# What is your definition of 'love'?



## Bluecheese50 (Jan 26, 2016)

I think love is liking someone a lot. I couldn't love anyone I didn't like.

I don't wish to love anyone with all my heart and being, just in case they die I have no wish to feel deep grief. So far I have achieved that even when my favourite grandmother died 36 years ago, I was fond of her. I hope none of my children/grandchildren, of whom I am very fond die before me, I might find it hard not to grieve their loss.


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## Ken N Tx (Jan 26, 2016)

My wife and I have been in love for 58 years now..I hope that I will go first..


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 26, 2016)

Ken N Tx said:


> My wife and I have been in love for 58 years now..I hope that I will go first..



My husband and I have managed 46 years so far, and haven't murdered each other yet, so that is an achievement I guess!


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## SifuPhil (Jan 26, 2016)

Bluecheese50 said:


> I think love is liking someone a lot. I couldn't love anyone I didn't like.



While liking someone before you love them makes sense, I would hazard the opinion that love is something more than liking someone a lot. There are many levels of love to be considered as well. You can love your goldfish. You can also love your spouse. Different levels of feeling. 



> I don't wish to love anyone with all my heart and being, just in case they die I have no wish to feel deep grief. So far I have achieved that even when my favourite grandmother died 36 years ago, I was fond of her. I hope none of my children/grandchildren, of whom I am very fond die before me, I might find it hard not to grieve their loss.



I've always felt that, especially when it comes to spouses and family, full-out, unrestricted love should be the norm. If you fear loss you cannot love fully.


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 26, 2016)

SifuPhil said:


> While liking someone before you love them makes sense, I would hazard the opinion that love is something more than liking someone a lot. There are many levels of love to be considered as well. You can love your goldfish. You can also love your spouse. Different levels of feeling.
> 
> 
> 
> I've always felt that, especially when it comes to spouses and family, full-out, unrestricted love should be the norm. If you fear loss you cannot love fully.



As I said I couldn't love anyone I didn't like and that includes family. Fortunately I like my children and grandchildren.


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## hollydolly (Jan 26, 2016)

I find that in a personal relationship you do have to ''like' someone before you can feel love for them...however outside of that not so much., For example there are members of my family whom I love , but for various reasons I don't like them very much, they're not people I would choose to have as friends for example..


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## Ralphy1 (Jan 26, 2016)

Aww, love, yes, poets, philosophers, novelists, songwriters, they have all grappled with it.  Such a meaningful but elusive thing.  Where did I leave my heart last night...?


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## Shalimar (Jan 26, 2016)

I am a sensitive emotional person with a great deal of empathy. I have also experienced huge losses, some I still mourn. I hate grieving. But for me, the price of humanity is heartbreak, the lack of it, anathema. I prize connection above all things, not out 

of any codependent need, but rather an incredible joy in deep interactions with others. Liking is great, I make friends easily, loving is a whole new ball game. While I would never give all to anyone because I believe it to be unhealthy for both persons 

involved, I love deeply and unconditionally, whether it be my pets, close  friends,  children, or a beloved man. All things die, that is the poignancy of life. I will grieve when I must, but until then, I will glory in the gift of loving as the most  precious part 

of my existence. To do less would be to live in fear, to shut myself away from pain by excluding the vulnerability required to be truly open to another. I have paid a high price for this choice, but It continues to define my life. In my humble opinion, my 

capacity for love  is the crowning achievement of this life. I am a poet, with a marvelous perennial muse.


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## Shalimar (Jan 26, 2016)

Ralphy, did you check San Francisco?


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## SifuPhil (Jan 26, 2016)

So much better said than I could ever hope to.


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## Ameriscot (Jan 26, 2016)

I think real love is unconditional.  It means caring about the well-being of the other person and not loving them on the condition that you get something in return.  No conditions.


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## Karen99 (Jan 26, 2016)

Life isn't much without love.  I also believe in loving with all your heart.  It's worth whatever it costs.  I'm not saying be a stupid fool..but people do that too. A good friendship is a wonderful thing..but not the same as love.  You love your kids even if they break your heart.  

When I was ten I taped this poem into my scrapbook and decided this was what life is all about..I still do.

*Barter*


Life has loveliness to sell,
      All beautiful and splendid things,
Blue waves whitened on a cliff,
      Soaring fire that sways and sings,
And children's faces looking up
Holding wonder like a cup.

