# confused about 55+ communities



## BiXLL

I have been looking at different places around Florida to possibly retire to.  I found a house in a central Florida community called Royal Harbor that I really like.

 I found Royal Harbor in researching areas that could provide good fresh  water boating, golf, 55+ community that was golf cart friendly with organized  activities.  Another place I have looked into and my mom and dad have friends  living there is Riverside club, in Ruskin Fl.. http://www.suncommunities.com/riverside-club/AboutUs.aspx.    While visiting there they called me and my dad was all excited telling me how  nice the place was.  It is a Mfg. Home Community.  I asked what the fees were  there and he told me it was $800.00 a month.  I said that sounded awful high to  me, and he stated that is what he is paying and his taxes are not included as  they are in Riverside. 

  OK, I am confused.  The house that I like in Royal Harbor Has HOA fees of  $142. Per month.  It includes:

Community Features: Association  Recreation - Owned, Buyer Approval Required, Card Entry, Community Hot Tub/Spa,  Fees Required, Fishing Pier, Fitness, Gated Community, PUD, Recreation Building,  Security, Tennis Courts, Water Access 
Maintenance Includes: Cable, Community  Pool, Escrow Reserves Fund, Manager, Private Road, Recreational Facilities,  Security, Tennis Courts

The taxes on it are $2326. Per year or $194.00  per month.

$194.00 + $142. = $336.00 per month.


Explain what I am missing???  What would I get from the place in  Ruskin, that would warrant and additional $470.00 per month????   I honestly do  not understand.  Are there additional fees at royal Harbor I am not  considering?  When researching, some places say there is a community boat dock  on the lake, is there an additional fee for using that?  What other fees/costs  am I not seeing?


----------



## Pappy

Taxes, $2326 per year? Are you buying the land? The place must be very upscale. My taxes are about a tenth of what you are paying.

Cable. Basic only, at least in most places. Want wi-Fi and premium channels, it is an extra charge.

Is lawn mowing included? 

It sounds very nice, but you are paying for a lot of extras which is fine if you plan on having a boat and using all of them.

Glad to answer anything you have if I know the answers.


----------



## BiXLL

This is the house in Royal harbor.
http://www.estately.com/listings/info/3258-kingston-way


SE/TP/RG: 13-20-25Zoning: PUDSection #:  Subdivision #:  1811Future Land Use:  RESBlock/Parcel: 000 Tax ID: 13-20-25-181100059800Zoning Comp: Front Exp: Northeast Taxes: $2,326Tax Year: 2015Lot #: 598 Homestead: YesCDD: NoAnnual CDD Fee:  Other Exempt: No Alt Key/Folio #:  3829294Add Parcel: No Legal Desc: TAVARES, ROYAL HARBOR PHASE 4 SUB LOT 598 PB 52 PG  87-90 ORB 2686 PG 54Mill Rate: 21.7000 Ownership: Fee SimpleComplex/Comm Name:   Book/Page: 2686/54Floor #: Flood Zone: X Lot Dim: 62X124X123X135Lot Size Acres:  0.33Lot Size SqFt:  14,561 Water Access: Lake, Limited AccessWater Name: LITTLE LAKE HARRIS Water View: Water Extras: Fishing Pier, Sailboat Water, Skiing  Allowed Interior Information A/C: CentralFloor Covering:  Carpet, Ceramic  Tile Heat/Fuel: Central, Fuel - Gas NaturalSecurity Sys:  Fireplace: NoSqFt Source: Public Records Utilities Data:  BB/HS Internet Avail, Cable Connected,  City Water, Electric, Fiber Optics, Gas, Public Sewer, Public Utilities,  Sprinkler Meter, Underground Interior Layout:  Breakfast Room Separate, Formal Dining  Room Separate, Formal Living Room Separate, Split Bedroom, Volume  Ceilings Interior Features:  Attic, Blinds/Shades, Ceiling Fan(S),  Handicapped Modified, Inside Utility, Solid Wood Cabinets, Unfurnished, Walk In  Closet, Washer/Dryer Hookup, Wheelchair Accessible Master Bath: Dual Sinks, Garden Bath, Handicapped Accessible,  Tub with Separate Shower Stall Appliances Included:  Dishwasher, Disposal, Hot Water Gas,  Microwave Hood, Oven, Range, Refrigerator Kitchen Feat: Breakfast Bar, Closet Pantry 
Additional Rms: Family Room, Inside  Utility
  
