# Your views please !!  Covid 19



## charry (Jan 16, 2021)




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## Judycat (Jan 16, 2021)

Only if they offer a mask first and only if they don't mind grown people acting like toddlers in front of their store. This could drive away business.


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## Camper6 (Jan 16, 2021)

I just got out of hospital after an operation.
The hospital I was in was very fussy about rules to prevent any COVID infections.
They had security at the entrance and people had to sanitize their hands and wear an approved mask before they could enter.  Visitors were restricted to one designated individual.
All I can say is that not one case of infection by COVID 19 was reported in this hospital.
So of course I'm going to support it.  Whether it's successful or just luck I'm going to run with it.
We have had infections in supermarkets where the whole building was shut down and fumigated.


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## Murrmurr (Jan 16, 2021)

Yes.


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## old medic (Jan 16, 2021)

I feel that any private business has the right to refuse any service to any body for any reason...
I may not agree with the reason... but thats their business.


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## Murrmurr (Jan 16, 2021)

At a liquor store where I worked, we had a sign on the door that said "If you're tweaking, please buy your booze elsewhere. If you're stoned, yes, we know, the labels are pretty interesting."


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## Becky1951 (Jan 16, 2021)

Yes.


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## Aneeda72 (Jan 16, 2021)

I can’t see what the sign says but in Utah you cannot enter a store without a face shield or mask or some kind of covering on your face.


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## 911 (Jan 16, 2021)

No one wants COVID-19. It’s nothing like any of us has ever experienced, unless you are fortunate enough to get one of the lesser variations of the disease. My wife also got it and it effected only her sinuses. I was the less lucky one and it effected my lungs.


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## Lee (Jan 16, 2021)

Yes of course.


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## Aneeda72 (Jan 16, 2021)

911 said:


> No one wants COVID-19. It’s nothing like any of us has ever experienced, unless you are fortunate enough to get one of the lesser variations of the disease. My wife also got it and it effected only her sinuses. I was the less lucky one and it effected my lungs.


Same with my son and girlfriend.


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## horseless carriage (Jan 16, 2021)

It's inevitable that with so many of the Government's rules involving constraints on behaviour in the home, there will be many others who will be informed on by neighbours for actual or suspected breaches. The sense that we are being turned into a nation of snoops is not a pleasant one. On the other hand, it's understandable that if one family is diligently observing all the rules, however much disruption it causes to the normal pattern of their lives, they will deeply resent those who behave as if they are above the law — a law which is (however inconsistently or ineffectually) designed to protect the community as a whole from the dangers of infection. In the case of masks, the inconsistencies have been legion. Mask wearing reduces the risk of the disease spreading, so if you don't want to wear a mask, don't go out.


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## jujube (Jan 16, 2021)

Yes.


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## Lewkat (Jan 16, 2021)

Yes.


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## Keesha (Jan 16, 2021)

Absolutely. It would be irresponsible of them not to.


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## charry (Jan 16, 2021)

Aneeda72 said:


> I can’t see what the sign says but in Utah you cannot enter a store without a face shield or mask or some kind of covering on your face.


What about if ones exempt Aneeda ......


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## charry (Jan 16, 2021)

There are a lot of people out that , that can’t wear those masks , and  have badges to classify that they dont have to........!!
Plus , they can’t get online food delivery orders.....
So what happens to them ?

When I last went into my supermarket, there were quite a few of young girls pushing prams, that had no masks on, chatting on their phones as they do  

I had a word with the cashier, and they said , they were told not to intervene, as there had been lots of arguement s and fights....

I can’t see this ever ending .......
.
I wear a mask everywhere now....and hate it !! But it’s to be........


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## rgp (Jan 16, 2021)

old medic said:


> I feel that any private business has the right to refuse any service to any body for any reason...
> I may not agree with the reason... but thats their business.




 So then you agree with baker & the photographer that refused to do business with the gay guys a few years back ?

Last I heard, both were forced out of business.


