# TUI Boeing 757 Comes into Land Sideways in 40 Knot Crosswind at Bristol Airport During a Storm



## Paco Dennis (Jul 20, 2021)




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## Devi (Jul 20, 2021)

Wow! That's some flying!


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## Geezerette (Jul 20, 2021)

Awesome!


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## Chet (Jul 20, 2021)

In the Air Force they called that "crabbing".


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## Llynn (Jul 20, 2021)

Amazing. Thanks for the share.


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## Cameron (Jul 20, 2021)

Pilots are  underpaid for what they do and responsibility.   Amazing to see that video


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## jujube (Jul 20, 2021)

They're going to have to burn most of the seats after that, I'd imagine.

Give that pilot a raise!


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## cdestroyer (Jul 20, 2021)

that was just plain awesome landing. pilots knew what they were doing there!!!


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## oldman (Jul 20, 2021)

Looks like the pilot used a slip to land his plane.


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## win231 (Jul 20, 2021)

Just makes ya wanna get on a plane...........


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## Tommy (Jul 21, 2021)

oldman said:


> Looks like the pilot used a slip to land his plane.


Having "enjoyed" several such landings myself, I'd be interested to learn more about what that entails.


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## FastTrax (Jul 21, 2021)




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## oldman (Jul 21, 2021)

Tommy said:


> Having "enjoyed" several such landings myself, I'd be interested to learn more about what that entails.


This following excerpt (***) below explains better than I could with writing a bunch of mumbo jumbo that no one understands. When you read the following explanation, keep in mind that airspeed is also very important as well as flaps, ailerons, rudder and elevation above the runway. The pilot knowing what the windspeed and direction of the wind are also something the pilot should be aware of. Yes, it's a tricky move to have to make during a very windy landing. 

***"The most commonly taught crosswind landing technique is the cross-control, or wing-low landing. The *pilot slips the airplane to the runway with just enough cross control* to keep the aircraft aligned with the centerline. Remember that the ailerons control the airplane's lateral movement."


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## Tommy (Jul 22, 2021)

Thanks, oldman!  Are there hard and fast limits on the relative wind direction and wind speed at which this type of landing can be attempted?


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## oldman (Jul 22, 2021)

Tommy said:


> Thanks, oldman!  Are there hard and fast limits on the relative wind direction and wind speed at which this type of landing can be attempted?


Good question. The short and simple answer is yes. Headwinds and tailwinds often aid or hinder flight. Since airplanes depend on wind flowing over the wings (and not thrust as many people believe) headwinds are a plus while in flight, but not excessive headwinds. Excessive headwinds will only slow down the plane. However, a tailwind can push a plane along allowing planes to cover more miles faster while using less fuel and gets the plane to its destination in less time. OTOH, a tailwind on landing is not the best resource for a pilot. Having your plane pushed down the runway can be exciting, but pilots don’t like exciting. (A little humor.) This is where speed comes in. If I land my plane too fast with a tailwind, the plane may eat up more runway surface than expected and then the plane may run out of runway.   When this happens, a plane landing too fast with a strong tailwind, pilots will generally start (what we call) hammering the brakes. It’s important to get the plane down on the runway with all of its landing gears down on the runway, so the plane is balanced and the braking is more central. It’s not a good situation to be in. This is just a short composite of what is necessary to make a good landing. Having good takeoffs and landings both come with experience. There is more to making a good landing than I have only touched on, but it would take a whole lot of typing to write it all out, so I apologize for this condensed version. 

You come across as a smart person. I hope I haven’t confused you.


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## oldman (Jul 27, 2021)

I got to thinking about my time in the 747 and decided to put those thoughts on paper and allow others to read how I advanced in my career. Only a few people are interested in things like this, but what the heck. Here it is anyway. 

I have only ever flown Boeing jets, other than when I first started flying commercial and flew the "puddle jumpers." Once while I was in Seattle, I went out to Everett, Washington to tour the Boeing plant that then manufactured the B-747. I had flown the B-727, 737 and the 757/767. After I toured that plant, I wanted to fly the 747-8 (800 series) because I was really impressed with the technology and the avionics onboard, so when I returned to my home airport, there happened to be job postings from my employer, United, which was offering pilots that were interested to apply for the Chicago-Honolulu route flying the B-747. The job posting also mentioned that there would be training opportunities for pilots that were seriously interested. I decided to give it a go and glad that I did. 

After two interviews, I received notice that I would be accepted, provided I did well in the simulators and then passed my check flights, which is a flight where you fly the aircraft and are evaluated by an experienced pilot on that particular plane. It took me two flights to get through all of the requirements because during my first check flight, we had terrible weather over the Pacific. During the first check flight, we hit a few pockets of clear air turbulence over the Pacific, which the check-pilot told me to turn off the autopilot and hand fly the plane.  It kind of made my check flight anything but routine.