Life has loveliness to sell,
      Music like a curve of gold,
Scent of pine trees in the rain,
      Eyes that love you, arms that hold,
And for your spirit's still delight,
Holy thoughts that star the night.

Spend all you have for loveliness,
      Buy it and never count the cost;
For one white singing hour of peace
      Count many a year of strife well lost,
And for a breath of ecstasy
Give all you have been, or could be.

sara Teasdale


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## Ralphy1 (Jan 26, 2016)

Tony!  And he still out there looking for it at 88!


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 26, 2016)

hollydolly said:


> I find that in a personal relationship you do have to ''like' someone before you can feel love for them...however outside of that not so much., For example there are members of my family whom I love , but for various reasons I don't like them very much, they're not people I would choose to have as friends for example..



How do you define 'love'? I didn't like my mother much, especially in her later years, and certainly wouldn't have described the feelings I had for her as love. However, together with my siblings we ensured she wanted for nothing, and had the best of care homes.


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## mitchezz (Jan 26, 2016)

You can tell if you love someone unconditionally by asking one question "Would I take a bullet for this person?"


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## Ralphy1 (Jan 26, 2016)

We are starting to go into all kinds of love other than romantic love...


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## Ameriscot (Jan 26, 2016)

mitchezz said:


> You can tell if you love someone unconditionally by asking one question "Would I take a bullet for this person?"



True.


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## Shalimar (Jan 26, 2016)

Sometimes in the case of difficult aging family members, love is exclusively a verb. You do your best to ensure they are well cared for, because of personal values, regardless of how horrid the people  may be.. My mother was a raging narcissist for most of her life, fortunately her stroke turned her like able. Regardless, I did my duty and was a part of caring for her.


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## Shalimar (Jan 26, 2016)

Mitchezz, qft.


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## Jackie22 (Jan 26, 2016)

Ralphy1 said:


> We are starting to go into all kinds of love other than romantic love...



Yes, I have the love of my grandchildren....I find this love satisfying, to watch them grow, to see how they deal with life and to have them hug me when they come to visit, I'm grateful for their parents that taught them love.


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## Shalimar (Jan 26, 2016)

I am not certain that romantic love is the epitome of love.


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 26, 2016)

Shalimar said:


> I am a sensitive emotional person with a great deal of empathy. I have also experienced huge losses, some I still mourn. I hate grieving. But for me, the price of humanity is heartbreak, the lack of it, anathema. I prize connection above all things, not out
> 
> of any codependent need, but rather an incredible joy in deep interactions with others. Liking is great, I make friends easily, loving is a whole new ball game. While I would never give all to anyone because I believe it to be unhealthy for both persons
> 
> ...



The only love I have, if that is what the feeling is, is for my children and grandchildren. I get on with my siblings, but I don't think the feeling I have for them is love. As my husband's carer I do what I have to do for him, although apart from our family we have nothing in common whatsoever. If I felt any grief it was when he had his subarachnoid haemorrhage in 2006, which robbed him of half his brain and his MEGA intelligence. I suspect it was his intelligence which attracted him to me in the first place, when I met him at 15. If he died I doubt I would feel any grief, just relief because he is so frustrated that he can't do anything of an academic nature anymore; academia is his greatest love.

I have two friends I made at school, but would never describe any feelings I had for them as love. I have plenty of friendly acquaintances, but have never needed close friends.

I could never 'love' an animal, of which we have had plenty as they have their uses. They were well taken care of, but never treated like humans.

I enjoy my hobbies, digital art, poetry, writing and creating glitter stones, but I would not use the word 'love' in that context.

I know I am far from perfect, but I am content being just me and wouldn't wish to change the way I feel.


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## Ralphy1 (Jan 26, 2016)

But there ain't nuttin' to compare to it, even if it is just falling for a fantasy...


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## Karen99 (Jan 26, 2016)

Sounds like you got what you wanted, Bluecheese...judging from your last sentence..so good on you.


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## 911 (Jan 26, 2016)

Ken N Tx said:


> My wife and I have been in love for 58 years now..I hope that I will go first..



I "have" to go first. Otherwise, I couldn't make it on my own for very long. I have been a very pampered husband and I have appreciated every minute of it.


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## AprilT (Jan 26, 2016)

I challenge the idea that you have to like family members, even some friends on occasions,  in order to love them, I know this from experience, I don't like some, but I love them with all my heart and want nothing but the best for them in life, but, I can do without day to day contact nor want them as friends due to their personalities, but, I would be there for them if they needed me.  Now in romance, to be "IN" love, I definitely have to like the person.


