# This puts a new twist on attempted suicide



## Vivjen (Jan 11, 2014)

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-25681048

Do read his quote at the end...


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## Diwundrin (Jan 11, 2014)

Sounds like a fairly Mickey Mouse operation all round doesn't it?


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## Old Hipster (Jan 11, 2014)

Well that takes the cake! I can well imagine how the mortuary workers must have reacted. 

I always feel sorry for folks who live through a botched suicide attempt. I mean you have to have hit rock bottom emotionally and maybe physically as well. But you feel so hopeless and life is not worth living anymore, nothing is going right in your life etc..and then you can't even manage to kill yourself properly. I mean how much worse could that make you feel!

When I was growing up there was a man in town who always had half of his face hidden, he had tried to kill himself by putting a gun in his mouth and only managed to blow off half of his face and then lived. Poor man.

Maybe this will turn the poor fellows life around, coming back from the dead and all.


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## Vivjen (Jan 11, 2014)

It must have been scary; for both sides! At least he will be ok; I can't imagine how it must feel to fail..


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## Diwundrin (Jan 11, 2014)

I think what would make it worse is that you'd be expected to be grateful to the people who 'saved' you.


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## Warrigal (Jan 11, 2014)

My husband attempted suicide once. He was in the depths of depression at the time.
He was unsuccessful and is now over his illness. 

He still expresses the intention to kill himself rather than enter a nursing home.
We will see what he does should the time ever come.
I won't help him though.


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## Vivjen (Jan 11, 2014)

That is dreadful, I feel for both of you. 
Depression is so difficult to deal with, you can be in denial until you are so far down that it is difficult to get help; I know.
I am too much of a coward to attempt suicide..


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## Old Hipster (Jan 11, 2014)

Warrigal said:


> My husband attempted suicide once. He was in the depths of depression at the time.
> He was unsuccessful and is now over his illness.
> 
> He still expresses the intention to kill himself rather than enter a nursing home.
> ...


On I am sorry to read this, it must be hard on you. But I can understand his point. 

Decades ago I used to get migraines to the point where I would have to be in bed sometimes for a couple of days and the agony was beyond tremendous. And I can remember laying there thinking that death didn't sound like such a bad thing, at least the pain would be gone. 

So I can understand how a person could feel and how easy it might be in those circumstances to welcome death. Even though when my grandpa committed suicide, we understood why he did it, but it still leaves a big gaping wound in the family and you do feel as if you failed the person.


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## SifuPhil (Jan 11, 2014)

> A witness told the Star newspaper that when noises were heard inside the  cold room: "The mortuary attendant and a worker took to their heels  screaming."



"They then ran to their mud-and-straw church and sacrificed three goats and five chickens."

Seriously, why is anyone surprised that this happens with some regularity in places like this?


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## Diwundrin (Jan 11, 2014)

My Mum made a half-hearted attempt when I was 15.  A neighbour had called in and Mum managed to tell her what she'd taken so she got an ambulance and an overnight hospital stay. She hadn't taken a lethal amount anyway but I was shattered.  Luckily I had a mentor in life's lessons much wiser than me, her brother, who clued me up that it wasn't my fault and that she'd always been a drama queen and was looking for attention. He was right but it was still hard to come to terms with at the time. 15 yo kids are supposed to be the centre of their mothers' universe aren't they? My mistake. And good lesson.

I never really forgave her for that although I stayed with her for another 50+ years.  She shrugged it off as 'an accident' and never tried it again.  In fact she was the most tenacious person I ever knew when it came to hanging on to life. Believe me, no amount of coercion or parental concerns would have convinced her to request euthanasia.  That simply doesn't apply to people who don't want it. Attempted 'suicides' or not.

Sympathy for those migraines OH I've only ever had 2 that qualified and that was plenty for me thanks.  I don't know how people who get them often cope with that.


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## Old Hipster (Jan 11, 2014)

Luckily I don't get them anymore!

