# Disturbing Phone Call



## oldman (Aug 11, 2014)

This afternoon I received a phone call from a very close friend of mine and my wife, who along with his wife have been socializing together for years. I am writing on this forum because he does not belong to Senior Forums or does he know my moniker. He was speaking very slowly and so low that I could hardly hear him. Some time ago, he told me that he had been suspicious of his wife cheating on him. He had told me this also again about a month a go and at first I told him he was off base, but he was insistent and said that he was going to find out. He asked me if I knew of a way he could find out what she was typing on the computer because he suspected his wife of trading e-mails with the other man. I told him that there is a device called a key logger and he may be able to buy one at Radio Shack and if not, perhaps, they could lead him to one.

Well, today he called me and said he was right that his wife was having an affair, but asked me not to tell anyone, including my wife. And, of course, he asked me for advice. I told him that I didn't want to be involved in this, but because he was my friend, I thought his best place to start is with a therapist and to go from there. He was so hurt and said that he felt that he had been hit by a ton of bricks and that his life was over. I told him to take it one step at a time and start with the therapist and then proceed from there. They have been married 49 years. Two years longer than my wife and me. Do people this old have affairs? I mean, he has given her everything, including love, a beautiful home, new cars (Lexus's) and so on.

Originally, he asked me if I would go for a ride with him in the morning, so we could talk. I said OK, but then 10 minutes later he called me back and asked me if I would meet him at 9:00 p.m. tonight at the club he and I belong to and talk there. I agreed, but wish that I hadn't. My wife is suspicious and now I will probably end up in the doghouse, but he is my friend and this is what friends do for one another.  

Have any of you ever been in a similar situation and if you have, what's the best advice to give and how do these things usually turn out? He is 71 and she is 70 and will be 71 later this year. I wouldn't think a divorce is imminent, but who knows what the outcome will be? I mean 71 years old and having an affair? Really, people do this at that age? Is it for sex? Nah, that doesn't sound logical. 

Thanks for any guidance because I am at a loss here and dumbfounded.


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## Warrigal (Aug 11, 2014)

My guess is that something in his wife's life has been unfulfilled for a very long time and that she has suppressed it. 
It is not his fault and the best thing that they could do, even at their age, is to see a marriage counsellor and talk it out.


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## SeaBreeze (Aug 11, 2014)

Never been in a similar situation, but I think it's good that you're going to talk to him.  I'm sure he needs a friend right now.  I'd tell him you can't keep a secret like this from your wife, and hopefully she will stay quiet until he works things out.  Young or old, many times affairs are not about sex, but just about getting attention from someone who seems to be caring.  Good luck, maybe they can work things out.  After so many years, people can be forgiving with each other.


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## GeorgiaXplant (Aug 11, 2014)

For starters, don't say "I understand how you must feel"!

I think in your shoes I'd keep pushing him to get counseling, but other than that offer no advice. It could come back to bite you in the arse, not to mention that you can hardly be an objective third party. A counselor can guide him in his next steps...confrontation? joint counseling? 

Affair? Holy cow. Who on earth would throw away 49 years of marriage, 49 years of history? If they had kids, they're probably grown and have kids of their own...what's this going to do to their whole family?

If he's sworn you to secrecy and you can't bring it up with your wife, where does that leave you when she eventually learns about it? He's kind of put you behind the eight ball, on the one hand, but on the other, you're friends so who else would he turn to?

What a mess! Counseling. Insist that he get counseling. Maybe his pastor? Or he could ask his family doctor for a referral?


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## Ina (Aug 11, 2014)

It's not right, but maybe she just wanted to feel young one more time, and she couldn't feel that way with her husband anymore. Sounds like they had stopped sharing.


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## SifuPhil (Aug 11, 2014)

SeaBreeze said:


> ...  Young or old, many times affairs are not about sex, but just about getting attention from someone who seems to be caring...



/\/\/\ This. I believe they often refer to them as "emotional affairs". 



GeorgiaXplant said:


> ... Maybe his pastor? ...



Just personal opinion, but to me that seems like going to a nun for advice on becoming a stripper. Other than that I agree with all of your points.

Oldman, I'd be careful about reaching out too far to help your friend, especially as regards not telling your wife. Friendship is just that - friendship - not a mutual suicide pact. You have to live with your _wife_, not with _him_. Any help rendered should be done so from a firm and well-thought-out basis. 