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 26, 2016)

AprilT said:


> I challenge the idea that you have to like family members, even some friends on occasions,  in order to love them, I know this from experience, I don't like some, but I love them with all my heart and want nothing but the best for them in life, but, I can do without day to day contact nor want them as friends due to their personalities, but, I would be there for them if they needed me.  Now in romance, to be "IN" love, I definitely have to love the person.



Well what do you mean by 'love', then?


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## AprilT (Jan 26, 2016)

Bluecheese50 said:


> Well what do you mean by 'love', then?



It was suppose to read like, I have to like to be "In" love.


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## SifuPhil (Jan 26, 2016)

Love is often about sacrifice.

You let your child walk to school by themselves for the first time. Your common sense and every fiber in your being says to accompany them as usual, but after they beg you your love for them takes over and says "yes".

As I said previously, I could love my goldfish. But I wouldn't take a bullet for them - that's reserved for the people I love. 

The old saying "If you love someone, let them go" ... painful, yes, but an indicator of true love. 

Love can smother the loved one, true. It happens every day. That's not true love - that's selfishness. One-way love.


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 26, 2016)

SifuPhil said:


> Love is often about sacrifice.
> 
> You let your child walk to school by themselves for the first time. Your common sense and every fiber in your being says to accompany them as usual, but after they beg you your love for them takes over and says "yes".
> 
> ...



If that is what you mean by love then I love, I suppose as I would do anything I could for my family.


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## SifuPhil (Jan 26, 2016)

Bluecheese50 said:


> If that is what you mean by love then I love, I suppose as I would do anything I could for my family.




There you go!


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 26, 2016)

SifuPhil said:


> There you go!



But I don't consider that love, just being a decent person.


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## AprilT (Jan 26, 2016)

Oh, I could define what it is for me to love, but, I'd have to hide the weapon I used on ya afterwards.  Love means different things to different people for me, I know it when I feel it it's not some neat little package you can wrap up and put a bow on it and as Phil has said, there are levels and types of love.

I have loved deeply with every fiber of my body, I have loved moderately, I have been in love with all those fibers and then some and can say I still hold that person in my heart and probably will do so till the day I die, but, I could love another as deeply if they had same qualities and crossed my path, but, I'm hopeful that won't happen as I too would rather not go through that kind of all in feeling again it's too overwhelming due to past lost and I don't mean romantic, I mean general lost of loved ones, I'm just not interested in doing that anymore.  

Only each person can define for themselves and no one has the right to determine what love is for them it's meaning is quite individual, but, one thing for sure, you don't purposely hurt those you love, you don't wish harm for those you love, you want the best for those you love.


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## AprilT (Jan 26, 2016)

Bluecheese50 said:


> But I don't consider that love, just being a decent person.



sThen for you it isn't your definition, for someone else it is love as they see it, as defined for themselves.


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## SifuPhil (Jan 26, 2016)

Bluecheese50 said:


> But I don't consider that love, just being a decent person.




Interesting viewpoint.

One of my tests has always been the ability to switch a statement round to see if it is true both ways.

Yes, loving someone means you're a decent person.

But does being a decent person mean loving everyone and everything? You've already said "no" to that yourself.


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## vickyNightowl (Jan 26, 2016)

"Love" is unconditional,I love my kids.
I love some family members


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## jujube (Jan 26, 2016)

1 Corinthians 13:4-8 : 

Love is patient and kind; love does not envy or boast; it is not arrogant or rude. It does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful; it does not rejoice at wrongdoing, but rejoices with the truth. Love bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. Love never ends. As for prophecies, they will pass away; as for tongues, they will cease; as for knowledge, it will pass away.


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## SifuPhil (Jan 26, 2016)

jujube said:


> 1 Corinthians 13:4-8 :
> 
> Love is patient and kind; love does not envy or boast; it is not arrogant or rude. It does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful; it does not rejoice at wrongdoing, but rejoices with the truth. Love bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. Love never ends. As for prophecies, they will pass away; as for tongues, they will cease; as for knowledge, it will pass away.



Hmmm ... as you might expect, I both agree and disagree with this.

I agree with everything up to "love never ends". It does indeed. But it also contains the ability of the phoenix, to resurrect itself from the ashes. People love, they fall out of love, then find the ability to love again. One love dies ... another begins life.


