunt Marg said:


> It's an option for now, with my preference definitely steering towards the cook-top with two additional ovens built-in (off to the side) as shown in the first picture.
> 
> Not only is it a clean setup, it will allow for more below counter space below.
> 
> ...


Oh I see now. Yes. I didn't see the ovens off to the side at first. I agree that 1st one would be great! More counter space and more cabinet space. Yes!


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

MarciKS said:


> Oh I see now. Yes. I didn't see the ovens off to the side at first. I agree that 1st one would be great! More counter space and more cabinet space. Yes!


Yes, the layout of the first kitchen plan is very modern and sleek, so fresh, and we'll be going with white as well with quartz countertops.


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## MarciKS (Jan 27, 2021)

I hate my kitchen cuz there's no counter space at all.


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

MarciKS said:


> I hate my kitchen cuz there's no counter space at all.


That would drive me batty as well. 

Are you tied to living where you are, or do you have options?


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## Knight (Jan 27, 2021)

Only once did we have electric. As has been mentioned regulating heat is a problem. 

Bought an LG gas oven stove top combo. The ceramic or what ever the stove top material is is a breeze to keep clean. That would be something to check out no matter which brand you choose. 

One feature we thought would be great was an oval shaped center burner. That as a use for cooking is useless. What is convenient ares the two front larger burners, back left a smaller burner, back right an even smaller burner. Those have been used a lot for keeping something warm. 

Then there is professional installation. No worries about gas leaks. Even if a gas leak began gas has an odor put in it.  <---- a safety measure.

Last who ever installs the oven or ovens you chose should turn it on & calibrate the heat. If you set for 350 it should hold heat at 350. 

Last if you chose stainless steel as the surface. Weiman Stainless steel cleaner is a terrific product.


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## J.B Books (Jan 27, 2021)

Aunt Marg said:


> Yes, the layout of the first kitchen plan is very modern and sleek, so fresh, and we'll be going with white as well with quartz countertops.


White is the new fashion statement in kitchens.'
When I remodeled mine a while back I went cherry cabinets, granite counter tops and a light maple hardwood floor for contrast.  I have a very large kitchen. My wife does not cook so the kitchen remodel was for me.


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

Knight said:


> Only once did we have electric. As has been mentioned regulating heat is a problem.
> 
> Bought an LG gas oven stove top combo. The ceramic or what ever the stove top material is is a breeze to keep clean. That would be something to check out no matter which brand you choose.
> 
> ...


Sure do appreciate all, Knight!

I'll be coming back to this thread topic again and again.

I knew I could count on the folks here to get me started on the right foot on this.


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

J.B Books said:


> White is the new fashion statement in kitchens.'
> When I remodeled mine a while back I went cherry cabinets, granite counter tops and a light maple hardwood floor for contrast.  I have a very large kitchen. My wife does not cook so the kitchen remodel was for me.


That sounds lovely!

I love dark cabinetry, but white just talks to me, and I want glass-fronted cupboards, which I think will look really nice in white, especially with interior lighting, and I'm looking at something in the way of nickel or brushed nickel hardware for the pulls/knobs.


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## MarciKS (Jan 27, 2021)

Aunt Marg said:


> That would drive me batty as well.
> 
> Are you tied to living where you are, or do you have options?


No options I can afford and this is the cleanest place I've seen. LOL


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

MarciKS said:


> No options I can afford and this is the cleanest place I've seen. LOL


That's a shame, because being comfortable and happy in ones own place is so important.

You must cook and bake a lot?


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## J.B Books (Jan 27, 2021)

Aunt Marg said:


> That sounds lovely!
> 
> I love dark cabinetry, but white just talks to me, and I want glass-fronted cupboards, which I think will look really nice in white, especially with interior lighting, and I'm looking at something in the way of nickel or brushed nickel hardware for the pulls/knobs.


Fashion is weird. White is the in thing now. Dark was in when I did my kitchen.
My Great Aunt's kitchen from the Late 40's was white glass fronted cupboards with Nickle hardware for knobs.
Fashion repeats itself.
I just hope bell bottoms don't back!

I tried to attach a picture of my island. It has a bone loin I was about to cut up.


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## MarciKS (Jan 27, 2021)

Aunt Marg said:


> That's a shame, because being comfortable and happy in ones own place is so important.
> 
> You must cook and bake a lot?


with no counter space i don't. if i had more to work with i could and would.


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

J.B Books said:


> Fashion is weird. White is the in thing now. Dark was in when I did my kitchen.
> My Great Aunt's kitchen from the Late 40's was white glass fronted cupboards with Nickle hardware for knobs.
> Fashion repeats itself.
> I just hope bell bottoms don't back!


Honestly, I say white, but I may go with a pale yellow or pale green, time will tell.

Yes, it is funny how history and fashion/design goes in and out.

