# Advice for dealing with a depressed mother....



## FrankieD (Dec 7, 2020)

Hello,

I'll try not to make this long. So I'm 40 years old and my mom is 74. In 2003, we lost my father when he was just 63. Since that moment, my mom has been on a slow and steady decline mentally and physically. She comes from a traditional Greek background so everything is really black or white with little or no gray.

To add some context, she lost her mother when she was young (mid/late 20's). Her father sat her and she siblings down and stated that "the show must go on" and for him it did where he eventually found a new wife. She despised him for that so naturally when my father passes away, she feels that she needs to suffer until her time is here is done. Now I'm not saying she needed to find a new husband, but she takes no effort nor cares to make herself better mentally or physically. She constantly plays roulette with her health. She has no serious ailments but at 74 things like chronic arthritis and venous ulcers in the legs had added to her constant depression. 

My sister, my wife, and I have been in an upwards battle with her to try to get her to get the proper help needed. We drive her to Dr's appointments, and there are some solutions such a PT etc. She consistently makes excuses and it's climaxing to a state of constant exhaustion. I have two young daughters and my mother is basically their only grandparent. I want her around to enjoy them but enjoyment seems something to hard to get out of her. 

I'm at the point where I don't how to approach her anymore. I've tried everything under the sun. I've been nice, I've been assortative, and empathetic. But her lack of resiliency and sheering wanting to be better is draining the family. 

So the question is what do you do? I can't give her an ultimatum such as I won't see her anymore as she is so stubborn that she will just go along with it. Do I just stop taking an interesting and offering my time to help her physically? Do I just submit to the fact that she is a grown women and if this is the route she choses to go then it's on her?

I really appreciate any feedback and advice!


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## Pinky (Dec 7, 2020)

It sounds as though your mother just wants to have control over her own life in regards to her health, though I understand your concern. As for depression, only she knows how she feels, and if she doesn't think she needs help, there is little you can do about it. Being with family should be comforting for her .. but perhaps without constant pressure to do what she doesn't want to do - even if it is well meant.

This may not be what you want to hear, and I could be wrong, but that's how I've read your post.

All the best to your mother.


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## RadishRose (Dec 7, 2020)

FrankieD said:


> Do I just submit to the fact that she is a grown women and if this is the route she choses to go then it's on her?


Yes, this. But of course continue affection, visits and include her as usual.


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## Liberty (Dec 7, 2020)

This can be an exhausting situation...know from experience.  My MIL lived with us, as did my mom and you couldn't have had two more opposite women - they were both born on the same day, too...go figure!  MIL came to live with us when her hub died.  She was negative and so forth.  Over and over we tried to help her.  Finally I told her "Elinor, wish you enjoyed your life more" and let her be.  She lived to be 95, but spent the last several years flat on her back in a nursing home. 

Once you get to the point you can't be a "fixer" and  change someone's attitude,  you'll be  well on your way to only doing what is "humane" and not enabling.


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## Kathleen’s Place (Dec 7, 2020)

Your Mom and I are the same age, and as much as I feel for her and what she has gone through, I feel sorrier for you and your siblings. It’s a hard thing to stand by and helplessly watch. Unfortunately, Frankie, I don’t think there is anything you can do. The decision to move on has to be hers. Maybe right now she is thriving on all of the attention she is receiving from all of you...maybe not, but it’s a thought. If it were me, I think I would back off a bit.  Be there for her like you would be if your Dad were still alive. Invite her to things like dinners or movies or your kids functions, whatever you all do.  But if she doesn’t want to go, then fine, just drop the issue and move on. Perhaps knowing that you all aren’t gowing to keep fawning over her is the wake u call she needs.  Just be there for her when needed, love her whichever road she chooses to take, and know in your heart and accept, that you have done all you could do and that the decision to move on is only hers to make.  It made me smile that you reached out to a Senior group...smart and creative thinking on your part. Your Mom is a very lucky woman to have you in her corner


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## grahamg (Dec 7, 2020)

If you question whether or not to turn your back on your mother, then in my humble opinion, you have already started to withdraw your emotional support from her, (ditto raising questions on a public forum, albeit anonymously).

I am the proof remarkable turnarounds for people with depression do happen, but whether whatever you might do will make much difference is very hard to say, and I'd guess you'll live with whatever outcome ensues.