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 26, 2016)

SifuPhil said:


> Interesting viewpoint.
> 
> One of my tests has always been the ability to switch a statement round to see if it is true both ways.
> 
> ...



Definitely not, using my definition of love.


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## Gail.S (Jan 26, 2016)

I agree with mitchezz, if you wouldn't rather die yourself than have a particular person die then you don't truly love this person. I would take a bullet for my kids (including the nephew I raised) and grand kids but not anyone else in my life thus far. I loved my parents in a dutiful sort of way and siblings. I love my roommate and many friends but I can't honestly say I would die for any of them.


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## nitelite (Jan 26, 2016)

Love is when you both feel it.


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## Sassycakes (Jan 26, 2016)

I met my husband when I was 15 yrs old and in high school.  It was love at first sight for both of us. I broke off with my boyfriend that day and my husband broke up with his girlfriend. We are approaching our 50th wedding anniversary this May.Our feelings for one another has never changed. We have 2 children and 3 grandchildren that we love with all our Hearts. I wouldn't want to spend one second on this earth without any of my Hearts.:love_heart:


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## Warrigal (Jan 26, 2016)

Love is a decision rather than a feeling. 
It is a verb more than it is a noun.

It is a steadfast commitment, even when from time to time for some reason you don't really like the beloved. 
Like when they come home drunk at 1.00 am and vomit on the carpet.
Love is cleaning it up, putting them to bed and saving the shouting until morning.


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## SifuPhil (Jan 26, 2016)

Warrigal said:


> Love is a decision rather than a feeling.



How do you explain "love at first sight", unless you don't believe in that? Is that just a quick decision?


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## AprilT (Jan 26, 2016)

Warrigal said:


> Love is a decision rather than a feeling.
> It is a verb more than it is a noun.
> 
> It is a steadfast commitment, even when from time to time for some reason you don't really like the beloved.
> ...



Nevermind, I've never loved anyone in that case.  Just kidding, sadly I actually have done something like that for a friend and or boyfriend in my day can't say it was always out of love, caring and compassion for sure. Sometimes it's just better to clean the mess up right then before it dries and sets into the carpet.  

I actually had a better answer for this question when I was in sixth grade when it was a topic of discussion amongst us group of kids back then. I don't remember what I said, but, I remember the other kids being impressed, even the class bullies.


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## Cookie (Jan 26, 2016)

After all is said and done, I think in the end love is all we really have/had - very precious and something I am very grateful for.


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## Shalimar (Jan 26, 2016)

Qft Cookie.


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## Linda (Jan 27, 2016)

My husband and I tell each other several times each day that we love each other.  We've been together over 50 years but I don't know exactly how to define love.  I used to think I knew, but I don't know anymore.  

Someone here said "love is taking a bullet for someone".  I'm not so sure about that.  There are a lot of people who have taken a bullet for someone they don't even know.  I hope I'm one of those kind of people but I don't know for sure if I am or not.


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## SifuPhil (Jan 27, 2016)

Cookie said:


> After all is said and done, I think in the end love is all we really have/had - very precious and something I am very grateful for.



I still have a Crackerjack toy that I value deeply - does that count?


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## SifuPhil (Jan 27, 2016)

Linda said:


> My husband and I tell each other several times each day that we love each other.  We've been together over 50 years but I don't know exactly how to define love.  I used to think I knew, but I don't know anymore.




That's fantastic - congratulations!



> Someone here said "love is taking a bullet for someone".  I'm not so sure about that.  There are a lot of people who have taken a bullet for someone they don't even know.  I hope I'm one of those kind of people but I don't know for sure if I am or not.



That's usually a case of being in the wrong place at the wrong time. I'm talking about a pre-meditated act, not an impulsive one. 

I'm not sure I could sacrifice my life for a stranger, unless it was for a child.


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 27, 2016)

I think 'love' is a very overused word, imo. I use it very sparingly indeed, and could never love anyone unconditionally, not even my children.


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## Shalimar (Jan 27, 2016)

Different strokes for different folks. Some observe rather than participate.


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## Underock1 (Jan 27, 2016)

Ken N Tx said:


> My wife and I have been in love for 58 years now..I hope that I will go first..



Ken, You have a rare thing. I'm sure you know it. Cherish every minute. I lost my love last March after 58 years. I was glad that I was able to be there for her. It hurts like Hell, but it was worth the price. There is no happy ending.