It might seem cruel and uncaring. The same could be said of drowning people that attempt to drag down their rescuers. You just have to be prepared to defend yourself so you don't get dragged down as well.


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## SeaBreeze (Aug 11, 2014)

I agree with Phil about telling your wife.  I know that I would have to tell my husband something like that, and just ask him to keep it under wraps.  Also agree, that not everyone needs a counselor, sometimes just having a candid discussion with your spouse will bring things out into the open, and sometimes a minor problem can be worked on and overcome.


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## charlotta (Aug 11, 2014)

Stop!  Take a deep breath.  I don't believe she is having an affair.  But anyway, anyhow, don't tell anybody else, not even your wife.  If your wife  finds out, let her know you weren't  sure of what was really happening.  He may have had a minor stroke, or something.  You don't really know if she is really stepping out or what. Just listen to him and tell him if it was happening to you, you would go to a counselor.  Don't tell him to follow her, or offer any suggestions that way.  I may be wrong, but I would just let him vent and stay out of it.  Is it unusual for 
you guys to go to the club, just you and friend, to have a round of golf or a beer?


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## oldman (Aug 12, 2014)

I spent two and a half hours with him last night. He was very grief stricken. Almost like someone had died. My wife and I always thought they were a loving couple. She certainly didn't want for anything. He said he asked her why and her answer was that they just began talking at their place of employment, (She works part time at a Walgreens.), and then they began taking their breaks together and by doing that they found out that they had so much in common. Her and her husband, which is a very good friend of mine, do not have a lot in common. In fact, they go their separate ways quite often. He goes on expensive hunting trips 3 or 4 times a year and she likes staying home and volunteering, going to bingo and spending time with her children. So, she said that one thing lead to another and this was the result, a full blown affair. 

I asked him if he considered speaking with his pastor or going to counselling. He said the only counselling that he is going to is the one with his lawyer. Unfortunately, I believe he will end the marriage. The family will be torn apart because as I have been told by others that have gone through similar situations, their grown children and the rest of the members of the family will choose sides. 

There just isn't anything I can do. He really wasn't asking for advice. He just wanted someone to talk to. I told him last night that I will need to speak with my wife because she is good fiends with his wife and if my wife finds out that I was holding back on her, she may take offense to it even though I was protecting the confidentiality of my friend. 

I am in a lose-lose situation.


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## JustBonee (Aug 12, 2014)

If you chose to keep it to yourself, you would be party to the situation, and guilty by association in the end. 

And ..it could be that your wife already knows. .. get it out in the open at _your _house.


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## ClassicRockr (Aug 12, 2014)

This is why wife and I don't get involved with situations like this (you last statement I put in red). Friend or not, we just don't do it........well, sort of not, will explain in my next reply.




oldman said:


> I spent two and a half hours with him last night. He was very grief stricken. Almost like someone had died. My wife and I always thought they were a loving couple. She certainly didn't want for anything. He said he asked her why and her answer was that they just began talking at their place of employment, (She works part time at a Walgreens.), and then they began taking their breaks together and by doing that they found out that they had so much in common. Her and her husband, which is a very good friend of mine, do not have a lot in common. In fact, they go their separate ways quite often. He goes on expensive hunting trips 3 or 4 times a year and she likes staying home and volunteering, going to bingo and spending time with her children. So, she said that one thing lead to another and this was the result, a full blown affair. I asked him if he considered speaking with his pastor or going to counselling. He said the only counselling that he is going to is the one with his lawyer. Unfortunately, I believe he will end the marriage. The family will be torn apart because as I have been told by others that have gone through similar situations, their grown children and the rest of the members of the family will choose sides. There just isn't anything I can do. He really wasn't asking for advice. He just wanted someone to talk to. I told him last night that I will need to speak with my wife because she is good fiends with his wife and if my wife finds out that I was holding back on her, she may take offense to it even though I was protecting the confidentiality of my friend.
> 
> I am in a lose-lose situation.


