# Air Travel Changing



## oldman (Apr 21, 2019)

According to the news in my union magazine, air travel will see changes beginning with the 2019 travel season and beyond. Airports and even certain airlines will be using what is called “human biometric data,” which amounts to using facial recognition software to seek out terrorists, wanted criminals and any other low-lifes. 

Also, air travel is expected to climb an average of 4-6%, which is a very large increase over previous years.  

Getting through security at certain airports may take a bit longer due to TSA agents being instructed to pay more attention to the monitors that highlight certain items in passenger’s handbags and carryon luggage. If you have ever seen the monitor, it highlights unidentifiable objects. Then, the TSA agent has some discretion as to have the bag checked or let it pass. If the object is outlined in red, it must be checked. My guess is that security is being heightened due to Homeland Security receiving some information of terroristic threats. Let’s hope not.


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## RadishRose (Apr 21, 2019)

I'm glad about the security, but since oil prices are rising, I'm surprised that an increase of flights are projected.


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## Tommy (Apr 21, 2019)

"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."


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## RadishRose (Apr 21, 2019)

Oh no, I'm gonna loose sleep over this now.


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## oldman (Apr 22, 2019)

A friend of mine who is still flying said that he spoke with a TSA agent and they have only heard about this new technology, but no training has begun yet. 

My friend flies the Triple 7 (Boeing 777) and his last flight was from Washington to London. By the way he was talking, they must have really went though some pretty bad turbulence. He said that he had heard a few screams, but no one was hurt and he did make a few announcements asking for the passengers to remain calm. They had tried different altitudes, but nothing worked, so he decided to just take the shortest route. It lasted for almost an hour. 

At the end of the flight, he had maintenance check the plane for damage to the outside.


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## retiredtraveler (Apr 22, 2019)

oldman said:


> ......Also, air travel is expected to climb an average of 4-6%, which is a very large increase over previous years......



You sure are not reading what I have. In 2017, air travel increased 7.9% over 2016. In 2018, went up about 6%. Perhaps you're talking domestically, instead of worldwide? For 2019, there is some doubt about increases due to global economic slowdown. We'll see on that.


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## oldman (Apr 22, 2019)

Domestic travel. I kind of focus just on domestic, only because I never flew international. The closest that I came to international was the two years that I did the O’hare to Honolulu and Lihue in Kauai routes. Pretty boring just flying back and forth over the water. However, some pilots enjoy the challenge of the changing air currents. 

I once posted a notice that was in one of my union monthly periodicals that stated 20,000 pilots would be needed in the next five years due to attrition, additional routes and additional planes being added. The skies are definitely getting busier.


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## Packerjohn (May 1, 2019)

Just flew from Canada to London, England last week.  It was terrible.  No meals given on a 7 hour flight; just coffee & 2 tiny biscuits.  Everyone sat like zombies starring at their electronic toys all night.  Glad I had my wife with me to talk to.  This will be my last overseas flight.  The airline, Westjet, treat passengers like some cattle.  Everyone wants to fly to Europe for free so I guess what you pay for is what you get.


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## oldman (May 1, 2019)

Packerjohn said:


> Just flew from Canada to London, England last week.  It was terrible.  No meals given on a 7 hour flight; just coffee & 2 tiny biscuits.  Everyone sat like zombies starring at their electronic toys all night.  Glad I had my wife with me to talk to.  This will be my last overseas flight.  The airline, Westjet, treat passengers like some cattle.  Everyone wants to fly to Europe for free so I guess what you pay for is what you get.




Sounds about right. Most, if not all, low cost carriers, do not include the frills that other airlines include and also add into the price. I flew from Washington, D.C. to London just a few years ago on United in First Class. I get free coach travel, but must pay for any upgrades. 

