# "6-Feet Social Distance, 60 Feet.  No Difference"



## win231 (Apr 26, 2021)

Maybe that's why the "Experts" weren't practicing what they preached?
https://www.yahoo.com/news/staying-6-feet-apart-indoors-112732760.html


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## officerripley (Apr 26, 2021)

I notice the article did say that _*masks *_were still useful: "[The MIT researchers] said other variables - like the number of people in a space, whether they wear masks, what they are doing, and the level of ventilation - were much more important."


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## Sunny (Apr 26, 2021)

The scary thing about this new finding is that restaurants are pretty dangerous. It sounds like it doesn't matter how widely spaced the tables are. You are at the same risk from someone 60 feet away.


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## win231 (Apr 27, 2021)

officerripley said:


> I notice the article did say that _*masks *_were still useful: "[The MIT researchers] said other variables - like the number of people in a space, whether they wear masks, what they are doing, and the level of ventilation - were much more important."


Yes, they said "Masks were still useful - like they said about 6 feet distancing.
What do you suppose they'll be saying about masks in a few weeks?  Perhaps what Fauci said earlier - that they were useless?


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## squatting dog (Apr 27, 2021)

Borrowed this from another site I go to. From someone who works in the industry of  "Respiratory Protection via Tight Fitting, Ambient Air Filtering facepieces". (aka masks).

From my observations, there is virtually nobody bothering to ensure that their masks or gaiters, or anything else they put over their faces fits and seals out ambient air, disregarding any filtering properties that the mask may or may not have. I see a lot of masks perched on upper lips, with the nose exposed.

So then I investigated the size of a virus. I found that it varies with the strain of virus, but they range from a couple hundred NANO meters down to a couple dozen nanometers. That is small. A Micron is 10 to the -6 meters, or a millionth of a meter. A nanometer is 10 to the -9 meters, one thousandth of a micron, or three orders of magnitude smaller than a micron. Information on microns and nanometers:
So, here it is: To protect against a particle that is so small it requires a filter that can remove 99.97% of all particles down to .3 microns in size, plus rigorous, documented verification of the integrity of the face to facepiece seal. Yet, for an even smaller hazard, one that is anywhere from 20 to 100 times smaller than the smallest asbestos fiber, we can just wrap a rag or piece of filter paper around our face, let gaping openings at the sides, nose and chin and we are told that will ward off the most deadly world wide pandemic of our lifetime.
That means that a P100 respirator filter, the best available, which is effective down to .3 microns particle size, can only filter out the very largest of viruses. .3 microns is 300 nanometers. The SARS virus, which I understand is a close relative to the Corona Virus Disease (COVID)19, is 60 to 140 nanometers in size.


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## Sunny (Apr 27, 2021)

So, the best conclusion we can reach at this point in time is:  get the damn vaccine! All these other things were measures designed to at least partially protect us before there was a vaccine available.  Once we are vaccinated, we don't have to spend every waking minute worrying about distances between people, whether the masks work or not, whether to keep sterilizing everything, etc.  The anti-vaxxers are coming up with their usual scare stories; they are aimed at those who are easily scared by fictitious anti-science claims. Those ridiculous claims have been around forever, since the first vaccine was invented.

There is a huge sigh of relief in my community, since pretty much everybody has gotten the vaccine by now. And I haven't heard of a single vaccinated person getting Covid, or getting seriously ill from the vaccine itself. I had something like the flu for one day after getting the second Pfizer shot. That's the worst reaction I've heard of anyone around here, anyway, having to the shot. A small price to pay for remaining alive.


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## StarSong (Apr 27, 2021)

squatting dog said:


> So then I investigated the size of a virus. I found that it varies with the strain of virus, but they range from a couple hundred NANO meters down to a couple dozen nanometers. That is small. A Micron is 10 to the -6 meters, or a millionth of a meter. A nanometer is 10 to the -9 meters, one thousandth of a micron, or three orders of magnitude smaller than a micron. Information on microns and nanometers:
> So, here it is: To protect against a particle that is so small it requires a filter that can remove 99.97% of all particles down to .3 microns in size, plus rigorous, documented verification of the integrity of the face to facepiece seal. Yet, for an even smaller hazard, one that is anywhere from 20 to 100 times smaller than the smallest asbestos fiber, we can just wrap a rag or piece of filter paper around our face, let gaping openings at the sides, nose and chin and we are told that will ward off the most deadly world wide pandemic of our lifetime.
> That means that a P100 respirator filter, the best available, which is effective down to .3 microns particle size, can only filter out the very largest of viruses. .3 microns is 300 nanometers. The SARS virus, which I understand is a close relative to the Corona Virus Disease (COVID)19, is 60 to 140 nanometers in size.


