# Working With Our Hands: What skills should we all develop?



## MercyL (Jun 17, 2013)

I bet most of us attended school when gender roles were much narrower. Male students took shop class while female students studied home economics, and males earned letter jackets while females had to date a jock to get anywhere near one.  Today, everyone takes home economics, under a different name like "Single Living Seminar" or "clothing design". Female students work on cars beside their male counterparts.

This general exposure to tools and machinery does not last a lifetime without practice and most college graduates cannot change a tire.

I am fortunate in having sons who do not see working with your hands as some odd form of degradation, but I know several parents whose grown children are still living in the basement because the cannot find work. These graduates followed the "party line", shunning vocational skills for masters' degrees in finance or business administration, but are ill prepared to start their own businesses providing much needed light, but physical, labor.

My maternal grandfather believed that being able to work with your hands could save you from homelessness by providing an income stream. This latest depression has driven this point home, but high schools still push the 4 year degree as the logical end to compulsory education. They are not preparing students for life, they are preparing them for more school.

Some marketable skills require at least 1 more year of post secondary vocational education, and some do not. Instead of paying for classes these vocational skills can be learned through a family business, or the tutelage of an older relative - the relative that says everyone should be able to work with their hands.

I think everyone should know at least one "craft", like sewing or knitting. You can earn money with sewing skills creating custom designs and by making alterations for others. You can sell your original knitting patterns or finished items, and can knit custom designs for "wealthy" clients.

If your grandson or grand daughter asked which vocational skills everyone should have or learn, what would your answer be?


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## rkunsaw (Jun 17, 2013)

Everyone should know the basics of all the skills needed around a home.

Electric, plumbing, carpentry, machinery repair, and I would add gardening.

Learning to cook is a skill needed for both sexes too.


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## JustBonee (Jun 17, 2013)

rkunsaw said:


> Electric, plumbing, carpentry, machinery repair


...  

Would be great to have these skills as a woman, but I can't wrap my feeble brain around this stuff.  I do know how to use a hammer, screwdriver, and even a hand saw, but power tools scare the heck out of me!  :nightmare:


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## SeaBreeze (Jun 17, 2013)

It's awesome to be able to do all those things TWHRider! :coolthumb:  Gotta be a good feeling to know you can repair and construct things without help.  The fact that your Mr. is also talented is a big plus too!

My hubby has maintained all of our vehicles since I've been with him (around 40 years), and also fixed plumbing and installed ceiling fans, etc. around the house.  I'd have to hire out for all those if he wasn't there.  I'm only good at grunt work, like cleaning, painting, etc.  I can change a flat tire, etc. but don't use too many power tools.


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## Happyflowerlady (Jun 18, 2013)

Wow, TWH Rider, you are amazing !  I am not mechanical at all.  I don't understand the first thing about a machine, and the only nail that I can for sure hit, is the one on my THUMB ! 
I have a friend that is mechanical like you, and she is the one that hangs the ceiling fans in her family, too. We once went on a trip from Idaho to California to visit her mom, and my old Datsun pickup blew a head gasket ( or something like that), and she was working on that little truck most of the way down there. We ended up driving at about 30 mph, and pouring in water every few miles all the way to California, but we made it, thanks to God and Nyla.

And how did we get back home, you ask....
Well, that was even more amazing. Her mom had the church praying for the Datsun, and there were several other churches having revival, so that little truck was strongly prayed for by the time we left. 
We started at 30mph,  and when it didn't overheat, we just slowly kept speeding up, and saying a prayer, and went all the way back home at 55 mph, and hardly had to add water.
(Once we got home, it overheated again, but my husband was there to fix it, so it was ok.)

But, as for helpful skills, I think definitely, that is important. Cooking is good. So are some mechanical skills, if you can manage that. Find what you have a knack for, and develop in that area.


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## SifuPhil (Jun 18, 2013)

Working with our hands?