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## horseless carriage (Jan 16, 2021)

Charry, all retail stores and places of public retail like cinemas, theatres, heritage railways, travelling circus and many more, have the right to refuse entry to anyone. But in practice such establishments may leave themselves open to litigation against all the various groups that have fought for their rights over the years. The right to refuse anyone is usually only as a last resort to someone such as a persistent shop lifter or fare dodger.


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## charry (Jan 16, 2021)

old medic said:


> I feel that any private business has the right to refuse any service to any body for any reason...
> I may not agree with the reason... but thats their business.


Yes your right ......old medic .......it’s their business......they can serve who they want !!


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## charry (Jan 16, 2021)

rgp said:


> So then you agree with baker & the photographer that refused to do business with the gay guys a few years back ?
> 
> Last I heard, both were forced out of business.


Sad, if they were forced out of business......but it’s still their choice rgp ..........


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## charry (Jan 16, 2021)

horseless carriage said:


> Charry, all retail stores and places of public retail like cinemas, theatres, heritage railways, travelling circus and many more, have the right to refuse entry to anyone. But in practice such establishments may leave themselves open to litigation against all the various groups that have fought for their rights over the years. The right to refuse anyone is usually only as a last resort to someone such as a persistent shop lifter or fare dodger.





There will be a lot of no admissions soon,   When the non vaccine guys, try .......

Apparently , a non vaccine person  , won’t be able to get out of the country without a stamp on their passport ....horseless........


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 16, 2021)

Yes, absolutely, positively, without question, for sure.


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## Aneeda72 (Jan 16, 2021)

charry said:


> What about if ones exempt Aneeda ......


Have a mask or stay home at present or the face shield.  The face shield let’s you breathe fine.


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## HoneyNut (Jan 16, 2021)

What I don't understand is where were all these maskless people in previous years, why weren't they showing up barefoot and shirtless and having hysterics that they should be allowed in without shirts and shoes?  Apparently foot fungus and BO is more serious to them than an infectious airborne disease.


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## J.B Books (Jan 16, 2021)

it's kind of the law here.
I don't think masks do much good. (Not going to get into that discussion here please)
I had Covid. wasn't fun. Guess I am immune now?
If I want to go into a store, I wear a mask.
I comply.


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## Nathan (Jan 16, 2021)

Keesha said:


> Absolutely. It would be irresponsible of them not to.


My thoughts exactly.    Not only that, but our county and state health officials _require_ masks be worn by customers of all businesses.


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## Aunt Marg (Jan 16, 2021)

HoneyNut said:


> What I don't understand is where were all these maskless people in previous years, why weren't they showing up barefoot and shirtless and having hysterics that they should be allowed in without shirts and shoes?  Apparently foot fungus and BO is more serious to them than an infectious airborne disease.


I think of it as the toddler syndrome, where once those who choose to buck the system have the attention of others, they stomp their feet, lay on the floor and thrash, kick, buck, and cry.

Attention getters they are plain and simple.


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## Jeni (Jan 16, 2021)

Nathan said:


> My thoughts exactly.    Not only that, but our county and state health officials _require_ masks be worn by customers of all businesses.


because government  turned over any enforcement/ backlash  as a requirement for all businesses.... 

my state list exceptions but when you just tell a person with zero knowledge they can't or won't deal with those that have exceptions.


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## Jeni (Jan 16, 2021)

J.B Books said:


> it's kind of the law here.
> I don't think masks do much good. (Not going to get into that discussion here please)
> I had Covid. wasn't fun. Guess I am immune now?
> If I want to go into a store, I wear a mask.
> I comply.


I am in same boat as you ..... I had a mild case ( very early on)
I comply but get frustrated when I see what passes an complying..... not because I think masks work ( in this)....
but all those who are convinced they do ......are basing that on an assumption that people are doing it CORRECTLY.

I assist running  a respiratory program for a medical lab for a BIO-pharm company ....... when any mask even N95, are mandatory.... we are required to have them do a medical clearance.....,,,,,,,,, and to  fit masks and train on use.