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## FrankieD (Dec 7, 2020)

Kathleen’s Place said:


> Your Mom and I are the same age, and as much as I feel for her and what she has gone through, I feel sorrier for you and your siblings. It’s a hard thing to stand by and helplessly watch. Unfortunately, Frankie, I don’t think there is anything you can do. The decision to move on has to be hers. Maybe right now she is thriving on all of the attention she is receiving from all of you...maybe not, but it’s a thought. If it were me, I think I would back off a bit.  Be there for her like you would be if your Dad were still alive. Invite her to things like dinners or movies or your kids functions, whatever you all do.  But if she doesn’t want to go, then fine, just drop the issue and move on. Perhaps knowing that you all aren’t gowing to keep fawning over her is the wake u call she needs.  Just be there for her when needed, love her whichever road she chooses to take, and know in your heart and accept, that you have done all you could do and that the decision to move on is only hers to make.  It made me smile that you reached out to a Senior group...smart and creative thinking on your part. Your Mom is a very lucky woman to have you in her corner


Hi Kathleen,

Thank you so much your reply and kind words. In fact, thank you to all that replied with feedback and advice. I think a neutral position is the best way to go which ultimately gives her the power and control that she may seek (or not seek). My sister is also hyper-emotional and similar to my mom in personality so they act as fire and the ocean floor constantly colliding.

When I talk to my mother, I just a different stories and overall vibe. When she talks to her it's the negative aspects of how she is feeling. When we are all together it's a big pot that is brewing. By me keeping the "peace" or turning the attention away is by no means me saying that I don't care. It's just that I'm beat and would honestly rather focus my energy on my girls.

What saddens me is that my childhood was wonderful. Together, my parents were the best team. They gave me as a young man so much power, ability, and confidence to do and follow whatever I wanted. However, her approach to life has been filled with complete fear and anxiety. I've been slowly feeling like an orphan over the past 17 years since my father's death and now that feeling can be more than felt inside of me.


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## asp3 (Dec 7, 2020)

I lost my mother this year the Friday after Thanksgiving.  It wasn't a surprise overall as she's been in decline for years.  However it happened much more quickly than expected.

Based on what I saw my mother do I would say do everything you can to get your mother into some sort of mental health treatment.  However once you've done everything you can do to get her into treatment find a way to feel at peace that you did everything you could and be as loving and available for your mother as you can be without it negatively affecting you.

My mother became a self imposed recluse many years ago.  During that time there were two opportunities when she appeared to be in a program that could help her, but my father gave into her wishes to not be treated and she just continued to deteriorate over time.  She hadn't willing left their condo in years.

My wife and I did everything we could to get her treatment but she wasn't interested.  I followed the advice I gave above and when she passed I was still at peace.  I had actually tried to engage her in getting help even before she stopped being active and mobile so I had put in a lot of effort over many years.  I had actually started grieving many years ago because I had lost my vibrant, active mother through her own stubbornness.

Good luck with your mother and I hope that you are able to get her to choose to seek help and treatment.


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## FrankieD (Dec 7, 2020)

asp3 said:


> I lost my mother this year the Friday after Thanksgiving.  It wasn't a surprise overall as she's been in decline for years.  However it happened much more quickly than expected.
> 
> Based on what I saw my mother do I would say do everything you can to get your mother into some sort of mental health treatment.  However once you've done everything you can do to get her into treatment find a way to feel at peace that you did everything you could and be as loving and available for your mother as you can be without it negatively affecting you.
> 
> ...


Thank you for sharing and my condolences to you and your family. I see a lot of similarities and really hope I am able to as least communicate to her properly that she needs proper assistance and treatment.


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## Aneeda72 (Dec 7, 2020)

I am 74.  I can’t speak for your mom and, guess what, you can’t speak for her either.  You think she’s depressed.  Maybe she is, maybe she is not.  Idk.  I do know that most of us, if not all, want to do it our way, make our own decisions about everything, and be left alone unless we ask for help, visits, and/or interaction.

We have had 74 years of interaction with the world and some of us are tired of the world and the energy we must put into it.  Some of just want to do our own thing and if we need our children’s help or advice we will ask.  It has nothing to do with our children, but this is OUR time to spend it as we wish.

You use the “I” word a lot in what you wrote.  You talk about what you you want.  But you don’t talk about what your mother wants.  Remember when you were a teenager and your parents wanted control over your life.  Thought they knew how you felt and how you should act and how you should live your life?  Sounds like you want that type of control, even if you are not aware of it.

