# Michael Drejka sentencing tomorrow



## applecruncher (Oct 9, 2019)

(Handicapped parking space killing in Florida)

I don't know the time of the hearing, but it'll be interesting.
Drejka's atty filed a motion for a new trial - don't know if that will affect the scheduled sentencing.


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## Butterfly (Oct 10, 2019)

I haven't seen any news on that, AC, will you please keep us updated?


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## applecruncher (Oct 10, 2019)

*Drejka has been sentenced to 20 years in prison.*

https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/10/us/florida-trial-michael-drejka-sentencing/index.html


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## Trade (Oct 10, 2019)

I'm glad to see this. 

It's too bad that Amber Guyger didn't get the same.


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## applecruncher (Oct 10, 2019)

No hugs in THIS court room.

Drejka is a nasty piece of work who thought he was some kind of superhero.  Showed no remorse. I'm glad he's off the streets.


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## Judycat (Oct 10, 2019)

How about a new, Mind Your Own Business law. People need to stop making a big deal out of stuff that doesn't directly affect them. There are plenty of harassing goofs giving handicapped people a hard time because they don't look handicapped enough to park in these spaces. It is not their place to judge. MYOB. You are not always right, surprising as it may sound. It really grinds my gears the way some people take liberties to the extreme. Gah!


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## rgp (Oct 10, 2019)

An extreme overt travesty of justice !


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## Camper6 (Oct 10, 2019)

rgp said:


> An extreme overt travesty of justice !


What is an overt travesty of justice?


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## rgp (Oct 10, 2019)

Camper6 said:


> What is an overt travesty of justice?




HuH ?......this whole thing.


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## Trade (Oct 10, 2019)

rgp said:


> An extreme overt travesty of justice !



Not like the "Good Old Days" huh RPG?


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## rgp (Oct 10, 2019)

Trade said:


> Not like the "Good Old Days" huh RPG?




 Well, I did not denote/point to anything at all......I merely said that IMO this whole thing was/is a travesty of justice.

 Please don't try & spin what I say, &/or put words in my mouth.


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## SeaBreeze (Oct 10, 2019)

applecruncher said:


> *Drejka has been sentenced to 20 years in prison.*



That's good, thanks for the update!


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## win231 (Oct 10, 2019)

Trade said:


> I'm glad to see this.
> 
> It's too bad that Amber Guyger didn't get the same.


Police officers are never sentenced to anywhere near the time non officers are.
And, I doubt Drejka will end up serving more an 3-4 years....& that's only if his conviction isn't thrown out, which it may be.


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## Trade (Oct 10, 2019)

The video clearly shows McGlockton taking at least 2 full steps backward before Drejka shoots him. A clear cut case of murder.


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## 911 (Oct 10, 2019)

win231 said:


> Police officers are never sentenced to anywhere near the time non officers are.
> And, I doubt Drejka will end up serving more an 3-4 years....& that's only if his conviction isn't thrown out, which it may be.


I think Florida laws state that a sentenced felon must serve 85% of his sentence before being considered for parole.


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## Buckeye (Oct 10, 2019)

Justice has been served.  Amen.


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## Trade (Oct 10, 2019)

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-new...-man-parking-space-dispute-sentenced-n1064626
So Drejka parked illegally and then went and got in someone's face for parking illegally. I know. This is tragic. But I can't help laughing at that one.



> Circuit Judge Joseph Bulone said that the defense showed the jury that Drejka was a "wannabe law enforcement officer" who made a hobby out of monitoring the parking spot at the Clearwater Circle A Food Store.
> 
> When the store's owner asked him to stop acting as a keeper of the space, which was "not even the best space in the whole parking lot," because it was leading to altercations, he simply started bringing a gun with him, Bulone said.
> 
> ...


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## 911 (Oct 10, 2019)

State Appellate Courts can and do surprise, even shock us at times. I don’t pretend to be an authority or courts and I would hate to make a wager on which way this one will go. Just by looking at the video, most of us would say that the jury got it right. But, how the Appellate Court interprets Florida’s “Stand Your Ground” law could surprise all of us. Let’s hope not. 

I will go out on a limb and say that if the Florida Appellate Court upholds the verdict, I would be surprised if the Federal Appeals Court would overturn the State Appellate Court’s decision to let the verdict stand. Federal Appeals Courts do not overturn State Appeals court’s decisions too easily.


