# Good and Evil



## Ina (Mar 15, 2014)

I'm not sure how to ask this, but I'll try anyway. I know what the answers would be from most religions, but some don't believe in any of them. So....... Where does good and evil come from, and what is it's purpose? I been thinking a lot about this, and I'd like to read your different opinions. nthego:


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## Warrigal (Mar 15, 2014)

Good luck with that, Ina.

Every society back to prehistory has asked that same question, and many creation myths attempt to provide an answer.

All I can say is that it is a human quality. I don't think evil resides anywhere else in the natural world but I could be wrong about that. Studies of chimpanzees seems to indicate that they are more like humans than we have previously given them credit for.

All I can say is that sometimes I become aware of an action or a person that appears to me to be so reprehensible that I would apply the word 'evil' to it but that is a very subjective assessment. 

I tend to think that like other abstract nouns like love, generosity, goodness, and their opposites, evil is a construct of the human mind and it has developed a general meaning that most people understand.

Some people have wanted to give the concept of evil a body or other physical form, and use snakes or mythical beasts to represent evil. The devil and Satan are representations of this concept that can be shown in artworks and even in this day and age, in movies. So are witches, goblins, demons and other popular bugaboos.

However, in the final analysis, evil is something that dwells within each of us. So is goodness, or God.


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## Ina (Mar 15, 2014)

Warri, Thank you, I can understand that concept, but to what purpose? :sentimental:


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## SifuPhil (Mar 15, 2014)

I can't improve on what Warri said.

As to purpose ... sometimes things don't HAVE a purpose - like nipples on a man, they just _are_. 

... at least in MY philosophies.


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## That Guy (Mar 15, 2014)

Oh, there's sure to be a plethora of explanations.  Simply put, it's just a balancing act . . .


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## Denise1952 (Mar 15, 2014)

SifuPhil said:


> I can't improve on what Warri said.
> 
> As to purpose ... sometimes things don't HAVE a purpose - like nipples on a man, they just _are_.
> 
> ... at least in MY philosophies.



LOLLLLLLLLL!  Where do you get this stuff:lofl:don't tell me, I already know, LOL!!


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## SifuPhil (Mar 15, 2014)

nwlady said:


> LOLLLLLLLLL!  Where do you get this stuff:lofl:don't tell me, I already know, LOL!!



Lots of deep meditation while shirtless in front of a mirror.


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## Denise1952 (Mar 15, 2014)

SifuPhil said:


> Lots of deep meditation while shirtless in front of a mirror.



Few make me laugh out loud when I am reading their stuff, but you are one of those few, LOL!! Ok, I'm still laughin!!


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## SifuPhil (Mar 15, 2014)

nwlady said:


> Few make me laugh out loud when I am reading their stuff, but you are one of those few, LOL!! Ok, I'm still laughin!!



Well, it's true - I mean, nipples on men _are_ sort of like fins on a '57 Cadillac - they might _look_ good but they don't serve any real purpose.


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## Denise1952 (Mar 15, 2014)

SifuPhil said:


> Well, it's true - I mean, nipples on men _are_ sort of like fins on a '57 Cadillac - they might _look_ good but they don't serve any real purpose.



Well, I used to think that, but I don't believe it now


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## Ina (Mar 15, 2014)

I call myself an agnostic, but I have seen and been very close to evil. Then I've seen the seen and felt goodness. So, to me, they are real. So I wondered where these traits came from and why. Religion doesn't come into it for me.


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## That Guy (Mar 15, 2014)

SifuPhil said:


> As to purpose ... sometimes things don't HAVE a purpose - like nipples on a man, they just _are_.
> 
> ... at least in MY philosophies.



It's a matter of efficiency in the manufacturing process.  To spend resources and time separating the two, male/female, for function would be an unacceptable cost overrun.  We have computer printouts to defend our position.  -- The Management.


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## Denise1952 (Mar 15, 2014)

That Guy said:


> It's a matter of efficiency in the manufacturing process.  To spend resources and time separating the two, male/female, for function would be an unacceptable cost overrun.  We have computer printouts to defend our position.  -- The Management.



Yes, perfection always gets my vote, LOL!!


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## SifuPhil (Mar 15, 2014)

That Guy said:


> It's a matter of efficiency in the manufacturing process.  To spend resources and time separating the two, male/female, for function would be an unacceptable cost overrun.  We have computer printouts to defend our position.  -- The Management.