How about you ask her what she wants?  Have a conversation with her where you actually listen to what she says.  You might learn something.  IMO.


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## FrankieD (Dec 7, 2020)

Aneeda72 said:


> I am 74.  I can’t speak for your mom and, guess what, you can’t speak for her either.  You think she’s depressed.  Maybe she is, maybe she is not.  Idk.  I do know that most of us, if not all, want to do it our way, make our own decisions about everything, and be left alone unless we ask for help, visits, and/or interaction.
> 
> We have had 74 years of interaction with the world and some of us are tired of the world and the energy we must put into it.  Some of just want to do our own thing and if we need our children’s help or advice we will ask.  It has nothing to do with our children, but this is OUR time to spend it as we wish.
> 
> ...


Thank you for the reply. It could very well be that what me and my sister want or expect out of her has taken a level of importance over her own wants. I would need to think that through more but it's possible. 

I have tried to really gain an inside and promote what she wants or how she wants to conduct her life. However, it's also a tough challenge as her anger, resentment, and overall missing of my father has results in me becoming a dumping ground for it. And it's not in the form of she's sad and misses my father as for that I would be totally comforting. However, when my character starts getting attack and I am the receipt of low blows from a person who never was like that then as most of us we are only human and can only withstand so much.


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## Aneeda72 (Dec 7, 2020)

FrankieD said:


> Thank you for sharing and my condolences to you and your family. I see a lot of similarities and really hope I am able to as least communicate to her properly that she needs proper assistance and treatment.


But what you think is “proper” and what she thinks is proper might be two different things.  Lots of older people on the forum mostly stayed home even before the virus hit.  We are secure and comfortable at home and not as willing to put up with the stupidity of younger people.

I have started refusing certain medical treatment, and I have stopped seeing so many specialists.  That is my right and I would be upset if my children tried to interfere, but they don’t. My mother is 95 years old, a horrible person, just try telling her what to do.  .

She had to move to a new town a few years back because she told a local doctor what he could do with his advice, she was 90 at the time.  All the doctors in that area blacklisted her.   Most older people are not as nasty as she is, but, as I’ve said, we do want our own way.


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## FrankieD (Dec 7, 2020)

Aneeda72 said:


> But what you think is “proper” and what she thinks is proper might be two different things.  Lots of older people on the forum mostly stayed home even before the virus hit.  We are secure and comfortable at home and not as willing to put up with the stupidity of younger people.
> 
> I have started refusing certain medical treatment, and I have stopped seeing so many specialists.  That is my right and I would be upset if my children tried to interfere, but they don’t. My mother is 95 years old, a horrible person, just try telling her what to do.  .
> 
> She had to move to a new town a few years back because she told a local doctor what he could do with his advice, she was 90 at the time.  All the doctors in that area blackballed her.   Most older people are not as nasty as she is, but, as I’ve said, we do want our own way.


I get that for sure. And for the most part I let her conduct things how she wishes to do so. There are just moments like become trying and me seeking advice from this forum is trying to think of new methods for approach.


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## Aneeda72 (Dec 7, 2020)

FrankieD said:


> Thank you for the reply. It could very well be that what me and my sister want or expect out of her has taken a level of importance over her own wants. I would need to think that through more but it's possible.
> 
> I have tried to really gain an inside and promote what she wants or how she wants to conduct her life. However, it's also a tough challenge as her anger, resentment, and overall missing of my father has results in me becoming a dumping ground for it. And it's not in the form of she's sad and misses my father as for that I would be totally comforting. However, when my character starts getting attack and I am the receipt of low blows from a person who never was like that then as most of us we are only human and can only withstand so much.


I agree.  My mother, the last time I visited her said some horrific things to me.  But she has always been abusive and I told her I would not see her again and I have not.  I still keep in phone contact with her.  My mother hated her life and I was, according to her, to blame.

As children we sometimes land between the rock and the hard place.  We have to bear that burden to a limited extent. Thus I take her calls and listen to her crap.  But I will never see her again.

She, your mother, I am sure, had envisioned her life to the end, and deeply resents that her husband died and left her alone to deal with life by herself.  Life can be so overwhelming to a lot of people.  Therefore, she needs someone to blame and there her children are.  Unwilling victims of her might have been dreams.