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## Butterfly (Oct 10, 2019)

applecruncher said:


> *Drejka has been sentenced to 20 years in prison.*
> 
> https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/10/us/florida-trial-michael-drejka-sentencing/index.html




Good!  Thanks, AC.


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## Butterfly (Oct 10, 2019)

911 said:


> State Appellate Courts can and do surprise, even shock us at times. I don’t pretend to be an authority or courts and I would hate to make a wager on which way this one will go. Just by looking at the video, most of us would say that the jury got it right. But, how the Appellate Court interprets Florida’s “Stand Your Ground” law could surprise all of us. Let’s hope not.
> 
> I will go out on a limb and say that if the Florida Appellate Court upholds the verdict, I would be surprised if the Federal Appeals Court would overturn the State Appellate Court’s decision to let the verdict stand. Federal Appeals Courts do not overturn State Appeals court’s decisions too easily.



Here, it takes a bit to get a criminal conviction overturned.  Appellate courts will not reject the verdict of a jury unless they find that there was some error in the trial itself that affected the outcome or that there wasn't adequate evidence to support the jury's verdict, which is a pretty low bar.  Our appellate court won't rethink the jury's weighing of the evidence, so in a "could go either way" situation they won't overturn the verdict.  Lots of people think you can bring in new evidence on direct appeal, but here, at least, that's not true.  The appellate court can only review what was presented at the original trial, and they cannot go beyond the trial transcripts, the pleadings, and the exhibits.  An appeal is not a new trial, it is judicial review of the original trial.


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## Sunny (Oct 11, 2019)

Maybe this will help the parking lot vigilantes to take a deep breath and consider what they are really so angry about.  If a person without a handicapped sticker, who looks hale and hearty, parks in a handicapped space, what's the big deal?  This might be cause for mild annoyance, hardly enough for murderous rage.  Drekja clearly was just itching to pull that trigger. And what's become of the rule of law in this country?  Since when are we justified in going around shooting each other, like little kids playing cops and robbers?


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## Knight (Oct 11, 2019)

Trade said:


> The video clearly shows McGlockton taking at least 2 full steps backward before Drejka shoots him. A clear cut case of murder.


 Drejka doesn't appear to be physically capable of defending himself from being attacked and pushed to the ground. The stepping back could be viewed like that. But with no sound to know what was said how can anyone be certain re positioning to do further harm wasn't the intent? 

The justice system works, so if there is appeal by Drejka maybe Applecruncher will keep us informed.


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## Trade (Oct 11, 2019)

Knight said:


> Drejka doesn't appear to be physically capable of defending himself from being attacked and pushed to the ground. The stepping back could be viewed like that. But with no sound to know what was said how can anyone be certain re positioning to do further harm wasn't the intent?



It's plain as day that McGlockton is backing away as soon as he sees the gun. If you don't see that it's because you don't want to.

As for Drejka, he was real brave when he was confronting a woman with small kids. But when it came to facing a man he "wasn't physically capable of defending himself"

He'd better toughen up some when he gets to prison because they are not going to let him have a gun there.


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## rgp (Oct 11, 2019)

Trade said:


> It's plain as day that McGlockton is backing away as soon as he sees the gun. If you don't see that it's because you don't want to.
> 
> As for Drejka, he was real brave when he was confronting a woman with small kids. But when it came to facing a man he "wasn't physically capable of defending himself"
> 
> He'd better toughen up some when he gets to prison because they are not going to let him have a gun there.




 If you don't see the physical attack by McGlockton it's because you don't want to. IMO he [Drejka] had every right to stand his ground. As Knight said, we have no idea what was said , or what threat Drejka felt.


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## Trade (Oct 11, 2019)

rgp said:


> If you don't see the physical attack by McGlockton it's because you don't want to. IMO he [Drejka] had every right to stand his ground. As Knight said, we have no idea what was said , or what threat Drejka felt.




We all can see McGlockton attack Drejka. We can also see Drejka pull a gun on him. And we can also see McGlockton backing away from Drejka when he sees the gun. The show of the gun was all that was needed to remove the threat. The shooting was totally unnecessary. 

I'd like to ask you another question RPG. What kind of man gets in the face of a woman with small kids? Over a freakin parking place for Christ sake? I can't imagine a scenario where I would do such a thing. Would you?