Wait, what - there's no difference between the two?

I've been doing it _wrong_ all these years?

--- Your Humble but Confused Employee


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## Denise1952 (Mar 15, 2014)

SifuPhil said:


> Wait, what - there's no difference between the two?
> 
> I've been doing it _wrong_ all these years?
> 
> --- Your Humble but Confused Employee



No, you just got the nips because removing them every other being would not be as cost effective, doi


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## That Guy (Mar 15, 2014)

SifuPhil said:


> Wait, what - there's no difference between the two?
> 
> I've been doing it _wrong_ all these years?
> 
> --- Your Humble but Confused Employee



Of course there are differences and we only concentrate on the important parts.  You would know this had you studied your manual.


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## SifuPhil (Mar 15, 2014)

That Guy said:


> Of course there are differences and we only concentrate on the important parts.  You would know this had you studied your manual.



I spent a LOT of time with self-ab ... um, self-study. I thought I _found_ all the important parts.

*sigh*

I KNEW I should have gone for a Liberal Arts degree ...


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## Denise1952 (Mar 15, 2014)

SifuPhil said:


> I spent a LOT of time with self-ab ... um, self-study. I thought I _found_ all the important parts.
> 
> *sigh*
> 
> I KNEW I should have gone for a Liberal Arts degree ...



It's good to remain teachable, wow, the things you can learn, I wouldn't miss a thing.


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## Justme (Mar 16, 2014)

Good and bad are just part of human nature. During the evolutionary process I guess humans eventually discovered that doing good, and being co-operative, usually had a better outcome.


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## SifuPhil (Mar 16, 2014)

Justme said:


> Good and bad are just part of human nature. During the evolutionary process I guess humans eventually discovered that doing good, and being co-operative, usually had a better outcome.



So why didn't they stick with it?


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## Vivjen (Mar 16, 2014)

SifuPhil said:


> So why didn't they stick with it?



Because Eve came along.....seriously; I think everybody has a capacity for good or evil; it depends on so many things as to which way an individual goes.
am I off thread? If so, sorry.


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## SifuPhil (Mar 16, 2014)

Vivjen said:


> Because Eve came along.....seriously; I think everybody has a capacity for good or evil; it depends on so many things as to which way an individual goes.
> am I off thread? If so, sorry.



I don't think you are, but then I've been wrong before.

I agree that everyone has the necessary seeds for both good and evil within them - it's a Taoist principle. All it takes is for family or friends, society, or blind luck to tip you over to one side or the other, and a firm set of self-regulating principles is the only thing that can keep you in balance during those extreme times.

Being too good is just as harmful as being too bad ...


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## That Guy (Mar 16, 2014)




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## Warrigal (Mar 16, 2014)

SifuPhil said:


> I don't think you are, but then I've been wrong before.
> 
> I agree that everyone has the necessary seeds for both good and evil within them - it's a Taoist principle. All it takes is for family or friends, society, or blind luck to tip you over to one side or the other, and a firm set of self-regulating principles is the only thing that can keep you in balance during those extreme times.
> 
> Being too good is just as harmful as being too bad ...



Finally, we're back on the topic.

The issue of good and evil is embedded in much of our literature and folklore because we cannot understand our species without examining it.

Two examples, both half remembered.

Graham Green's novel Brighton Rock is a crime novel in which the characters represent the spiritual concept of good/evil and the secular concept of right/wrong. They are subtly different in meaning and in how they influence our actions. 

The other example is Roddenberry's take on the character of James Kirk in the original series. There is one episode where the captain is split into two versions of himself. One has all of his better qualities and the other his darker nature. The former is useless and the latter is very dangerous. The point being made is that we need both to be fully human and to survive as individuals and as a species. Additionally, Kirk, being fully human embodies good and evil, but Spock, representing intellect and logic, understands only right versus wrong. 

Our dual nature is a theme of many old stories, including the native American parable of the two wolves within.



> White Wolf -- Gray Wolf  (Parable) [h=5]   There was grandfather, his little grandson often came in the evenings to sit at his knee and ask the many questions that children ask. One day the grandson came to his grandfather with a look of anger on his face.
> 
> Grandfather said, "Come, sit, tell me what has happened today." The child sat and leaned his chin on his Grandfather's knee. Looking up into the wrinkled, nut brown face and the kind dark eyes; the child's anger turned to quiet tears.
> 
> ...