This is an OSHA requirement.... and YES some  staff are told "NO, you should not be wearing these for a whole shift..."................. these folks often cannot stay if not occupationally cleared.......
Some staff are checked EVERY year  because system is monitoring them for damage from long term use..........other healthy staff with no conditions can be cleared for 3-5 years

So there ARE long term effects in wearing this and the general public refuse to believe it...

Why are all these businesses now having people workers ...... just wear them....... and many are NOT Providing  them ( OSHA requirement if you mandate wearing them)   .................but letting employees wear whatever mask they buy etc.....  many of these mandates are NOT following safety guidelines that set out for long term use of mask etc in state version or OSHA requirements.

Seems to me if businesses were concerned about liability their own workers health should be considered..... we will not know what respiratory  conditions that were created or compounded by this.

The reason is the medical clearance through an occupational health system is EXPENSIVE......
perhaps we can readdress what laws/ requirements  are mandatory good news for businesses forced to follow these guidelines........ if those are now deemed unneeded.


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## win231 (Jan 16, 2021)

rgp said:


> So then you agree with baker & the photographer that refused to do business with the gay guys a few years back ?
> 
> Last I heard, both were forced out of business.


Not a valid comparison.


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## Jules (Jan 16, 2021)

charry said:


> Apparently , a non vaccine person , won’t be able to get out of the country without a stamp on their passport ...



Interesting.  I would like to see this for travel on a plane, since that’s the only way I’ll ever be able to see my kids.  It was rumoured they might do this.


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## win231 (Jan 16, 2021)

J.B Books said:


> it's kind of the law here.
> I don't think masks do much good. (Not going to get into that discussion here please)
> I had Covid. wasn't fun. Guess I am immune now?
> If I want to go into a store, I wear a mask.
> I comply.


^^^ Nailed it!


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## J.B Books (Jan 16, 2021)

Jeni said:


> I am in same boat as you ..... I had a mild case ( very early on)
> I comply but get frustrated when I see what passes an complying..... not because I think masks work ( in this)....
> but all those who are convinced they do ......are basing that on an assumption that people are doing it CORRECTLY.
> 
> ...


I agree.
But the law is about wearing masks. And they don't want to know how harmful they are. (It's better than nothing right?)
(here we are getting into a discussion I was try to avoid)
It's about appearance of doing something. It's about control.
Shut up and obey! Wear a mask!


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## Jules (Jan 16, 2021)

It’s the law here too.  

A few try to skirt it.  They don’t pay the person at the door enough to put up with the BS that sometimes happens.  Frankly, I’d like to see those who say they can’t wear a mask offered free pick up service.


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## Jeni (Jan 16, 2021)

Jules said:


> Interesting.  I would like to see this for travel on a plane, since that’s the only way I’ll ever be able to see my kids.  It was rumoured they might do this.


there are a lot of rumors about what will happen


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## terry123 (Jan 16, 2021)

Yes!


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## charry (Jan 16, 2021)

Jules said:


> Interesting.  I would like to see this for travel on a plane, since that’s the only way I’ll ever be able to see my kids.  It was rumoured they might do this.


Sadly yes....but your be fine, as long as you;have the jab ..


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## Jeni (Jan 16, 2021)

J.B Books said:


> I agree.
> But the law is about wearing masks. And they don't want to know how harmful they are. (It's better than nothing right?)
> (here we are getting into a discussion I was try to avoid)
> It's about appearance of doing something. It's about control.
> Shut up and obey! Wear a mask!


It is a very slippery slope ..... a Mandate is NOT equal to a LAW ...... 
A law can be enforced not shrugged off to retail workers and restaurants.........


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## rgp (Jan 16, 2021)

win231 said:


> Not a valid comparison.




 Why not ? He said that a business is the owners business , to run as the owner sees fit. That's exactly what my question was all about.


win231 said:


> Not a valid comparison.