I vote for self-defense and sex. Not at the same time, of course. Although there WAS this one gal that ...

On a more serious note (LAAAAAA), I'm the proud owner of the ability to accomplish most of the household, automotive and domestic tasks needed to survive. My weakest areas are cooking and sewing - in both I practice Bachelor Survival skills (BS skills) at a *Level 3* - enough to get by, but I won't win any praise from spectators.

I used to own a commercial cleaning company, so I'm OCD on cleaning, at least for pay. But I DO have the necessary knowledge, so *Level 8*.

House maintenance - *Level 8*. Auto maintenance - *Level 6* on the old cars, *Level 2* on the new ones.  

Self-defense - *Level 9*. 

Sex - *email for details*. 


I can't speak for the fairer sex (because I'm old-fashioned) but I think that _guys_ should have at least a modicum of ability in these fields, both to survive and to have a back-up plan for when that fancy college degree turns out to be useless.


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## That Guy (Jun 18, 2013)

I'm a strong proponent of the Three Rs:  Readin', 'Ritin' 'n' 'Rithmatic.  These are survival skills paramount to a happy, successful life.  I also believe in learning basic outdoor skill like we did in The Boy Scouts:  build a fire, catch food, sleep on the ground.  Most important, though, I would encourage young people to follow their own path.  Dreams do not necessarily come to fruition, but the honest work in that struggle will often lead to fulfilling self discovery.

I would also recommend dumpster diving . . .


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## JustBonee (Jun 18, 2013)

That Guy said:


> I would also recommend dumpster diving . . .



???  lol .. never know what or who you might find in there!!


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## That Guy (Jun 18, 2013)

Boo's Mom said:


> ???  lol .. never know what or who you might find in there!!


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## TICA (Jun 18, 2013)

*TWHRider *I have to meet you face to face.  An amazing women!!!!  I have taken numerous wood working courses, have table saws, reciprocating saws, jigsaws, a bunch of drills, cement mixer, etc etc.  The noise still scares me to death, but I try.  I don't go near  electricity or cars, have only been pumping my own gas the last few years and that's as far as I will go.  I did change a brake light last week so I guess that is progress but haven't a clue about engines and don't care to learn.   If you run out of projects, come visit and I'll put you to work with lots of food and beverages as your reward.


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## SifuPhil (Jun 18, 2013)

That Guy said:


> I would also recommend dumpster diving . . .



Heck, if I found a mother-lode like this I'd dive in head first and OD on carbs ...



Seriously, dumpster-diving IS a survival skill one would need when the SHTF - good call.


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## Pappy (Jun 19, 2013)

That Guy said:


> I'm a strong proponent of the Three Rs:  Readin', 'Ritin' 'n' 'Rithmatic.  These are survival skills paramount to a happy, successful life.  I also believe in learning basic outdoor skill like we did in The Boy Scouts:  build a fire, catch food, sleep on the ground.  Most important, though, I would encourage young people to follow their own path.  Dreams do not necessarily come to fruition, but the honest work in that struggle will often lead to fulfilling self discovery.
> 
> I would also recommend dumpster diving . . .



I once tried this That Guy. Damn near drowned in some old stale pizza sauce....


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## Happyflowerlady (Jun 19, 2013)

One skill that I have found to be of a lot of use to me in my life, and that I would recommend to my family ( and did my best  to teach my kids) is the art of barter, or negotiating.  I realize that his is not the same as a skill we learn to do with our hands, like the cooking and sewing survival skills, but, nevertheless , it can be very helpful. 

You may be able to trade something that you can do or make, for something that you can't do or make, so it will often make your life much easier if you can barter. Negotiating price is even better, and you will be surprised at how much you can save by simply making an offer on something, and there is nothing to lose by trying.

The kids dad used to walk away and hide if I was negotiating for something, I embarrassed him so much ; but he would send me, when he wanted something and didn't want to pay what was being asked for It.
At least,  the kids usually watched, and have learned to be pretty good at negotiating also.