RoomDimLevelFloor Covering RoomDimLevelFloor Covering
  
 
Living Room15x181stCarpet



 
Dining Room10x121stCarpet




 
Kitchen11x141stCeramic Tile



 
Dinette9x101stCeramic Tile




 
Family Room12x171stCarpet



 
Master Bedroom13x181stCarpet




 
2nd Bedroom11x131stCarpet



 
3rd Bedroom11x121stCarpet




 
Inside Utility6x101stCeramic Tile



 
Foyer8x81stCeramic Tile




 
Balcony/Porch/Lanai28x161stConcrete


 Exterior Information Exterior Construction:  Block, StuccoDescription: One Story Roof: ShingleGarage Dim: 21x24 Exterior Features:  Irrigation System, Mature Landscaping,  Outdoor Lights, Patio/Porch/Deck Screened, Sliding Doors, Sprinkler Metered,  Wheelchair Accessible Pool: Pool Dim:  Community Information Community Features:  Association Recreation - Owned,  Buyer Approval Required, Card Entry, Community Hot Tub/Spa, Fees Required,  Fishing Pier, Fitness, Gated Community, PUD, Recreation Building, Security,  Tennis Courts, Water Access Maintenance Includes:  Cable, Community Pool, Escrow  Reserves Fund, Manager, Private Road, Recreational Facilities, Security, Tennis  Courts HOA Comm/Assn:  RequiredHOA Fee:  $142.00HOA Pmt Sched:  MonthlyMo Maint$(add HOA):   Condo Fees: Other Fees: Housing for Older Per:  55 or older Max Pet Weight:   
Pet Restrictions: See Royal Harbor Deed  Restrictions
 


----------



## Pappy

I'm sorry. I misunderstood. When you said manufactured home, I thought it was a double wide mobile home. Can't be much help BiXLL. 
There are some folks on here that do have homes in Florida. Maybe they will see your post. The think oldman has a place.


----------



## BiXLL

No, the place in Ruskin is Mfg. Home community.


----------



## BiXLL

Well, after some more research, the house in Tavares is out.  I found that Tavareas is rated VERY HIGH for crime, with murder and violent crimes topping the list.  It is also rated high for hurricanes.  Hurricane insurance for only $65,000 is around $1600.00 a year in a high rated area, I can only imagine what it would cost for $235,000.!!!!!  The crime rate is appearantly due to the fact that the area is in a heavy orange producing zone that attracts large numbers of migrant workers


----------



## jujube

Have you looked into The Villages?  That's the biggest retirement community in Florida, as far as I know.  It's so big, it's in four different counties.  Apparently there are all sorts of neighborhoods/communities in The Villages.


----------



## BobF

Having once lived in Florida, I would suggest having your list of possible places put together and then doing a trip to each to decide what you think you will have and reality on what you will have are the same.   

I lived way down south in Boca Raton and know little about the central or northern areas.   We did have relatives living up north in Bartow area in central location and not much experience in the pan handle locations.   As I remember Florida there are many distinct areas of very rich with mansions they would visit if in the area and very poor areas not far away.   In between are many nice average home areas with good maintenance rules and others not so good looking.   Shopping reasonably close is important as it gets harder for us to do as we grow older.   As I remember it, we had all those all within the Boca Raton area when we were living there.