When dinner was served, I walked back through Coach just to find out what was on their menu. They were given a choice of wraps and a desert, plus snacks throughout the trip. Each seat also had access to an entertainment system located on the seat back in front of them. They could tune in movies, TV shows or play games, along with tracking the flight and also an opportunity to listen to the chatter between the pilots and the flight controllers, which is pretty neat if you have never experienced it. All United flights offer passengers the opportunity to listen to the chatter. 

I am am sure that the people in coach paid more for their seat than someone who may have flown on one of the low cost carriers.


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## RadishRose (May 1, 2019)

I remember this. I looked it up on Quora just now-
[h=1]Is it true that American Airlines saved $40,000 in 1987 by eliminating one olive from each salad served in first class?[/h]
It seems close. Some interesting answers at:

https://www.quora.com/Is-it-true-th...e-olive-from-each-salad-served-in-first-class.

Another quote there-

"AA  was always a leader in fuel savings.  It's the reason their airplanes  are mostly bare metal -- AA found the paint added significantly enough  to each plane's weight that removing most of the paint resulted in  significant fuel savings. 
(from a former, and proud, AA employee)"

One more quote-

"Note also that the former Northwest Airlines saved $500,000 per year by cutting its limes into 16 pieces instead of 10 (How  much money did Northwest Airlines save by cutting its limes into  sixteenths instead of tenths to harmonize their merger with Delta  Airlines?), so it's not that hard to believe that removing one olive per salad could save American $40k."[h=1][/h]


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## Camper6 (May 1, 2019)

RadishRose said:


> I'm glad about the security, but since oil prices are rising, I'm surprised that an increase of flights are projected.



Why? The price will be passed on.  They never miss a trick.


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## oldman (May 1, 2019)

Rose.....United must have learned the paint trick from AA. United’s planes are pretty plain now too, since the merger with Continental. We used to make jokes about each other’s airline in the Dispatcher’s office or the pilots lounge. 

I knew that AA was the cost saving leader in the airline business for many years. Jet fuel contracts are done similar to your home heating oil contracts. They are negotiated far in advance, but not too far. This is done so that both the airline and the oil company can regulate their costs and fare prices. 

Most airlines have learned from Southwest’s way of buying jet fuel. Instead of paying spot price for what they use on a day to day business and instead they use a system called “fuel hedging,” which is nothing more than buying jet fuel on future contracts when jet fuel is low, or at expected low prices.


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## RadishRose (May 1, 2019)

My goodness they have things down to a science, Oldman!


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## oldman (May 1, 2019)

Just think, if you could have bought a gas contract back a year or two when gas hovered around $2.00 per gallon. Wouldn’t you and I have bought a contract for a few thousand gallons at that price? I probably would have. Today, gas prices are about $3.00 a gallon here. That means if I bought a 2000 gallon contract, I would save $2000.00.


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## Lethe200 (May 12, 2019)

Some warning signs ahead:

*Is a travel recession in the wings?*
Consumers nervous, cutting back according to reports
Chris McGinnis, SFGATE.com, May 10, 2019
https://www.sfgate.com/travel/article/travel-recession-13832563.php

(excerpted)  Travel demand is almost always a good predictor of what's to come for the overall economy. It's like the canary in the coal mine. When consumers and big companies start to feel nervous about future prospects, travel is usually one of the first things to get cut (or reduced) from the family or corporate budget.

So while employment and overall economic numbers still look like it's full steam ahead for the U.S.  economy, the travel industry may be starting to feel a light recessionary chill. Some examples:

"We have had 100‐plus straight months of travel expansion in the U.S., and there are now parts of the world that are just starting to join the travel revolution...But despite these positive factors, I see increasing and worrying signs about where worldwide demand is headed and evidence that suggests the U.S. is poised for a slowdown across every travel category" writes Clayton Reid, the CEO of MMGY Global, a giant marketing and communications firm in the travel space.

.... MMGY's research shows an overall decline in demand for travel over the last two years, with a lot more travelers citing sensitivity to pricing as the reason for cutting back. It finds that business travel demand is currently a little stronger than leisure demand, which is propping up airfares and hotel rates, but that is also expected to decline in 2020. With economies outside the U.S. going soft, fewer travelers will be headed to big American gateway cities like New York or San Francisco, pushing down demand.