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## applecruncher (Oct 11, 2019)

@Knight 

Maybe you can check news reports...if you're that interested in the case and Drejka's welfare. Appeal? Pffft.  The case is over. Done. 
Here's an update:  Applecruncher predicts Drejka will rot in prison.


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## 911 (Oct 11, 2019)

Butterfly said:


> Here, it takes a bit to get a criminal conviction overturned.  Appellate courts will not reject the verdict of a jury unless they find that there was some error in the trial itself that affected the outcome or that there wasn't adequate evidence to support the jury's verdict, which is a pretty low bar.  Our appellate court won't rethink the jury's weighing of the evidence, so in a "could go either way" situation they won't overturn the verdict.  Lots of people think you can bring in new evidence on direct appeal, but here, at least, that's not true.  The appellate court can only review what was presented at the original trial, and they cannot go beyond the trial transcripts, the pleadings, and the exhibits.  An appeal is not a new trial, it is judicial review of the original trial.


That’s exactly correct. A defense attorney (or Prosecutor for that matter) cannot introduce new evidence to an Appellate Court. Appellate Courts only rule on trial evidence that was already presented at trial. Correct me if I’m wrong, but there is no guarantee that the Appellate Court would even hear oral arguments, if after reading the defense attorney’s brief that they find no wrong-doing during the trial. And, even if there were minor errors, the Appellate Court could rule to hold the trial judge’s errors as harmless. 

If I was a gambler, I would bet that this case is over.


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## Butterfly (Oct 11, 2019)

Knight said:


> Drejka doesn't appear to be physically capable of defending himself from being attacked and pushed to the ground. The stepping back could be viewed like that. But with no sound to know what was said how can anyone be certain re positioning to do further harm wasn't the intent?
> 
> The justice system works, so if there is appeal by Drejka maybe Applecruncher will keep us informed.



It was the victim who was stepping back, not Drejka.   What does the victim's stepping back have to do with Dreka's physical ability?  The victim's stepping back indicates he was trying to get out of the situation.


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## Butterfly (Oct 11, 2019)

911 said:


> That’s exactly correct. A defense attorney (or Prosecutor for that matter) cannot introduce new evidence to an Appellate Court. Appellate Courts only rule on trial evidence that was already presented at trial. Correct me if I’m wrong, but there is no guarantee that the Appellate Court would even hear oral arguments, if after reading the defense attorney’s brief that they find no wrong-doing during the trial. And, even if there were minor errors, the Appellate Court could rule to hold the trial judge’s errors as harmless.
> 
> If I was a gambler, I would bet that this case is over.



I agree.  Even if they hear oral arguments, those have to be based on what's in the briefs, and briefs have to be specific about what the attorney claims is wrong with the trial.  They can't just go in and say "The jury got it wrong."  Most trial errors are harmless error and don't affect the outcome of the trial.  

I'd bet this one is over, too.


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## rgp (Oct 11, 2019)

Trade said:


> We all can see McGlockton attack Drejka. We can also see Drejka pull a gun on him. And we can also see McGlockton backing away from Drejka when he sees the gun. The show of the gun was all that was needed to remove the threat. The shooting was totally unnecessary.
> 
> I'd like to ask you another question RPG. What kind of man gets in the face of a woman with small kids? Over a freakin parking place for Christ sake? I can't imagine a scenario where I would do such a thing. Would you?




 I might approach her and point out that these spaces are for the handicapped....[although I never actually have] and if she started yelling?....yeah i might [probably would] yell back.


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## Butterfly (Oct 11, 2019)

rgp said:


> I might approach her and point out that these spaces are for the handicapped....[although I never actually have] and if she started yelling?....yeah i might [probably would] yell back.



Well, IMHO unless you are a handicapped person needing the space, or the owner of the parking lot, or the police, it really isn't any of your business to point out to the woman her sketchy parking.   If it troubles you all that much, report it to the police., whose business it is.

Being a vigilante isn't the way to solve the problems of the world.


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## 911 (Oct 11, 2019)

Butterfly said:


> I agree.  Even if they hear oral arguments, those have to be based on what's in the briefs, and briefs have to be specific about what the attorney claims is wrong with the trial.  They can't just go in and say "The jury got it wrong."  Most trial errors are harmless error and don't affect the outcome of the trial.
> 
> I'd bet this one is over, too.