So sorry about your early years. That which does not kill us makes us stronger, ain't that the truth. 

Many years ago my husband saved his sister who was trying to kill herself with pills, he and their mom went to her house and got in and found her unconscious and called 911 and saved her. She never tried it again.


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## Ozarkgal (Jan 11, 2014)

My father ravaged by war wounds, diabetes compounded by alcoholism and resulting mental issues chose to take his own life at 34, when I was nine.  This was before PTSS was a known condition.  His attempt was successful with a long step out of a three story window.  It was determined an accident by the coroner, but I think not.  He was in and out of my life, mostly out since I was a baby, but I really remember only the bad times.


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## SeaBreeze (Jan 11, 2014)

Sad to hear about your dad Ozarkgal, too bad he couldn't get help after coming home from the war.   Maybe things would have been a bit different then.


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## Vivjen (Jan 11, 2014)

I really didn't mean this thread to bring back so many dreadful memories; I hope I haven't upset anyone too much.


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## CeeCee (Jan 11, 2014)

Don't feel bad, vivjen...we know you didn't mean for memories to be stirred up.

I personally don't have any suicides in my family but do know people that did...one was a boy of 17 that I babysat when he was a baby....what was tragic was that it was all because of a girl.

As to the article, I agree with situPhil, although I have heard of it in other countries too.


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## Old Hipster (Jan 11, 2014)

I believe death needs to come out of the closet so to speak, in regards to it is all part of life and we should talk about it. And if we have dark thoughts at times, I have always found that misery loves company and it is good to talk about it and most of us feel the same way, after all we are all the same and have to come face to face with our mortality at some point. Or that of a loved one.


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## CeeCee (Jan 11, 2014)

Old Hipster said:


> I believe death needs to come out of the closet so to speak, in regards to it is all part of life and we should talk about it. And if we have dark thoughts at times, I have always found that misery loves company and it is good to talk about it and most of us feel the same way, after all we are all the same and have to come face to face with our mortality at some point. Or that of a loved one.



:iagree:

It is a very difficult subject though...especially as we get older!


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## SifuPhil (Jan 11, 2014)

CeeCee said:


> It is a very difficult subject though...especially as we get older!



I think it's only as difficult as we make it.

Some people cling to life long after it has lost its meaning, while others jump into it willingly. It depends in part upon your view of whether it is an ending or a beginning (religious), the pain involved (practical) and the satisfaction you've had from life (fulfillment). 

Some see it as a terrifying monster coming to claim them, while others welcome death as an old friend. It's still death, no matter what - it's just in how you perceive it. So it might be good to discuss death as both a general and a personal topic, because who knows when you might stumble across a new philosophy that sits well with you?


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## CeeCee (Jan 11, 2014)

I sure would like to find one that would ease my fears...I'm not very religious although I was raised catholic so thoughts of heaven don't make death more easy...I'm kind of clinging to a hope that our soul doesn't die as in our energy or whatever it is that makes us different from animals.

I just hope to die in my sleep...do not want to know that I am dying like my husband did.   He handled much better than I would.


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## Vivjen (Jan 11, 2014)

I know what you mean, although my husband died only 3 months after diagnosis. The irony was that the tumour had gone; he died; suddenly; of pneumonia. That was 7 years ago now, I still wonder the 'what ifs'.


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## CeeCee (Jan 11, 2014)

My husband didn't actually die of the cancer but of massive infection...he had 5 tubes coming from his body just for all the waste ...poop and pee.

His heart was strong when he died and had it not been for that infection he would have suffered 6more months...tops.


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## SifuPhil (Jan 11, 2014)

I go with the energetic model myself - you're in good company! 

Now about that "dying in your sleep" thing ... the way I see it, if you put too much hope into it and when the time comes you find that you're fully awake, you might have a bit of a rough ride. If instead you figure out a way to greet death independent of your surroundings or what you're doing at the time then you might accomplish your passing much easier.

