# Election Year - real estate values



## needshave (Oct 13, 2020)

2020 has been a difficult year at best. With the pandemic rumored to still be spiking in areas and possibly making a return visit, plus the upcoming presidential election, how will all of this impact real estate sales and values. What if you are ready to sell, will the value of your property be impacted? Is it not the time to sell, instead just hold onto it for after the election and the honeymoon period? What about commercial properties, the same? Its a concern,Your thoughts appreciated.


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## mathjak107 (Oct 14, 2020)

real estate is way to localized to really say


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## StarSong (Oct 14, 2020)

Attempting to precisely time any market is usually a fool's errand.  If you're ready to sell and you think you can get a good price, then sell.  Nobody knows what tomorrow will bring.


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## Aneeda72 (Oct 14, 2020)

If you are wanting to buy investment property, Utah is the place.  The real estate market is still going up and no end in sight.  Our house has increased 17% since we bought it and more than that since we got it on a low bid.  The flipper had too many projects going on.


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## asp3 (Oct 14, 2020)

Here in the San Francisco bay area rents and property values are going down because people are now allowed to work from home wherever that is.  I know Twitter decided that their employees can now be permanently working from home so some of them are moving out of the high cost San Francisco area where they have a big Twitter office and moving to lower cost regions.

So some areas are seeing an influx of people with higher salaries than those in the area and those areas are seeing their rents and property values going up.

Other factors are the damage and destruction that has happened from the fires in California and from the Hurricanes that have happened.  The fires in California have kept up the prices in some areas as people need to find new places to live in the areas where they used to reside.

You need to determine what the current state is doing to your region and go from there.


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## asp3 (Oct 14, 2020)

I also forgot to include the affect of Covid-19 on vacation and tourist areas.  Some of them are going to be depressed for quite a long time even after we get back to more normal travel availability.  Some people are not going to be able to afford travel even if it is safe, so there won't be money going into areas with large numbers of outside tourists coming in.  I think of places like Hawaii, Florida, NYC and other areas will be down for a while.


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## JimBob1952 (Oct 14, 2020)

Suburban real estate is booming where I live.  The main reason is that no one wants to stay downtown with all the BLM/Antifa crazies, the graffiti, and the ugly stumps of torn-down statues. 

There are probably some great bargains for patient investors in the beautiful historic districts within the city limits.


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## JimBob1952 (Oct 14, 2020)

asp3 said:


> I also forgot to include the affect of Covid-19 on vacation and tourist areas.  Some of them are going to be depressed for quite a long time even after we get back to more normal travel availability.  Some people are not going to be able to afford travel even if it is safe, so there won't be money going into areas with large numbers of outside tourists coming in.  I think of places like Hawaii, Florida, NYC and other areas will be down for a while.



Florida is doing well.   People from the Northeast are establishing permanent residence there to escape the crushing state income and local property taxes.  

NYC, not so well, and it's going to be a while.  It will eventually come back, however.


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## asp3 (Oct 14, 2020)

JimBob1952 said:


> Florida is doing well.   People from the Northeast are establishing permanent residence there to escape the crushing state income and local property taxes.
> 
> NYC, not so well, and it's going to be a while.  It will eventually come back, however.



Thank you for the correction.

Looks like my speculation regarding Florida was wrong.  I think it's economy is less driven by tourism than I thought it was.  There are several articles I found saying that the Florida real estate market is booming these days.


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## Aneeda72 (Oct 14, 2020)

asp3 said:


> Thank you for the correction.
> 
> Looks like my speculation regarding Florida was wrong.  I think it's economy is less driven by tourism than I thought it was.  There are several articles I found saying that the Florida real estate market is booming these days.


Well, New Yorkers have to love somewhere


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## StarSong (Oct 15, 2020)

Most NYers love NY.  It's such an exciting city.  
When this pandemic is past the rents and prices in the five boroughs will zoom back up.  I'd guess it's going to be a short window buying opportunity for NYers.