OK, so far so good. So, if the state appeals court upholds the sentence and denies a new trial, or even to listen to oral arguments, the next step would be to appeal to a federal appeals court? And, if that fails, the defendant would have to request that the U.S. Supreme Court hear the case?

So, would the defendant have to not only pay for his attorneys, but would he also be charged the court costs? 

It will never get this far, I’m just trying to understand the progression of an appeals case. I was never involved in a federal appeals case.


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## jerry old (Oct 11, 2019)

It has been stated, we didn't hear any audio.
Who was the man in the store that opened the door, then went back insidel
I strongly suspect McGlockton was told, 'Someone is giving your woman hell in the parking lot.'
Note he came out of the door 'primed for action.'
He walked to the car, rapidly, hitching  up his pants, a male behavior of preparedness .
Drejka killed him for pushing him down-that is it the case in a nutshell

At best McGlockton was guilty of a Class C misdemeanor, possibly a Class B, do not know how the courts operate in his state.

Provocation? you bet, Drejka had every right to get up and kick his ass, now comes the other circumstances...

A man, apparently incapable of protecting himself killed the bully.

We do not shoot bullies (some of us in grade and high school had homicidal thoughts towards bullies, but we had no pistol.)

Yes, I'm vacillating, but the actual events (audio) are unknown?

I saw a man push another man down, that man shot and killed him for it.  Drejka was also primed, and carrying a pistol which made him lethal!

Nuff said!
DALLAS:
The cop shoot a man, when she was in the wrong apt-even when the  evidence is beyond doubt, strange things happen.


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## win231 (Oct 11, 2019)

rgp said:


> I might approach her and point out that these spaces are for the handicapped....[although I never actually have] and if she started yelling?....yeah i might [probably would] yell back.


I've never understood why anyone would approach someone & point out that they're in a handicapped space.  Do you actually think someone wouldn't already know that?  Since they know it's a handicapped space & they're parking there, anyway, they're obviously an inconsiderate moron.  What good is it to tell them?  Especially when you'd get a reply like, "Go screw yourself."


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## jerry old (Oct 11, 2019)

What you say is true: those of us that are gimps have an entirely different view.
I've felt the urge to cuss a 'violator,' but in todays world, I suck it up and hobble off- me and my two canes.
I don't carry a gun in public places, my temper has gotten me in trouble before.


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## rgp (Oct 12, 2019)

win231 said:


> I've never understood why anyone would approach someone & point out that they're in a handicapped space.  Do you actually think someone wouldn't already know that?  Since they know it's a handicapped space & they're parking there, anyway, they're obviously an inconsiderate moron.  What good is it to tell them?  Especially when you'd get a reply like, "Go screw yourself."




 Well, it might be the most polite way to approach them ? Some people are myopic & live in their own little world. Oblivious to the concerns of others. As I said, I have never done it, but that might be my approach ?


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## Camper6 (Oct 13, 2019)

rgp said:


> I might approach her and point out that these spaces are for the handicapped....[although I never actually have] and if she started yelling?....yeah i might [probably would] yell back.


What difference does it make to your lifestyle when someone disobeys the rules.
If you are handicapped, and you don't get a spot, yes you should speak up.
But it's not worth a life. If you are assaulted get the licence number and call the police.
Death is so final.


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## 911 (Oct 13, 2019)

Camper6 said:


> What difference does it make to your lifestyle when someone disobeys the rules.
> If you are handicapped, and you don't get a spot, yes you should speak up.
> But it's not worth a life. If you are assaulted get the licence number and call the police.
> Death is so final.



This is where so many people make their mistake, but you make a good point. If anyone sees a car parked in a handicapped spot, this is when you report it to the police. If they have an officer in the area and is not busy, they may respond and take up the issue with the driver. 

Keep in mind that different states have different laws. In Pennsylvania, if you would call and report this vehicle with the license number and the car would leave before the officer responds to the call, he would be amiss because according to our laws, the driver must be cited and not the car. So, if I were the officer responding and the car was gone and I would go to the owner of the car’s house and ask him who was driving the car and he replied, “I don’t remember,” game over. All the officer can do is leave. 

Same thing on an assault or road rage. If I’m driving down the road and someone (for whatever reason) waves his gun at me, I need to call the police immediately and hope that they can catch him/her before the car is parked and there is no driver behind the wheel. Again, police must cite the driver, unless a passenger admits to doing the act, and not the car. The car is not guilty of doing anything. Make sense? 