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## fuzzybuddy (Jan 16, 2021)

If you want to live in a civilized society, you have to abide by the rules.  Nobody says you have to enjoy the rules, only the benefit of what a civilized society provides. If you want unbridled freedom to do whatever you feel, you live alone in the jungle. You can't do both.
And quite frankly, wearing a mask to stop more millions from getting the virus, is not a bone crushing request.  It don't believe anyone's life has been upended by that request, and I doubt that wearing a mask will cause  significant post traumatic  stress symptoms.


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## tbeltrans (Jan 16, 2021)

No shoes, no shirt, no mask, no service?

Tony


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## Pink Biz (Jan 16, 2021)

*Yes!*


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## Camper6 (Jan 16, 2021)

rgp said:


> So then you agree with baker & the photographer that refused to do business with the gay guys a few years back ?
> 
> Last I heard, both were forced out of business.


So they can't get their cakes or pictures now? Happy now with what you have accomplished for spite?


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## Camper6 (Jan 16, 2021)

J.B Books said:


> I agree.
> But the law is about wearing masks. And they don't want to know how harmful they are. (It's better than nothing right?)
> (here we are getting into a discussion I was try to avoid)
> It's about appearance of doing something. It's about control.
> Shut up and obey! Wear a mask!


Would you trust a surgeon operating on you without a mask? Just asking.


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## moviequeen1 (Jan 16, 2021)

absolutely


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## Chet (Jan 16, 2021)

Yes. Some people don't even want to stop at a stop sign. Are they special?


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## Aneeda72 (Jan 16, 2021)

Jeni said:


> I am in same boat as you ..... I had a mild case ( very early on)
> I comply but get frustrated when I see what passes an complying..... not because I think masks work ( in this)....
> but all those who are convinced they do ......are basing that on an assumption that people are doing it CORRECTLY.
> 
> ...


So just wear a face shield when shopping, not as good as a mask, IMO, but it does NOT block breathing at all.  It is open on the sides.


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## Aneeda72 (Jan 16, 2021)

J.B Books said:


> I agree.
> But the law is about wearing masks. And they don't want to know how harmful they are. (It's better than nothing right?)
> (here we are getting into a discussion I was try to avoid)
> It's about appearance of doing something. It's about control.
> Shut up and obey! Wear a mask!


*Or a face shield, wear a face shield.*


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## old medic (Jan 16, 2021)

rgp said:


> So then you agree with baker & the photographer that refused to do business with the gay guys a few years back ?
> 
> Last I heard, both were forced out of business.


Like I said... I may not agree with the reasoning behind it... But agree the owner of a private business should not be forced to provide
Goods and or services against their beliefs or will....
The fact the government was allowed to step in and ultimately forced them out of business scares the hell out of me.


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## rgp (Jan 17, 2021)

old medic said:


> Like I said... I may not agree with the reasoning behind it... But agree the owner of a private business should not be forced to provide
> Goods and or services against their beliefs or will....
> The fact the government was allowed to step in and ultimately forced them out of business scares the hell out of me.



 I understand & agree !


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## Sunny (Jan 17, 2021)

That baker and photographer who refused service to a gay couple is completely off the subject of this thread!  Why not start a separate topic if you want to discuss that?


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## rgp (Jan 17, 2021)

Sunny said:


> That baker and photographer who refused service to a gay couple is completely off the subject of this thread!  Why not start a separate topic if you want to discuss that?




 That is your opinion, to which I disagree.


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## MarciKS (Jan 17, 2021)

Frankly I see no reason why they aren't well within their rights to ask customers for the no shirt no shoes no mask policy. If the workers have to wear masks to protect you we have the same right to be protected against you when you come in for services.

You guys have the option to stay home. We don't. You have no idea what we're going through to continue serving you. 

Frankly I wish more people would stay the hell home. Covid can kill you. Staying home isn't gonna kill you.


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## Chet (Jan 17, 2021)

MarciKS said:


> Frankly I see no reason why they aren't well within their rights to ask customers for the no shirt no shoes no mask policy.


In a related issue, social media sites like Facebook apparently have a right to control free speech because they are a private business, which should settle the facemask issue right there about what private businesses can do.