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## Underock1 (Jan 27, 2016)

jujube said:


> 1 Corinthians 13:4-8 :
> 
> Love is patient and kind; love does not envy or boast; it is not arrogant or rude. It does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful; it does not rejoice at wrongdoing, but rejoices with the truth. Love bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. Love never ends. As for prophecies, they will pass away; as for tongues, they will cease; as for knowledge, it will pass away.



The best passage in the Bible and the only one worth keeping.


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## Shalimar (Jan 27, 2016)

Hmmm. I love the Song Of Solomon.


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## Underock1 (Jan 27, 2016)

Sassycakes said:


> I met my husband when I was 15 yrs old and in high school.  It was love at first sight for both of us. I broke off with my boyfriend that day and my husband broke up with his girlfriend. We are approaching our 50th wedding anniversary this May.Our feelings for one another has never changed. We have 2 children and 3 grandchildren that we love with all our Hearts. I wouldn't want to spend one second on this earth without any of my Hearts.:love_heart:



You are part of a rare group of people who find their life partner at an early age. It pays huge dividends. Enjoy every minute.


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## SifuPhil (Jan 27, 2016)

And then, there are the times when the candle that burns oh so brightly, burns so quickly ...


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## Underock1 (Jan 27, 2016)

Bluecheese50 said:


> My husband and I have managed 46 years so far, and haven't murdered each other yet, so that is an achievement I guess!



That counts as love in the _real _world. When I retired, I used to joke about whether my wife and I would end up killing each other with sex or with steak knives. Sex came close, but in the end we left each other with gentle touches and loving looks.


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## SifuPhil (Jan 27, 2016)

Now I'm getting all weepy here, Rock - cut it out! :sorrow:


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 27, 2016)

Underock1 said:


> You are part of a rare group of people who find their life partner at an early age. It pays huge dividends. Enjoy every minute.



I was 15 when I met my husband and he was nearly 18, that was 51 years ago. We married four years later and have stuck it out ever since. We aren't romantic which is YUCKY, but I guess we see something in each other, even if I am not exactly sure what.


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## Ameriscot (Jan 27, 2016)

Bluecheese50 said:


> I think 'love' is a very overused word, imo. I use it very sparingly indeed, and could never love anyone unconditionally, not even my children.



So are you saying that if your child does something bad or something you don't approve of you'd no longer love them?  You've put 'conditions' on loving them?


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 27, 2016)

Ameriscot said:


> So are you saying that if your child does something bad or something you don't approve of you'd no longer love them?  You've put 'conditions' on loving them?



It depends what they did of course, but if it was something terrible I couldn't love them.


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## Ken N Tx (Jan 27, 2016)

Underock1 said:


> Ken, You have a rare thing. I'm sure you know it. Cherish every minute. I lost my love last March after 58 years. I was glad that I was able to be there for her. It hurts like Hell, but it was worth the price. There is no happy ending.





Underock1 said:


> You are part of a rare group of people who find their life partner at an early age. It pays huge dividends. Enjoy every minute.



Not as rare as you state..There are 2 couples on our road that are close to 50 years..Another enjoying 38..


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## Shalimar (Jan 27, 2016)

Therapist or not, the idea that a mother would stop loving their child for any reason appalled me. I have seen some terrible things, if my child had ever committed those atrocities, I would be horrified, angry, terrified etc. I would not like who they were, but I would always love them. I had a mother who used conditional "love" as a whip. That is not genuine love, but emptional blackmail IMHO.


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 27, 2016)

Shalimar said:


> Therapist or not, the idea that a mother would stop loving their child for any reason appalled me. I have seen some terrible things, if my child had ever committed those atrocities, I would be horrified, angry, terrified etc. I would not like who they were, but I would always love them. I had a mother who used conditional "love" as a whip. That is not genuine love, but emptional blackmail IMHO.



If one of my children turned out to be a paedophile, for instance, not only would I turn them into the police, I would disown them completely. I could never love evil scum like that! Fortunately for me my kids are good people and I am very fond of them.


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## Ameriscot (Jan 27, 2016)

I will love my two sons and my granddaughters no matter what they do, no matter how horrible.  I would be upset and disappointed, but I will always love them.