I know of one state that no matter what goes on; litter being tossed out the window, someone flips another driver the bird, whatever, the owner would be charged and cited. If he didn’t do it and could convince one of his or hers passengers to admit guilt, the driver could get off the hook. This is another one of our laws that used to get my goat.


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## StarSong (Oct 13, 2019)

I predict that Drejka is going to meet lots of new friends in the prison showers and around every corner.  Prisoners reportedly have a way of meting out justice.  Swiftly and decisively.  Not saying it's right, just saying it happens.


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## Trade (Oct 13, 2019)

StarSong said:


> I predict that Drejka is going to meet lots of new friends in the prison showers and around every corner.  Prisoners reportedly have a way of meting out justice.  Swiftly and decisively.  Not saying it's right, just saying it happens.



I was hoping for that myself, but then again there are lots of  white supremacists in prison and he will be a hero to them. He will find saftey under their protective wing.


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## Camper6 (Oct 13, 2019)

911 said:


> This is where so many people make their mistake, but you make a good point. If anyone sees a car parked in a handicapped spot, this is when you report it to the police. If they have an officer in the area and is not busy, they may respond and take up the issue with the driver.
> 
> Keep in mind that different states have different laws. In Pennsylvania, if you would call and report this vehicle with the license number and the car would leave before the officer responds to the call, he would be amiss because according to our laws, the driver must be cited and not the car. So, if I were the officer responding and the car was gone and I would go to the owner of the car’s house and ask him who was driving the car and he replied, “I don’t remember,” game over. All the officer can do is leave.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the information from the reliable source.
My point. He could have pulled the gun and that would have stopped the guy but he didn't have to pull the trigger.  It's not worth it.


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## Butterfly (Oct 13, 2019)

911 said:


> OK, so far so good. So, if the state appeals court upholds the sentence and denies a new trial, or even to listen to oral arguments, the next step would be to appeal to a federal appeals court? And, if that fails, the defendant would have to request that the U.S. Supreme Court hear the case?
> 
> So, would the defendant have to not only pay for his attorneys, but would he also be charged the court costs?
> 
> It will never get this far, I’m just trying to understand the progression of an appeals case. I was never involved in a federal appeals case.



I can only speak to what happens here.  I'm not a lawyer, and I'm speaking from what is readily available on the internet regarding court rules and procedure.

Here, if you cannot afford to pay for a defense at the trial level, the state appoints an attorney to represent you at no cost to you -- either the Public Defender or contract counsel.

On direct appeal, the state will also appoint appellate counsel for you and I imagine that continues to state habeas as well.

As to habeas to a federal court, the court may appoint counsel to represent you under the Criminal Justice Act if you meet the requirements for appointed counsel.

As to the Supremes, I believe they have procedures to appoint counsel for the indigent defendant.  Bear in mind that just because a person wants to appeal to the Supreme Court doesn't mean that the court will agree to hear the case.  They have strict limitations about which cases they will hear.

If you have appointed counsel, costs are generally also paid by the court.


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## win231 (Oct 13, 2019)

It's never over, even though we think it's over.
I just watched a "20/20" report on the Chowchilla kidnapping.  You may recall 3 guys kidnapped a bus load of kids & their driver & buried them underground while they demanded ransom.  Some of the kids were injured & (of course) all were traumatized for life.  That made the kidnappers eligible for life without parole sentences, which they received.
Later, an appeals court ruled that the kids were not injured severely enough to warrant life without parole & threw out the sentence.  Two of the kidnappers have been released.


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## jerry old (Oct 13, 2019)

I'm against state killings (executions) mostly, not sure on how I think, depends on crime I suppose.
Burying kids alive qualifies for, ' These folks need a good killing.'


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## 911 (Oct 13, 2019)

win231 said:


> It's never over, even though we think it's over.
> I just watched a "20/20" report on the Chowchilla kidnapping.  You may recall 3 guys kidnapped a bus load of kids & their driver & buried them underground while they demanded ransom.  Some of the kids were injured & (of course) all were traumatized for life.  That made the kidnappers eligible for life without parole sentences, which they received.
> Later, an appeals court ruled that the kids were not injured severely enough to warrant life without parole & threw out the sentence.  Two of the kidnappers have been released.