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## oldman (May 13, 2019)

I have seen different articles and reports in travel magazines and also in my monthly union newsletter. Most agree that thanks to Brexit, travel from the UK to the U.S. has slowed. 

Here in the U.S., travel overall is down about 1-2%. I have always thought that the economy can be judged by the amount of passengers flying. When the economy begins to sink, you can see more people taking to the highways. 

Some of the the more popular routes like from the east coast to west coast and vice versa has remained fairly steady. In the summer when travel peaked, I would fly the Boeing 767, which seats around 300 passengers. Then, when the travel season would begin to lessen, I would switch to the B-757, which seats about 200-250, depending on which version of the plane we would be flying. Mainly, the planes would be full to my delight. 

I flew down to Florida this past weekend leaving from Washington, D.C. The flights were full down and back. Florida is a popular destination, so it should be no surprise that the flights were full. If you look at smaller, less popular markets, I am sure the plane’s would be less than full. It costs airlines a lot of money to run regional flights, which most airlines will add a few bucks to other more popular destinations to help defray the costs of running a regional system. 

Someone mentioned cost cutting on airlines, which was always a huge ongoing effort. At United, if an employee would suggest a cost cutting idea that they would implement, the employee would be rewarded. I remember one of my pilot friends recommended using recycled paper towels in the lavatories. He did his homework and estimated that the airline would save approximately ‘x’ amount of dollars (I forget how much.) The airline used his idea and he received a check for $2000.00.


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## Butterfly (May 14, 2019)

Lethe200 said:


> Some warning signs ahead:
> 
> *Is a travel recession in the wings?*
> Consumers nervous, cutting back according to reports
> ...



Among people I know there is a lot less flying going on, partly due to how expensive it is and partly due to the incredible hassle of flying nowdays and cramped quarters on the planes.  It just isn't any fun anymore.


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## jeremias (Jun 25, 2019)

Butterfly said:


> Among people I know there is a lot less flying going on, partly due to how expensive it is and partly due to the incredible hassle of flying nowdays and cramped quarters on the planes.  It just isn't any fun anymore.



It would be nice if more people would think the same. In my opinion, flying should not be fun overall. In times of climate change, air travel should be made even less attractive. When I look at the scale of air travel, I get dizzy: https://www.flight-radar.org


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## Capt Lightning (Jun 25, 2019)

Air travel and affordable prices have opened up the world of travel to people who could never have managed it a generation or two ago. Yes, it can be hassle, but a couple of hours of minor discomfort is hardly a show stopper.  I'm glad I can have 2 or 3 foreign holidays a year - something my parents could never have dreamed of.


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## CarolfromTX (Jul 20, 2019)

Hubs and I flew over to Athens on American Airlines a couple weeks ago. Coach. It felt incredibly cramped. The nearly 10 hour flight about did me in. We cruised to Italy, did an extension in Tuscany, then flew out of Florence. We flew Lufthansa from Munich to Chicago, and it was way better than AA. More leg room, a better incline on the seat back, great screen in the seat back, more restrooms, better service. Still a long boring flight, but more comfy for sure.


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## oldman (Jul 20, 2019)

Carol: Do you know what size planes you flew in both directions?


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## Don M. (Jul 20, 2019)

We flew to Las Vegas...from Kansas City...a few weeks ago, via SW Airlines.  We booked the non stop flights on their "gotta get away" bargain fares, and the flights were on time, and uneventful.  We actually spent more time at the airports...going through security, etc., than the flights themselves.  Since it is only about a 2 hour flight, we just had a small snack and a cup of coffee while on the plane.  True, the seats seem to be getting smaller, and the leg room has diminished in recent years, but since neither of us are very large, the seats are still comfortable.  My only concern about flying is having the bad luck of being seated next to a huge "Lard a$$", or on the return flight, a drunk.


