# They don’t make them like they used to - thank goodness



## Islandgypsy (Nov 15, 2019)

Having a fun back and forth with a friend of 41 years. His claim - my 9 year old Honda Insight Hybrid with 196k miles is junk compared to his 1977 Pontiac Trans Am Firebird with 72k original miles. Mine -  50-60 mpg and cold a/c. original including the hybrid battery, changed starting battery twice and tires twice. His - gets 6-9 mpg,  rebuilt transmission twice, engine once, brakes, ball joints, shocks, steering gearbox, radiator, exhaust, rear axle clunks and whines, original windshield leaks, windows rattle, upholstery disintegrated, headliner replaced 4 times, doors drop when opened, a/c currently not work despite repaired numerous times etc., etc. But his is a muscle car. My hybrid 3 cylinder is faster to 60. They don’t build them like they used to - thank goodness.


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## win231 (Nov 15, 2019)

It's never fair to compare the quality of American junk to any Japanese car.  I always LOL at people who praise the quality of their American car - based on "Patriotism," rather than the truth.  They'll usually accept all the quality & reliability problems to support the illusion of "Supporting Americans."


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## treeguy64 (Nov 15, 2019)

I've never had any problems with my American manufactured trucks. Yeah, I wouldn't buy foreign. Never bought foreign made cars, either. I know, I know, just look at who supplies the components. Even then, I'm still buying American.


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## Aunt Bea (Nov 16, 2019)

I've always driven American made vehicles and I have to agree that the modern vehicles are light-years ahead of my first car a 1970 Ford Torino.

The only good thing I remember about my old Ford is that when you opened the hood you could see the ground, it was a very basic simple system with plenty of elbow room just not very dependable or durable compared to the modern vehicles.

I'm sure my stepfather would have had similar things to say about his Ford model T compared to his enormous Detroit vehicles of the 60s and 70s.


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## Keesha (Nov 16, 2019)

win231 said:


> It's never fair to compare the quality of American junk to any Japanese car.  I always LOL at people who praise the quality of their American car - based on "Patriotism," rather than the truth.  They'll usually accept all the quality & reliability problems to support the illusion of "Supporting Americans."


My mom cursed me out something awful when she discovered I’d purchased a Japanese made car.

Since her father became a P.O.W., she would deem anything Japanese with disgust but I LOVE my cute little car and just because it’s a Japanese car doesn’t mean it’s actually made by the Japanese and even if it was I’m ok with that. They aren’t the same people who tortured my grandfather. 

Ontario has one of the biggest Japanese car manufacturers in the world.

I don’t base my preferences on patriotism. I base it on $ verses performance and reliability.


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## Don M. (Nov 16, 2019)

I fully agree that today's cars/trucks are far better than they were when I first started driving....1959.  It seems that I was always poking around under the hood in those early years.  I rarely have any issues with my car/truck today....just do all the required maintenance as it comes due.  I have a 1997 Dodge Dakota that is in excellent shape, and just turned 100K, and a 2006 Impala (72K) that is doing great.  I did have some trouble with the Impala a couple of years ago...the radio, etc., wouldn't shut off when I exited the car....turned out it needed a drivers door lock sensor....took 3 trips to the dealer before they were finally able to get a good "code" reading.  That's my primary complaint with new cars...a "shade tree" mechanic stands little chance of finding/fixing any of these "gee whiz" electronic problems.  That, plus trying to replace the rear spark plugs on one of these sideways mounted V6 engines almost requires a trip to the dealer.
I check out new cars occasionally, but with minimal problems with my current vehicles, I see no need to spend 10's of thousands for a new one.  The Name on the vehicle seems to matter little, anymore, as many of the foreign brands are made here, with the majority of parts being US origin....while many of the US brands are assembled in Mexico/Canada using foreign parts.  I read awhile back that a Toyota Camry is the Most U.S. car...with over 80% U.S. parts, and assembled here.


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## Islandgypsy (Nov 16, 2019)

Oops, my Insight Hybrid is 19 years old. I checked the spark plugs about 5 years ago. Looked good so reinstalled. Still starts instantly and run perfectly. Very little ferrous metal. About 75% aluminum. 5 % plastic.


