# Should I interfere or not?  Worried about my aunt.



## debodun (Jun 25, 2018)

I  went to bring some food to my 85-year-old aunt who is married to my  mother's brother. When I arrived, she was sitting outside on the open  porch. I was surprised she would do this on such a cool, rainy day. Then  I noticed she was crying. She said "I'd invite you in, but I can't."  She would not elaborate on the reason even when asked. She took the food  inside while I waited and came back out. We talked about a few more  things, than I left, but it made me wonder what was happening, why she  didn't want me in the house, why she was crying and if I should tell my  cousin about it. I am torn between feeling like a meddler in telling  others that maybe my aunt doesn't want known, or getting her some help  which it seem she obviously needs.


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## C'est Moi (Jun 25, 2018)

You know your family better than we do.   If this were my family, I'd definitely call my cousin and at least let them know what was happening.   I hope you told your Aunt to call you if she needed you.


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## Geezerette (Jun 25, 2018)

Another vote to call your cousin & without getting at all emotional, tell her you were concerned about an unusual experience with your aunt. You didn't say anything about your uncle but I only hope he wasn't ill or abusing her or something. Good luck.


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## Linda (Jun 25, 2018)

Forget calling the cousin.  If it had been me I wouldn't have left till I went in her house and found out what was causing her distress.  I used to type up reports for the lady who headed the Elder Abuse in the county I lived in during the 1980s.  It's unbelievable what some elderly people have to go through and they are often ashamed to reveal what is going on.  Usually they are afraid they'll be put in a home if their kids find out what is going on.  How far does she live from you?  I'd go over there right now and find out what is going on. And now, after the fact I'd call the cousin but really it might be closing the barn door after the horse has got out.  If necessary I'd call the county Elder Abuse too.  Also, a lot of people might be like me and be quite surprised how many elder people are the victims of ****** abuse.


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## StarSong (Jun 25, 2018)

Linda said:


> Forget calling the cousin.  If it had been me I wouldn't have left till I went in her house and found out what was causing her distress.  I used to type up reports for the lady who headed the Elder Abuse in the county I lived in during the 1980s.  It's unbelievable what some elderly people have to go through and they are often ashamed to reveal what is going on.  Usually they are afraid they'll be put in a home if their kids find out what is going on.  How far does she live from you?  I'd go over there right now and find out what is going on. And now, after the fact I'd call the cousin but really it might be closing the barn door after the horse has got out.  If necessary I'd call the county Elder Abuse too.  Also, a lot of people might be like me and be quite surprised how many elder people are the victims of ****** abuse.



I'm with you on this one, Linda.


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## Shalimar (Jun 25, 2018)

StarSong said:


> I'm with you on this one, Linda.


I agree.


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## jujube (Jun 25, 2018)

I would call the cousin.


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## Leonie (Jun 25, 2018)

I agree that it needs investigation, and calling the cousin would obviously be the first thing that comes to mind, but how do we know that the trouble isn't actually with (or about) the cousin?  

Tread carefully if you do decide to call, no matter how well you think you might know your cousin.  I think I would be inclined to go back to the house to check on the elderly lady if she was my aunt.


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## SeaBreeze (Jun 25, 2018)

I would visit her again as soon as you can and see how she is.  Abuse was the first thing that came to my mind when I read your post.  Where was her husband at the time?  Considering her age, her crying and being out on the porch, I probably would have insisted on going inside just to make sure she was safe and everything was okay.  Won't hurt to call your cousin either, providing they're close and get along.  Someone has to get with her and see what the trouble is, I don't think I could sleep thinking about her and worrying.  Good luck, hope she's okay.


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## terry123 (Jun 26, 2018)

I would have found some reason to get into that house.  If I was really worried I would call the police for a "welfare" check and tell them to be sure and check out both of them. They won't tell her who called them.  Only after that would I call he cousin.  The problem might be the cousin.


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## 911 (Jun 26, 2018)

Being a cop, I would have had to find out what the heck was going on. That's just the bloodhound in me. I think I would have had to get inside no matter what. Anything that's so distressful that makes my older aunt cry would cause me to be suspicious enough to want to try to find out the problem and then "maybe" try to resolve it. 