----------



## LogicsHere

I've looked into the possibility of moving to a 55+ community at one time, but when I looked at the cost of entry fee's, plus $3500 a month rent . . . I just couldn't afford it.  It is outrageous that just because they have a rec room and other activities that they charge you so much. A 55+ and older community here in Metro NY where I live has rents of about $1200 a month for a 2 bedroom apartment and use of the community's library, recreation facilities is free.


----------



## Pappy

jujube said:


> Have you looked into The Villages?  That's the biggest retirement community in Florida, as far as I know.  It's so big, it's in four different counties.  Apparently there are all sorts of neighborhoods/communities in The Villages.



True, jujube. We had a chance to visit someone there and they showed us some of the area. They have double wide homes to million dollar houses with garages big enough to hold their million dollar motor homes. Just about any price range.


----------



## BiXLL

everything I have read about the Villages tells me its way too big for me


----------



## jujube

I'll grant you, it's big.


----------



## squatting dog

One more thing to keep in mind. Flood insurance. I was stunned to find that all water retention ponds are now considered high flood zones and insurance is extremely high around them. Most people only thought the new rules would apply only to lake/river/ocean front property. Not so... my neighbor has 2 retention ponds behind and to the left of his land. After April, his insurance payments jumped 300 dollars per month. Needless to say, he's fit to be tied., mainly because when he was buying the lot, it was pointed out that because of the ponds, his risk of flood was less and thus the lot cost more.


----------



## Butterfly

I sure couldn't afford to live in one of those places.


----------



## jujube

BiXLL said:


> I have been looking at different places around Florida to possibly retire to.  I found a house in a central Florida community called Royal Harbor that I really like.
> 
> I found Royal Harbor in researching areas that could provide good fresh  water boating, golf, 55+ community that was golf cart friendly with organized  activities.  Another place I have looked into and my mom and dad have friends  living there is Riverside club, in Ruskin Fl.. http://www.suncommunities.com/riverside-club/AboutUs.aspx.    While visiting there they called me and my dad was all excited telling me how  nice the place was.  It is a Mfg. Home Community.  I asked what the fees were  there and he told me it was $800.00 a month.  I said that sounded awful high to  me, and he stated that is what he is paying and his taxes are not included as  they are in Riverside.
> 
> OK, I am confused.  The house that I like in Royal Harbor Has HOA fees of  $142. Per month.  It includes:
> 
> Community Features: Association  Recreation - Owned, Buyer Approval Required, Card Entry, Community Hot Tub/Spa,  Fees Required, Fishing Pier, Fitness, Gated Community, PUD, Recreation Building,  Security, Tennis Courts, Water Access
> Maintenance Includes: Cable, Community  Pool, Escrow Reserves Fund, Manager, Private Road, Recreational Facilities,  Security, Tennis Courts
> 
> The taxes on it are $2326. Per year or $194.00  per month.
> 
> $194.00 + $142. = $336.00 per month.
> 
> 
> Explain what I am missing???  What would I get from the place in  Ruskin, that would warrant and additional $470.00 per month????   I honestly do  not understand.  Are there additional fees at royal Harbor I am not  considering?  When researching, some places say there is a community boat dock  on the lake, is there an additional fee for using that?  What other fees/costs  am I not seeing?



What your dad is paying $800 a month for _might_ be only the lot rental.  In these mobile home/park model/manufactured home communities, you own your unit, but you _lease_ the lot it sits on.  The lease payment usually covers yard care and sometimes water/cable/wi-fi. You pay your own electricity, and water/cable/wifi if not included.  The more amenities the park community offers, the higher the monthly "rent" is for the lot.  

We've spent the last couple of summers (four months each summer) in a 55+ RV park in North Carolina, taking a break from our usual gadding about the country during that time.  We pay $490 a month for our space.  That includes water, cable, Wi-Fi, mowing/lot maintenance and the use of the pool, gym and club house.  We pay our own electricity.  The only thing we actually own is our RV.  There are people who live there full-time, some in their RVs and some in "park models" that have been placed on bigger lots than what the RVs sit on.  Others, like us, are "transients" or "seasonals".   The rent for a space varies widely, depending on how big the lot is and how long you stay. 