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## win231 (Nov 16, 2019)

Many of the parts on Japanese cars are manufactured in America, Mexico & Canada.  The sticker on my Nissan says "Engine & Transmission 40% American," & "Final Assembly: Ohio.."  (I think a certain percentage is required).  But they are manufactured on imported machinery from Japan & also frequently imported workers from Japan.  So patriotic Americans are still supporting American workers.

When Toyota started making the Lexus, I recall driving by Lexus dealers & seeing hundreds of traded-in Mercedes Benz' for sale on the lots. That's when Mercedes learned their lesson:  If someone makes a car that's as good or better than yours for $15,000.00 less, people will buy it.  

Many industries are set up like that.  Example:  85% of police departments in America as well as the FBI are issued a Glock (a big firearms manufacturer).  Glock is Austrian.  But they opened a plant in Smyrna, GA so they can manufacture it here & "sorta" call it "American."  The design & machinery is still Austrian.  After extensive testing & design, the American-made S & W auto they were using was replaced.

The U.S. military dropped the American-made Colt Govt. Model & changed to the Italian Beretta around 1985.  Same thing; Moved Italian machinery to Maryland to manufacture it here.
Unfortunately, when it absolutely HAS to work, & be reasonably priced, it won't be American.


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## squatting dog (Nov 16, 2019)

Islandgypsy said:


> Oops, my Insight Hybrid is 19 years old. I checked the spark plugs about 5 years ago. Looked good so reinstalled. Still starts instantly and run perfectly. Very little ferrous metal. About 75% aluminum. 5 % plastic.



Not a bad little rocket ship.   Daughter had one and after an oil change where they forgot to fill the engine, I had the dubious honor of changing it. Not all that complicated, however, one does need insulated gloves and to be aware that the electric side of that little hybrid can easily electrocute you. Just before she passed away, she sold it to a guy in Indianapolis who was collecting them. He has a couple of buildings and when we were there a few years ago, he had 27 of them and counting.  We had to put her's in the overflow building. Looked to me like he had room for a bunch more.


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## fmdog44 (Nov 16, 2019)

As a life long car guy I can't choose what cars are what even close up. Fords look like Jaguars and a Kia looks like a Lexus. Show pics of cars from the 50-60s and I 'll call them call.


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## Trade (Nov 17, 2019)

My 2009 Accord has 123,000 miles on it and is the most dependable vehicle I have ever owned. 

I have no use for those gas hogging 1970's muscle cars that constantly need to be worked on.


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## 911 (Nov 17, 2019)

Islandgypsy said:


> Having a fun back and forth with a friend of 41 years. His claim - my 9 year old Honda Insight Hybrid with 196k miles is junk compared to his 1977 Pontiac Trans Am Firebird with 72k original miles. Mine -  50-60 mpg and cold a/c. original including the hybrid battery, changed starting battery twice and tires twice. His - gets 6-9 mpg,  rebuilt transmission twice, engine once, brakes, ball joints, shocks, steering gearbox, radiator, exhaust, rear axle clunks and whines, original windshield leaks, windows rattle, upholstery disintegrated, headliner replaced 4 times, doors drop when opened, a/c currently not work despite repaired numerous times etc., etc. But his is a muscle car. My hybrid 3 cylinder is faster to 60. They don’t build them like they used to - thank goodness.


I doubt the validity of this post. Any car this bad belongs in the junk yard, not on the road. If you tell me it’s sitting up on blocks, OK,  otherwise, phhtt.


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## 911 (Nov 17, 2019)

Deleted by 911.


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## 911 (Nov 17, 2019)

American made cars have made enormous strides in quality. If you look at a 1965 Honda Accord, it’s about as miserable as a 1965 Impala. The foreign car companies beat the American companies to improvements. Domestic companies were convinced that they would keep their loyal customers, but slowly, Americans made the switch to foreign.

The foreign companies were smart enough to learn quickly that if they wanted to continue having success selling cars here in America and make profits, that they needed to make a long term commitment by building their cars here in America and Canada.