With me I've always had a thing for white, no matter what it is, I just like white, have my entire life.

Gosh, bell-bottoms, I remember having a few pairs of bell-bottoms back in the day, and at the time I remember how fearful I was over them going out of style or wearing out through washing and wear. LOL!


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

MarciKS said:


> with no counter space i don't. if i had more to work with i could and would.


What about the option of a small island on wheels, where you could roll it in and out of the kitchen as needed, but have it pull double-duty outside of kitchen time?


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## MarciKS (Jan 27, 2021)

I will take a couple photos so you can see what I have to work with. BRB


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## MarciKS (Jan 27, 2021)

Keep in mind there's some clutter. Pay no attention to that. LOL!


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## MarciKS (Jan 27, 2021)

As you can see my space is very limited. LOL


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

MarciKS said:


> Keep in mind there's some clutter. Pay no attention to that. LOL!
> View attachment 146575
> View attachment 146576
> View attachment 146577


Boy, you weren't kidding when you said you had no counter space.

What about the option of a tall shelving unit on either side of the stove so you can store the likes of the coffeemaker, microwave, and other kitchen necessities on, helping to free up workable counter space?


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## MarciKS (Jan 27, 2021)

That's the same face I make. LOL


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## MarciKS (Jan 27, 2021)

Aunt Marg said:


> Boy, you weren't kidding when you said you had no counter space.
> 
> What about the option of a tall shelving until for either side of the stove so you can store the likes of the coffeemaker, microwave, and other kitchen necessities on, helping to free up workable counter space?


I am not allowed to hang anything on the walls so it would have to be free standing and out of the way when I open the cabinets and drawers.


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## MarciKS (Jan 27, 2021)

He put that stupid tile up to protect the wall behind the stove so I can't move the fridge back over there plus that interferes with the cabinet and drawer. I don't know what the lady before me did with that mess over there. Good Lord.


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

MarciKS said:


> I am not allowed to hang anything on the walls so it would have to be free standing and out of the way when I open the cabinets and drawers.


What a bummer that is.

I feel for you.

Have you tried approaching the property owner and asking if arrangements could be made for you to hang some shelves on the wall?


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## MarciKS (Jan 27, 2021)

He just painted before I moved in. If I want to hang curtains I'm gonna have to have someone come over so I don't mess up the sills and he specifically asked me not to hang stuff.


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## MarciKS (Jan 27, 2021)

I was allowed to hang 2 or 3 small things but anything more I don't think he'd be agreeable.


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

MarciKS said:


> He put that stupid tile up to protect the wall behind the stove so I can't move the fridge back over there plus that interferes with the cabinet and drawer. I don't know what the lady before me did with that mess over there. Good Lord.


You could get away with a free-standing shelving unit to the left of your stove.

I would look at something at least 6' to 7' in height, with 5 or 6 adjustable shelves on it. It would make a big difference for you.

Paper towels, cleaners, your microwave, toaster, coffeemaker, all could be neatly and conveniently stored away. Would make the cleanup process much easier, too, without all in the way.


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## MarciKS (Jan 27, 2021)

I could but the plug in of course is on the right. LOL

I don't know who designs this crap but they need to put a little more thought into placement. LOL


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

MarciKS said:


> I was allowed to hang 2 or 3 small things but anything more I don't think he'd be agreeable.


That's a shame.

You know, you could always approach him while using a little psychology, and tell him, I'm going to hang such and such, and if I move out, I'll putty and paint before I go.

Never hurts to ask.


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

MarciKS said:


> I could but the plug in of course is on the right. LOL
> 
> I don't know who designs this crap but they need to put a little more thought into placement. LOL


I agree, it's not at all designed well. 

There's zero cupboard space beside or above the fridge, and the fridge shouldn't be where it is anyway.


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## Oris Borloff (Jan 27, 2021)

MarciKS said:


> As you can see my space is very limited. LOL


I don't know if this will make you feel any better in case misery really does love company, but my kitchen is so bad I can't fully open the refrigerator door because it hits the front of the stove.  There is literally no room to move things around without  completely gutting the kitchen and starting over and that would only gain getting full access to the refrigerator  possible.  

I second  the notion of using rolling work station and shelving.  We have several wire shelving units on wheels and it helps out a lot.


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## MarciKS (Jan 27, 2021)

Oris Borloff said:


> I don't know if this will make you feel any better in case misery really does love company, but my kitchen is so bad I can't fully open the refrigerator door because it hits the front of the stove.  There is literally no room to move things around without  completely gutting the kitchen and starting over and that would only gain getting full access to the refrigerator  possible.
> 
> I second  the notion of using rolling work station and shelving.  We have several wire shelving units on wheels and it helps out a lot.


OMG LOL! I've lived in places like that in the past.