[/h]What is important is not that we understand the purpose of evil, but to understand that it is part of our nature as human beings and to learn to be masters of our own selves.


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## SifuPhil (Mar 16, 2014)

Anger is not always evil, just as happiness is not always good. Emotions are a thing totally apart from moral judgments. 

Excellent story.


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## Warrigal (Mar 16, 2014)

Emotion (or feelings) are neither good nor bad. 
In any case, they are fleeting. They rise and fall.
It's how we respond to them that really matters.

The story of the two wolves, like most parables, is worth internalising and reflecting upon from time to time.
It can help use rise above our more painful moments, past and present.


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## SifuPhil (Mar 16, 2014)

Warrigal said:


> Emotion (or feelings) are neither good nor bad.
> In any case, they are fleeting. They rise and fall.
> It's how we respond to them that really matters.



While I agree with this in theory, in practice people are slaves to their emotions. They are not taught to control them - rather, looking around our society nowadays, I would venture to say that we are encouraged to express them as loudly and as dramatically as possible. We are now raised with the expectation of our crying out whenever we please, for however trivial a reason, because "it's healthier that way".

Some people are slaves not only for the moment, but for their entire lives. They live in the past and continue to re-visit their low times, moaning and crying over how unfair life was to them. They die in tears, having existed with their hearts on their sleeves.



> The story of the two wolves, like most parables, is worth internalising and reflecting upon from time to time.
> It can help use rise above our more painful moments, past and present.



A lesson is only as useful as a student's willingness to learn it.


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## Warrigal (Mar 16, 2014)

Of course, Phil, but I am an educator.
It's what I do.


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## SifuPhil (Mar 16, 2014)

Warrigal said:


> Of course, Phil, but I am an educator.
> It's what I do.



As was I, but I retired. 

You can only teach the unwilling and the uncaring for so long.


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## Denise1952 (Mar 16, 2014)

That Guy said:


>



Boy this movie got to me, way creepy, I guess that call that a sociopath no conscience in murdering someone.


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## Ina (Mar 16, 2014)

I want to thank every one of you that has taken the time to ponder this question. I have run from anything that even resembled a religion, mainly because I couldn't find a nitch in which I could fit into, and my lack of education. 
I can feel my depression starting to lessen, and I think it will not be a long time before I return to my regular optimistic out look. I guess too much "stuff" just came at me all at once, and then kept coming. Your patience has been a life saver for me.
I am quieting down I feel. I can't tell you how much you have helped me. Every one of you.
Lately I've been doing a lot of just reading your posts, and just trying to post enough to let ya'll know I'm still here. I can't tell you how much you have help me put my thoughts back together.:bighug:


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## Denise1952 (Mar 16, 2014)

Ina said:


> I want to thank every one of you that has taken the time to ponder this question. I have run from anything that even resembled a religion, mainly because I couldn't find a nitch in which I could fit into, and my lack of education.
> I can feel my depression starting to lessen, and I think it will not be a long time before I return to my regular optimistic out look. I guess too much "stuff" just came at me all at once, and then kept coming. Your patience has been a life saver for me.
> I am quieting down I feel. I can't tell you how much you have helped me. Every one of you.
> Lately I've been doing a lot of just reading your posts, and just trying to post enough to let ya'll know I'm still here. I can't tell you how much you have help me put my thoughts back together.:bighug:



Happy to hear this Ina, I know when I have had any depression, it comes then goes.  It doesn't "feel" as if it will go, but it does.  As far as religion, I know for me personally I have been on a search, and will continue to find what rings true to me.  One thing I liked about christianity was that they said it was "personal" which I believe is true.

See you around, and you and Michael have a lovely St. Patrick's day Denise


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## Ina (Mar 16, 2014)

Young Michael's birthday would have been tomorrow, but I think I'm ready for it.


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## Warrigal (Mar 16, 2014)

I've been thinking of you a lot, Ina, and I'm glad that you have drawn something good from being part of this online community. I hope that tomorrow, somewhere in the memories that it will bring up, that you will find comfort that helps to heal your inner wounds.


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## Ina (Mar 16, 2014)

Thank you Warri, I have never had more than a couple of friends in my lifetime, I guess I was be busy with the family. I guess I thought if anyone knew who I was and what had happened to me they would just be discussed, and some were. But if I discussed anyone they were polite enough to to ignore me. I know many people have had to deal with much more than I, and maybe one day I can say something meaningful, and help them. :encouragement:


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## SifuPhil (Mar 16, 2014)

nwlady said:


> Boy this movie got to me, way creepy, I guess that call that a sociopath no conscience in murdering someone.