My wife bought a Lexus back in 2005. It was great then. But, the next one in 2010, not as nice or dependable, so she went back to the Buick LaCrosse. That car never cost us a dime, except for scheduled maintenance. She ordered a 2020 Buick Enclave that is supposed to be delivered next week. The dealer has to go to North Carolina to pick it up. She told the dealer not to drive it up here and that it must have less than 100 miles on it. Talk about being spoiled.

I really like the new cars with WiFi inside the vehicle. And, for only $15 a month. I wished my home WiFi was that inexpensive.


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## squatting dog (Nov 17, 2019)

I just picked up my sisters Ford Focus. She bought new in 2010 and now has 220,000 miles on it without any major issues. Nothing but the usual maintenance (fluids, brakes, tires etc) I haven't owned a new car since the wife's 2000 Camaro, but, if this Focus (made in Michigan) is an example of American cars today, sign me up. I have acquired it and plan to gift it to my oldest granddaughter when she graduate's.


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## WheatenLover (Nov 17, 2019)

My husband has a 2009 Lincoln MKZ, 203K miles on it, just regular maintenance has had to be done over the years. Made in Mexico, according to the paperwork.


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## win231 (Nov 17, 2019)

Al Bundy's Dodge has one million miles on it.


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## Tommy (Nov 18, 2019)

911 said:


> American made cars have made enormous strides in quality. If you look at a 1965 Honda Accord, it’s about as miserable as a 1965 Impala.


I agree with your overall assessment, but for the record the first Honda Accord didn't hit the market until 1976 (the Honda Civic came out in 1972).

A friend in high school graduated in 1965.  For a graduation gift is father, a high ranking US Air Force officer, had a 1965 Honda shipped to him from Japan.  It was incredibly flimsy piece of junk with a motorcycle engine, chain drive, and a hand-crank stored under the passenger's seat that could be used to start it when the electric starter failed.

Thank heaven they don't make them like they used to!


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## 911 (Nov 22, 2019)

Tommy said:


> I agree with your overall assessment, but for the record the first Honda Accord didn't hit the market until 1976 (the Honda Civic came out in 1972).
> 
> A friend in high school graduated in 1965.  For a graduation gift is father, a high ranking US Air Force officer, had a 1965 Honda shipped to him from Japan.  It was incredibly flimsy piece of junk with a motorcycle engine, chain drive, and a hand-crank stored under the passenger's seat that could be used to start it when the electric starter failed.
> 
> Thank heaven they don't make them like they used to!


Then there was also the Buick Opel. What a piece of crap.


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## win231 (Nov 22, 2019)

Many people think the name "Ford" is Henry's last name.
It's actually an acronym for "Found On Road Dead."


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## squatting dog (Nov 22, 2019)

911 said:


> Then there was also the Buick Opel. What a piece of crap.



Unless of course you're a dragster man.


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## squatting dog (Nov 22, 2019)

win231 said:


> Many people think the name "Ford" is Henry's last name.
> It's actually an acronym for "Found On Road Dead."




"Fix or repair daily", or,if one of our's, the other side of the coin. "First on race day".


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## 911 (Nov 22, 2019)

squatting dog said:


> Unless of course you're a dragster man.
> 
> View attachment 82282


Are you trying to tell me that the car in this picture is an Opel? Not likely.


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## 911 (Nov 22, 2019)

I think the biggest change has been humanity. Lack of manners, respect and empathy. Too many people feel entitled. Selfishness, it’s all about me. Like my dad used to say; “Hooray for me and to Hell with everyone else.” He would tell me to avoid these type of people.

Every year at this time, I remember when he would go to a local Amish farmer that raised turkeys. He would buy 25 turkeys and dress them, then donate them to our church to give to the less fortunate in the community. Guess how much he paid for each turkey..






50 cents.


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## squatting dog (Nov 22, 2019)

911 said:


> Are you trying to tell me that the car in this picture is an Opel? Not likely.