I've always been fascinated by the Japanese samurai and their training for death. They were admonished to think about their death from the moment they woke up until they fell asleep, a fair bit extreme, granted, but it allowed them to perform their necessary duties to their masters. I would never advocate spending so much time on such matters - you'd end up looking like Wednesday Addams   - but I've taken a page from their book (literally - they had a book for samurais on how to live and die) and have thought about my death many times. 

I've done "what if" experiments as a form of mediation, envisioning my death from any of a hundred causes, and have found that, at least for me, it was the "fear factor" that had me dreading death. Once I saw the actual process in my mind's eye I was reassured that it was just a variation of sending my soul/spirit/energy on into the world. 

As many have said before, what I still fear is the _prolonged_ death, especially at the hands of well-meaning medicos. That's why I have also investigated several self-termination options and am always willing to learn more, because as the choices are eliminated one by one I fear that my courage and my resolve will disappear along with them. I don't want to die cringing; I want to go with a smile.


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## That Guy (Jan 11, 2014)

I'm so sorry about your father, OG.  I was so miserable after Vietnam that I was ready to check out.  Luckily, it dawned on me that I'm gonna go eventually anyway so might as well stick around and see what happens.  That was over 40 years ago and some really great and not so great things have happened that I would have missed.


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## CeeCee (Jan 11, 2014)

Very interesting, SifuPhil....maybe preparing ourselves is the key!

Why does death have to be so mysterious with no real answers to as to what really happens?

i don't believe in the NDE of some people in that I don't believe that they really died no matter what the machines say.

I think that it is all a form of what my BIL a Dr. Calls ICU psychosis which is the hallucinations that are caused by all the drugs they are given.

I envy the people that truely believe in God and heaven when it comes to dying.


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## SifuPhil (Jan 11, 2014)

CeeCee said:


> Very interesting, SifuPhil....maybe preparing ourselves is the key!



I've always thought so, but in moderation. I've had acquaintances that were fixated on death, and some who simply refused to acknowledge it could happen to them. I try to avoid such extremes and find a happy middle ground.



> Why does death have to be so mysterious with no real answers to as to what really happens?



I think the main problem is finding volunteers for the research. :ambivalence:



> i don't believe in the NDE of some people in that I don't believe that they really died no matter what the machines say.
> 
> I think that it is all a form of what my BIL a Dr. Calls ICU psychosis which is the hallucinations that are caused by all the drugs they are given.



I pretty much agree with you and your BIL. I did a bit of research on the topic back in my college days and never found anything that could be verified without a few loopholes involved.



> I envy the people that truely believe in God and heaven when it comes to dying.



I do not. I want my life to be authentic, honest, factual; I don't want to spend it under any but the most sensual (meaning, able to be sensed) conditions.


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## Old Hipster (Jan 11, 2014)

I have a half baked idea that when we die maybe what we think is going to happen to us happens, we make our own reality in death, that is if something does carry on. Oh! like that movie What Dreams May Come.

The choices are limited to our imagination. What I came up with, that would fit my belief, or lack there of, system.

You die and that's it. Nothing happens. The End!

Or maybe when we die we go into some other dimension, like our own personal Twilight Zone, with infinite possibilities. Where anything is possible. Like a dream and you are controlling it.

I've seen evidence of some sort of spirit world so I tend to think there could be something. But maybe it was just that part of my brain that was able to tap into that reality for a few brief moments.

Or maybe when we die our life essence goes back to our home planet were we take on another form and live again.


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## Vivjen (Jan 11, 2014)

I do think that there must be something; I imagine my husband somewhere with his best mates and a large glass of red; otherwise I don't think I would have got through it.
but I can't believe in heaven and hell, nobody is perfect surely?


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## That Guy (Jan 11, 2014)

CeeCee said:


> Why does death have to be so mysterious with no real answers to as to what really happens?