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## Dana (Jan 27, 2021)

MarciKS said:


> Keep in mind there's some clutter. Pay no attention to that. LOL!
> View attachment 146575
> View attachment 146576
> View attachment 146577



From a nosy Aussie - first up, declutter and magically you will find a lot of space will emerge.  That corner space next to the fridge can house a couple of small fold up tables. Free standing vegetable racks can also be used as storage.   Good luck MarciKS


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## MarciKS (Jan 27, 2021)

Dana said:


> From a nosy Aussie - first up, declutter and magically you will find a lot of space will emerge.  That corner space next to the fridge can house a couple of small fold up tables. Free standing vegetable racks can also be used as storage.   Good luck MarciKS


It will block the back door though.


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## Dana (Jan 27, 2021)

MarciKS said:


> It will block the back door though.



Apologies, I should have explained more fully. Keep tables folded. When needed as a work station, pull out. Just a suggestion


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## MarciKS (Jan 27, 2021)

i have some extra folding tables downstairs. good idea. ty.


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## Jules (Jan 27, 2021)

Aunt Marg said:


> As for spill-overs, etc with the glass-top stoves, I can only imagine how easy it is to clean up.


Easier for the basic wipe up.  If something blows on top of a hot burner, it’s still a mess.  Someone mentioned Weismann cleaner.  It’s excellent. 


Aunt Marg said:


> With me I've always had a thing for white, no matter what it is, I just like white, have my entire life.


Me too.  All my walls are white.  After white cabinets, no thanks to wiping them off continually.  Any little spot shows.  

I admit to having lots & lots opinions on kitchens.  Too much HGTV.  We all have different desires.  

Have you checked out the price of a 6 burner gas stove top?  Ouch.  Also, there are varying heat levels for burners - gas or electric.  

As you’ve said, you’re just starting out.  I’ll try not to be opinionated as we all have different needs and desires.  

Now, if you or I were redoing a bathroom, I’d have heated floors and towel racks.  Ah, decadence.


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## peramangkelder (Jan 27, 2021)

@Aunt Marg if you have always wanted 2 gas ranges then when you remodel your kitchen you should have your 'druthers 
You do a lot of cooking and you also enjoy cooking....unfortunately I do not but that is another story
When you remodel your kitchen if you only put 1 gas range in you will always look in and think I should have gone for 2 ranges
Maybe find a computer program where you can put your kitchen dimensions in and add the 2 gas ranges and cupboard finishes and even floor coverings and lighting but don't forget to include a teeny Aunt Marg  
When I was looking into kitchen renos the thing I kept reading was to have the range, the fridge and benchtop/s as a 'triangle'
One triangle point is your range, the second triangle point is your fridge and the third triangle point are benchtop/s
The kitchen triangle is a way of making the shortest distance between large kitchen appliances....works for me


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

Jules said:


> Easier for the basic wipe up.  If something blows on top of a hot burner, it’s still a mess.  Someone mentioned Weismann cleaner.  It’s excellent.
> 
> Me too.  All my walls are white.  After white cabinets, no thanks to wiping them off continually.  Any little spot shows.
> 
> ...


That's one nice thing to seeing our kids raised and gone, is I don't have to work hard at keeping things clean and shiny anymore, but right you are, white shows soiling.

Indeed I have checked out 6 burner gas ranges, and yes, ouch, is right.

It's been nice hearing everyone take on the matter, their likes, their dislikes, what works for them now, what's worked for them in the past, it's a learning experience for me and I love every minute of it.

Heated bathroom floor, absolutely, towel rack included.


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 27, 2021)

peramangkelder said:


> @Aunt Marg if you have always wanted 2 gas ranges then when you remodel your kitchen you should have your 'druthers
> You do a lot of cooking and you also enjoy cooking....unfortunately I do not but that is another story
> When you remodel your kitchen if you only put 1 gas range in you will always look in and think I should have gone for 2 ranges
> Maybe find a computer program where you can put your kitchen dimensions in and add the 2 gas ranges and cupboard finishes and even floor coverings and lighting but don't forget to include a teeny Aunt Marg
> ...


I love your way of thinking, Peram! 

I couldn't agree with you more, after the fact is too late to ruminate about the double or single option.

There's a few local custom cabinetmakers that specialize in kitchen, bathroom, and walk-in master closet cabinetry (and everything in-between), and we've already visited one such cabinetmaker already, and he said when the time comes, he would pop over, measure out our kitchen, and even put together a few workable plans for us, and we couldn't be happier with such an arrangement.

I remember the triangle layout, can't remember where I recall learning about it... I'm thinking on one of those HGTV television shows, but thankfully our current layout already has the triangle thing going on, so that in itself is a blessing, as we won't have to re-plumb the kitchen.

Lighting is a different matter, we're definitely going to have to update the lighting in our kitchen, and of course that will be a whole other process. I have a few ideas already, but boy, has lighting ever evolved.

So very nice hearing from you.


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