About the only thing Opal is the body, but, it's definitely an Opal    Drag racers loved the "baby vette".
https://barnfinds.com/baby-vette-drag-car-1969-opel-gt/


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## Uptosnuff (Nov 22, 2019)

win231 said:


> It's never fair to compare the quality of American junk to any Japanese car.  I always LOL at people who praise the quality of their American car - based on "Patriotism," rather than the truth.  They'll usually accept all the quality & reliability problems to support the illusion of "Supporting Americans."




I don't think people love their old cars because of "patriotism" , I think it's because of nostalgia.  I would love to own a late 1960's early 1970's convertible.  They are just cool looking cars.  All cars pretty much look the same to me anymore.  Those cars had style and class.

(But, it would have to be in decent shape and run)


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## Tommy (Nov 22, 2019)

win231 said:


> Many people think the name "Ford" is Henry's last name.
> It's actually an acronym for "Found On Road Dead."


IIRC, "GMC" stood for "God's Mechanical Curse". 

I owned a lot of cars over the years.  Quality has typically depended more on the model (and the individual car) than on the manufacturer.


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## 911 (Nov 22, 2019)

squatting dog said:


> About the only thing Opal is the body, but, it's definitely an Opal    Drag racers loved the "baby vette".
> https://barnfinds.com/baby-vette-drag-car-1969-opel-gt/


I followed drag cars when I was 14 until about 20. They were more of a novelty car than a true drag car. I liked the dragsters, like “Big Daddy Don Garlits” drove. He was the first drag racer that built a rail powered with a .392 hemi. After that, he just kept improving on the horsepower.

But, my favorite was Tommy Ivoe and his famous 4-engine Dragsters. He once built a 4-engine Buick. Guy was an engineering genius.


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## 911 (Nov 24, 2019)

Yeah, that .392 hemi had about 525 hp out of the factory. Garlits has a museum down in Ocala, Florida, which I hope to visit maybe next summer. If I had a million bucks that I could spare, I would build my own drag car. I once met a guy that was his lead mechanic back in the day. Maybe he was or maybe he wasn’t. I don’t really know, but he knew an awful lot about him and the cars he built. We talked for almost an hour before I cut him loose.


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## squatting dog (Nov 24, 2019)

911 said:


> But, my favorite was Tommy Ivoe and his famous 4-engine Dragsters. He once built a 4-engine Buick. Guy was an engineering genius.



Oh yeah... great times back then.  I really liked it when he stuck the wagon body on it.


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## Nautilus (Nov 25, 2019)

The nicest car I've ever owned was my 1919 Cadillac close-coupled sedan which took me a year to restore.  It was originally owned by Henry P. Morganthau, Secretary of the Treasury under Roosevelt.  Unfortunately, back in 2009 when things were tough, I sold her.


These days, I own a 1994 Cadillac Eldorado Touring Coupe in pristine condition that we take on weekend drives and even fairly long trips.  It has power everything, it's a dream to drive, totally dependable and has an option you can't even get in cars these days...a cassette deck!


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## Fyrefox (Nov 26, 2019)

I've owned American, German, and Japanese cars.  My parents only bought Fords owing I guess to brand loyalty.  I haven't bought new since the 1990's, with my goal generally to buy a late model car with low miles in good condition.  Presently I have a Subaru and a Nissan, and both are solid and reliable.


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## squatting dog (Nov 26, 2019)

This thread made me look up the places of manufacture for 4 of my vehicles. 1 assembled in Oklahoma, 1 in Ontario, 1 in Michigan, and 1 in either Riverside Ca, or Japan, or Canada. (too rainy out to go look up the vin right now)  
Looks like my stuff is more worldly than me.


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## 911 (Nov 26, 2019)

squatting dog said:


> Oh yeah... great times back then.  I really liked it when he stuck the wagon body on it.
> 
> View attachment 82520View attachment 82521


When I went to the drags one night, I saw Ivo with his 4 engine "yellow" Buick dragster. The dragster had 4, 425 cu. in. Buick Wildcat engines mounted on it. I forget the times it ran, but it was quick off the line.