I am only going to say that take a hard look at what you want for her and then try and see what she wants for herself.  If she wants to be left alone, or if she wants limited interaction, or if she just wants help when she wants help. 

Don’t try and make her into the mother and grandmother YOU envision.  Let her be herself.  Just my opinion.


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## FrankieD (Dec 7, 2020)

Aneeda72 said:


> I agree.  My mother, the last time I visited her said some horrific things to me.  But she has always been abusive and I told her I would not see her again and I have not.  I still keep in phone contact with her.  My mother hated her life and I was, according to her, to blame.
> 
> As children we sometimes land between the rock and the hard place.  We have to bear that burden to a limited extent. Thus I take her calls and listen to her crap.  But I will never see her again.
> 
> ...


Thank you for sharing your experiences. I like that's very valuable insight and it's something that I've been thinking a lot about lately with the route to go with it. 

She needs to at the end of the day get the proper help needed both mentally and physically. If she wants to, I am there and if not I am there just in neutral form. 

My sister is another one that I think I need to chat with about becoming more neutral. She displays an energy that my mother just doesn't react well to.


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## Aneeda72 (Dec 7, 2020)

FrankieD said:


> I get that for sure. And for the most part I let her conduct things how she wishes to do so. There are just moments like become trying and me seeking advice from this forum is trying to think of new methods for approach.


You word choice says a lot here.  You “let” her.  Think about that.


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## hollydolly (Dec 7, 2020)

FrankieD said:


> I didn't see your post. I was under the impression that this forum was for all age ranges. If it's not, then I do apologize.


No need to apologise...this is predominately a 50 plus senior forum, but Admin is the one with the final say , and they've clearly felt  you needed some advice, and permitted your post.. , Merry Christmas to you, and good luck with your mum


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## Judycat (Dec 7, 2020)

Sounds like she's declared her life over. My mom and dad were the same way. I helped where I could and when they reached the point when my help wasn't enough anymore, I had the doctors and the county become involved.  My brother, who was waiting to take over, got wind of this and swooped in and had them sign him on as power of attorney. His daughter and her husband moved in with Mom.  I continued to visit, but Mom and dad didn't like it that I wasn't following their orders anymore. Meanwhile my brother's family were trying to pin me with some form of neglect. Neighbors knew better though and were quick to say so.

My dad died first and my brother who had built a room onto his house for mom took her to his place. She went no contact with me because she felt I should have taken her in. It wouldn't have worked no matter which way I looked at it, and my husband would have demanded she be put into a nursing home at some point, so at least she spent her last days with family. She lived another year. My dad was 84 and she was 83 when they died. They both got and didn't get what they wanted. Life and death are like that. I think people who want to wind down their lives shouldn't be forced to be active, but I also think they shouldn't designate a certain adult child to be the slave to their whims either.


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## jujube (Dec 7, 2020)

I just lost my 95 year old mother a couple of weeks ago. 

She lived her life as she wanted and until four months ago was fully independent.  There were times when I gritted my teeth and internally screamed "MOM, WHAT ARE YOU THINKING?????" but she was an adult and fully competant and could do as she pleased.

You're worried about your mom and you'd like to make her life "better", but sometimes you just have to step back and let what happens....well, happen.

As others have wisely suggested, continue to try to involve her in your family life but if she resists, let her be.


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## Phoenix (Dec 7, 2020)

Maybe you could get her a teddy bear.  Seriously.  It's something to cuddle that does not expect anything.  I'm three years younger than your mom.  I remember when I was 40.  My dad died when I was 34.  Mom was 65.  I helped Mom through the initial stages and then left it up to her what she wanted to do.  It was the right choice even though she was incredibly lonely.  She figured out what to do about it on her own. 

At this point someone 40 seems so very young to me.  Your mother may feel that way too.   If I were her I would want to know that you loved me...you've demonstrated that.  Then I would want to be left to do things my way.   She is an adult.  The choice of what to do with her life is hers.  If someone pushes me at this age, I back away from them.  Just love her.  Just love her and allow her to make her own choices.  I know that's hard.  It was for me with my mom.  Mom lived to be 91.