From what I can tell, what you get at Royal Harbor seems to be a home and lot that you _own_.  You buy that separately. Then you have to pay an "association fee" that covers the use of the pool, docks, club house, etc. and _might_ cover the cost of mowing your front lawn.  These fees can be quite high.   If the clubhouse needs a new roof or the pool needs fixing, the "fee" can go up each year.


----------



## Sunny

I'm in a high-rise condo in a 55+ community. I own the condo, and pay a monthly condo fee, which covers a lot of features such as the water and sewer bill, free cable TV, wireless in every apartment and a computer room free of charge, trash and recycling, snow removal, grounds maintenance, security, cleaning (building is kept immaculate) recreational features such as tennis courts, pools, etc. (playing golf is extra), and a lot of clubhouse activities such as theatre entertainment, a fully equipped gym, dance and exercise groups, clubs (music, writing, political discussion, card games, billiards, pingpong, etc.). Put all of those things together, and if paid for separately, they would cost many times the few hundred dollars I pay every month.

The difference in the two condo fees you ask about could be due to a number of reasons. I have a feeling you are comparing apples and oranges. Could the $800 include a mortgage? Or golf course fees? Is the Royal Harbor fee really only $142 including taxes? Sounds suspiciously low.  Are the two units comparable in size, construction quality, etc.?  Are both communities equally good? Do both places offer a similar amount of security, maintenance, and recreational activities?  What does your gut instinct tell you about the two places? 
places to live?


----------



## Kath

Hi Sunny - I live in an 55+ community lower PA.  Instead of apartments, it's all homes.  My husband and I bought ours 8 years ago because it was the closest we could find to where my kids and grandkids lived.  The monthly HOA fee is very steep (to me it seems steep!) but covers the amenities which are similar to yours.  Now that I'm widowed, I find that taking care of this place is a really big task and I'd love to live in a much smaller place.  I'm talking to realtors about selling but apparently it takes eons of time to sell homes like this which are considered to be in a niche market.  I've been told it could take 6 to 12 months or more to unload a place like mine.  That was a kick in the gut! Of course, if one is willing to take any lowball offer that comes down the pike, getting the place sold goes much faster.  I have no idea where I would move to at this point.  My dream was always to end up in UK but wish I'd done that when hubby was still on earth so I wouldn't have to face such a big move alone.


----------



## Kitties

Kath, when my stepfather sold his mobile in a nice, but smaller rural town park, it took 9 months. I felt bad for him but luckily he has retirement so he could pay the space rent while the place sat empty.

If you really want to move, you just may need to move forward. It sure is hard though and selling a place is very stressful. I hope in the end all works out.


----------



## Kath

I'm not very surprised at the amount of time it may take to sell the place but due to some extraneous factors (spouse died; and I'm recovering from spine surgery), my stress level is a bit elevated right now.  Working hard on getting a grip though.  Glad your stepfather was successful with his sale.


----------



## Kitties

Kath said:


> I'm not very surprised at the amount of time it may take to sell the place but due to some extraneous factors (spouse died; and I'm recovering from spine surgery), my stress level is a bit elevated right now.  Working hard on getting a grip though.  Glad your stepfather was successful with his sale.



Kath, it sounds like you are going through a lot. These are never easy decisions.


----------



## Sunny

Kath, I also fell in love with the UK when I visited in 2014, and like you, I felt a longing to live there... not that I have it so bad now! These things are always complicated and include many factors,
such as where your children and grandchildren live. When my husband was alive and we were hale and hearty in our 50's, our children were grown and living all over the country, so we followed our
dream and moved to the Pacific Northwest, where we lived for 18 wonderful years. But eventually it was obviously time to move near one of our children, so we returned to Maryland, where our son and grandson are. Living alone now, I'm glad we made the move. Although there are some adventurous pioneer types who do live thousands of miles from their children, even into extreme old age. I give them credit; I couldn't do it.