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## ClassicRockr (Aug 12, 2014)

My wife's girlfriend, with whom she graduated from high school with and they done many things together during the years before graduation, was pretty sure her husband was having an affair. They met just after he returned from Viet Nam in the mid 70's. Anyway, As she got older, and their two boys left the nest, she really didn't like Michigan winters and would go down to their second home in Florida. At the time, her husband was still working a full-time job, so he didn't go. There were times that they really didn't spend much time together......at least that's what we understand. So, back in 2008, while we were on a business trip to Michigan and visiting them, she secretly told us that she thought he was having an affair. We were at a casino in Detroit and his cell phone rang. He told us, "I can't hear, I'm going to the restroom". She said, "there he goes again". She didn't really talk to us about it, just sort of laughed it off. To this day, we don't know if he had had an affair or not, or still is. He's is fully retired now, so they do spend more time together.

Now, the *KICKER *to the above story.........We got a Living Will in the mail from her and read it. She is not leaving anything to him, all goes to her sons. She told us in a letter, that came with the legal Will, "please don't say anything about this to him". So, we haven't and won't. The Will is in our Safe Deposit Box at the bank. 

I told my wife, "this is the only thing we are getting involved with" (the Will). Funny, wife's girlfriend never once asked my wife or both of us, for help/advice.


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## SeaBreeze (Aug 12, 2014)

It's a shame they will divorce after so many years, I hope he doesn't fall into a deep depression and do something like end his life.  After long term relationships like that, these things happen.  Good you went to talk to him Oldman, and good you made it clear that you wouldn't keep the news from your wife.  You did all you can, and acted as a good friend.


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## Denise1952 (Aug 12, 2014)

I thought your advice was very good, talk to someone who deals with these things, studies them etc.  I think folks can "wander" in later stages of life, yes.  The world is always enticing us through television, internet, and just other people, pier pressure, to make other choices.  I believe wrong choices, unless there is terrible abuse, and then, I don't think we should seek out another mate to "fix" it.  

I could sure fill the wandering wife in on online-dating, yuck  Of course, offline meetings can be just as bad.  No advice from me here, I can barely manage my own issues, but being his friend means being honest about your thoughts, or maybe just listening, someone for him to talk to.  Maybe you could explain to him that you and your wife share these things, and you don't want to break your "best friend" status with her by hiding things.

Hugs OM, glad to shared with us, it might just help to be able to talk to others as well. Denise


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## Denise1952 (Aug 12, 2014)

SeaBreeze said:


> It's a shame they will divorce after so many years, I hope he doesn't fall into a deep depression and do something like end his life.  After long term relationships like that, these things happen.  Good you went to talk to him Oldman, and good you made it clear that you wouldn't keep the news from your wife.  You did all you can, and acted as a good friend.



Oh, I missed that part I guess about OM not being willing to keep secrets from his wife, good for you OM!!


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## SifuPhil (Aug 12, 2014)

Oldman, as to the reference that the "family will be torn apart" - I would assume that the children mentioned are all adults. Far better that way, than to have children directly involved. 

That's at least _one_ silver lining in the cloud ... 

Many people seem to think that staying in a marriage, no matter how awful, is always the right thing to do. 

Far from it.

Why spend the rest of your days with someone you loathe and despise, just to keep up "the family"? If they really care for you they'll want you to be happy, whether in or out of a marriage. Those who will despise you ... well, they're showing their true colors at last, and you're better off for it.


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## Denise1952 (Aug 12, 2014)

I've heard too many people say that they just grew apart, or "I'm just not in love anymore".  I don't think those are reasons to divorce, or get in an affair with some Prince/Princess to supposedly put the romance in your life.  Marriage is work, I think too many take the easy way out thinking they will do better elsewhere.  Maybe they feel the do, but when you have a history of loving times, I think you can recapture that if you are willing to work at it.


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## oldman (Aug 12, 2014)

I spoke with my wife just a short time ago and she was shocked. The first thing out of her mouth was, "I can't believe that she didn't say anything to me. We share most everything, except what goes on in our own homes." My friend called me earlier today and said that he is going to take my suggestion and speak with a counselor. His appointment with the counselor is for later today and his appointment with his attorney is on Friday. I did ask him if his wife seemed remorseful and was willing to break it off. He said they really haven't discussed anything yet because he is in a fog and just can't think rationally. I said maybe you shouldn't make any decision before you are able to think clearly and at least talk about this between the two of you before you make any decisions. He said she keeps wanting to talk about "things", but he told her he just can't yet. He's a mess and he said he wants to get together with me after he speaks with the counselor. I knew that he would keep me  involved in this. I told my wife that all I can do at this point is be a good listener and I do not intend to give advice about something I have no knowledge of. So, now, I have started reading about affairs on the internet.