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## rkunsaw (Jun 20, 2013)

As a retired tool & die maker, I'm used to building things. The dam project was something beyond anything I'd ever tried before but it turned out fairly well.

When you own a home, especially if you have acres of land, raise animals, grow a garden, etc. you have to learn to do things yourself. Besides it's more rewarding to have something you built yourself instead of having someone build it for you.


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## SifuPhil (Jun 20, 2013)

Happyflowerlady said:


> One skill that I have found to be of a lot of use to me in my life, and that I would recommend to my family ( and did my best  to teach my kids) is the art of barter, or negotiating.  I realize that his is not the same as a skill we learn to do with our hands, like the cooking and sewing survival skills, but, nevertheless , it can be very helpful ...



Bartering is one skill I never developed, much to my sorrow. There were many times it would have been a useful ability to have, but I'm the kind that always caves under pressure when I want something - I pretty much get down on my knees, throw all my money at the seller and beg them to allow me to buy it.

... it isn't pretty ...


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## That Guy (Jun 20, 2013)




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## SifuPhil (Jun 20, 2013)

The black belt got me excited for a moment, but I saw it wasn't karate-related. 

The ranch corn nuts have potential, though ... maybe they'd trade for my gently-used computer -


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## JustBonee (Jun 20, 2013)

Barter?  I had my chance to barter on a Cancun vacation and blew it!  I was told the merchants peddling things expect it and raise their prices to the American tourists on purpose.   So when I saw this canvas bag I wanted, I asked how much .. was told $20, and I said OK!  Paid for it and left.  They must have had a good laugh over that.

Good thing I don't go car shopping too much .. :lol:


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## Happyflowerlady (Jun 20, 2013)

Oh, Boo's Mom, I have done that very thing myself ! 
Long ago, I actually went on a trip to California, and made a day trip into Mexico, just to look and shop. I found peacock feather earrings, and had to have a pair of them.... Talked the guy down from $20 to only $13, paid for them, put on my earrings, and went happily on down the street.

 Little Mexican guys were soon chasing me down the street to sell me more peacock earrings, and by the end of the day, I had acquired about 6 pair, at decreasing prices for each pair, and sure that I had finally done well negotiating for them.

A day or so later, we had made it as far as Phoenix, Arizona, (and guess what !) ..... They had a HUGE flea market out there, and the peacock earrings at the flea market were only about $4 each, way less than I had paid for even the cheapest ones in Mexico.
But it was a fun experience, and I had enough peacock feather earrings to share with all my friends and family when I returned back home, not to mention, a great story to tell them....


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## That Guy (Jun 20, 2013)

I, too, cannot barter a price well.  If the guy says the price is $20 then the price is $20.  I just don't want to put the energy into trying to get the damned thing for $19.


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## Happyflowerlady (Jun 20, 2013)

That Guy said:


> I, too, cannot barter a price well.  If the guy says the price is $20 then the price is $20.  I just don't want to put the energy into trying to get the damned thing for $19.



You never know what will happen, until you try. I always assume that someone has overpriced something, so that they have room to come down, and still get what they want for the item. Sometimes though, you can be way wrong on this...

Once, I went to look at a saddle, offered for $50. (It was old and well used). I decided that I would be ok if I got it for around $35, so I offered the people $20 for the saddle. 
We sat there , she looked at him, he looked back at her, and then they both nodded their head, and  said, yes, they would take the $20. 

I  bought the saddle, but I really felt bad that I got it that cheap. I only wanted a good price, not to steal the saddle from them. But I could not very well offer to pay them more, after they accepted the $20, so I gave them the money, thanked them for the saddle, and took it home and cleaned it up. It was actually a good saddle for me for quite a while afterwards.


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## SifuPhil (Jun 21, 2013)

I've heard that in certain cultures it's seen as an insult if you don't attempt to bargain-down a seller. Don't remember exactly but the Arabic countries come to mind - probably the original horse-traders. 

