# Do you think we got cheated?



## fuzzybuddy (Jun 1, 2016)

For the very senior of us, we grew up with Howdy Doody and mostly cartoon shows. And our kids grew up with Sesame Street and a host of educational kids TV shows. You saw how those shows affected your kids. For us senior seniors, do you think time cheated us by missing those programs?


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## fureverywhere (Jun 1, 2016)

As a late boomer we had Romper Room, Wonderama, Captain Kangaroo, Mr. Roger's Neighborhood. I don't think earlier generations missed out on anything. I feel we learned more than today's generation. All the information at their fingertips. But if suddenly there was no more electricity, no more generators. They wouldn't know how to use a paper card catalog, write on paper in script, go out with a gang of kids into an open field with a ball and make up games to play...


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## NancyNGA (Jun 1, 2016)

fuzzybuddy said:


> ..., do you think time cheated us by missing those programs?



Just a little bit.  I remember in the first week of first grade more than half the kids couldn't count or recite the alphabet.  Not much harm done in learning those things, imo.  Btw, they now hold _graduation exercises _in some PRE-Ks.  I kid you not.


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## Shalimar (Jun 1, 2016)

Yes, I wish I had been exposed to the variety of knowledge that was available for the next generation.


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## Guitarist (Jun 1, 2016)

No, I don't.  I never liked _Sesame Street._  I would not have wanted my kids watching a show that seemed to assume all kids live on a street of row houses in New York City.  Very alien environment to me and to any kids I might have had.  The letters and numbers sequences could be cute, but kids shouldn't need TV to teach them that; that is for the parents to do, one on one.  

But then I believe that if you don't want to spend time with your kids you shouldn't have any, just as you shouldn't buy a dog if you plan to leave it out in the back yard all day and not train it how to walk on leash and behave.  

When I was a kid we had Captain Kangaroo who taught us cool stuff, also Romper Room and The Mickey Mouse Club.  We also had parents who taught us the alphabet, numbers, colors, how to read, behave, etc.  

I did love Mr. Rogers' Neighborhood which came along after I was grown.  I miss it. Teletubbies was good, too, and I thought the short videos of kids in other countries (usually the UK) were very educational; I was disappointed when they were changed to videos of kids in the US.  I live in the US.  I appreciate exposure to other cultures and ways of doing things.  The videos of English-speaking families were a lot more logical to me for the Teletubbies' very young viewers than all the Spanish on TV these days.


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## Manatee (Jun 1, 2016)

We didn't have a TV until I was 19.  I had one friend that had a TV.  His father built it himself, he was an engineer for CBS.

Howdy Doody never lit my fire.  I was in the Navy when the Mickey Mouse  Club was in its heyday.  Way more watchers than places to sit.  No TV out at sea.  I found other things to do.  Read a lot of books.


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## Geezerette (Jun 1, 2016)

I loved radio! The Shadow, Jack Armstrong, Hop Harrigan, all the great mystery, adventure & comedy shows. Really fed my imagination!


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## Phoenix (Jun 1, 2016)

I didn't have a television until I was nine, and then the reception was so bad we could barely make it out. Finally when I was 11 one tv station came to town.  Some of the shows that most boomers saw I didn't see until I left home at 18 and moved to Portland.  I had no phone until I left home at 18.  I did listen to some shows on the radio.  There was nothing wrong with that.  I didn't miss a thing.


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## Butterfly (Jun 1, 2016)

Geezerette said:


> I loved radio! The Shadow, Jack Armstrong, Hop Harrigan, all the great mystery, adventure & comedy shows. Really fed my imagination!



I did also.  I loved the radio shows.  I think they were better for us kids than TV, because radio shows helped build your imagination.  I don't remember any "little kid" radio shows, though I suppose there were some. I still remember "Who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of men?  The SHADOW knows."  I was also delighted by Fibber McGee and Molly's closet.  Do you remember Inner Sanctum?  Deliciously scary -- we weren't allowed to listen to it, but we'd creep up to our bedroom door and listen to it when our parents were listening after we went to bed.  I wish they still had "stories" on the radio.