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## Ralphy1 (Jan 27, 2016)

A mother's love knows no boundaries in some case.  An infamous murderer killed a mother and her two children here when he was only sixteen.  His mother continued to visit him while he was in prison here before he was sent to Florida to spend his time.  Don't know if she still visits him down there...


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## SifuPhil (Jan 27, 2016)

I don't understand how any woman who assumes the title of "Mother" could abandon her children. It's against Nature.


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## Shalimar (Jan 27, 2016)

Wow, Cheese, why are you so angry? Just because someone disagrees with you?


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## Ameriscot (Jan 27, 2016)

SifuPhil said:


> I don't understand how any woman who assumes the title of "Mother" could abandon her children. It's against Nature.



I agree.


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## Shalimar (Jan 27, 2016)

Philly, my narcissistic mother disowned me on a regular basis over pique,well into my forties,  until I finally told her if she did it again, I would not be back.  Not all women are maternal or capable of that type of nurturing. Lack of strong parental love damages children for life.


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## SifuPhil (Jan 27, 2016)

Shalimar said:


> Philly, my narcissistic mother disowned me on a regular basis over pique,well into my forties,  until I finally told her if she did it again, I would not be back.  Not all women are maternal or capable of that type of nurturing. Lack of strong parental love damages children for life.



I guess I've been spared such experiences. I tend to extend the rules of nature into the human arena, and am often surprised that they don't always apply.


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## mitchezz (Jan 27, 2016)

I couldn't imagine my life if I thought my Mum didn't love me. 

As far as my children go.....I could be disappointed in them, ashamed of them, devastated by their actions but I can't believe I could ever not love them.


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## Ken N Tx (Jan 27, 2016)




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## Shalimar (Jan 27, 2016)

Fantastic post Ken! The best way out is through.


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 27, 2016)

Ralphy1 said:


> A mother's love knows no boundaries in some case.  An infamous murderer killed a mother and her two children here when he was only sixteen.  His mother continued to visit him while he was in prison here before he was sent to Florida to spend his time.  Don't know if she still visits him down there...



If that was a child of mine I would wish them dead, that is for sure!


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 27, 2016)

Shalimar said:


> Wow, Cheese, why are you so angry? Just because someone disagrees with you?



I am not angry, not in the least, I am just stating my point of view that is all.


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## Underock1 (Jan 27, 2016)

Ken N Tx said:


> View attachment 26197



:thumbsup1:


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## Underock1 (Jan 27, 2016)

Ken N Tx said:


> Not as rare as you state..There are 2 couples on our road that are close to 50 years..Another enjoying 38..



Glad to hear it. I don't know how that's going to work in the future. People seem to be starting their lives about ten years later. Of course we are living about ten years longer. I prefer our way. Not going to roll on the floor with your grandkids at 90.

Something that always puzzled me. When we were married the general view of society was disapproving."Oh, your way too young", but when we celebrated our fiftieth, everyone thought it was wonderful. How do they think that happens?


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## Linda (Jan 28, 2016)

Glad to hear it. I don't know how that's going to work in the future.  People seem to be starting their lives about ten years later. Of course  we are living about ten years longer. I prefer our way. Not going to  roll on the floor with your grandkids at 90.
Underrock1, our 2nd oldest son was married over 20 years before they decided to have a baby.  They were both 40 when she was born.  My son said they are raising her to be very independent since they are so old and she has no siblings.  The parents are both in good health so maybe it'll work out ok but I keep thinking how old they'll be when she graduates from high school and college.


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## Underock1 (Jan 28, 2016)

Linda said:


> Glad to hear it. I don't know how that's going to work in the future.  People seem to be starting their lives about ten years later. Of course  we are living about ten years longer. I prefer our way. Not going to  roll on the floor with your grandkids at 90.
> Underrock1, our 2nd oldest son was married over 20 years before they decided to have a baby.  They were both 40 when she was born.  My son said they are raising her to be very independent since they are so old and she has no siblings.  The parents are both in good health so maybe it'll work out ok but I keep thinking how old they'll be when she graduates from high school and college.



I hear you, Linda. I guess we shouldn't decide what's the best way to be happy for others. Every life style has its pros and cons. I just think that many young people are being robbed of some of life's best joys by being sold on the idea of late marriage and child birth. Mother Nature doesn't give a crap about our preferences.


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 28, 2016)

I don't think having parents old enough to be your grandparents is a good idea. My husband's parents had him as an afterthought 14 years after his brother. They were disappointed he wasn't a girl so he could look after them in their old age! His brother played with him and did the things parents are supposed to do until he left home! 