Yes, Florida is booming right now.  Several of my friends have retired there to escape high NJ taxes and northern winters.


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## mathjak107 (Oct 16, 2020)

you have to remember that nyc rental markets have more then 1/2 the rentals stabilized so they set the floor for rentals ... those apartments outside of stabilization are not cutting rents since stabilized rents will not fall lower .

the new laws our idiot politicians put in place hurt landlords so once a stabilized rent is temporarily lowered that becomes the new base . you can't ever bring the rent back to what it was and then get the yearly increase .

that lowered rent becomes the base and all increases forever are on the lower amount .

we are seeing a months free rent advertised , but not rent decreases for the most part .

homes are still selling since the areas most who can afford homes in nyc are slim so demand is still high .

the co-op we were originally interested in which is down the block is going for more than last year .

the supply of nice homes is very low after all the buying we saw ...my son sold his scarsdale home in two days and had a bidding war on it ... the home he bought was sold to him the day it came out .


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## StarSong (Oct 16, 2020)

@mathjak107, thank you for the inside scoop on NY rentals and how the landlords get through down periods without creating long-term damage to their bottom lines.   Sure explains the advantage of offering a free month or two over lower rent.  

A given area's real estate markets and rental are often much more complex than they appear to an outsider. 

Houses here also sell within days - many are gone even before they hit the listings. For the past few years when a local house lingers for 10 days without a Sold, In Escrow or Offer Pending sign we wonder what's going on. Presumption is that it's either overpriced or has serious problems.

Don't you think these rapid sales are at least partly due to Zillow.com, Realtor.com and other websites?  Potential buyers do a lot of internet sifting and shopping before buying.  They can get interior photos, drone photos/videos, and very specific descriptions from the comfort of their own homes.


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## Liberty (Oct 16, 2020)

asp3 said:


> Thank you for the correction.
> 
> Looks like my speculation regarding Florida was wrong.  I think it's economy is less driven by tourism than I thought it was.  There are several articles I found saying that the Florida real estate market is booming these days.


Florida is driven by retirees with money who don't want to spend half of their life "behind closed doors", suffering through brutal winters.
What's not to like about beach, sand and sun during the winters?


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## CarolfromTX (Oct 16, 2020)

Houses here are selling like hotcakes.


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## Liberty (Oct 16, 2020)

CarolfromTX said:


> Houses here are selling like hotcakes.


That's what I've heard about this area too Carol.


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## Ken N Tx (Oct 17, 2020)

CarolfromTX said:


> Houses here are selling like hotcakes.





Liberty said:


> That's what I've heard about this area too Carol.


Same here....


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## Gary O' (Oct 17, 2020)

CarolfromTX said:


> Houses here are selling like hotcakes.


Same here

Low interest (less than 3%) has to be a factor


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## Liberty (Oct 17, 2020)

Guess if you had planned on moving a couple years, it might be  time to 
do it now, instead.


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## needshave (Oct 17, 2020)

Unfortunately, I have a difficult task. A family member passed and the family wants to sell house and commercial property so I'm trying to prepare to sell both, But I'm two and 1/2 hours away, so travel time and other requirements is probably going to place the properties availability to sell well after the first of the year, So my concerns are with what the  property value impact will be after the election and if this pandemic every lifts. In Ohio Covid is starting to spike again. I have the option of seeing properties as is, but of course no one wants to do that.


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## StarSong (Oct 17, 2020)

needshave said:


> Unfortunately, I have a difficult task. A family member passed and the family wants to sell house and commercial property so I'm trying to prepare to sell both, But I'm two and 1/2 hours away, so travel time and other requirements is probably going to place the properties availability to sell well after the first of the year, So my concerns are with what the  property value impact will be after the election and if this pandemic every lifts. In Ohio Covid is starting to spike again. I have the option of seeing properties as is, but of course no one wants to do that.


Are you the executor?


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## Aunt Bea (Oct 17, 2020)

I agree with others that the current low-interest rates should help to broaden the market and support a higher selling price for an attractive property.