I really enjoyed my time in the 747. What a plane. It was everything I thought it would be and more. Very easy to fly. Sorry to see that it was retired by United.


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## cdestroyer (Jul 27, 2021)

flying a 747 any version is like flying a brick,,, actually any of them big planes.. they dont turn on a dime, they dont excelerate fast and you cant land just any ol place.. i prefer choppers, not easy to fly but you can fly in most any directions, up down sideways backward or hover in place and land just about anywhere,. its only fault is if the power fails it drops like a rock


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## oldman (Jul 28, 2021)

cdestroyer said:


> flying a 747 any version is like flying a brick,,, actually any of them big planes.. they don't turn on a dime, they don't accelerate fast and you can't land just any old place.. I prefer choppers, not easy to fly but you can fly in most any directions, up down sideways backward or hover in place and land just about anywhere,. its only fault is if the power fails it drops like a rock


Yes, they are a big cumbersome airplane, but safe as all get out. 
I flew in helicopters in the Marines, but never felt very safe.


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## Been There (Aug 1, 2021)

oldman said:


> I got to thinking about my time in the 747 and decided to put those thoughts on paper and allow others to read how I advanced in my career. Only a few people are interested in things like this, but what the heck. Here it is anyway.
> 
> I have only ever flown Boeing jets, other than when I first started flying commercial and flew the "puddle jumpers." Once while I was in Seattle, I went out to Everett, Washington to tour the Boeing plant that then manufactured the B-747. I had flown the B-727, 737 and the 757/767. After I toured that plant, I wanted to fly the 747-8 (800 series) because I was really impressed with the technology and the avionics onboard, so when I returned to my home airport, there happened to be job postings from my employer, United, which was offering pilots that were interested to apply for the Chicago-Honolulu route flying the B-747. The job posting also mentioned that there would be training opportunities for pilots that were seriously interested. I decided to give it a go and glad that I did.
> 
> ...


Which plane were you flying before transitioning to the 747? How long did you fly it and did you only fly the 747 to Hawaii?


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## LittleRed (Aug 1, 2021)

That certainly was some expert flying!  Reminds me of one evening when I was making dinner for my dad and he started playing several cross wind landings.  Not sure of what airport it was, however, not only were there dangerous cross winds, but also the runway was like a roller coaster!  Don't know why they couldn't have flattened out that runway.


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## oldman (Aug 2, 2021)

Been There said:


> Which plane were you flying before transitioning to the 747? How long did you fly it and did you only fly the 747 to Hawaii?


At the time when I made the switch to the 747, I had been flying the 757/767, which I later returned to. I flew the 747 for two years and only flew it from Chicago nonstop to Honolulu and Lihue in Kauai. United allows pilots to switch between the 757 and 767 because the avionics are mostly identical. When I flew the 747, I only flew to either Honolulu or Kauai. United no longer flies to Lihue (Kauai) I am told. Too bad. It’s a beautiful place. Orchids grow wild on that island.


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## oldman (Aug 2, 2021)

Been There said:


> Which plane were you flying before transitioning to the 747? How long did you fly it and did you only fly the 747 to Hawaii?


Did you fly commercial or just military? What plane or planes did you fly and did you fly off of carriers?


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## oldman (Aug 4, 2021)

My last flight in the 747 was from Honolulu to Chicago. Full plane and we are about 1 mile from the airport and about 500 feet off the ground. I look out at the runway and I see a plane just starting to cross our runway. We had to abort the landing and go around. Scary situation, but we had enough time and distance to abort. Doing that does rattle the passengers a bit though. 

Later after landing, we were told that the pilot of an AeroMexico 737 was lost on the airfield.


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## Feelslikefar (Aug 4, 2021)

While stationed at Shemya AFB, Alaska, watching the planes handle the cross winds on our island was always exciting.
Since Reeve Aleutian Airways ( Lockheed Electra ) flew to our station every Tuesday and Thursday, 
we greeted each plane as something to break the boredom.

The RC-135 Cobra Ball seemed to handle things fairly well, but the Electra always seem to be 'Crabbing' just before touchdown.


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## dobielvr (Aug 4, 2021)

That's all really fascinating you guys.........reading about how you piloted all these planes.

And the BIG ones too!


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## oldman (Aug 5, 2021)

Feelslikefar said:


> While stationed at Shemya AFB, Alaska, watching the planes handle the cross winds on our island was always exciting.
> Since Reeve Aleutian Airways ( Lockheed Electra ) flew to our station every Tuesday and Thursday,
> we greeted each plane as something to break the boredom.
> 
> The RC-135 Cobra Ball seemed to handle things fairly well, but the Electra always seem to be 'Crabbing' just before touchdown.