Last year, I sold the large condo that my husband and I had lived in, and downsized to a smaller one, much less expensive and more suitable for a single person. I had no difficulty selling it. I put it on the market in January (dumb move) and nobody even came to look until March, and then it sold right away, after a total of less than 3 months on the market. Of course, the housing market varies a lot from place to place. Here in Montgomery County, it's pretty bustling.

From what I hear from my daughter in PA, that is one of the most expensive states to live in. So that factors in too.  Good luck with whatever you decide to do.


----------



## Manatee

We talked with our kids about Florida where they grew up.  They are both now in the Pacific Norwest, but considering returning to FL when retirement time comes.  They are in their mid 50s, and still have friends here.


----------



## Kath

Sunny, I lived for quite a few years in Montgomery County, MD (both Potomac and Bethesda).  Where I now live (near Lancaster, PA), it is semi-rural and a lot less expensive than Mont. County.  This area was hit pretty hard by the housing bust several years ago, so if one sells their house they often get less at the time of sale than they originally paid for it.  Consequently, people only sell if they absolutely have to.  I think I'll have an easier time making the moving decision after I get rid of some of the stress of recent widowhood and recovery from surgery.  Right now I feel exhausted just thinking about moving.


----------



## Sunny

You're wise to take your time. Don't do it until you're ready.

(We lived in Bethesda too! Wonder if it was at the same time?)


----------



## Kath

I lived in Bethesda from 1977 to 1983 - were you around that area then?


----------



## Sunny

Yes! We lived there from 1975 to 1990. We were on Bradley Blvd. Perhaps we were neighbors?


----------



## Kath

Pretty darn close!  House was about 2 blocks off River Road.  Not far from the Unitarian Church.


----------



## Sunny

We belonged to that church! 

Our house was between Wilson and Huntington.


----------



## Kath

Isn't this mind-blowing!  My marriage to my second husband took place in that church. I thought it was such a pretty church because it was surrounded by so many lovely trees.   I still miss many things about the area because there is so much going on all the time and friends I haven't seen in many years.  I was born in DC and have lived in many of the areas adjacent to the city.  During school years, I lived on the Virginia side of the Potomac River and on the Maryland side after that.


----------



## Sunny

Bill Murray, the minister at that time (he officiated at the weddings of all three of my children) is still around, or at least he was a few years ago. He gave a talk somewhere nearby and was selling copies of his book. We bought one. 

Somehow, in later years, I lost the incentive to belong to any organized religion. But I still remember that church, as you do, very fondly.


----------



## Lon

Having had two homes at different times in one of the Del Webb Retirement Communities I am a real fan. Good rules & fees, good neighbors, over all good value. In addition to actually living in one I have visited five or six different facilities in different states.


----------



## Ray

When we were looking - back about 20 years ago - we visited a place that was interesting, it offered both options lower price but higher monthlies (rent the land) and higher prices but lower monthlies (own the land). In trying to determine the best option for us we decided that all we had to do was to look into the future about 10-15 years. Just find a place you like, can afford, and let the chips fall where they may.

I agree about the Villages being too large and crowded, We also lived a few years in Sun City Center (south of Tampa) and found it to be a lot of fun but a bit "sterile" (don't ask - I can't explain). We then discovered Timber Pines in Hernando County moved in and figure it's the second best decision we ever made.


----------



## ember

In a manufactured home community you usually pay a monthly lot fee.  It's possible that you will also pay an HOA fee for access to the amenities.  If you own the land on which the home sits, then you will pay property tax.  If you do not own the land, then you usually pay an annual licensing fee.


----------