IMO you need to balance the selling price with the monthly carrying costs to maintain the property.

Sometimes it's better to accept a lower sales price to stop the ongoing monthly expenses and the lost opportunity to reinvest the proceeds of the sale.

The hardest part may be keeping all of the relatives and armchair quarterbacks in the family happy.

Good luck!


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## Butterfly (Oct 17, 2020)

Liberty said:


> Florida is driven by retirees with money who don't want to spend half of their life "behind closed doors", suffering through brutal winters.
> What's not to like about beach, sand and sun during the winters?



Hurricanes and humidity.


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## mathjak107 (Oct 17, 2020)

We were once going to move to florida ...one summer time at my dads there cured that thought


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## Liberty (Oct 18, 2020)

Butterfly said:


> Hurricanes and humidity.


Way better than half your life every year suffering a" life indoors brutal winter" or wearing 3 or 4 layers of clothes, shoveling snow or trying to drive in it.  Been there and done that for too many years.  Like mom said "you get used to hanging if you hang long enough though, huh...lol.


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## StarSong (Oct 18, 2020)

Butterfly said:


> Hurricanes and humidity.


Spoken like a woman who knows the glories of The Land of Enchantment.  (I have friends in Las Cruces.  DH & I fell in love with NM during our very first trip there; our affection has only deepened during subsequent visits.)


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## StarSong (Oct 18, 2020)

Florida is lovely to visit but I couldn't live there.  The humidity and bugs would be enough to put me off, but gators, crocs, all manner of snakes, plus tons of other creepy crawlies make it a total deal breaker for me.  

That said, I do love visiting friends there during springtime.


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## OneEyedDiva (Oct 19, 2020)

@mathjak107 & @StarSong  NYC used to be a nice place to visit...haven't been in quite awhile, but I never would want to live there. The rents in decent areas are just ridiculous. Apartment.com has some studios listed as high as $3,704 and 1 bedrooms with 1 bath as high as $5,722. I only saw one studio for $1,100 and the rest were several hundred dollars more, many in the $2,000 range.


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## mathjak107 (Oct 19, 2020)

OneEyedDiva said:


> @mathjak107 & @StarSong  NYC used to be a nice place to visit...haven't been in quite awhile, but I never would want to live there. The rents in decent areas are just ridiculous. Apartment.com has some studios listed as high as $3,704 and 1 bedrooms with 1 bath as high as $5,722. I only saw one studio for $1,100 and the rest was several hundred dollars more, many in the $2,000 range.


The boroughs are far cheaper then manhattan ...we are in a lovely area in queens called bay terrace ..you can rent a nice 2 bedroom 2 bath apartment for 2500 .00.

we can take the train and be in midtown manhattan in 30 minutes or so


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## WhatInThe (Nov 1, 2020)

As the old saying goes 'location location location' along with 'timing is everything'

It's about the market as well although keep in these stimulus packages costing trillions will eventually have to be paid for. And many markets were already on the cusp of bubble prior to the virus because their prices are/were exorbitant.


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## Lewkat (Nov 4, 2020)

StarSong said:


> Most NYers love NY.  It's such an exciting city.
> When this pandemic is past the rents and prices in the five boroughs will zoom back up.  I'd guess it's going to be a short window buying opportunity for NYers.
> 
> Yes, Florida is booming right now.  Several of my friends have retired there to escape high NJ taxes and northern winters.


Hi NJ taxes?  NY has nothing to talk about when it comes to taxes.  When I lived there I was taxed more than I ever was in NJ.


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## Lewkat (Nov 4, 2020)

I loved living in NY.  lived on the Upper West Side as a child and then my parents moved to NJ when I was about 7.  While I grew to love the town we lived in, I missed the city for a kid there has tons of options.  When I got out of the AF and obtained my Master's, I moved back and worked there for years.  Live in a great apartment on Jane Street a little over 2 blocks from the Hudson River.  Taxes then were a pain, but I made good money over there and it was safe.  All of NY was quite safe back in the day and I always had something to do.  I too could never live in Fla.  It is flat and not at all inviting to me.  Friends and relatives galore live there.  More power to them.  I was offered a job with NASA back when they were just starting with the astronauts.  One look at Merritt Island and I was out of there.