I know very little about the planes ,mentioned, but I know a pilot at AA that flew the Lockheed Electra. I forget what model, but he also flew in the military, which I never did. I wanted to, but was rejected. The reason that was given to me was that I was too tall. At 6'4", that is pretty hard to believe, even back in the 60's. I later knew pilots at United, American and US Air that were taller than me and they flew in the military.

I remember seeing a Lockheed Constellation. What a beautiful plane she was.


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## oldman (Aug 5, 2021)

dobielvr said:


> That's all really fascinating you guys.........reading about how you piloted all these planes.
> 
> And the BIG ones too!


Glad you enjoy the stories here. There are plenty to write about, but most of them are not very exciting. I never crashed or even came close to it. Never had to ditch my plane. When I flew the 747 and had that plane crossing my runway, I thought that I was going to have to change my undershorts. Had we been a little more closer to landing, I may not have been able to see the runway, then we probably wouldn't be having this conversation. 

When landing, pilots have what is called a decision height, which is when they need to decide whether to abort the landing or to continue it. For most of us, the decision height was/is 200 feet. I know that doesn't sound like a lot, but in a big plane, (jets mostly), we can spool up the engines and get the plane back in the air pretty quickly to do what is called a "Go Around" or a TOGA, which stand for "Take Off Go Around." 

When pilots do a go around, it kind of scares some of the passengers. They know we are going to land because we told them so. They heard the landing gears drop down and so now they expect to hear the bump when the plane sets down. The plane's engines are fairly quiet just before landing, so when the pilot has to spool the engines back up to be able to climb, people get nervous and think some pretty crazy stuff. To quell some of their emotions, one of us in the cockpit must try to get on the intercom ASAP and announce to everyone what's happening. I think as long as pilots give a reasonable explanation as to what we are doing, it eases their fears.


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## dobielvr (Aug 5, 2021)

What did you think of Sully's miraculous landing years ago in the Hudson?

Also, I always wondered what the depth was of the water where he landed...If told , I don't remember.


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## oldman (Aug 5, 2021)

It was near the end of my career and on a clear Wednesday afternoon in Miami when we were preparing to land. We were given permission and given our runway number for landing, which matched what we had on our flight plan, so there would be no runway change. Pilots hate it when their runway is changed from what was given to them in their flight plan.

We were in our final approach and at about 2500 feet. The controller tells us that our gate is blocked by another United plane and maintenance is doing a tire change. They were being told that it would still be about 15 minutes before the plane would be ready for pushback. I asked for a parking spot on the tarmac, but the controller said he wasn't able to provide one at that time, so I asked him what are we suppose to do. He asked me how much fuel I had remaining. I lied and told him maybe about 20-30 minutes, which we did have about an hour remaining. The controller became quiet. I thought he was asking me how much fuel I had because he was going to put me in a holding pattern, which is never a good thing and that is why I told him it was less than what we did have.

A minute or so later, I asked if I could get another gate. Again, he says no, all gates are either full or will be shortly. I asked again, what were we supposed to do. He asks me what do you want to do. I told him that I wanted to land. He tells me OK, land. I ask him, then what. He tells me that he will have a plan for me when I land. I ask for vectors to the outer marker and now we are back into our landing sequence. Just as we are touching down, the controller tells us to exit at Taxiway Delta (D) and proceed to Taxiway Foxtrot (F) that is not being used and park. OK, so now we sit for almost a half hour, burning fuel and with passengers busting at the seams to deplane. This is what our life (as part of a flight crew) is like sometimes.


dobielvr said:


> What did you think of Sully's miraculous landing years ago in the Hudson?
> 
> Also, I always wondered what the depth was of the water where he landed...If told , I don't remember.


I'm not sure of the depth myself, but with it being a river (Hudson River), I would guess it to be less than 50 feet. 
I thought he did an excellent job of landing (ditching) his plane in the Hudson. The irony is that I can remember reading an article in our pilot's magazine that Sully had written about water landings. He was considered an expert in this field. I also went to see the movie and even though it did have some Hollywood propaganda crap in it, I thought it was well done. Sully got all the honors that he was worthy to receive. 

I also want add that pilots who often fly over large bodies of water will practice ditching while in a simulator. Unlike landing in a river, landing in an ocean is a much greater challenge due to the waves and tides. Often, the plane will be either rolled or tossed on its side. Either movement will cause the plane to possibly tear apart or perhaps tear a hole in the side. Landing in a river is more predictable and is more controllable, but landing in an ocean, well, it may be lights out.


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## dobielvr (Aug 5, 2021)

Interesting info oldman.

I can imagine with your description the fright  and danger associated w/landing in a river vs landing in an ocean!


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## Been There (Aug 8, 2021)

oldman said:


> Did you fly commercial or just military? What plane or planes did you fly and did you fly off of carriers?