I was thrilled to learn to read and I remember how wonderful it felt when I realized I was actually DOING it.  I've had a lifelong love of books as a result.

We didn't get TV until I was a teenager.  Didn't miss a thing.


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## Warrigal (Jun 1, 2016)

You poor babies. We didn't have TV in OZ until 1957. We just had to make do with books. :hide:


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## Ken N Tx (Jun 2, 2016)




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## exwisehe (Jun 2, 2016)

Speaking of 1957, that's the year I went to college in the fall to a very puritanical, old fashioned, Southern Baptist college in NC.  The boy's dorm was on one side of campus and the girl's on the other.  If we asked for a date, we had to sign in, state the time back, where we were going, (on campus only).  The house mother paged the lady on the PA system, we waited for her in the lounge, as the house mother looked on.  Coming back, we could only give a good night kiss for 4 seconds, otherwise the house mother would tap us on the shoulder saying, "that's long enough!"

Do I think I was cheated? I used to, but after growing older, I look back with fondness to those days, and realize that they were precious for me, and gave me many principles in morality that have helped me along life's journey.  When I see how today's dorms are governed at institutions, I think the cheating that is going on now is in the lives of our youth.  When I was in my teaching years, I used to tell the youth how things were so regulated and strict, and they would always say, "Mr ****, I wish I would have lived like that when I went to school.  No one cared what we did and we did as we pleased."


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## Phoenix (Jun 2, 2016)

One of the things that bothers me now is that from what I hear, in the showers in the dorms, both guys and gals enter the same shower room.  If that's true, it's inviting rape.  There's a lot of rape at the state run university campus not too far from where I live.

I agree that it's good to teach morality.  When I was living at home and got back from a date, if I was in the car too long, Mom would come out onto the porch and tell me it was time to come in.  Of course, if a person wanted to fool around, they would have done it before they got back to the house.  Still....


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## nitelite (Jun 2, 2016)

I don't feel cheated. We all have our own unique era which has made us who we are. Makes me think of part of lyrics from a Rod Stewart song "ooh la la" which are:
 "I wish that I knew what I know now
When I was younger
I wish that I knew what I know now
When I was stronger"


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## senile1 (Jun 2, 2016)

As man has evolved intellectually, the species have come to put a higher value on education, and even starting one's education at an earlier age. Studies have shown, Starting to school at an earlier(preschool)age , has served to help students to be a step ahead of other students upon starting grammar school. I do not know as to whether we were cheated, but our children are much more advanced educationally than we were at a younger age.


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## Shalimar (Jun 3, 2016)

Hmm, in many ways morality is a personal thing. What is acceptable to one, is often unacceptable to another. I chose to "preach" responsibility and accountability to my son, rather than pass on the guilt and shame that formed me. It has worked 

well. I was a wild child, rebellious, breaking all the rules. He is more mainstream, he has been with the same woman for twelve years, married for eight. They are soul mates.


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## Butterfly (Jun 3, 2016)

senile1 said:


> As man has evolved intellectually, the species have come to put a higher value on education, and even starting one's education at an earlier age. Studies have shown, Starting to school at an earlier(preschool)age , has served to help students to be a step ahead of other students upon starting grammar school. I do not know as to whether we were cheated, but our children are much more advanced educationally than we were at a younger age.



Maybe in some ways, but I got a much better grounding in reading, writing, etc. than kids do now.  Kids now know a heck of a lot more about electronic gadgets, etc., but half of them cannot compose a coherent sentence.


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## senile1 (Jun 3, 2016)

Butterfly said:


> Maybe in some ways, but I got a much better grounding in reading, writing, etc. than kids do now.  Kids now know a heck of a lot more about electronic gadgets, etc., but half of them cannot compose a coherent sentence.