I just can't seem to get past the fact of their ages, the number of years that they have been together and what the both of them are about to lose, if they divorce. I think the ages thing really has me confused. I never knew people had ****** affairs at 71 years of age. I am just so taken back by this. I mean, 71, are they nuts???


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## SifuPhil (Aug 12, 2014)

Depends how you look at marriage.

Most humans are progressive beings; it doesn't suit us to live in the past by attempting to preserve something that is gone. You can't live on memories.

At the same time, there's no excuse (other than the thrill, a dubious excuse at best) for an affair. If you think your marriage is over, do the right thing and get that divorce BEFORE you go playing around. Allow your partner some respect.

ETA: Oldman, I know a 70's+ affair is a relative rarity but I believe they DO happen, more than either of us knows.


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## Denise1952 (Aug 12, 2014)

People get used to having someone so they want a replacement before they let go of the "trade in".  Most people I know look for that, if they find what they think is better, they go for it, otherwise, they don't seem to have the courage to be on their own.

I agree Phil, it is the the "right" way, if you are going to do it, leave a marriage, or relationship of any kind.  IMO.  Also, people you exchange online romances with, letters, texts, phonecalls, turn out to be very different most of the time, then you have them built up to be.  I do speak from experience on that.  All that "seems" so beautiful and shiney, rarely turns out to be anything good for us.


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## SifuPhil (Aug 12, 2014)

Very true. 

It's like buying one of those cake mixes in a box. The picture on the cover shows this incredibly beautiful cake, but when you finish putting everything together and baking it it looks like someone sat on it. 

And tastes the same way.

Packaging is one thing ... the contents, something totally different. And unless you're an experienced chef, you can't make a wedding cake out of a cinnamon bun.


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## Happyflowerlady (Aug 12, 2014)

Dame Warrigal said:


> My guess is that something in his wife's life has been unfulfilled for a very long time and that she has suppressed it.
> It is not his fault and the best thing that they could do, even at their age, is to see a marriage counsellor and talk it out.



I agree with Warri on this. I think that there has been something she was missing in the relationship, and she either tried to tell him, and it didn't get through to him clearly enough; or she just kept everything stuffed inside and tried to hold on to what little parts of the marriage they still had left. 
If their interests were all that different, there was probably just not a lot of enjoyable little conversations together, and sometimes, it is those small everyday things that keep us close to someone. 

My first marriage was pretty wild, and maybe best to be over; but even through the fights; we always enjoyed our morning coffee together, and we could talk about anything in the whole world together and share our thoughts and feelings. 
I really miss those wonderful little chats we used to have. Bobby treats me really well, but we like different things, and he is not open to hearing different opinions than his own; so we just never really talk about much besides the weather, and stuff like that.


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## Shirley (Aug 12, 2014)

A woman needs romance. That's why romantic novels are a multi-trillion dollar business. Doesn't matter who she is, how old she is, how rich or poor she is. It's not about sex, either. It's the feeling that she is the most important thing in the world to him but it's more than that. He can pick a blue wildflower, give it to her and say, "It made me think of the blue in your eyes."  Or a rose from her favorite bush and say, "It matches the roses in your cheeks."   Write her a sweet note and put it where she will find it. Things like that mean a lot to her. 

Men, when was the last time you picked a flower for your wife? Try it. She will love you for it.


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## Fern (Aug 12, 2014)

Oldman you have been put in a horrible situation but this happens when we have good friends. I believe you are handling it well by not getting too involved but being there as a good listener. You did the right thing by telling your wife.


> He said she keeps wanting to talk about "things"


The fact that she wants to talk may indicate that their marriage is not at an end.


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## SeaBreeze (Aug 12, 2014)

Oldman, I agree with Fern that you're handling it the best way possible.  I also agree that your friend needs to talk with his wife, and get everything clear about her wants and intentions.  She may be willing to break it off, if there are some changes made in the marriage...or she may be ready to part ways with him too.  Either way, he's better knowing what the facts are and having some conversations with her.