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## FrankieD (Dec 7, 2020)

Phoenix said:


> Maybe you could get her a teddy bear.  Seriously.  It's something to cuddle that does not expect anything.  I'm three years younger than your mom.  I remember when I was 40.  My dad died when I was 34.  Mom was 65.  I helped Mom through the initial stages and then left it up to her what she wanted to do.  It was the right choice even though she was incredibly lonely.  She figured out what to do about it on her own.
> 
> At this point someone 40 seems so very young to me.  Your mother may feel that way too.   If I were her I would want to know that you loved me...you've demonstrated that.  Then I would want to be left to do things my way.   She is an adult.  The choice of what to do with her life is hers.  If someone pushes me at this age, I back away from them.  Just love her.  Just love her and allow her to make her own choices.  I know that's hard.  It was for me with my mom.  Mom lived to be 91.


Thank you for sharing and for the great advice.


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## Kathleen’s Place (Dec 8, 2020)

asp3 said:


> I lost my mother this year the Friday after Thanksgiving.  It wasn't a surprise overall as she's been in decline for years.  However it happened much more quickly than expected.
> 
> Based on what I saw my mother do I would say do everything you can to get your mother into some sort of mental health treatment.  However once you've done everything you can do to get her into treatment find a way to feel at peace that you did everything you could and be as loving and available for your mother as you can be without it negatively affecting you.
> 
> ...


I suffered from severe depression when I was younger, still do to some extent, and it scares the heck out  me that I could very very easily sink into that hole again. It is like any other mental health disease. Misunderstood by so many who think “snap out of it” is the answer, and so very hard to watch the deterioration by those who love them and can’t do a thing to save them. From my experience, that desire to be saved has to come from within and an awfully, terribly, hard thing to do. This covid thing is really taking it’s toll on me...getting harder and harder to fight the battle to stay above ground mentally, but fight it I do. It seemed easier to fight when I was younger and had more of a life and young kids to fight for. 
I guess what I’m trying to say is that depression is as much of a disease as cancer or any other disease is. And I feel so sorry that both of you had/have to witness it in someone you love so much. Asp, I’m so happy you made peace within yourself, and I know your Mom is happy about that too. And Frankie, I hope you find it too. You both tried and the fact that your efforts didn’t work doesn’t mean your mothers didn’t love you with all of their hearts...it just means for whatever reason they felt safer where they were/are. Hard to explain unless you’ve been there, but never ever think that they are in that place because they don’t/didn’t love you enough to pull themselves out of it. Depression doesn’t work that way. Love and peace to you both


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## grahamg (Dec 8, 2020)

Kathleen’s Place said:


> I suffered from severe depression when I was younger, still do to some extent, and it scares the heck out  me that I could very very easily sink into that hole again. It is like any other mental health disease. Misunderstood by so many who think “snap out of it” is the answer, and so very hard to watch the deterioration by those who love them and can’t do a thing to save them. From my experience, that desire to be saved has to come from within and an awfully, terribly, hard thing to do. This covid thing is really taking it’s toll on me...getting harder and harder to fight the battle to stay above ground mentally, but fight it I do. It seemed easier to fight when I was younger and had more of a life and young kids to fight for.
> I guess what I’m trying to say is that depression is as much of a disease as cancer or any other disease is. And I feel so sorry that both of you had/have to witness it in someone you love so much. Asp, I’m so happy you made peace within yourself, and I know your Mom is happy about that too. And Frankie, I hope you find it too. You both tried and the fact that your efforts didn’t work doesn’t mean your mothers didn’t love you with all of their hearts...it just means for whatever reason they felt safer where they were/are. Hard to explain unless you’ve been there, but never ever think that they are in that place because they don’t/didn’t love you enough to pull themselves out of it. Depression doesn’t work that way. Love and peace to you both


I think it fair to say you've given a lot of insights into yourself there, both in terms of the obvious things you've said, but in the way you've said them too I think.
I was asked by the mental health professionals, (who were all really good to me), what I thought had brought me out of my depression? Well, the first thing to say is they appeared to be as mystified as I was/am, although I did answer news of my first grandson being born was something happening where there were "no negatives" to my mind, and in a sense gave meaning to my life, (even though I've been permitted to see the boy just once at six months of age). The health professionals agreed this was vey positive, and beyond that, as I think I've said before on this forum, as "stranger", or at least someone I didn't know well, played a part, because he encouraged me, in a very good hearted way. He kept doing it too, when he saw signs of progress in me from my very low ebb, he said very simply, "Keep going Graham!", and that mattered a great deal to me.


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