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## oldman (Jul 20, 2019)

Don....Since seats are not assigned on SW, you have the option of changing your seat. I know that you may feel awkward in doing so, but it is an option. As for the drunk, unless he/she is unruly, they can fly, but again, you can ask to be reseated. I would rather sit in the back of the plane than next to someone who makes me uncomfortable.

The thing about seats is that when an airline contracts with either Boeing or Airbus to have a plane built, they give the manufacturer their seating requirements and the manufacturer will then assemble the seating in the fuselage as requested. 

SW has an all Boeing 737 livery. Some of their 737’s have been stretched like the -7 & -8 or -700 & -800. The older 737’s, like the -3’s & -4’s have tighter seating. 

At United, we offered extra legroom seating for about $20.00 each way. Airlines do what they can to make a buck. I tell everyone to keep in mind that it was only up to about 7 or 8 years ago that U.S. airlines finally turned decently profitable thanks to deregulation and cost savings. Flying is still a good deal and time saving for those with only a limited amount of vacation time. 

I hear people tell me that when they fly they miss a lot of what’s on the ground to see. If you have driven to your destination previously, then you’ve seen everything. For me, I just want to get to where I’m headed.


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## Don M. (Jul 20, 2019)

oldman said:


> I hear people tell me that when they fly they miss a lot of what’s on the ground to see. If you have driven to your destination previously, then you’ve seen everything. For me, I just want to get to where I’m headed.



Yeah....we've driven to Denver and Las Vegas several times in the past, but anymore it just isn't worth driving.  It would take us 4 full days to drive to/from Las Vegas, and when you factor in the cost of gas, motels, meals, etc., it would cost several times more than an airline ticket.  That, plus, my age making driving for 12 hours a day a real challenge, makes air travel the only real sensible option.  

One time, coming back, we had some guy who stunk of booze and body odor plop down in our row, and he slept virtually all the way, but having to put up with his stench, even with the overhead vents running full blast, almost made us ill.  Then, another time, we got stuck next to a really obese dude....he took the aisle seat and almost blocked half the aisle with his "excess" hanging over the armrest.  But, outside of a couple of experiences, flying has been quite good.  Now, since 911, security has been more intense, but we don't take any carry on luggage, and get through the screening quickly....just the delays of standing in line waiting for our turn.


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## oldman (Jul 21, 2019)

Don: I shouldn’t even talk about this, but I can remember having a 400+ pound man onboard going from New York to LA. I’m in the cockpit and we just received clearance to pushback and start our engines when the Purser came in and told us (the First Officer & myself) that two passengers were raising cane in the middle of the plane over seating issues. I asked her what’s the issue? She said the one guy is pretty big and the other man is telling him to sit somewhere else because he was encroaching on his side of the seat. 

I just shook my head and I asked her if we had any seats open in first or business class. She said we had three seats open. So, I told her to offer the guy complaining a seat in first. That way, there would only be two people in a three-person seating row. That should be plenty of room. Finally, everyone was happy. 

Having people onboard that smelled bad was always an ongoing issue. There just isn’t much we (the employees) or the company can do, unless the smell is so rank that several people complain and that has also happened. We were just lucky to have some open seats that allowed us to adjust the seating to make everyone happy. 

Flying is (was) supposed to be a pleasurable experience. Ever since the airlines took away the meals and narrowed the seating clearances things have changed. People aren’t as happy or satisfied as they should be. I have found that if you want to find the most rudest people around, just go to an airport. Vacation passengers are happy and taking their time while business passengers are, at times, grumpy and rushed. Mix those two together and it makes for a poor environment.


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## Don M. (Jul 21, 2019)

I've used air travel for probably over 50 years....and it sure has changed over the decades.  Back in the 1960's, when I took my first flight, air travel was almost a special experience.  People dressed up like they were going out for a special occasion, and the airline service was almost like going to a luxury hotel.  Now, some people show up acting like they are traveling on a city bus or subway....and I'm surprised that a person can still get a cup of water without paying a surcharge.