"_What?!? You ask me to lower the price of this fine stallion?!? I should take the food from my children's mouths and allow them to starve?!? You will put me out of business, Allah be praised!!! I will be destitute!!!_ "


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## Happyflowerlady (Jun 25, 2013)

Sifu, it really is a lot of fun to negotiate for the price on something, and unless you have found one of those "not a penny less" people, who set the price in concrete , it can be a great way to buy or sell something, with both parties coming away pleased at the sale.
One of the main requirements, is that it is important to buy something when you DON'T need it, and the other guy DOES need to sell it.
 That way, you can decide your price limits , and if you don't get it for that price, and you walk away empty handed , it is no big thing. If you are buying something that you absolutely need right away, then you are in the position that you described earlier, of throwing your money at them, while begging to buy that item.

With the economy struggling along, I believe that any time that we can trade something we don't need, and get something we want, and no money is exchanged, we come out ahead. And even when we pay for something, say at a yard sale, at least there are no taxes involved, so we still save a bit.
I keep a close watch on Craigslist for things I would like to acquire, and now and then, a good deal pops up, and I do my best to grab it, and have saved money this way.


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## That Guy (Jun 25, 2013)




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## SifuPhil (Jun 26, 2013)

Happyflowerlady said:


> Sifu, it really is a lot of fun to negotiate for the price on something, and unless you have found one of those "not a penny less" people, who set the price in concrete , it can be a great way to buy or sell something, with both parties coming away pleased at the sale.
> One of the main requirements, is that it is important to buy something when you DON'T need it, and the other guy DOES need to sell it.
> That way, you can decide your price limits , and if you don't get it for that price, and you walk away empty handed , it is no big thing. If you are buying something that you absolutely need right away, then you are in the position that you described earlier, of throwing your money at them, while begging to buy that item.
> 
> ...



I suppose that that all works for someone who has the desire, or the need, to acquire _stuff_. For good or for bad, I've spent the last 15 years or so getting RID of my stuff. My philosophy is that simpler is better - I'm what some people call a minimalist.

As a result I rarely have occasion to bargain anymore. The few places that I shop have a non-negotiating policy (think convenience store, Salvation Army, drug store, grocery store). I no longer go to flea markets or garage sales because I don't WANT anything and perhaps more importantly I don't think I NEED anything. 

So I'm afraid your idea of buying something when I DON'T need it is a foreign concept to me, because I don't even buy it when I DO need it! 

I understand the logic of what you're saying and I agree with it fully. If I were still 100% "in the World" I would follow your ideas to the letter. I just find that, at least for now, I have no need to negotiate for things simply because I don't need them.


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## SifuPhil (Jun 26, 2013)

TWHRider said:


> Barter is my middle name - I believe it was Born Into Me - lol lol  I used to embarrass my son's father when we were first married - he was like you, " throw all the money at the seller and beg them to allow him to buy it" lol
> 
> Over time, he learned to be as bad as I was - lol
> 
> The worst you can hear, when bartering, is "NO!" lol lol



I was always the kind to judge a price not by what was stamped on the item nor on what the seller told me it cost, but by what the item was worth to ME. I had already made up my mind long before I got to the table / counter what that gizmo meant to me and what I was willing to pay for it. To me, negotiating is "haggling" (def: _to cut roughly or clumsily; to annoy or exhaust with wrangling_), and that isn't my personality type.

There's just something about the act of bargaining that turns me off - always has. It just feels like a demeaning process, for BOTH parties. I know it's the custom in many parts of the world and a great way to save money, but then I've never really _been_ "about the money" ...


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## That Guy (Jun 26, 2013)

SifuPhil said:


> There's just something about the act of bargaining that turns me off - always has. It just feels like a demeaning process, for BOTH parties. I know it's the custom in many parts of the world and a great way to save money, but then I've never really _been_ "about the money" ...



You and me both, amigo.


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