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## StarSong (Jan 19, 2021)

fuzzybuddy said:


> If you want to live in a civilized society, you have to abide by the rules.  Nobody says you have to enjoy the rules, only the benefit of what a civilized society provides. If you want unbridled freedom to do whatever you feel, you live alone in the jungle. You can't do both.
> And quite frankly, wearing a mask to stop more millions from getting the virus, is not a bone crushing request.  It don't believe anyone's life has been upended by that request, and I doubt that wearing a mask will cause  significant post traumatic  stress symptoms.


Beautifully said.


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## asp3 (Jan 19, 2021)

Yes.


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## asp3 (Jan 19, 2021)

Chet said:


> In a related issue, social media sites like Facebook apparently have a right to control free speech because they are a private business, which should settle the facemask issue right there about what private businesses can do.



They are in no way infringing on anyone's right to free speech.  Just because someone wants to say it doesn't mean they must be forced to broadcast what they have to say.  The person can still say it, email it, send it in snail mail or call people and tell them what they have to say.  I feel Facebook and other social media sites and businesses are well within their rights to restrict messages to one they feel are appropriate for their business.


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## StarSong (Jan 19, 2021)

old medic said:


> Like I said... I may not agree with the reasoning behind it... But agree the owner of a private business should not be forced to provide
> Goods and or services against their beliefs or will....
> The fact the government was allowed to step in and ultimately forced them out of business scares the hell out of me.


The government didn't force them out of business, their customers decided to vote with their feet and wallets, and spent their money elsewhere.  

Owners of private businesses must operate within the laws of the land - and there are plenty of them.

Segregation, including separate lunch counters, drinking fountains and restrooms were occurring within private businesses until the government stepped in and said, NO MORE!


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## Murrmurr (Jan 19, 2021)

StarSong said:


> The government didn't force them out of business, their customers decided to vote with their feet and wallet, and spent their money elsewhere.
> 
> Owners of private businesses must operate within the laws of the land - and there are plenty of them.
> 
> Segregation, including separate lunch counters, drinking fountains and restrooms were occurring within private businesses until the government stepped in and said, NO MORE!


True, when refusing customers is based on the business owner's bias, the business owner runs the risk of losing business. The success of ones business relies heavily on getting and keeping customers. If you want to stay in business you have to offer what customers want, and you have to set your biases aside and take care of them.

But also you have to keep your shop safe and clean, and that's exclusively what the shirt, shoes, and mask signs are all about.


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## StarSong (Jan 19, 2021)

Murrmurr said:


> True, when refusing customers is based on the business owner's bias, the business owner runs the risk of losing business. The success of ones business relies heavily on getting and keeping customers. If you want to stay in business you have to offer what customers want, and you have to set your biases aside and take care of them.
> 
> But also you have to keep your shop safe and clean, and that's exclusively what the shirt, shoes, and mask signs are all about.


Absolutely true.  My husband and I owned a manufacturing business that also had a retail component for many years.  I also worked retail during my teens and early twenties.


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## tbeltrans (Jan 19, 2021)

fuzzybuddy said:


> If you want to live in a civilized society, you have to abide by the rules.  Nobody says you have to enjoy the rules, only the benefit of what a civilized society provides. If you want unbridled freedom to do whatever you feel, you live alone in the jungle. You can't do both.
> And quite frankly, wearing a mask to stop more millions from getting the virus, is not a bone crushing request.  It don't believe anyone's life has been upended by that request, and I doubt that wearing a mask will cause  significant post traumatic  stress symptoms.


Exactly!  Somehow, I missed this one earlier.  I seem to skip around in the forum when the number of new posts goes beyond a certain point.  I am glad other folks caught this post and quoted it so I couldn't miss it.    

Tony


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## Tish (Jan 19, 2021)

Absolutely!


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## Aneeda72 (Jan 19, 2021)

Murrmurr said:


> True, when refusing customers is based on the business owner's bias, the business owner runs the risk of losing business. The success of ones business relies heavily on getting and keeping customers. If you want to stay in business you have to offer what customers want, and you have to set your biases aside and take care of them.
> 
> But also you have to keep your shop safe and clean, and that's exclusively what the shirt, shoes, and mask signs are all about.


