# Drug called Ivermectin can prevent COVID-19?



## Murrmurr (Dec 17, 2020)

Has anyone else heard about an anti-parasitic drug called Ivermectin being used successfully as a prophylactic against the COVID-19 virus?
Maybe some members of Congress expect big dividends from the vaccine if they can keep this quiet. What are your thoughts?


----------



## Becky1951 (Dec 17, 2020)

We used Ivermectin on our cattle years ago, it was also used in some flea products. I wouldn't want to use it! Covid isn't a parasite.


----------



## Murrmurr (Dec 17, 2020)

Becky1951 said:


> We used Ivermectin on our cattle years ago, it was also used in some flea products. I wouldn't want to use it! Covid isn't a parasite.


True, but these doctors are saying it is also an anti-viral.


----------



## Becky1951 (Dec 17, 2020)

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7539925/

Very long article but it explains the why Ivermectin is not a reasonable nor effective enough drug to use against Covid.


----------



## Murrmurr (Dec 17, 2020)

Becky1951 said:


> https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7539925/
> 
> Very long article but it explains the why Ivermectin is not a reasonable nor effective enough drug to use against Covid.


That was in Oct 2020. Here's a more recent study following active trials.

https://www.drugs.com/medical-answers/ivermectin-treat-covid-19-coronavirus-3535912/


----------



## tbeltrans (Dec 17, 2020)

Becky1951 said:


> We used Ivermectin on our cattle years ago, it was also used in some flea products. I wouldn't want to use it! Covid isn't a parasite.


Cattle...herd immunity.  Just a weird thought when I read your post.   

Tony


----------



## peramangkelder (Dec 17, 2020)

https://theconversation.com/ivermec...ovid-19-despite-what-you-may-have-read-144569


----------



## Murrmurr (Dec 17, 2020)

peramangkelder said:


> https://theconversation.com/ivermec...ovid-19-despite-what-you-may-have-read-144569


Thank you. This article says the _media_ touted it as a miracle drug and a cure, but the doctors who are asking the CDC to take it seriously are not saying that. They said the results as a _prophylactic_ are miraculous. They say that ivermectin can prevent you from getting the virus, and prevent most people (80+% in an ICU study) from dying from it. These doctors are just asking for a serious study/trial as soon as possible and from what I'm seeing, our politicians are trying to not let that happen.


----------



## Sunny (Dec 17, 2020)

If the drug is potentially as good as he says, why are there no clinical trials?  You'd think they would be rushing it into production.


----------



## Murrmurr (Dec 17, 2020)

Sunny said:


> If the drug is potentially as good as he says, why are there no clinical trials?  You'd think they would be rushing it into production.


I agree, and I'm not sure why not but in the video one senator absolutely attacked this doctor, but everything the senator said was untrue. So I have to conclude that some (or lots of) members of congress stand to profit from the vaccine and are afraid that treatment with ivermectin will mean that fewer people will _need _the vaccine. And that's what this doctor is saying (actually, a group of doctors).


----------



## Murrmurr (Dec 17, 2020)

Sunny said:


> If the drug is potentially as good as he says, why are there no clinical trials?  You'd think they would be rushing it into production.


What they're asking for is a rush to clinical trials but they're being met with resistance.


----------



## win231 (Dec 17, 2020)

Why spend a lot of money for a parasitic drug when Raid is is available without a prescription & is much cheaper?


----------



## Murrmurr (Dec 17, 2020)

win231 said:


> Why spend a lot of money for a parasitic drug when Raid is is available without a prescription & is much cheaper?


Ha!
And here's the thing about ivermectin; it's very cheap, and it's already being produced and is readily very available.


----------



## CarolfromTX (Dec 17, 2020)

Once again, it’s turned political so I don’t know what to believe. Follow the science. Which science? I firmly believe there are people who want to drag out this pandemic as long as possible.


----------



## Murrmurr (Dec 17, 2020)

CarolfromTX said:


> Once again, it’s turned political so I don’t know what to believe. Follow the science. Which science? I firmly believe there are people who want to drag out this pandemic as long as possible.