I had my first girl at 20, the second at 24 and the third at 26. I was sterilised after that not wishing to have anymore birth children. We adopted two boys with learning difficulties when I was in my mid 30s, that was part of our game plan when we were teenagers. We also fostered a lad of 16 who had Down's Syndrome, he lived with us for nine years. Of course we would not have taken on the boys if we hadn't had the full agreement of our daughters, who were very supportive.


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## meteorite83188 (Jan 28, 2016)

To love is better than to not have loved at all. It's what makes us tick in society. I love almost everything....it's humans who are the challenge.


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 28, 2016)

meteorite83188 said:


> To love is better than to not have loved at all. It's what makes us tick in society. I love almost everything....it's humans who are the challenge.



As I have said before it depends on one's definition of love. Mine seems to be different to that of most others.


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## meteorite83188 (Jan 28, 2016)

That's a nice poem. Wish more persons took the time to stop and take in a peaceful moment for themselves. I do and it works for me.


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## meteorite83188 (Jan 28, 2016)

I understand. Everyone is different about the feelings of love. But in the end? We're lucky to have that emotion.


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## Ameriscot (Jan 28, 2016)

Without love what do we have?  Nothing.  Absolutely nothing.


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 28, 2016)

meteorite83188 said:


> I understand. Everyone is different about the feelings of love. But in the end? We're lucky to have that emotion.



I am not sure about that if it means you are devastated if you lose it for whatever reason.


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 28, 2016)

Ameriscot said:


> Without love what do we have?  Nothing.  Absolutely nothing.



I wouldn't agree with that statement. I am quite content being me even though my idea of love is not that of others, apparently.


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## Ameriscot (Jan 28, 2016)

Bluecheese50 said:


> I wouldn't agree with that statement. I am quite content being me even though my idea of love is not that of others, apparently.



Love doesn't necessarily mean being in a romantic relationship.  If one has no friends or family that they love, what's the point of anything?


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 28, 2016)

Ameriscot said:


> Love doesn't necessarily mean being in a romantic relationship.  If one has no friends or family that they love, what's the point of anything?



I don't see it that way, I think you can have a fulfilled life without having love in it.

 However, I am pleased I have children of whom I am fond, and they appear to be fond of this daft old bat too. We have a good relationship, albeit a jokey one, the birthday cards I got from the kids  my siblings and my husband the other day were hilarious, they ensured I realised how old and senile I am! I wouldn't have it any other way, that is for sure.


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## Ameriscot (Jan 28, 2016)

Bluecheese50 said:


> I don't see it that way, I think you can have a fulfilled life without having love in it.
> 
> However, I am pleased I have children of whom I am fond, and they appear to be fond of this daft old bat too. We have a good relationship, albeit a jokey one, the birthday cards I got from the kids  my siblings and my husband the other day were hilarious, they ensured I realised how old and senile I am! I wouldn't have it any other way, that is for sure.



You are 'fond' of your children but you don't 'love' them.  You sound like a very sad and empty person.


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 28, 2016)

Ameriscot said:


> You are 'fond' of your children but you don't 'love' them.  You sound like a very sad and empty person.



Thanks very much! I am very content with me being me and wouldn't wish to change. I 'love' my children in my way and they have never found me wanting. They all say they had a good childhood, which they enjoyed, so I can't be that bad. I am always there for them, if needed, and I ensure they have any financial assistance if necessary, which is appreciated.


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## Ameriscot (Jan 28, 2016)

Bluecheese50 said:


> Thanks very much! I am very content with me being me and wouldn't wish to change. I 'love' my children in my way and they have never found me wanting. They all say they had a good childhood, which they enjoyed, so I can't be that bad. I am always there for them, if needed, and I ensure they have any financial assistance if necessary, which is appreciated.



So if you 'love' them in your own way then you do have love in your life.  So you can't say that you can live without love.


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 28, 2016)

Ameriscot said:


> So if you 'love' them in your own way then you do have love in your life.  So you can't say that you can live without love.



I said I don't define 'love' in the way others do. Anyway it really doesn't matter, I do things my way, and you do things your way.


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## SifuPhil (Jan 28, 2016)

Bluecheese50 said:


> I said I don't define 'love' in the way others do. Anyway it really doesn't matter, I do things my way, and you do things your way.



One of the hallmarks of society is communication. Without words, we humans are toast.