 I will agree with your statement my friend, but not in a general sense. I am sure there may be some children you have a "better grounding in reading, writing, ect" but over all, kids via computers and advanced education are  much more advanced than we were at similar ages. I remember when my daughter graduated from high school, some 19 years ago. She had a 3.89 grade average, and was 16th I,n her class. The valedictorian was accepted to West Point, and another of her fellow students was accepted at the US Naval Academy. My daughter herself, went on to graduate from the University of Virginia. My daughter has a 13 year old daughter whom seems headed down her mother's path.


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## Phoenix (Jun 3, 2016)

I did exceptionally well in school.  So did a number of my friends and younger people I know.  But what I learned over the years is that the ability to memorize which accounts for most good grades does not mean one is more advanced.  There needs to be an ability to extrapolate.  Being glued to devices does not allow for that.


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## Shalimar (Jun 3, 2016)

I received an excellent education, including post secondary. My son had the advantage of being placed in French Immersion from the age of kindergarten on. As a result, he is completely bilingual. He was able to parlay this talent into earning money to

help finance his university education. I took French, Spanish, and German in school, but I am not fluent. I wish I had had his opportunities.


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## exwisehe (Jun 3, 2016)

I can comprehend that on this forum I'd better watch what I say and do, because there are a lot of well educated and informed persons here.  So I'll try to be careful.


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## jujube (Jun 3, 2016)

I'm glad I grew up in a simpler time.  Kids today have so much more stress than we did back then.


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## senile1 (Jun 3, 2016)

exwisehe said:


> I can comprehend that on this forum I'd better watch what I say and do, because there are a lot of well educated and informed persons here.  So I'll try to be careful.




This was not to imply you were wrong my friend, and I am sure you have met many  who lack your reading and literary skills, but just my opinion, youth , in general, are further along, education wise, than we were at a similar age; There exists many children living in situations that are not conducive to good education opportunities.


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## Guitarist (Jun 3, 2016)

*Quote for the Day*

I just saw this on a website.

"Children are made readers on the laps of their parents." 
— Emilie Buchwald


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## Guitarist (Jun 3, 2016)

senile1 said:


> This was not to imply you were wrong my friend, and I am sure you have met many  who lack your reading and literary skills, but just my opinion, youth , in general, are further along, education wise, than we were at a similar age; There exists many children living in situations that are not conducive to good education opportunities.



I disagree.  I have worked in public libraries and the kids coming in to do class assignments amazed me not only with their ignorance of what I considered basic knowledge, but with their teachers' apparent lack of a quality education.  IME today's public-school-educated youth in general are way behind where we were at their age.  

And now they're not even being taught how to write.


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## Phoenix (Jun 3, 2016)

Guitarist said:


> I just saw this on a website.
> 
> "Children are made readers on the laps of their parents."
> — Emilie Buchwald



My mom read to me when I was little.  I scooched in beside her in the easy chair and she read me all kinds of stories.  It's a love filled memory and it taught me to appreciate books.

If a child is being beaten at home or is frightened to walk to school, like the kids in Chicago, it's so hard fro them to escape the trap.


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## Guitarist (Jun 3, 2016)

Phoenix said:


> I did exceptionally well in school.  So did a number of my friends and younger people I know.  But what I learned over the years is that the ability to memorize which accounts for most good grades does not mean one is more advanced.  There needs to be an ability to extrapolate.  Being glued to devices does not allow for that.



I went to public school from kindergarten through graduate school.  In graduate school I met two students who had done their undergraduate work at two very highly ranked private universities. I was surprised, and interested, to learn in classes that when we were asked questions, they never answered based on their own ability to reason, but always quoted some "authority" or other.  Maybe it was just them, or maybe it was what they had been taught as undergrads.  Whichever, it was peculiar to them.  The rest of us just thought out our own answers and gave them.  It certainly takes intelligence to memorize and quote others; it also takes intelligence to reason for oneself and answer creatively.

I just re-read the original question on this thread, about today's "educational" children's TV programs.  I don't necessarily consider them educational in a good way.  I remember two instances, on two different "educational" programs, where vocabularies were "dumbed down" rather than being used to educate viewers.  One was the lyrics to a good old song I loved as a child (and still do); the other was an old saying misused, entirely missing the point of the saying.