And there are people who are actually trying to stop the spread and protect us from it (with science). Follow the science, but also follow the money. Or just listen to researchers who have no political agenda or affiliations. But then I'd look into who's funding them, too. It's sad that it wouldn't surprise me to find out that this study is being blocked for profit.


----------



## grahamg (Dec 17, 2020)

Ivermectin is a very good drug to use against a range of parasitic worms.
However, unless we expect our doctors to start clinical trials when someone says a drug used for something other than viral diseases usually, may have useful benefits during this pandemic in completely novel ways, bearing in mind Ivermectin, like any other drug, will have side effects, or contraindications, I'd guess its a hopeless endeavour to try to examine this claim seriously.


----------



## Murrmurr (Dec 17, 2020)

grahamg said:


> Ivermectin is a very good drug to use against a range of parasitic worms.
> However, unless we expect our doctors to start clinical trials when someone says a drug used for something other than viral diseases usually, may have useful benefits during this pandemic in completely novel ways, bearing in mind Ivermectin, like any other drug, will have side effects, or contraindications, I'd guess its a hopeless endeavour to try to examine this claim seriously.


I'm taking it seriously because a trial was done within a community in South America and others were done in a number of hospitals with "miraculous" results. The SA trial had a baseline group but all of these were relatively small trials. All this team of doctors (who were appointed to a COVID-19 task force, btw) are asking is that the drug be used in a larger, more comprehensive study or trial ASAP.


----------



## Butterfly (Dec 18, 2020)

Ivermectin is what my dog takes to prevent heartworms.


----------



## StarSong (Dec 18, 2020)

So why aren't the manufacturers of Ivermectin conducting clinical trials?  The ball is in their court to prove its efficacy.


----------



## Sunny (Dec 18, 2020)

Murrmurr said:


> Has anyone else heard about an anti-parasitic drug called Ivermectin being used successfully as a prophylactic against the COVID-19 virus?
> Maybe some members of Congress expect big dividends from the vaccine if they can keep this quiet. What are your thoughts?


----------



## Sunny (Dec 18, 2020)

Sorry, having trouble getting this posted. It disappeared when I hit the Send button.

I tried googling this drug, and can find absolutely nothing about it except discussions about its use as a prophylactic against animal parasites, which seems very strange. Fox news seems to be the only medium even mentioning it.

So, either there is a massive worldwide conspiracy to suppress the fact that there is a miracle drug out there, cheap and easily available... or this is another "snake oil" claim.  I tend to be very skeptical about this stuff. As the old adage goes, if something sounds too good to be true, it usually is.


----------



## tbeltrans (Dec 18, 2020)

For what it is (or isn't) worth, here are a few links that discuss Ivermectin and COVID-19:

https://www.businesswire.com/news/h...ty-of-Continuous-Administration-of-Ivermectin

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/...nti-parasite-drug-scrutinized-covid-19-remedy

https://www.covid19treatmentguidelines.nih.gov/antiviral-therapy/ivermectin/

https://www.drugs.com/medical-answers/ivermectin-treat-covid-19-coronavirus-3535912/

There are many more references, but this gives folks who are interested, something to read anyway.  Personally, I have never heard of this drug prior to this thread and can't claim access to any first-hand knowledge that would allow me in good conscience to make the kind of conjecture as I see in this thread regarding why the drug isn't being widely pursued as a possible means of addressing COVID-19.  All I am doing in this post is providing links to some sites that have write-ups about the subject of the thread for those seeking such information on the internet.

I did a search on duckduckgo.com using "ivermectin covid-19" and got many, many results.  So anybody interested in reading further can try that.

Tony


----------



## Murrmurr (Dec 18, 2020)

Sunny said:


> Sorry, having trouble getting this posted. It disappeared when I hit the Send button.
> 
> I tried googling this drug, and can find absolutely nothing about it except discussions about its use as a prophylactic against animal parasites, which seems very strange. Fox news seems to be the only medium even mentioning it.
> 
> So, either there is a massive worldwide conspiracy to suppress the fact that there is a miracle drug out there, cheap and easily available... or this is another "snake oil" claim.  I tend to be very skeptical about this stuff. As the old adage goes, if something sounds too good to be true, it usually is.