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## StarSong (Nov 4, 2020)

Lewkat said:


> Hi NJ taxes?  NY has nothing to talk about when it comes to taxes.  When I lived there I was taxed more than I ever was in NJ.


Sorry - I didn't mean to compare NJ & NY taxes, only to say that some of my NJ friends complain about them and are moving to FL partly as an escape.  

My NY connections are family. They also complain about taxes but most of their kids/grands have remained nearby so they're more firmly entrenched in the area. 

Like you, I lived in both NY & NJ while growing up so I have roots in both places.


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## Lewkat (Nov 4, 2020)

Your friends are right to complain, Star Song.  We have some of the highest real estate taxes in the nation and they are going up again.  Lots of folks cannot sell their houses fast enough to get out.  Cannot go down any street in any town and not see a few for sale signs.  Now that is sad because this is truly a lovely state once you are off I-95.  I had relatives visiting from Ireland who were awed by NJ.  They said we had just as much beauty as Ireland.


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## twinkles (Nov 4, 2020)

my grandaughter is in real estate and she is selling houses like mad


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## StarSong (Nov 5, 2020)

twinkles said:


> my grandaughter is in real estate and she is selling houses like mad


I think a lot has to do with the extraordinarily low interest rates available right now.


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## Remy (Nov 23, 2020)

I don't live in Southern California, San Francisco Bay Area, or Silicon Valley and prices in my area have still gone nuts. Rents are getting insane. There was a piece of triangle shaped property for sale for years and years, I would drive by it. It finally got sold and I can't believe how many apartments they have crammed on that property on a busy street with plenty of street noise and the prices they are asking are crazy. They seem to be filling up as fast as they complete a section. It's scary. I don't know how people afford it.

 The complex I am in is in the process of being sold. We just got the notice and an inspection was done of each apartment. As scared as I am about the manufactured home I'm buying and the price I had to pay, I know it should work out. I also know the price of these apartments are going to go up to over a grand once that sale is completed. I think the local owners are a little bit below market and that will change I'm sure.


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## StarSong (Nov 23, 2020)

Good luck in your new home, @Remy!  When do you plan to move?


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## Butterfly (Nov 23, 2020)

OneEyedDiva said:


> @mathjak107 & @StarSong  NYC used to be a nice place to visit...haven't been in quite awhile, but I never would want to live there. The rents in decent areas are just ridiculous. Apartment.com has some studios listed as high as $3,704 and 1 bedrooms with 1 bath as high as $5,722. I only saw one studio for $1,100 and the rest were several hundred dollars more, many in the $2,000 range.


And the size of some of those "apartments!"  My smallest bedroom is probably larger than some of them.  I could not live in one of those tiny places where you can barely turn around.  I do not see how people can live like that, especially during quarantine.  I'd be stark, staring mad in about a week.


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## OneEyedDiva (Nov 23, 2020)

Butterfly said:


> And the size of some of those "apartments!"  My smallest bedroom is probably larger than some of them.  I could not live in one of those tiny places where you can barely turn around.  I do not see how people can live like that, especially during quarantine.  I'd be stark, staring mad in about a week.


You're right Butterfly. I saw on House Hunters International that some of the apartments in Paris were quite tiny too. I love how people say..."Oh we can make this work".  Yeah...suuurrrre you can.  But check out this 78 Sq. foot studio. I have to admit, he uses the space well but no way could I do this. Even tiny homes come much bigger.
https://www.6sqft.com/video-how-a-man-lives-and-works-in-a-78-square-foot-hells-kitchen-studio/


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## Don M. (Nov 23, 2020)

Real Estate is moving well, in our area.  One of the neighbors sold their house, and 10 acres, a couple of months ago, and had to move out quickly, as the buyers wanted to get away from the city, ASAP.  Our oldest daughter and son-in-law found a beautiful place on Truman Lake a couple of months ago....3200 sq.ft, 4 bedrooms, 3 baths, 3 car garage, with 5 acres...and bought it.  They put their current house on the Lake of the Ozarks for sale a week later, and it sold within 3 weeks.  More and more people...especially retirees...are moving to the countryside, as a result of this virus, and the rising crime in the cities.  In this area, one can find a really nice house for under $300K that would probably cost well over a million in some of the major coastal cities....and aren't "squeezed" into such a tight space that you can hear the neighbors cough.