Besides very few people want to see other people without shirts on.


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## Camper6 (Jan 19, 2021)

tbeltrans said:


> No shoes, no shirt, no mask, no service?
> 
> Tony


Tattoo parlour sign. No shoes, no shirt, no mask? No problem.


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## Camper6 (Jan 19, 2021)

Sunny said:


> That baker and photographer who refused service to a gay couple is completely off the subject of this thread!  Why not start a separate topic if you want to discuss that?


All threads have a habit of wandering off the beaten path. It's not a big deal. We can follow.


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## Aneeda72 (Jan 19, 2021)

Camper6 said:


> All threads have a habit of wandering off the beaten path. It's not a big deal. We can follow.


Except when the subject is political, then we can’t follow


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## Pepper (Jan 19, 2021)

Tried to gather a group together, once upon a time, to walk into diner with me, wearing only shirts & shoes.

No takers.  No guts.  No doing anything for a laugh.


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## tbeltrans (Jan 19, 2021)

Camper6 said:


> Tattoo parlour sign. No shoes, no shirt, no mask? No problem.


It was meant to be a rhetorical question, since to me, it seems obvious (but maybe not to those who refuse to wear a mask).

Tony


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## tbeltrans (Jan 19, 2021)

Pepper said:


> Tried to gather a group together, once upon a time, to walk into diner with me, wearing only shirts & shoes.
> 
> No takers.  No guts.  No doing anything for a laugh.


I wouldn't mind be at a restaurant where a such a group walked in.  The looks on the faces of the customers and staff would be priceless.

Tony


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## Pepper (Jan 19, 2021)

tbeltrans said:


> I wouldn't mind be at a restaurant where a such a group walked in.  The looks on the faces of the customers and staff would be priceless.
> 
> Tony


You're forty years too late!


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## tbeltrans (Jan 19, 2021)

Pepper said:


> You're forty years too late!


Better late than never!

Tony


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## Pepper (Jan 19, 2021)

tbeltrans said:


> Better late than never!
> 
> Tony


Big mistake, Tony.  Me & the gang were much cuter then and I never heard of anyone else with the desire to do this now!  Maybe we can inspire someone.............


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## Camper6 (Jan 19, 2021)

Pepper said:


> Big mistake, Tony.  Me & the gang were much cuter then and I never heard of anyone else with the desire to do this now!  Maybe we can inspire someone.............


Why would you want to ruin someone's dinner?


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## mellowyellow (Jan 19, 2021)

Yes


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## Butterfly (Jan 20, 2021)

My state requires masks to enter stores, businesses, etc., and requires businesses to ensure that customers comply.  The matter was litigated all the way up to our state supreme court, which ruled (fairly quickly for a change -- it usually takes them forever to rule on a case) that under our state constitution the governor has the authority to so order during a pandemic and to assess and collect fines against those who do not comply (both the business and the customer).


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## Wren (Jan 20, 2021)

Yes,  unless they are exempt for medical reasons and have proof


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## Rosemarie (Jan 20, 2021)

Murrmurr said:


> True, when refusing customers is based on the business owner's bias, the business owner runs the risk of losing business. The success of ones business relies heavily on getting and keeping customers. If you want to stay in business you have to offer what customers want, and you have to set your biases aside and take care of them.
> 
> But also you have to keep your shop safe and clean, and that's exclusively what the shirt, shoes, and mask signs are all about.


What about all the mask-wearing customers who chose to take their business elsewhere, because one shop-owner DIDN'T enforce the rule?


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## Mike (Jan 20, 2021)

Yes they are right to refuse service to unmasked people.

Unfortunately it cannot be policed properly, one of the
supermarket chains here, the Cooperative, told the staff
to refuse service to those without and that led to upsets
and in one case a cashier was slapped.

They, the Cooperative, then changed the policy and since
then, people wearing masks are unhappy that the staff are
serving those without.

That is a "No-Win" situation.