Understandable. There are videos on youtube where one of the doctors on the team Front Line COVID-19 Critical Care Alliance (FLCCC) sits before a congressional panel (I think it's a hearing) and you can hear the debate from both sides. The FLCCC also has a website where you can see their studies, trials, and reports and summations.


----------



## win231 (Dec 18, 2020)

Be careful about taking Ivermectin.  They gave it to Trump & it turned his hair bright yellow.


----------



## win231 (Dec 18, 2020)

Becky1951 said:


> We used Ivermectin on our cattle years ago, it was also used in some flea products. I wouldn't want to use it! Covid isn't a parasite.


Does that make it a cash cow?


----------



## Murrmurr (Dec 18, 2020)

StarSong said:


> So why aren't the manufacturers of Ivermectin conducting clinical trials?  The ball is in their court to prove its efficacy.


The FLCCC is asking for this. Apparently you have to have approval and cooperation (and probably funding). They are being met with resistance from government. I'm just wondering why, because the results they claim are extraordinary. I think treatment with ivermectin would mean fewer people would need the vaccine, and that's the problem; either the gov't (CDC, NIH, etc) is scared or they stand to lose profits (or a cash-cow, if you will).


----------



## Murrmurr (Dec 18, 2020)

win231 said:


> Does that make it a cash cow?


Funny you should say that.


----------



## Murrmurr (Dec 18, 2020)

Butterfly said:


> Ivermectin is what my dog takes to prevent heartworms.


The FLCCC totally knows this, and this is why it's cheap and readily available. What they're saying is that it also has anti-viral properties, and that it destroys some tiny part of the virus that causes viruses to mutate, which is a big deal if that's true.


----------



## Murrmurr (Dec 18, 2020)

Hey, I'm not pushing this drug, I just would like to hear a *reasonable* argument against further study. I haven't heard one yet (ie, from CDC, NIH, etc) but I'm still looking.


----------



## Becky1951 (Dec 18, 2020)

Any drug that shows even the slightest hope of helping against Covid should be investigated and studied, Ivermectin included.


----------



## StarSong (Dec 19, 2020)

From the NIH website regarding Ivermectin:
_"Recommendation_​
_The COVID-19 Treatment Guidelines Panel *recommends against* the use of *ivermectin* for the treatment of COVID-19, except in a clinical trial._
_Rationale_​_Ivermectin has been shown to inhibit the replication of severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) in cell cultures. *However, pharmacokinetic and pharmacodynamic studies suggest that achieving the plasma concentrations necessary for the antiviral efficacy detected in vitro would require administration of doses up to 100-fold higher than those approved for use in humans*. Even though ivermectin appears to accumulate in the lung tissue, predicted systemic plasma and lung tissue concentrations are much lower than 2 µM, the half-maximal inhibitory concentration (IC50) against SARS-CoV-2 in vitro.

Ivermectin is not approved for the treatment of any viral infection, including SARS-CoV-2 infection. The FDA issued a warning in April 2020 that ivermectin intended for use in animals should not be used to treat COVID-19 in humans."

https://www.covid19treatmentguidelines.nih.gov/antiviral-therapy/ivermectin/_


----------



## Murrmurr (Dec 19, 2020)

So they're finally going to approve a clinical trial?  

_Treatment Guidelines Panel *recommends against* the use of *ivermectin* for the treatment of COVID-19, except in a clinical trial._


----------



## StarSong (Dec 19, 2020)

Murrmurr said:


> So they're finally going to approve a clinical trial?
> 
> _Treatment Guidelines Panel *recommends against* the use of *ivermectin* for the treatment of COVID-19, except in a clinical trial._


This recommendation came back in April.  My take on their statement is that it could only be considered for use in a clinical trial - they weren't giving a blessing on a clinical trial.   