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## Lc jones (Aug 5, 2019)

I used to love flying because the airlines treated people like people and not like cattle. I no longer fly unless there’s a family emergency. And as I live in a really beautiful place I don’t miss it one bit.


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## Pappy (Aug 5, 2019)

Back in 56, the Army flew me from Binghamton, NY to San Francisco, CA. I flew mostly on a TWA Constellation. This is the kind of meals we received.


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## treeguy64 (Aug 5, 2019)

I don't fly, anymore. For business, I flew four to six times a week, when I was a young man. Now, with the types of folks who fly, chances of terroristic activities, unsafe craft, unskilled maintenance workers, crazy pilots........No thanks! 

I've always preferred driving, even cross country. I like the scenery, and I like making unplanned stops to check out points of interest. My world travels are over, obviously, and I regret that, but there's always the internet, to "take me" to those places I'll never visit, in person.


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## oldman (Aug 9, 2019)

treeguy64 said:


> I don't fly, anymore. For business, I flew four to six times a week, when I was a young man. Now, with the types of folks who fly, chances of terroristic activities, unsafe craft, unskilled maintenance workers, crazy pilots........No thanks!
> 
> I've always preferred driving, even cross country. I like the scenery, and I like making unplanned stops to check out points of interest. My world travels are over, obviously, and I regret that, but there's always the internet, to "take me" to those places I'll never visit, in person.



As for unsafe aircraft, you must be referring to the Boeing 737 MAX 8 & 900 series. Boeing definitely has some software issues with their new flight system, but I am also confident that they will get it done. I live by my statement that flying has never been safer that it is at this time in our lives. 

I was only a few weeks away from being trained on the Boeing Triple 7 and I was looking forward to it. However, along came an early out deal that I would have been foolish to walk away from.


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## Peachy (Aug 9, 2019)

I refuse to fly anymore. I got treated awful in the inspection line. I told them I had a colostomy and please don't embarrass me. They still made me throw my arms in the air and spin around in a circle while they took x-ray pictures in front of the public. NEVER AGAIN.


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## treeguy64 (Aug 9, 2019)

Peachy said:


> I refuse to fly anymore. I got treated awful in the inspection line. I told them I had a colostomy and please don't embarrass me. They still made me throw my arms in the air and spin around in a circle while they took x-ray pictures in front of the public. NEVER AGAIN.



I would NEVER allow those poorly-trained agents to use an x-ray source, of any kind, on me.  I don't allow dentists to x-ray me!  Next time, if there is one, demand a private search, in a closed room, no x-rays!  Other than that, as you're currently doing, and as I do, likewise:  When it comes to flying, JUST SAY "NO!"


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## oldman (Aug 10, 2019)

I am a little out of touch with the new TSA screening rules and laws that have recently been passed and a few still going through the Appeals Courts. The very last that I was aware of was that passengers have the right to ask for a private screening or pat down. Passengers also may bring along a companion to witness the private screening and passengers may also ask for a same gender TSA agent to conduct the pat down. If a pat down is agreed upon, the passenger may request and the TSA Agent shall change their gloves before proceeding with a pat down. 

This is not something bad. This is being done for everyone's protection. Airlines have no authority over the TSA Agents. They are hired by government agents. I will admit that I have seen some pretty picky agents and that not all agents act in a consistent manner. The manner in which a TSA Agent conducts his scan in Tampa, may not be the same as a TSA Agent performs his job in Denver. If there are any alerts that have been issued and Agents have been forewarned to look for certain people or items, the public would never know about it for obvious reasons. 

It's all about keeping the friendly skies friendly and safe for everyone.


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## toffee (Aug 10, 2019)

THE PILOT -heard a few screams Oldman lol
--it would have been me for sure .. anyway iam all for high security in any airport 'even if it takes longer . better safe than sorry I say .