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## squatting dog (Nov 29, 2019)

911 said:


> When I went to the drags one night, I saw Ivo with his 4 engine "yellow" Buick dragster. The dragster had 4, 425 cu. in. Buick Wildcat engines mounted on it. I forget the times it ran, but it was quick off the line.



Here you go.     man I love youtube.


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## 911 (Nov 29, 2019)

squatting dog said:


> Here you go.     man I love youtube.


I saw this car run back in 1967 or 68. It was a canary yellow and was called “The Wagonmaster.” I was able to very briefly speak with Tommy and I really wanted to know how he was able to work all 4 engines with 1 engine powering each individual wheel. He started into a very long story about using some type of fluid couplings and then he completely lost me.

What should I have expected from a former “Mouseketeer?” I always considered him an engineering genius after producing these cars.


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## squatting dog (Nov 29, 2019)

911 said:


> I saw this car run back in 1967 or 68. It was a canary yellow and was called “The Wagonmaster.” I was able to very briefly speak with Tommy and I really wanted to know how he was able to work all 4 engines with 1 engine powering each individual wheel. He started into a very long story about using some type of fluid couplings and then he completely lost me.
> 
> What should I have expected from a former “Mouseketeer?” I always considered him an engineering genius after producing these cars.



I'll tell you, I knew how many different paint jobs this buggy had.   I like the one pic which has a stock Buick nosed up. 
Hey... maybe that's you checking out the rig.


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## 911 (Nov 29, 2019)

Is that a Buick Riviera front end?

That’s not me checking out the car.


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## squatting dog (Nov 29, 2019)

Looks like a 1969 Riviera to me.


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## Butterfly (Nov 29, 2019)

squatting dog said:


> Here you go.     man I love youtube.



How can the driver see through all that smoke?


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## Doomp (Dec 13, 2019)

win231 said:


> It's never fair to compare the quality of American junk to any Japanese car.  I always LOL at people who praise the quality of their American car - based on "Patriotism," rather than the truth.  They'll usually accept all the quality & reliability problems to support the illusion of "Supporting Americans."


A lot of Japanese cars are manufactured on American soil by American workers. So I don't feel too bad about owning a Japanese car.


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## Getyoung (Dec 16, 2019)

I have owned many many cars and trucks. I have been a "car " forever. I own a 1969 camaro RS convertible that I have had for 40 years. I bought it from the original owner. I have kept this particular car stock, pretty much like it was from the factory. It drives like a 40 year old car, terrible handling, super uncomfortable seats, etc, etc. After I drive to a car show or just a Sunday drive and then get into my new vehicle, it always amazes me how much better they are and about a thousand times safer.
I have had a few drag cars, mostly big block plymouth barracuda's and a few GM cars, any new muscle car like the new Camaro, mustang, challenger, could blow my doors off! And get far better mileage as well. Yes, thankfully, they don't make them like they used to!


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## squatting dog (Dec 21, 2019)

Getyoung said:


> I have owned many many cars and trucks. I have been a "car " forever. I own a 1969 camaro RS convertible that I have had for 40 years. I bought it from the original owner. I have kept this particular car stock, pretty much like it was from the factory. It drives like a 40 year old car, terrible handling, super uncomfortable seats, etc, etc. After I drive to a car show or just a Sunday drive and then get into my new vehicle, it always amazes me how much better they are and about a thousand times safer.
> I have had a few drag cars, mostly big block plymouth barracuda's and a few GM cars, any new muscle car like the new Camaro, mustang, challenger, could blow my doors off! And get far better mileage as well. Yes, thankfully, they don't make them like they used to!


Heard that, We've had lot's of cars and some were wicked fast. However, they didn't stop as well and several didn't corner as well as newer stuff. I had no idea that auto's had built muscle until the wife wanted this Camaro convertible. Man, 180 mph capability   Stopping power to match and a corning fool... all this while wrapped in supple leather with the a/c and 800 watt Monsoon stereo blaring. 
That said, I'd still trade my soul for the 32 Ford I lusted for in my younger days. Mild chop, translucent purple iridescent pearl, Chrysler Hemi with 4 carbs, moon discs, wide whites. What's not to love?


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