When I was working out of the Clearfield Barracks in central PA, I received a call from 9-1-1 that an elderly lady had heard strange noises coming from behind her home. When I got to the house and went around back with my flashlight, I found a raccoon trying to get in underneath her house. I think the raccoon was pregnant and was trying to find somewhere safe to drop her litter. I told the older woman what I found and she said to let the mother raccoon alone. She said that she would enjoy the company. Gave me a chuckle for the night.


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## debodun (Jun 26, 2018)

I just thought that forcing my way into my aunt's house would entering unlawfully and get me in more trouble with the family. Maybe my uncle was walking around unclothed, maybe he got violent and busted up the place. My uncle does have a sadistic tendency. Decades ago at a Fourth of July family picnic, he called me over to him and said "Here I got something for you." He clapped something between my hands then held his hands together over mine so I could not open them or pull away. What it was was a small firecracker. When it went off, not enough to cause much damage, but it stung like $%#*. He just stood there and laughed. Another time when my mother was in the hospital, he invited me over for lunch, then slapped a frozen hamburger on a plate and put it in front of me.


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## RadishRose (Jun 26, 2018)

I'm with Linda! I wouldn't have gone in, right then and there.


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## debodun (Jun 26, 2018)

I did call my cousin this AM and she said "Mom's always crying." and assured me that no action was necessary. Guess that was a dead end. I may pursue it further if my aunt shows up for our church's weekday Bible study tomorrow.


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## RadishRose (Jun 26, 2018)

It's good that you have your eye on her though. A shame the poor lady cries all the time.


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## Linda (Jun 26, 2018)

Your uncle sounds like someone I would try to avoid.  There must be something wrong with him.


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## StarSong (Jun 26, 2018)

debodun said:


> I just thought that forcing my way into my aunt's house would entering unlawfully and get me in more trouble with the family. Maybe my uncle was walking around unclothed, maybe he got violent and busted up the place. My uncle does have a sadistic tendency. Decades ago at a Fourth of July family picnic, he called me over to him and said "Here I got something for you." He clapped something between my hands then held his hands together over mine so I could not open them or pull away. What it was was a small firecracker. When it went off, not enough to cause much damage, but it stung like $%#*. He just stood there and laughed. Another time when my mother was in the hospital, he invited me over for lunch, then slapped a frozen hamburger on a plate and put it in front of me.



Putting a lit firecracker in a small child's hand is far beyond a sadistic tendency.  Good grief.  If that were my relative, he wouldn't have had another unsupervised moment with my children - EVER!  

From what you wrote it sounds like your aunt needs rescuing from this dreadful man.


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## Shalimar (Jun 26, 2018)

I am uncomfortable with the dismissive statement by the aunt’s daughter that her mom cries all the time. Seems to me something is very wrong and the daughter is brushing it off for whatever reason. If the uncle is a sadist, your aunt’s life is likely a living hell. She needs help.


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## debodun (Jun 26, 2018)

I could call my other cousin, their son, but I hate to bother him. He lives farther away and is working two jobs. If I called him, he'd probably tell me to mind my own business (more like his dad). Ordinarily, I wouldn't interfere, but my aunt HAS been through hell the last couple of years with serious health issues as well as my uncle. His health problems may have exacerbated his behavior. Maybe my uncle knew I was on my way over and ordered her not to let me in. All speculation, of course.


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## SeaBreeze (Jun 26, 2018)

The husband sounds like an aggressive jerk, and she's probably been putting up with various kinds of abuse from him for a long time now, such a shame.  How long have they been married, has she ever been beaten by him or needed medical treatment because of him?

However, it's a delicate situation.  If he finds that she confided in anyone about him, or a relative comes nosing around looking for trouble, then he will take it out on her when they are alone again....no doubt about that.  Unless she is removed from him and put at a secure undisclosed location, she will be at risk living with him if he's angry about her telling others about his actions or abuse.

It's possible he's not abusing her at all, but you have to find out what's going on to upset here in a very subtle way, in my opinion.  Having a friendly chat at church might be a beginning, if she trusts you.

What do you mean when you say get you in MORE trouble with the family Deb?


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## gennie (Jun 26, 2018)

I would visit again and, if not invited inside, I would develop an urgent need to use the bathroom.