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## Peachy (Aug 10, 2019)

oldman said:


> I am a little out of touch with the new TSA screening rules and laws that have recently been passed and a few still going through the Appeals Courts. The very last that I was aware of was that passengers have the right to ask for a private screening or pat down. Passengers also may bring along a companion to witness the private screening and passengers may also ask for a same gender TSA agent to conduct the pat down. If a pat down is agreed upon, the passenger may request and the TSA Agent shall change their gloves before proceeding with a pat down.
> 
> This is not something bad. This is being done for everyone's protection. Airlines have no authority over the TSA Agents. They are hired by government agents. I will admit that I have seen some pretty picky agents and that not all agents act in a consistent manner. The manner in which a TSA Agent conducts his scan in Tampa, may not be the same as a TSA Agent performs his job in Denver. If there are any alerts that have been issued and Agents have been forewarned to look for certain people or items, the public would never know about it for obvious reasons.
> 
> It's all about keeping the friendly skies friendly and safe for everyone.


I get security issues totally. That is why I was upfront with my condition. They should have taken me into a private area for inspection.


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## 911 (Aug 10, 2019)

I would ask for a private screening, if you are sensitive to others watching over you.


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## Peachy (Aug 10, 2019)

911 said:


> I would ask for a private screening, if you are sensitive to others watching over you.


You would think that human respect & dignity would have offered me such. Instead they put me on public display.


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## Lc jones (Aug 10, 2019)

Peachy said:


> You would think that human respect & dignity would have offered me such. Instead they put me on public display.


 I agree that’s just common courtesy.


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## oldman (Aug 11, 2019)

I will be flying in a few weeks. Now that I am retired, I go through the same TSA checks everyone else does at the airport. I do have a TSA clearance, which helps speed the process a little. I think anyone that doesn’t mind spending $80.00 or so dollars can also get a KTN number by making application and obtaining the necessary clearances.


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## Lethe200 (Aug 11, 2019)

TSA PreCheck is $85 for a five-yr period. It does save a lot of time, but that didn't help when everyone had to wait for the destination airport to clear our plane's flight path because of bad weather. At least we could hang around the airport and didn't have to wait inside the plane!

For short hops, we're going to start using semi-private airlines. We live very close to one of the airports they use, and for the places we want to go, it's easier, faster, and worth the extra cost to be able to park the car nearby and walk onto the plane 1/2 hr before take-off - just like the old days, LOL.


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## 911 (Aug 21, 2019)

We just returned from our trip to Florida. The trip was great, except for the flights. We flew Southwest Airlines and was scheduled to leave on Monday evening at 7:30 pm. As we “arrived” at the airport, I got a text from SW telling me that my flight was delayed until 9:30. Oh, crap. What a start to a vacation. We traveled with our daughter and grandson. We finally got off the ground at 10:10 pm. and arrived in Ft. Lauderdale at midnight, which we had to then get our luggage, call the shuttle and go to the hotel. We got to bed at 1:00 am. 

Yesterday, on our return trip, we were to fly out of Tampa at 4:00 pm. I received another text at 10:00 am telling me that my flight was canceled. Are you kidding me? I called SW and was able to book a return trip at 11:45. We had to really hustle to make it, but yes, we did. In fact, we were 10 minutes before boarding. Not bad, but I’m glad that no speed traps were setup because we may have been late. 

Anyway, we went, had a really great time, and came home all safe and well, so, I can look back on this trip and say it was a pleasure to have done it.


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## needshave (Sep 2, 2019)

Does anyone have trouble getting through security? I have a terrible time. Not with my luggage, not with my carry ons or electrical toys.... but with me. I have no metal in my pockets, rings, watches, belts, nothing. I'm as close as I can get to my birthday suit as I can with a few clothes on. But every time I go thru the metal detector I set that thing off. I have looked at the scans, and it shows normally my chest area and thighs. so I normally go to the side and have to be patted down and then they use the portable wand. I know they are only doing their job when the alarms go off, but its hard to understand. Yet, although I fully expect it now,  it seems to be great amusement for my wife!