If we exhaled only the virus particles this would hold true.  However, those virus particles hitchhike their way out of our bodies on water droplets and water vapor which are considerably larger than the virus itself. 

The vapor and droplets are caught by masks, which is how my mask protects you (by catching any vapor/virus particles I might exhale) and your mask protects me from whatever you're exhaling.


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## Becky1951 (Apr 27, 2021)

When in doubt wear a mask. I do believe wearing masks helps protect you, also washing hands and using sanitizer.


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## squatting dog (Apr 27, 2021)

StarSong said:


> If we exhaled only the virus particles this would hold true.  However, those virus particles hitchhike their way out of our bodies on water droplets and water vapor which are considerably larger than the virus itself.
> 
> The vapor and droplets are caught by masks, which is how my mask protects you (by catching any vapor/virus particles I might exhale) and your mask protects me from whatever you're exhaling.


So then, you're ok with people who improperly wear a mask? (not tight fitting, used multiple times, etc)


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## Marie5656 (Apr 27, 2021)

*I go with I do what I can. I do always wear my mask in public. Try for the 6 feet, but with family, and closer friends (and I include friends I have made in my apartment building) not so much.  We keep a distance, but have relaxed thigs some.  In my building (seniors only) everyone has been vaccinated, so not as much of a concern.*


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## squatting dog (Apr 27, 2021)




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## digifoss (Apr 27, 2021)

I do avoid crowds, masked or not masked, but I've noticed that Walmart, WellsFargo and all of the other businesses around here that had their cute little floor stickers saying to stay 6 feet apart have removed them all.


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## squatting dog (Apr 27, 2021)

StarSong said:


> If we exhaled only the virus particles this would hold true.  However, those virus particles hitchhike their way out of our bodies on water droplets and water vapor which are considerably larger than the virus itself.
> 
> The vapor and droplets are caught by masks, which is how my mask protects you (by catching any vapor/virus particles I might exhale) and your mask protects me from whatever you're exhaling.


Not really. Let's try it this as a close comparison to covid droplets hitchhiking.
Let's release a cloud of tear gas/mace/pepper spray, as an analog for a cloud of spray from someone who has just exhaled, and walk, not run, through it breathing normally. You wear your cloth facemask and I'll wear a tight fitting, air purifying respirator with OV/P100 cartridges.


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## StarSong (Apr 27, 2021)

squatting dog said:


> Not really. Let's try it this as a close comparison to covid droplets hitchhiking.
> Let's release a cloud of tear gas/mace/pepper spray, as an analog for a cloud of spray from someone who has just exhaled, and walk, not run, through it breathing normally. You wear your cloth facemask and I'll wear a tight fitting, air purifying respirator with OV/P100 cartridges.


Here's the deal - don't wear a face mask if you don't believe in it.  
To quote an old friend of mine, It won't make me no difference.


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## squatting dog (Apr 27, 2021)




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## StarSong (Apr 27, 2021)

squatting dog said:


> View attachment 162134


As if...  

Here's the thing.  I don't care if you're disobedient (Wow! Way to rage against the machine!), nor do I perceive mask wearing or the lack thereof as a sign of strength or weakness.  

Mostly I prefer not to see non-maskers at all, but if I must, I certainly prefer to see them from a distance.


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## Jeweltea (Apr 27, 2021)

Did anyone actually read the study that this article was about? The link is in the article. Most of it was certainly above my level of education, but it did say that masks make a dramatic difference. There were articles written many months ago about aerosols and how people were being infected much further away than 6 feet so that makes sense. I think I will trust the people who did this study and continue to wear a mask indoors, rather than people who do not have the education to back up their claims.


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## Sunny (Apr 28, 2021)

Yesterday, we were told that for those who have received the vaccine, wearing a mask outdoors is now unnecessary. Big relief for me, since I find it difficult to breathe while walking energetically with a mask on.

Indoors, everybody around here continues to wear a mask, except when eating or drinking in a restaurant, when it's obviously impossible.


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## win231 (Apr 28, 2021)

Yesterday, our president was talking about the new mask policy & he said, "If you get vaccinated, you can do more stuff."
LOL - "Reward system"


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## Jeweltea (Apr 28, 2021)

win231 said:


> Yesterday, our president was talking about the new mask policy & he said, "If you get vaccinated, you can do more stuff."
> LOL - "Reward system"


It is a reward if you can do stuff and not get Covid.


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## digifoss (Apr 28, 2021)

win231 said:


> Yesterday, our president was talking about the new mask policy & he said, "If you get vaccinated, you can do more stuff."
> LOL - "Reward system"


Reward System; as in a free tank of gas ?, a $25 Walmart gift certificate ?  Nice.  Issuing guidelines are great, they can be very helpful, but when he starts talking about them as if it's what we are "allowed" to do,  his imagination is working overtime and I reach for the off button.


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