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## debodun (Jun 26, 2018)

SeaBreeze said:


> She's probably been putting up with various kinds of abuse from him for a long time now.  How long have they been married, has she ever been beaten by him or needed medical treatment because of him?



They were married in December 1955 and I suspect she has put up with quite a bit, if I know my uncle. However I've never heard any family member mention she'd been abused other than verbally. I know he has a very volatile temper. 



SeaBreeze said:


> What do you mean when you say get you in MORE trouble with the family Deb?



My relationship with my uncle has always been uneasy since that incident with the firecracker I mentioned. It worsened when after my grandmother was put in an assisted care facility, I went to her house to get something for her and discovered my uncle inside throwing things in a dumpster and generally cleaning out the house. I asked him what he was doing and he said he was getting ready to put the house up for sale. I told him that according to her will, the house couldn't be sold until after she passed. He said some uncomplimentary explicative  and I left him there. 

It came to a head when my grandmother died and my mother tried to get administration of her estate. My uncle suddenly appeared in court with a POA from my grandma we didn't know he had. He said that gave him the right to act as the estate administrator. The justice sided with my uncle. When the house was eventually sold, my mother never saw a cent of the money and we never learned where it went when the money SHOULD have been split between my mother and her 3 brothers. Since then my relationship with the family is strained. I feel that they hold a grudge because they thought my mother and I tried to usurp control of the estate.


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## ClassicRockr (Jun 26, 2018)

I'd really watch getting too involved. It could get dangerous for you. However, I do really think I'd contact local law enforcement about the situation. Not call 911, but go to their business office and talk to any officer. Perhaps fill out a report of what happened while you were there. 

All of us want to help a family member, but that "help" can sometimes backfire on us. Being a former EMT, I've seen what that "backfire" can look like and ………..well, you know. IOW, try to think more with your brain, not so much your heart.


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## john19485 (Jun 26, 2018)

call the police ,ask for a welfare check, Please call at once!!


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## RadishRose (Jun 26, 2018)

Agree. A lady shouldn't be "crying all the time". Maybe it's her; perhaps dementia or onset of Alzheimers? Either way, she needs help.

Get with some Eldercare Agency- the police can guide you. Tell them the problem an they'll arrange for visits and perhaps an investigation. You may of course give your unprofessional opinions but not necessarily make specific accusations.

As far as the son, if he resents you because of something his sister supposedly did, the heck with him.


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## SeaBreeze (Jun 26, 2018)

debodun said:


> They were married in December 1955 and I suspect she has put up with quite a bit, if I know my uncle. However I've never heard any family member mention she'd been abused other than verbally. I know he has a very volatile temper.



They've been married for a long time, and it's good to know that nobody has mentioned physical abuse with your aunt, but there may have been occasions that nobody is aware of.  There are a lot of marriages unfortunately, where the good moments may be more than the bad, or the wife is very much in love and will tolerate verbal abuse for the duration of the marriage.  This sounds like one of those cases.

If you aunt is still independent, functioning on her own, paying bills, shopping and completing tasks around the house, goes to the doctor when needed, etc., maybe she should be left to handle her own private life.  It's still a good idea to be there for her if she ever does want to share, but it's not likely if her husband has a short fuse.

If she wasn't mentally alert and able to care for herself and her responsibilities, I might feel differently.  But I know, if I were in her shoes, even if I was sad and crying sometimes, I'd prefer to be left alone and given my privacy.  I'd be furious if someone called the police to come and visit also.  If I just had an argument with my husband, and someone visited unannounced wanting to come in, I'd want them to respect my wishes of not entering my house.

If she had bruises or wounds, it would be a different story.  Just my opinion from everything you've said about her.


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## Leonie (Jun 26, 2018)

Yep, I think that now with all the information we have, I have to agree with SeaBreeze. Let's face it, realistically you aren't really in a position to do anything anyway. Your aunt has a husband and children, it would be different if she was on her own. If you did call any authority that looked after elderly people they would have to go through her immediate family anyway, and even if they kept the source confidential, given you have already raised your concerns with your cousin it wouldn't take much to figure out who had called them. That could lead to further trouble for you. 