Still wear a mask, PLEASE.

Mike.


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## Murrmurr (Jan 20, 2021)

Rosemarie said:


> What about all the mask-wearing customers who chose to take their business elsewhere, because one shop-owner DIDN'T enforce the rule?


It's the state and/or county health departments who define the mandates, and the sheriff's office that enforces the mandates. When the signs were first posted where I shop for groceries, a police car sat right outside the door for a few months and there are 2 or 3 parked at Walmart at all times.

Small "essential" businesses that don't enforce it themselves run the risk of being closed down. As for taking ones business  elsewhere, that's always an option.


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## Murrmurr (Jan 20, 2021)

Mike said:


> Yes they are right to refuse service to unmasked people.
> 
> Unfortunately it cannot be policed properly, one of the
> supermarket chains here, the Cooperative, told the staff
> ...


At least in my state and county, proper policing isn't a problem. 
A federal agency called OSHA and all state and/or county health departments inspect _all_ businesses to make sure they adhere to health and safety laws, including COVID-19 guidelines. 
Any person who slaps a store or shop employee for any reason is subject to being arrested and charged with assault.


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## fmdog44 (Jan 20, 2021)

rgp said:


> So then you agree with baker & the photographer that refused to do business with the gay guys a few years back ?
> 
> Last I heard, both were forced out of business.


No, I would check on that about being closed. They refused for religious reasons so it is fine with me. The food chain Chick-fil-A is closed on Sundays and stood up against pressure from the gay movement. In response to threats from the gay community the restaurants were packed with customers in an effort to shut the gays up and it worked just fine as they are all still open doing very well and still closed on Sundays


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## ohioboy (Feb 27, 2021)

horseless carriage said:


> Charry, all retail stores and places of public retail like cinemas, theatres, heritage railways, travelling circus and many more, have the right to refuse entry to anyone. But in practice such establishments may leave themselves open to litigation against all the various groups that have fought for their rights over the years. The right to refuse anyone is usually only as a last resort to someone such as a persistent shop lifter or fare.



As a matter of law, they just can't refuse service to "anyone", restrictions apply, if we are talking in the United States that is.


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## oldman (Feb 27, 2021)

Throughout the Coronavirus, I have been a faithful user and advocate for wearing masks. As we embark on receiving vaccines and am now being warned that wearing masks may not subside, I am beginning to think a little differently. Wasn't the whole idea behind getting the vaccine was that we would have our freedom back and the need for wearing a mask would go away? What happened to that intention?


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## ohioboy (Feb 27, 2021)

Butterfly, if you have some spare time?

https://nmonesource.com/nmos/nmsc/en/item/488119/index.do


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## Kathleen’s Place (Feb 27, 2021)

Absolutely!


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## chic (Feb 27, 2021)

I have a medical exemption but have not been able to shop in a grocery store in my own state since last April. A friend of mine who is the manager of a local Whole Foods where I used to shop invited me in to shop mask free, no questions asked, in her store last summer and this made me wonder how strict this rule really needs to be, but I declined because I'm sick of being treated like a villain and I'm sure some other customers would feel like many of you do here that I have no right to shop at all unless I wear a mask which I cannot do.


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## garyt1957 (Feb 27, 2021)

Murrmurr said:


> At least in my state and county, proper policing isn't a problem.
> A federal agency called OSHA and all state and/or county health departments inspect _all_ businesses to make sure they adhere to health and safety laws, including COVID-19 guidelines.
> Any person who slaps a store or shop employee for any reason is subject to being arrested and charged with assault.


What about the security guard who was shot and killed for trying to enforce the law? Police can't be outside every store and while they may show up after the fact what good does that do the dead security guard? The mask mandate is a good idea, imo without a good way to enforce it.


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## Murrmurr (Feb 27, 2021)

Murrmurr said:


> At least in my state and county, proper policing isn't a problem.
> A federal agency called OSHA and all state and/or county health departments inspect _all_ businesses to make sure they adhere to health and safety laws, including COVID-19 guidelines.
> *Any person who slaps a store or shop employee for any reason is subject to being arrested and charged with assault.*





garyt1957 said:


> What about the security guard who was shot and killed for trying to enforce the law? Police can't be outside every store and while they may show up after the fact what good does that do the dead security guard? The mask mandate is a good idea, imo without a good way to enforce it.