In Pennsylvania and some other states, when a defendant is convicted of Felony Murder, or what some call, First Degree Premeditated Murder, the penalty is out of the judge’s hands. The defendant is sentenced to life w/o parole. However, there have been times, not only in Pennsylvania, but other states as well, where the Governor has either commuted a sentence to time served or granted clemency. 

These acts by the Governor usually do not sit well with the public and this is why the Governor will generally take these actions when he is in his last year in office. Not surprising, huh?


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## 911 (Oct 13, 2019)

Butterfly said:


> I can only speak to what happens here.  I'm not a lawyer, and I'm speaking from what is readily available on the internet regarding court rules and procedure.
> 
> Here, if you cannot afford to pay for a defense at the trial level, the state appoints an attorney to represent you at no cost to you -- either the Public Defender or contract counsel.
> 
> ...



What made me ask the question was that I recently watched the Ted Bundy story. I’m sure that you know John Henry Browne defended Bundy against his wishes and in fact asked the judge to be excused, which was denied. Anyone that knows anything about Mr. Browne, knows that he is a lawyer’s lawyer. I had the pleasure of meeting him and I found him to be very intelligent, interesting and honest. Most people would not believe that of any lawyer.

Anyway, I wondered how much was paid for his defense. He filed several appeals, all of which failed. I would really like to know how much Atty. Browne was paid. Do you know if Browne was also Bundy’s Appellate Attorney? Can a trial attorney also act as an appellate attorney in the same case? I never saw it happen, but can it?


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## win231 (Oct 13, 2019)

911 said:


> In Pennsylvania and some other states, when a defendant is convicted of Felony Murder, or what some call, First Degree Premeditated Murder, the penalty is out of the judge’s hands. The defendant is sentenced to life w/o parole. However, there have been times, not only in Pennsylvania, but other states as well, where the Governor has either commuted a sentence to time served or granted clemency.
> 
> These acts by the Governor usually do not sit well with the public and this is why the Governor will generally take these actions when he is in his last year in office. Not surprising, huh?


No, it's not surprising.  I also remember Bill Clinton pardoning drug dealers whose families contributed to his campaign (with drug money proceeds) just before he left office.  Such powers should not be in any politician's hands.  They make our justice system even more pathetic than it already is.


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## Butterfly (Oct 13, 2019)

911 said:


> What made me ask the question was that I recently watched the Ted Bundy story. I’m sure that you know John Henry Browne defended Bundy against his wishes and in fact asked the judge to be excused, which was denied. Anyone that knows anything about Mr. Browne, knows that he is a lawyer’s lawyer. I had the pleasure of meeting him and I found him to be very intelligent, interesting and honest. Most people would not believe that of any lawyer.
> 
> Anyway, I wondered how much was paid for his defense. He filed several appeals, all of which failed. I would really like to know how much Atty. Browne was paid. Do you know if Browne was also Bundy’s Appellate Attorney? Can a trial attorney also act as an appellate attorney in the same case? I never saw it happen, but can it?



Here, an attorney can act as both trial and appellate counsel, providing they are admitted to practice in the particular appeals court.  And yes, it does happen.  I've seen it happen quite a bit.  However, in many, if not most, criminal cases, a separate appellate counsel is hired or appointed, as appeals are a whole different ball game than trial court.  If the defendant has appointed counsel, he must be appointed by the successive court.  Many times the same attorney will act through the state appeals, but another is appointed for federal appeals.  Courts, especially those above trial court level, have lists of those attorneys who have agreed to act as appointed counsel.  Appointed counsel are paid, in all courts that I know of, based on a schedule of what the court is willing to pay for what services, costs, etc. (and it's nowhere near what attorneys get paid in private practice, BTW). 

As to Browne, I did some searching on the internet and can't find out a whole lot about his dates of representation of Bundy, except for vague references.  Most sites say Browne represented Bundy only "briefly" and in the 70s and early 80s. I did find out that Bundy's last most active attorney was named Peggy Nelson and she did the final post-conviction work on trying to save him from execution.  

The Florida public defender who asked to withdraw and was made to remain as consulting counsel was Michael Minerva.  I can't find any definitive answer as to what, if any, role Browne played in the Florida trial.

As his cases progressed through the various courts, Bundy was represented by a whole host of attorneys from time to time.