Having said that, a discreet chat at church is still a rather good idea. Just letting her know there is someone she can talk to if she feels the need might be of help to her. Other than that I would leave it alone.

You can't help people who don't want to be helped.


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## Shalimar (Jun 26, 2018)

It seems to me the lady’s immediate family seem to brush off her emotions, that being said, I think her welfare is the prime concern. Better safe than sorry, how do we know this person is not being abused? Are other family members complicit in one 

form or another? It is amazing what happens to many elderly people at the hands of their own relatives. Elder abuse is epidemic, and largely hidden. Physical violence is only one form of abuse, emotional abuse is also horrific. My advice is to arrange for further investigation of the matter. I certainly see no clear evidence that she won’t be helped. Perhaps she is frightened. Perhaps there is gaslighting going on.


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## Butterfly (Jun 26, 2018)

gennie said:


> I would visit again and, if not invited inside, I would develop an urgent need to use the bathroom.



This is exactly what I was thinking.


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## Aunt Bea (Jun 27, 2018)

SeaBreeze said:


> They've been married for a long time, and it's good to know that nobody has mentioned physical abuse with your aunt, but there may have been occasions that nobody is aware of. There are a lot of marriages unfortunately, where the good moments may be more than the bad, or the wife is very much in love and will tolerate verbal abuse for the duration of the marriage. This sounds like one of those cases.
> 
> If you aunt is still independent, functioning on her own, paying bills, shopping and completing tasks around the house, goes to the doctor when needed, etc., maybe she should be left to handle her own private life. It's still a good idea to be there for her if she ever does want to share, but it's not likely if her husband has a short fuse.
> 
> ...



I agree.

The other question is if you involve yourself what are you prepared to do to improve her situation without possibly making things worse.

I would let her know that if she needed anything or if I could be of help that she should call me and leave it at that.


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## SeaBreeze (Jun 27, 2018)

Aunt Bea said:


> The other question is if you involve yourself what are you prepared to do to improve her situation without possibly making things worse.
> 
> I would let her know that if she needed anything or if I could be of help that she should call me and leave it at that.



Good point about possibly making things worse.  She's had many years of experience dealing with her husband and the makeup of their relationship, although not always happy, she may be content and doesn't want any interference or rocking the boat.  If Deb lets her know that she's there for her if she wants to talk or needs help, that should be enough.


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## jujube (Jun 27, 2018)

How long has it been since you were in her house last?  Could there be a hoarding problem that she didn't want you to see?  Or maybe just a big mess?


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## CeeCee (Jun 27, 2018)

I agree with Seabreeze on this and others who have made similar comments.

You know the situation the best and I would just keep an eye on things.

Lots of people cry for no real reason...I'm one of them.  I'm just sensitive and there doesn't even have to be anything wrong for tears to fall...just a sweet memory.


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## debodun (Jun 27, 2018)

jujube said:


> How long has it been since you were in her house last?



Thanksgiving 2016. She has also refused to have the Bible study at her house.


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## Shalimar (Jun 27, 2018)

I know of four elders over the years who died ignominiously, ignored by family who either didn’t want to be involved, or brushed off the possibility that a serious problem existed. The grieving families came to me for closure. Denial can be deadly.


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## RadishRose (Jun 27, 2018)

What I meant by mentioning the police was only that they point her in the direction of an Eldercare staff.

Also, hoarding sounds like it could be possible and maybe he's the hoarder, not her.


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## hearlady (Jun 27, 2018)

I wasn't too concerned until you said your uncle has a sadistic quality. Could be why she cries all the time. Something seems amiss.


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## JFBev (Jun 27, 2018)

ClassicRockr said:


> I'd really watch getting too involved. It could get dangerous for you. However, I do really think I'd contact local law enforcement about the situation. Not call 911, but go to their business office and talk to any officer. Perhaps fill out a report of what happened while you were there.
> 
> All of us want to help a family member, but that "help" can sometimes backfire on us. Being a former EMT, I've seen what that "backfire" can look like and ………..well, you know. IOW, try to think more with your brain, not so much your heart.



I agree completely -- given what the uncle has done previously regarding the POA, be careful to legally protect yourself as well. So sad. . .


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