I was addressing a physical assault. Assaults happen every day, all over. They're volatile situations. I wonder if the the place where that security guard got shot now has police presence. Or maybe they no longer insist their customers wear a mask.


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## win231 (Feb 27, 2021)

oldman said:


> Throughout the Coronavirus, I have been a faithful user and advocate for wearing masks. As we embark on receiving vaccines and am now being warned that wearing masks may not subside, I am beginning to think a little differently. Wasn't the whole idea behind getting the vaccine was that we would have our freedom back and the need for wearing a mask would go away? What happened to that intention?


One of several reasons thinking people aren't buying what they're feeding us.


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## Liberty (Feb 27, 2021)

Think wearing the mask "after full vaccination" is to be sure the person isn't transferring viral infections to others. Once the virus load gets beat down enough, masks will probably be optional.

Moderna has done some research on this, as the vaccine makers didn't specifically look for it when doing clinical testing:


 Moderna did test trial volunteers on the day they got their second shots. And the findings 

 suggested that there were fewer asymptomatic infections among participants who'd received the real vaccine than

 among those who got a placebo. Just 14 people of the 14,000-plus in the trial's vaccine group had asymptomatic cases

 that day, compared to 38 of the similarly sized placebo group.


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## J.B Books (Feb 27, 2021)

oldman said:


> Throughout the Coronavirus, I have been a faithful user and advocate for wearing masks. As we embark on receiving vaccines and am now being warned that wearing masks may not subside, I am beginning to think a little differently. Wasn't the whole idea behind getting the vaccine was that we would have our freedom back and the need for wearing a mask would go away? What happened to that intention?


The problem is you gave up your freedom.
They don't want to give it back.


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## Liberty (Feb 27, 2021)

Think the scientists are trying to get a handle on this nasty killer any way they can.  When its viewed from a personal nature by those of us that have been cooped up for a year now, it can certainly seem freedom is being infringed upon.  Still think when we beat the bug down - get the R factor to miniscule figure and it will be a whole different ball game.  Hopefully it will be in our rear view mirror.  These are definitely the historical times.  Will be written about for many many years to come, we are living in the days history will record.  Sure hope it helps our grandkids!


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## garyt1957 (Feb 28, 2021)

Murrmurr said:


> I was addressing a physical assault. Assaults happen every day, all over. They're volatile situations. I wonder if the the place where that security guard got shot now has police presence. Or maybe they no longer insist their customers wear a mask.


 
The state mandates you wear a mask in stores, here. But they unfairly leave enforcement to the stores. So that poor security guard barely making minimum wage gets shot. The grocery store near me has an employee at the entrance checking for masks. The other day it was some little older guy. All it takes is one A-hole who gets mad and gives him a shove. The guy falls and hits his head and if he doesn't die he might be incapacitated for life. For $12 an hour? Sure the attacker will be prosecuted but what good does that do the worker? Again, is the mask mandate a good thing? IMO, yes it is. But enforcing it is the problem.


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## Murrmurr (Feb 28, 2021)

garyt1957 said:


> The state mandates you wear a mask in stores, here. But they unfairly leave enforcement to the stores. So that poor security guard barely making minimum wage gets shot. The grocery store near me has an employee at the entrance checking for masks. The other day it was some little older guy. All it takes is one A-hole who gets mad and gives him a shove. The guy falls and hits his head and if he doesn't die he might be incapacitated for life. For $12 an hour? Sure the attacker will be prosecuted but what good does that do the worker? Again, is the mask mandate a good thing? IMO, yes it is. But enforcing it is the problem.


Here in Sacramento, Calif, there was a city cop at many but not all of the chain grocery stores and some downtown businesses during the first few months. I guess Sac could afford it...maybe only in the rougher areas.


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