I doubt it is possible to find out how much Browne was paid, or by whom.  Often high-profile cases attract high-profile attorneys who work for free or a reduced fee for clients in cases the attorneys are interested in.  

Now you've piqued my interest and I'll keep looking just for fun.


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## JB in SC (Oct 14, 2019)

Parking illegally is no reason to escalate a dispute. Businesses call the appropriate law enforcement agency (city or county) to handle it here, regularly I might add. Those $250 golden tickets do not get a pass at trial either.


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## Butterfly (Oct 14, 2019)

JB in SC said:


> Parking illegally is no reason to escalate a dispute. Businesses call the appropriate law enforcement agency (city or county) to handle it here, regularly I might add. Those $250 golden tickets do not get a pass at trial either.



Same here, only ours are $300.  I almost got one in a Walgreens parking lot right after I had my hips replaced and I had forgotten to hang the placard over the rearview mirror.  The cop tore up the ticket after I came hobbling out of Walgreens with my walker, but I got a stern talking to about hanging the placard.  Can't blame the cop, though, I WAS in a handicap spot and there was no placard visible.


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## JB in SC (Oct 15, 2019)

Butterfly said:


> Same here, only ours are $300.  I almost got one in a Walgreens parking lot right after I had my hips replaced and I had forgotten to hang the placard over the rearview mirror.  The cop tore up the ticket after I came hobbling out of Walgreens with my walker, but I got a stern talking to about hanging the placard.  Can't blame the cop, though, I WAS in a handicap spot and there was no placard visible.



I was just checking our law, it was changed some years ago. It’s now $500 to $1000, that’s without the court fees which effectively double the fine. I hear the local agencies regularly (scanner) called on violators. The old system had special car tags, but now use the placards like yours.

Some cities (Asheville, NC) have trained volunteers issuing tickets. They issue approximately 900 a year.

But back to topic. There are few instances where I personally would feel justified using lethal force....arguing over a parking space ain‘t one of ‘em.


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## DaveA (Oct 16, 2019)

Butterfly said:


> Same here, only ours are $300.  I almost got one in a Walgreens parking lot right after I had my hips replaced and I had forgotten to hang the placard over the rearview mirror.  The cop tore up the ticket after I came hobbling out of Walgreens with my walker, but I got a stern talking to about hanging the placard.  Can't blame the cop, though, I WAS in a handicap spot and there was no placard visible.


Lucky for you that Drejka wasn't patrolling your parking lot.  After he handed you a bunch of s$$t, he might have blasted you as well and you wouldn't be here to tell us your story.


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## win231 (Oct 16, 2019)

JB in SC said:


> I was just checking our law, it was changed some years ago. It’s now $500 to $1000, that’s without the court fees which effectively double the fine. I hear the local agencies regularly (scanner) called on violators. The old system had special car tags, but now use the placards like yours.
> 
> Some cities (Asheville, NC) have trained volunteers issuing tickets. They issue approximately 900 a year.
> 
> But back to topic. There are few instances where I personally would feel justified using lethal force....arguing over a parking space ain‘t one of ‘em.


Irrelevant.  Drieka didn't use lethal force over a parking space.


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## JB in SC (Oct 16, 2019)

win231 said:


> Irrelevant.  Drieka didn't use lethal force over a parking space.



Tell me again how it started? Do you think anyone would have been killed if Drieka had minded his own business?


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## win231 (Oct 16, 2019)

JB in SC said:


> Tell me again how it started? Do you think anyone would have been killed if Drieka had minded his own business?


I agree that Drieka is an idiot.  But to say he killed someone over a parking space is not only wrong, but stupid.  He killed someone over a violent assault - committed by Mr. Thug.


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## rgp (Oct 16, 2019)

JB in SC said:


> Tell me again how it started? Do you think anyone would have been killed if Drieka had minded his own business?




And no one would have been killed if [McGlockton's] arrogant girlfriend had not parked in that handicapped spot.......That is how it *started*.


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## JB in SC (Oct 16, 2019)

rgp said:


> And no one would have been killed if [McGlockton's] arrogant girlfriend had not parked in that handicapped spot.......That is how it *started*.



I sure don’t want to have to kill someone over arrogance...mine or theirs. It’s not worth my life, I guess the question that needs to be asked is would you have confronted her over parking in the space?