Whether the manufacturers of ivermectin decided to go ahead with clinical trials is another question altogether. I could find zero evidence of them doing so on the internet.


----------



## StarSong (Dec 19, 2020)

p.s.  I don't know about you, but I'd be very unwilling to take a drug at doses 100 times its approved level for humans.


----------



## Murrmurr (Dec 19, 2020)

StarSong said:


> This recommendation came back in April.  My take on their statement is that it could only be considered for use in a clinical trial - they weren't giving a blessing on a clinical trial.
> 
> Whether the manufacturers of ivermectin decided to go ahead with clinical trials is another question altogether. I could find zero evidence of them doing so on the internet.


Oh. Yes, they did. Well, the FLCCC did, in conjunction with hospitals, doctors, and medical PhDs in South Am and a couple other places. The results were published in Oct. The manufacturers of Ivermectin didn't request trials, so you'd have to look up FLCCC ivermectin trials to find that. But the trials the FLCCC did weren't "sanctioned"/approved or whatever. In One, a hosp in SA contacted the FLCC (or vice-versa) and that trial was basically just a comparison study - a small study done on 2 groups of no more than 250-some people; one group was given ivermectin the other wasn't. The result was 100% effective for the group that got ivermectin (1 person got covid). I forget how many in the other group got covid, but it was either a little over or under half, so about 125 got covid.

This and other small, localized studies (in and out of hospital settings) and the fact that ivermectin has no significant side effects -some in the FLCCC say none- is what prompted them (the FLCCC) to request clinical trials. In light of the evidence they have that ivermectin can PREVENT COVOD-19, the FLCCC is gob-smacked that CDC, NIH, WHO and the US congress all said no, and made it a big political issue.

I posted the video bc there's a lot there...all the stats and the whole argument, both sides.

(The manufacturers of Ivermectin should fund it, imo. But they'd still be up against the FDA so could be a lot of money thrown to the wind I guess.)


----------



## StarSong (Dec 20, 2020)

Interesting, @Murrmurr.  Well whatever they did it seems to have not gotten any traction in the US.  
Without clinical trials this will be dead in the water.


----------



## MarciKS (Dec 20, 2020)

Not sure if this helps...
Can Ivermectin be used to treat COVID-19 (coronavirus)? (drugs.com)

Also found this...
Ivermectin | COVID-19 Treatment Guidelines (nih.gov)


----------



## Sunny (Dec 20, 2020)

If it needs to be taken at doses 100 times the level approved for humans, why would anyone agree to take this stuff?  Who would even volunteer to be a part of the clinical trials?  Especially since there are already approved vaccines with a record of safety, being manufactured and distributed worldwide?


----------



## Murrmurr (Dec 20, 2020)

Sunny said:


> If it needs to be taken at doses 100 times the level approved for humans, why would anyone agree to take this stuff?  Who would even volunteer to be a part of the clinical trials?  Especially since there are already approved vaccines with a record of safety, being manufactured and distributed worldwide?


The FLCCC is showing pretty convincing evidence that ivermectin *prevents* you from getting COVID-19. It's a huge claim, but they do have evidence from some small studies/trials. They want to do a major study or trial. 
If it *is* preventive, then people wouldn't *need* a vaccine. I suspect that's why the FLCCC is being discredited and ignored. But idk...


----------



## Murrmurr (Dec 20, 2020)

MarciKS said:


> Not sure if this helps...
> Can Ivermectin be used to treat COVID-19 (coronavirus)? (drugs.com)
> 
> Also found this...
> Ivermectin | COVID-19 Treatment Guidelines (nih.gov)


Thanks, Marci! 
This> The limitations of this retrospective analysis make it difficult to draw conclusions about the efficacy of using ivermectin to treat patients with COVID-19.< is why the FLCCC requested a more comprehensive study (at the congressional hearing). I would just like to know why they were not only denied funding, but were villainized. It was ugly. Made me wonder if profit was behind the denial.


----------