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## jujube (Sep 3, 2019)

I can't say I've ever had any real problems with TSA.  I've even come across some with a sense of humor.  

Once I had a large rock in my carry-on that I was taking home as a souvenir. I expected problems with it.  Yep, bag got pulled by young TSA agent. He called over his supervisor.  I said, "Oh, I'm sure it's the rock in my bag, right?"  He said, "Yes, it's a rock for sure, but I have to look at it and besides, I told Tom here that the next time he called me over for a rock, I was going to take it out of the bag and beat him to death with it."  We had a good laugh and the rock and I headed to the gate.

I did "fail" the scatter-gram once because I had half a Kleenex in my back pocket.

Funniest time was when they were yelling "DON'T PUT SHOES IN THE BINS! PUT THEM DIRECTLY ON THE BELT!"  So I did.  At the other end, the bin comes rolling out, my carry one comes rolling out, one shoe comes rolling out. I wait....and wait....and wait.  Finally, I tell the agent, "Only one shoe came out."  She looks at me quite dully and says, "Were there two?"   My mouth gets ready to respond with, "OH MY GAWD, I MUST HAVE FORGOTTEN TO WEAR *TWO* SHOES TODAY!!!" while my brain is screaming, "DO *NOT* GET SNARKY WITH A TSA AGENT!!!"  For one of the few times in my life, my brain won out over my mouth.  They eventually fished my shoe out of the machine and I dodged the "no-fly list" once again.


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## 911 (Sep 3, 2019)

I have also read recently that airfares are expected to rise.
I also wouldn’t mind if they would make everyone check their bags and get rid of the overhead bins. It takes forever to get everyone off the plane after landing.


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## OneEyedDiva (Sep 8, 2019)

I started a personal boycott of the airlines several years ago for several reasons, one of them being the way the TSA was treating people (children, seniors, Muslims).  I read that people will have to start showing their passports or enhanced drivers' licenses to travel within the U.S. as well.  I also read that facial recognition software has some flaws regarding biases when it comes to people of color.  The software companies were made aware and are allegedly going to try to fix those issues.


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## Glowworm (Mar 5, 2021)

Pappy said:


> Back in 56, the Army flew me from Binghamton, NY to San Francisco, CA. I flew mostly on a TWA Constellation. This is the kind of meals we received.
> 
> View attachment 73926View attachment 73927View attachment 73927


Ah yes, TWA - Teeny Weeny Airlines

Also the now defunct Belgian airline Sabena - Such A Bloody Experience Never Again

Australia's QANTAS or as comedian Warren Mitchell once said in an ad "Quaintarse"





And here in Sweden our own SAS - "Startar Alltid Sent" which freely translates to Always Starts Late


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## ohioboy (Mar 5, 2021)

*DELTA

D*on't *E*xpect *L*uggage *T*o *A*rrive


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## Glowworm (Mar 5, 2021)

BA - Bloody Awful

Parody of British Airways 1970's Fly the Flag slogan - Breakfast in London, lunch in New York, luggage in Kuala Lumpur - fly the flag


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## Don M. (Mar 5, 2021)

In the past several years, we have only flown on SW Airlines....fairly short flights to/from Denver, or Las Vegas.  We haven't taken a trip this past year, but we've always had good results with SW.  Often, we spend more time at the airport, than the actual flight.  Once this virus thing settles down, we'll fly again...hopefully the air travel will recover nicely.


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## Glowworm (Mar 5, 2021)

If you're nervous about flying these pictures will put you at your ease


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## Pinky (Mar 5, 2021)

I love Qantas and Cathay Pacific.
My first flight ever was Toronto -Vancouver on Air Canada, when I was around 21. It was so impressive to have a steak & champagne breakfast served on real china.


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## Feelslikefar (Mar 5, 2021)

Airlines that were 'interesting' (out of the ordinary) for me, would be Reeves Aleutian Airways and Olympic Airlines.
Reeves flew us to the Island on the Aleutians and the cross winds made for some scary moments landing.
They used an L-188C Electra 4 prop job.