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## JB in SC (Oct 16, 2019)

win231 said:


> I agree that Drieka is an idiot.  But to say he killed someone over a parking space is not only wrong, but stupid.  He killed someone over a violent assault - committed by Mr. Thug.



I am certainly not stupid, you can continue this conversation with yourself.


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## rgp (Oct 16, 2019)

JB in SC said:


> I sure don’t want to have to kill someone over arrogance...mine or theirs. It’s not worth my life, I guess the question that needs to be asked is would you have confronted her over parking in the space?




 He {McGlockton] wasn't killed over arrogance, he was killed due to a perceived threat . The arrogance was displayed by his girlfriend, when she ignored the handicapped markings/sign .

 Would I ? I have answered that question, I really do not know? I never have, so...........


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## Trade (Oct 17, 2019)




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## rgp (Oct 17, 2019)

Trade said:


>




 As disgusting as it was.......Thanks for sharing.

 Always someone trying to game the system. I think the most disgusting of all was civil servants & of them the most disgusting/unbelievable was the assistant prosecutor .


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## DaveA (Oct 18, 2019)

Not funny really, but I had to pay a visit to my ophthalmologist this morning and lo and behold, there was a truck parked in the handi-cap space next to mine.  No driver or passenger in view and no placard.  What it did have was NRA stickers, "Don't p-ss me off sticker, America First, etc..  If  Dreika or someone of the same ilk was patrolling the lot, I'd hate to think how many of us might have been cut down in the fusillade of fire that would have erupted.


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## Trade (Oct 18, 2019)

DaveA said:


> Not funny really, but I had to pay a visit to my ophthalmologist this morning and lo and behold, there was a truck parked in the handi-cap space next to mine.  No driver or passenger in view and no placard.  What it did have was NRA stickers, "Don't p-ss me off sticker, America First, etc..  If  Dreika or someone of the same ilk was patrolling the lot, I'd hate to think how many of us might have been cut down in the fusillade of fire that would have erupted.




Drejka would have never messed with that dude. They're kindred souls.


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## applecruncher (Oct 18, 2019)

Trade said:


> Drejka would have never messed with that dude. They're kindred souls.



True.


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## ohioboy (Mar 5, 2021)

Butterfly said:


> As to the Supremes, I believe they have procedures to appoint counsel for the indigent defendant.  Bear in mind that just because a person wants to appeal to the Supreme Court doesn't mean that the court will agree to hear the case.  They have strict limitations about which cases they will hear.


Rule 10 concerns reasons (but not all inclusive) to possibly grant Certiorari (which only takes 4 Justices to grant to hear).

Rule 39 concerns indigency.

https://www.supremecourt.gov/ctrules/2019RulesoftheCourt.pdf


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## ohioboy (Mar 10, 2021)

911 said:


> I will go out on a limb and say that if the Florida Appellate Court upholds the verdict, I would be surprised if the Federal Appeals Court would overturn the State Appellate Court’s decision to let the verdict stand. Federal Appeals Courts do not overturn State Appeals court’s decisions too easily.



Before any possible federal court, he must exhaust all internal State remedies, meaning it has to be appealed to the Florida Supreme Court 1st. If denied to be heard, or upheld, then, if an Application for Habeas Corpus relief is filed (commonly known as a 2254 motion) in a U.S. District Court, it must contain elements of a federal nature. If a decision rests soley on state law, the petitioner must argue a federal question is in the ruling, and or a mixed bag, even if the decision rests primarily on state law/constitution.


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## StarSong (Mar 11, 2021)

ohioboy said:


> Before any possible federal court, he must exhaust all internal State remedies, meaning it has to be appealed to the Florida Supreme Court 1st. If denied to be heard, or upheld, then, if an Application for Habeas Corpus relief is filed (commonly known as a 2254 motion) in a U.S. District Court, it must contain elements of a federal nature. If a decision rests soley on state law, the petitioner must argue a federal question is in the ruling, and or a mixed bag, even if the decision rests primarily on state law/constitution.


Interesting!  Are you an attorney, @ohioboy?


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## ohioboy (Mar 11, 2021)

StarSong said:


> Interesting!  Are you an attorney, @ohioboy?



No, but since my College criminal law days, I've just studied various legal topics to help keep my mind sharp (boy is that a misnomer, ha).


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