Because no one comes back to actually tell us.  'Cept for maybe the zombies . . . and they ain't talkin'.


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## CeeCee (Jan 11, 2014)

And therein lies my problem of any afterlife...you would think that it would be possible for them to let us know...a little anyway.

Or some scientific PROOF of something, anything but so far...nothing!


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## That Guy (Jan 11, 2014)

CeeCee said:


> And therein lies my problem of any afterlife...you would think that it would be possible for them to let us know...a little anyway.
> 
> Or some scientific PROOF of something, anything but so far...nothing!



Then, again, all the wacky callers on Coast-to-Coast have all the answers.  Personally, I'm still goin' with the zombie angle...


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## CeeCee (Jan 11, 2014)

What is coast to coast?


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## Warrigal (Jan 11, 2014)

Last night I started a bit of reading on this topic from a philosophical point of view and while I'm not able to regurgitate all of it, it seems that there are three factors in play - pain, distress and suffering. It appears that either of the first two can be present independently and not be a serious problem but when both are present to a high degree then you have a rough definition of suffering. Perhaps a first course of action is to alleviate either  (or both) of the pain or the distress of a situation. Then death might not seem like the only solution.


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## Vivjen (Jan 11, 2014)

A problem arises when the pain is mental, rather than physical. Because it can't be seen, many people assume that it doesn't exist.
i remember my doctor saying to me once; "think of depression like a broken leg. We would plaster your leg, and people would understand and help you, but we can't plaster your head.."


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## Anne (Jan 11, 2014)

CeeCee said:


> What is coast to coast?



It's an old radio program, CeeCee:  http://www.coasttocoastam.com/

Art Bell used to host it; now it's George Noory.  They cover about every subject you can think of, from the paranormal to extraterrestrials, and conspiracies.   Pretty interesting if you're into any of that stuff.


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## Ozarkgal (Jan 11, 2014)

That Guy said:


> I'm so sorry about your father, OG.  I was so miserable after Vietnam that I was ready to check out.  Luckily, it dawned on me that I'm gonna go eventually anyway so might as well stick around and see what happens.  That was over 40 years ago and some really great and not so great things have happened that I would have missed.



Thank you TG..he was a WWII vet..in those times stress from war was was not recognized, at least officially.  Had it been the outcome may have been different, but that water has long ago flowed under the bridge.  You are fortunate to have a mind strong enough to be able to work through your problems and have a productive life.   As they say, only the strong survive.


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## That Guy (Jan 11, 2014)

Ozarkgal said:


> Thank you TG..he was a WWII vet..in those times stress from war was was not recognized, at least officially.  Had it been the outcome may have been different, but that water has long ago flowed under the bridge.  You are fortunate to have a mind strong enough to be able to work through your problems and have a productive life.   As they say, only the strong survive.



Thanks, OG.  It took a long while and is probably . . . no, is surely a work in progress.


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## jrfromafar (Jan 12, 2014)

Anne said:


> It's an old radio program, CeeCee:  http://www.coasttocoastam.com/
> 
> Art Bell used to host it; now it's George Noory.  They cover about every subject you can think of, from the paranormal to extraterrestrials, and conspiracies.   Pretty interesting if you're into any of that stuff.



Before xm radio it used to be the only station you could get heading over the grapevine (highway from L.A to Bakersfield) late at night. Brings new meaning to the phrase 'silence is golden'


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## CeeCee (Jan 12, 2014)

Thanks for the info, I don't listen to talk radio...maybe I should...always feel I'm going to fall asleep on the drive to my daughters.


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## Pappy (Jan 12, 2014)

Does anyone know what Art Bell is doing now? He use to have his own broadcasting complex in Parump, Nevada. Have followed c. To c. Since it started.


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## SifuPhil (Jan 12, 2014)

Pappy, I believe he's doing a radio show called Dark Matter which covers all his usual paranormal / conspiracy-type stuff.

ETA: It's on SiriusXM radio ...


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