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## Shalimar (Jun 3, 2016)

I think it is important to remember that we grew up in a simpler time than our children. Also,   in Canada, almost half of adults have a university education. That is far higher than a generation ago. For the first time, there are more women attending 

universities than men. I wish that when I attended uni, there had been the variety of programs available that today's students have. it is also far easier to "infiltrate" the so-called bastion of men's careers than when I became a psychologist. Cheated? 

Perhaps a little. I certainly don't feel that this generation is "dumbed down", nor do I believe that American kids are any less intelligent or motivated than Canucks. However, a poor home life drastically affects scholastic performance. It certainly affected 
mine off and on during my school years.


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## Phoenix (Jun 4, 2016)

In the US education is costing kids a lot more. Every year tuition goes up at the state universities.  At the University of Oregon for example, it's 3 - 5 percent annually.  The kids are being pushed out.  Kids on the average here come out of college $100,000 in debt.  That is not better. I got loans and grants for my college tuition and owed only $3,000 when I graduated from college.  I do wish there wasn't the sexism when I graduated, so other fields would have been open to me.  But the growth I experienced has been tremendous.  I wouldn't trade it.  Coming of age now means that kids face a future where some of the environmental damage is beyond repair.  They can only hope to slow it down.  We are in dire straits. Population growth is out of control in spite of the attempts of Zero Population Growth, while things heat up, dry up and burn.  Floods in some places are killing people all the time.  Extreme weather is becoming the norm.  As there are more and more people, and less and less resources, violence will continue to escalate.  The have-nots will try to take from the haves - making war unending. The ocean is dying because the "collective we" have been using them as garbage dumps.  One of the reasons I will not fly or take a cruise is because they dump stuff into the ocean.  It's my personal protest.  If we all stopped because of that, the policy would change.  It's radically now worse on many levels. I feel bad for those who are inheriting this.  Due to family genetics I have the potential to live thirty more years.  I hope that does not happen.  In thirty years things will be radically worse.


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## fureverywhere (Jun 4, 2016)

Maybe in some ways, but I got a much better grounding in reading, writing, etc. than kids do now.  Kids now know a heck of a lot more about electronic gadgets, etc., but half of them cannot compose a coherent sentence. 

Can't you just imagine a teen of today fighting that statement? " Why do old peple thnk that we cnt write 2? 2 txt all U ned is autoC"...it's sad.

I'm proud to say that even the youngest of mine is excellent at reading and spelling. Add in a love of cats and I done good.


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## fuzzybuddy (Jun 4, 2016)

I agree that we should be giving kids the best education possible. I want them to be happy and have fantastic, profitable futures. How else are the little bastards going to pay for my medicare?


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## Shalimar (Jun 4, 2016)

Fuzzy, hahahahahhahahahaha.


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## Phoenix (Jun 4, 2016)

I agree with your assessment.


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## Shalimar (Jun 4, 2016)

My Medicare is assured, but I want to go into the "good home."


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## Phoenix (Jun 4, 2016)

Shalimar said:


> My Medicare is assured, but I want to go into the "good home."



Is the "good home" you are talking about a nursing home when you become really ill?


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## tnthomas (Jun 4, 2016)

fuzzybuddy said:


> Do you think we got cheated?



I'm glad that I had a "happy-go-lucky" time period growing up, until about age 14.  Wasn't perfection, but we got to focus on _being a kid_, for awhile.


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## Shalimar (Jun 5, 2016)

Phoenix, techically yes, I was referring to a  nursing home. However I was being facetious. Anyone who is as claustrophobic and averse to rules and regulations as I, would shrivel in a home. Luck permitting, when the time comes, I shall ride the death pill into the sky.


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## Phoenix (Jun 5, 2016)

Oops, my bad.  Let's hope we all pass quickly when it comes time.  My mom thought that too, but it didn't work that way for her.  I learned a lot by going to the nursing home and observing those who lived there with her.


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