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## oldman (Aug 13, 2014)

My friend told me last evening that his wife told him that she will break it off and that she still wants him in her life. He also said the therapist told him that if she tells you that she will break it off and there was no love involved, he recommends two things. One is that she tells him through a telephone call while he is listening to her tell him that she was weak and never loved him, that she was only looking for her feelings to be nurtured and validated and two; she has to change jobs. 

My friend said that he is going to tell her these things this morning, but even if she agrees, he isn't sure he wants to stay with her. I told him to go slow and make sure he knows what he wants.


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## GeorgiaXplant (Aug 13, 2014)

I hope he doesn't throw the baby out with the bath water! Forty-nine years of history is a lot to give up. To err is human; to forgive, divine...

And here's something that I just thought of...if she's been missing something in her marriage for 49 years and hasn't made her feelings--or lack thereof--known, she REALLY needs counseling. None of us are mind readers. He can't be expected to provide something if he has no idea that there's anything wrong.


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## SifuPhil (Aug 13, 2014)

Shirley said:


> ... Men, when was the last time you picked a flower for your wife? Try it. She will love you for it.



The last time I did that I mistakenly picked poison oak and told her it reminded me of the green between her teeth.


... I'm divorced now ...


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## Twixie (Aug 14, 2014)

Oldman..the first thing you must do is tell your wife...she should be your main priority, friends come second.
If you keep mysteriously disappearing without explanation or are fibbing about where you are going,and she finds out, she may think you are up to something!!
I have been used as a sounding board in a similar situation...the couple eventually got back together and she told him what I had said about the situation, so in one foul swoop I lost both their friendships..

It can come back and bite *you* on the bum!!


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## Warrigal (Aug 14, 2014)

Twixie is 100% correct. Listen by all means but don't take sides and don't say anything against either party. Don't break confidence by repeating anything that you have been told. If you can't do this, back out now if you value your friendships.


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## Twixie (Aug 14, 2014)

I found that after the person had told me so many intimate things about their lives together...when they got back together she were embarrassed at having confided in me..
I tried to be a good friend..she would ring me up sobbing at 3 am..I listened to her...

You must be beware...


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## Bettyann (Aug 16, 2014)

As the old saying goes "The heart is a lonely hunter" ... and I really don't think "age" has that much to do with anything. I am sorry for everyone in this situation...including the predicament YOU are in, OM ... Just please DO tell your wife... YOU also need support now!... not just your friend.
As far as 'why would anybody want to throw away 49 years of marriage'... who knows...and who can REALLY judge... no one should. None of us, besides OM, really knows the people involved. I agree that he SHOULD get counseling and NO (agree with SiFuPhil--NOT a preacher or priest!)... but an objective non-attached to the situation, counselor/therapist. 
Basically, OM, you need to take care of YOU...and don't think its 'selfish' to think that way. It is NOT your problem and you have got to remember this (yes, I can hear all the arguments  ) .... do what you can as long as you can. Just remember you can't help anyone if you jump into the drowning pool. I wish you ALL the best. Please tell your wife.


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## hollydolly (Aug 17, 2014)

Twixie said:


> I found that after the person had told me so many intimate things about their lives together...when they got back together she were embarrassed at having confided in me..
> I tried to be a good friend..she would ring me up sobbing at 3 am..I listened to her...
> 
> You must be beware...



Exactly , I have had the same thing happen...never again!!


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## oldman (Aug 28, 2014)

For anyone that was following this topic, I just wanted to let all of you know that my friend has filed and served his wife with divorce papers yesterday. He also has asked he to leave the house by the weekend.


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## SeaBreeze (Aug 28, 2014)

Thanks for the update oldman, your friend knows best what decisions must be made for him.  I hope he can find some peace, and maybe another lady friend to help him over the hurt.  Wishing him the best, and he's lucky to have a friend like you.


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## SifuPhil (Aug 28, 2014)

As much as it probably hurts, it's good that there's a sort of resolution. Thanks, Oldman.


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## GeorgiaXplant (Sep 1, 2014)

I only just saw this new development today. Can't blame him for kicking her to the curb, so to speak. If she felt "unfulfilled" for whatever reason and wanted something "more", she should have left the marriage before taking up with someone else. I, too, hope that he finds some peace and is able to get past the hurt.


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