I flew Olympic Airlines from Athens to Crete in 1988 and what was allowed as carry-on was pretty interesting.
You name it, bring it on board!

All time favorites for me, would be British Air (the 80's ) and the Virgin Atlantic flight we took from LA, Ca.  to Heathrow, UK. 1993.
They spoiled our youngest son with his own small pack pack filled with kid stuff. They would come by with treats the
entire flight. First plane we flew on that had small TV's in each seat back. Cartoons kept him busy most of the long flight.

Flown a lot in the past, but just don't get too thrilled about taking a flight anymore in this new age.


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## MrPants (Mar 5, 2021)

I remember the days when flying was a really special thing and you'd be pampered by caring and helpful attendants. Lots of room in your seat and always a decent meal on most flights over a couple hours.
These days it's more like how many can we squeeze into the plane and how much can we charge for "extras". I guess luggage is now an extra with many. It's just a cattle car experience now and that's reflected by how you're treated by most attendants now. Thank god safety and maintenance hasn't seen the wrath of cost cutting .... yet.


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## oldman (Mar 5, 2021)

For years and years, airlines had lost money. I'm not talking about a few hundred or even a few million dollars, but many millions of dollars. This was mostly due to fuel prices and costs associated with wages and maintenance. Then the idea of charging for luggage and the other extras became a reality for many of today's airlines, except Southwest. 

As for meals, flights over four hours on United still get a short meal, except for anyone sitting in one of the upper classes of service. The pilots eat pretty good when food is onboard. I was a bit paranoid when it came to eating. I never ate at the same time of my F/O. I was always concerned that some of the food would be tainted and we would both become ill, so I either ate a different entre or at a different time from my F/O. Just to be on the safe side. 

I can still remember when people dressed a bit differently than they do today. Men either wore a suit or dressed in business casual. The women would wear a suit or business casual as well. Very few women would wear a dress when flying.


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## 911 (Mar 6, 2021)

oldman said:


> For years and years, airlines had lost money. I'm not talking about a few hundred or even a few million dollars, but many millions of dollars. This was mostly due to fuel prices and costs associated with wages and maintenance. Then the idea of charging for luggage and the other extras became a reality for many of today's airlines, except Southwest.
> 
> As for meals, flights over four hours on United still get a short meal, except for anyone sitting in one of the upper classes of service. The pilots eat pretty good when food is onboard. I was a bit paranoid when it came to eating. I never ate at the same time of my F/O. I was always concerned that some of the food would be tainted and we would both become ill, so I either ate a different entre or at a different time from my F/O. Just to be on the safe side.
> 
> I can still remember when people dressed a bit differently than they do today. Men either wore a suit or dressed in business casual. The women would wear a suit or business casual as well. Very few women would wear a dress when flying.


Some people sitting in first class look like bums. They probably use their miles to upgrade, which is fine. I dress in what you call business casual. Unless I am flying with a companion, like my wife or friend, I never know who will be sitting in the seat beside me. I have sat beside doctors, lawyers, a Vice President from Kodak and others. I have seen mostly younger people dressed in shorts, a muscle shirt and a pair of slides in first class. Not that dress is all that important, but we should present ourselves to suit the setting or situation. Don’t you think?


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## oldman (Mar 9, 2021)

Nothing beats flying in First Class. I get free flights for myself and a companion, but save my credit card points to upgrade from coach to FC. Sometimes when I get to the airport, I will ask at the check-in if there are any open seats in FC. If there are, it is sometimes possible to get a seat at a very big discount if you ask really nice.

The gate agent sometimes will cut me a break and exchange my coach ticket for an upgrade, depending on how many classes of service are on my flight, I may get a seat in Business Class for little or no extra charge. Try it sometime. You never know what may happen. Just never tell them a “story.” They are smart enough to know when they are being played.


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