That being the case, we need to define and agree upon our terms. If you and I were to look at a piece of fruit and you called it "apple" and I called it "orange", we would have a tough time coming to agreement.  

One cannot blithely say that their definition of a word is different from the accepted definition without going into laborious detail to explain their interpretation every time that word comes up in conversation. 

That slows down the act of communication. If that is your goal - to frustrate people during the act of communicating - then you have succeeded. Otherwise, it might be well to define your terms more precisely.


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 28, 2016)

SifuPhil said:


> One of the hallmarks of society is communication. Without words, we humans are toast.
> 
> That being the case, we need to define and agree upon our terms. If you and I were to look at a piece of fruit and you called it "apple" and I called it "orange", we would have a tough time coming to agreement.
> 
> ...



I am not sure what you mean? I have stated my definition of 'love' which is liking someone a lot, I could not conceive of loving anyone I didn't like. To others the term 'love' means something different, which is fair enough. I can't see it their way, anymore than they can see it mine. I am content with my way, and presumably they are content with theirs, so what is the problem?


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## SifuPhil (Jan 28, 2016)

Bluecheese50 said:


> I am not sure what you mean? I have stated my definition of 'love' which is liking someone a lot, I could not conceive of loving anyone I didn't like. To others the term 'love' means something different, which is fair enough. I can't see it their way, anymore than they can see it mine. I am content with my way, and presumably they are content with theirs, so what is the problem?



The problem is, once again, agreeing upon standard interpretations of a word - usually achieved by examining the dictionary's entry.

The Oxford Dictionary of American English defines "love" thus:

1. An intense feeling of deep affection

2. A deep romantic or ****** attachment to someone

3. A great interest and pleasure in something (Note: Not some_one_)


Unfortunately, your usage does not jibe with any of these definitions. 

I can define "love" as the act of putting on my galoshes and doing the Macarena, but that still doesn't mean that my definition is correct. Because it does not fit the standard, accepted interpretation of the word, _*I*_ am the one who is wrong, not everybody else.


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 28, 2016)

SifuPhil said:


> The problem is, once again, agreeing upon standard interpretations of a word - usually achieved by examining the dictionary's entry.
> 
> The Oxford Dictionary of American English defines "love" thus:
> 
> ...



If you want

Well as I said I am happy with the way I perceive 'love', even if no one else is!


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## SifuPhil (Jan 28, 2016)

Bluecheese50 said:


> If you want
> 
> Well as I said I am happy with the way I perceive 'love', even if no one else is!



Hmmm ...

Then I can only assume that you are happy to cut yourself off, in some small way, from communicating with society. 

That's fine, as long as you know you are doing it.


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 28, 2016)

SifuPhil said:


> Hmmm ...
> 
> Then I can only assume that you are happy to cut yourself off, in some small way, from communicating with society.
> 
> That's fine, as long as you know you are doing it.



I communicate well with my family and friendly acquaintances, that is all I care about.


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## SifuPhil (Jan 28, 2016)

Bluecheese50 said:


> I communicate well with my family and friendly acquaintances, that is all I care about.



Ah, an isolationist - okay, I can identify with that.

Still, not to flagellate a deceased equine, but ... as someone who claims to like writing poetry (wait, does that mean you really LOVE writing it, or merely LIKE writing it? I'm confused ...), one would think that you are aware of the meaning and impact of words, and would never choose their definitions willy-nilly ...


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## Bluecheese50 (Jan 28, 2016)

SifuPhil said:


> Ah, an isolationist - okay, I can identify with that.
> 
> Still, not to flagellate a deceased equine, but ... as someone who claims to like writing poetry (wait, does that mean you really LOVE writing it, or merely LIKE writing it? I'm confused ...), one would think that you are aware of the meaning and impact of words, and would never choose their definitions willy-nilly ...



I enjoy my hobbies, especially as I can shut myself away in 'my space' to do them!


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## SifuPhil (Jan 28, 2016)

Bluecheese50 said:


> I enjoy my hobbies, especially as I can shut myself away in 'my space' to do them!



So then a quick question:

If you are concerned only with family and friendly acquaintances understanding you, why post your poetry online? 

I once had a hobby of journaling. Every day I would write the intimate details of my life in my books. I shut myself away and expressed my fears, frustrations and elations on those pages. I enjoyed doing it.

Yet I would never dream of revealing the contents of those journals to the public.


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