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## Jules (Nov 23, 2020)

From that guy in the 78 sq ft apartment.


> he doesn’t mind not having a kitchen or having to share a hallway bathroom with three other people, he does wish he had a sink.


No thanks.

Our prices are staying high too.  IMO, after being isolated indoors for so long, everyone is desperate to have some extra space, especially outdoors.  Also many can work from home so are moving to the burbs.


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## Remy (Nov 23, 2020)

StarSong said:


> Good luck in your new home, @Remy!  When do you plan to move?


Thanks so much StarSong, probably toward the end of December I will start. Having had things stolen by movers once, I'll move most of my small stuff myself. I have cataract surgery next month also so I have a lot going on. Your kind words help.


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## Remy (Nov 23, 2020)

Jules said:


> From that guy in the 78 sq ft apartment.
> 
> No thanks.
> 
> Our prices are staying high too.  IMO, after being isolated indoors for so long, everyone is desperate to have some extra space, especially outdoors.  Also many can work from home so are moving to the burbs.


My real estate agent stated that some people are upsizing their houses since working from home may become more permanent for some.


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## Aunt Bea (Nov 23, 2020)

I think that we have front row seats to the next real estate bubble.

In my area of the city, some very nice homes that were selling a year ago in the 250k range are now on the market for 350k.  Realtors are also posting advertisements asking local homeowners to contact them because they have a surplus of buyers.

I'm afraid that if interest rates begin to creep up the newly inflated prices/value of these properties will fall leaving people upside down with their mortgages.  When that happens people that are forced to relocate usually hand the bank a deed in lieu of foreclosure and walk away.


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## oldmontana (Nov 23, 2020)

Aunt Bea said:


> I think that we have front row seats to the next real estate bubble.
> 
> In my area of the city, some very nice homes that were selling a year ago in the 250k range are now on the market for 350k.  Realtors are also posting advertisements asking local homeowners to contact them because they have a surplus of buyers.
> 
> I'm afraid that if interest rates begin to creep up the newly inflated prices/value of these properties will fall leaving people upside down with their mortgages.  When that happens people that are forced to relocate usually hand the bank a deed in lieu of foreclosure and walk away.



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I agree.  In Montana cities like Missoula and Bozeman prices have gone Big country sky high.

https://nbcmontana.com/news/local/housing-prices-around-montana-skyrocket-due-to-covid-19

Part of the link...

Missoula, MONT — Housing prices in Montana have skyrocketed over the past few months, and local realtors say COVID-19 is largely to blame.

"People are coming from across the country, realizing their jobs are online, and they can live where they want," said Tanya Gersh, a realtor with PureWest Christie's International Real Estate in Whitefish.

Realtors say that led to a major increase in housing prices.

The median sales price for a Gallatin County home increased from $384,000 in February, just before the pandemic, to $479,900 in August. Missoula County saw the median home sales price increase from $323,000 to $370,000. In Lake County it increased from $325,000 to $423,000. And Flathead County saw an increase from $335,000 to $415,000.

Now..



-----------------------------

Now 
Buying a home in the Gallatin Valley continues to grow more expensive.
From September 2020 to October 2020, the median sales price of a single family home in Gallatin County increased by about 6%, from $550,000 in September to $585,000 in October, according to a news release from the Gallatin Association of Realtors.
That’s a 27.6% increase over the median sales price of $458,600 in October 2019, according to the association’s Market Watch.


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