I still fly my little private prop plane which is the Cessna 172 and is very popular for many small fixed wing pilots and other airplane enthusiasts that enjoy owning their own plane. Maintenance and upkeep is affordable for most of us who are now back in civilian life. The fuel is the most expensive item for me now that I have to pay my own bills.

While in the military, I mainly flew the F/A 18 Hornet. Sure I flew off and onto carriers. I was an active aviator in the Marines for 16 years. My first assignment was into the middle east.


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## FastTrax (Aug 9, 2021)

dobielvr said:


> What did you think of Sully's miraculous landing years ago in the Hudson?
> 
> Also, I always wondered what the depth was of the water where he landed...If told , I don't remember.





oldman said:


> It was near the end of my career and on a clear Wednesday afternoon in Miami when we were preparing to land. We were given permission and given our runway number for landing, which matched what we had on our flight plan, so there would be no runway change. Pilots hate it when their runway is changed from what was given to them in their flight plan.
> 
> We were in our final approach and at about 2500 feet. The controller tells us that our gate is blocked by another United plane and maintenance is doing a tire change. They were being told that it would still be about 15 minutes before the plane would be ready for pushback. I asked for a parking spot on the tarmac, but the controller said he wasn't able to provide one at that time, so I asked him what are we suppose to do. He asked me how much fuel I had remaining. I lied and told him maybe about 20-30 minutes, which we did have about an hour remaining. The controller became quiet. I thought he was asking me how much fuel I had because he was going to put me in a holding pattern, which is never a good thing and that is why I told him it was less than what we did have.
> 
> ...





dobielvr said:


> Interesting info oldman.
> 
> I can imagine with your description the fright  and danger associated w/landing in a river vs landing in an ocean!



Hey oldman didn't we have a thread somewhere about 1549 in the Earthsciences or Travel subforums? I know we did a comprehensive thing on it somewhere but I can't find it.

Anyway here is the Hudson River stuff.











https://nauticalcharts.noaa.gov/publications/coast-pilot/files/cp2/CPB2_C12_WEB.pdf

www.untappedcities.com/2017/03/30/the-top-10-secrets-of-the-hudson-river-nyc/

https://dec.ny.gov/lands/4923.html

www.janetpanic.com/where-is-the-deepest-part-of-the-hudson-river/

www.bwog.com/2019/03/back-of-the-envelope-bodies-in-the-hudson/

www.nytimes.com/2009/02/25/nyregion/25crash.html

www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=121345792

www.wired.com/2010/05/ntsb-makes-recommendations-after-miracle-on-the-hudson-investigation/

https://abcnews.go.com/travel/story?id=6811078&page=1

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hudson_River

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/US_Airways_Flight_1549

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sully_Sullenberger

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Highest_Duty


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## oldman (Aug 10, 2021)

FastTrax said:


> Hey oldman didn't we have a thread somewhere about 1549 in the Earthsciences or Travel subforums? I know we did a comprehensive thing on it somewhere but I can't find it.
> 
> Anyway here is the Hudson River stuff.
> 
> ...


What a day that was. If we didn't believe in miracles before this happened, we should now.


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## Been There (Aug 14, 2021)

I agree. Sullenberger’s landing on the Hudson was a miracle. Kudos to him.
On one flight over the Med, we were still 6 miles from the carrier when we had engine failure. After three attempts to do a restart, I informed  the Air Boss on the carrier that we were preparing to eject. He had our position and was alerting the ship’s Commander. I tried another restart with no luck. As I placed my hand on the ejection lever, I gave it one last try. Luck was with us on that day. We had a restart and landed on the deck safely. Maintenance told us that we had a faulty oxygen module in the engine.


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## Nathan (Aug 14, 2021)

Chet said:


> In the Air Force they called that "crabbing".


I would call that "crapping"...in one's pants!


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## oldman (Aug 16, 2021)

Whenever I see the US Air plane in the river as in the picture above, I get a flashback of the Florida Air jet that left Washington going down to Florida. On takeoff, the pilot barely got the plane airborne. It struck a railing on a bridge over the Potomac, hit a car and then ditched the plane into the Potomac on a very cold, snowy day. One hero jumped into the freezing water to rescue one passenger. A few others survived, but most of the passengers perished in the water.

The NTSB investigation showed the plane had icing on the wings. It’s true that planes can fly with a very light coating of ice on the wings, however, this plane had been sitting at the gate and then taxied out and then sat in line waiting for departure clearance. These delays caused severe icing on the wings. According to the NTSB, the Captain thought if he could get close enough to the plane in front of him while in line, the heat from the plane’s exhaust would melt the ice. This is rushing it and being in too much of a hurry. The Captain did not want the delay he would have had with getting out of line and having the plane deiced. 

Plain foolishness. That’s taking chances and one thing all pilots learn early in our careers is to never take chances. Planes do not always give a second chance.


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