Actually the essential difference between a sociopath and a psychopath is that the former is of little danger to others, while the latter moves into criminal acts.

Therefore, a murderer would correctly be termed a psychopath.


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## Denise1952 (Mar 16, 2014)

SifuPhil said:


> Actually the essential difference between a sociopath and a psychopath is that the former is of little danger to others, while the latter moves into criminal acts.
> 
> Therefore, a murderer would correctly be termed a psychopath.



Ok, thanks for the info Phil, didn't realize the dif.  The psychopath evidently has not conscience either I take it.  Strange world for sure.


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## SifuPhil (Mar 16, 2014)

nwlady said:


> Ok, thanks for the info Phil, didn't realize the dif.  The psychopath evidently has not conscience either I take it.  Strange world for sure.



It _is_ strange, because many times a psychopath can hide their symptomology much better than a sociopath.


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## Denise1952 (Mar 16, 2014)

SifuPhil said:


> It _is_ strange, because many times a psychopath can hide their symptomology much better than a sociopath.



eeeeeeeeeweeeee, that is just creepy.  Ted Bundy I take it hey?  Everyone liked him, eek!!


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## SifuPhil (Mar 16, 2014)

nwlady said:


> eeeeeeeeeweeeee, that is just creepy.  Ted Bundy I take it hey?  Everyone liked him, eek!!



Exactly.

Sociopathy and psychopathy share some confusing roots. They are terms that are often used interchangeably, and even the DSM - the textbook of psychiatry - has flip-flopped on the usage of the two terms. 

Modern-day sociopathy most often resembles APD - Antisocial Personality Disorder - but differs from psychopathy in degree and intent. Most prisoners in jails, for example, could be said to be sociopaths, but only a very small percentage are psychopaths.


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## Denise1952 (Mar 16, 2014)

SifuPhil said:


> Exactly.
> 
> Sociopathy and psychopathy share some confusing roots. They are terms that are often used interchangeably, and even the DSM - the textbook of psychiatry - has flip-flopped on the usage of the two terms.
> 
> Modern-day sociopathy most often resembles APD - Antisocial Personality Disorder - but differs from psychopathy in degree and intent. Most prisoners in jails, for example, could be said to be sociopaths, but only a very small percentage are psychopaths.



Really, most prisoners/criminals are considered sociopaths?  I guess I find it hard to believe so many people are literally without conscience.  I mean, it's just hard to believe, no remorse at all for doing wrong.  Seems like many of our criminals do realize the did wrong and get on the right road, I mean, I don't know, I'm just getting this from what I've seen on tv, or in articles, which I don't make a habit of studying the criminal mind.


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## Warrigal (Mar 16, 2014)

:stop1:

I'm sorry to say this, Phil and NWLady, but I don't think this side issue is really helping the OP all that much. Ina has spoken of her pain in this thread and first it was derailed by mention of male nipples and now it is wandering off course in an abstract discussion of the difference between psychopaths and sociopaths.

Did you both miss the revelation that tomorrow is the birthday of the son whom she still  mourns? Take off the emotional blinkers and think before you keep going in this thread. Start another if you want to explore these ideas any further. Enough is enough on this one.


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## Denise1952 (Mar 16, 2014)

I didn't think, and I am sorry WG, I will not post again on what Phil and I got off on.  Apologies Ina, as well as anyone else in the thread. Denise


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## SifuPhil (Mar 16, 2014)

I won't post anymore either. My apologies.


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## Happyflowerlady (Mar 16, 2014)

Ina said:


> Young Michael's birthday would have been tomorrow, but I think I'm ready for it.



My heart aches for you , too, Ina, and I know that I would not be holding it together, if I were in your place. Grief is a part of the healing , and there is no putting boundaries on how long or how deep it is, it is personal to each person.  Treat yourself kindly, try to remember some of the good memories, and save them for the future. 
As a Christian, I have been raised to believe in a future place called heaven, where we are together again with our loved ones. This gives me comfort when I think about the loved ones I have lost. I understand that your perception of religion has been totally different than mine, and there is no way to know that we will be with our family again; but there is no real proof that it won't happen, either. 

If I believe in God, and it turns out that I was wrong, it won't make any difference;  however, it gives me great comfort to believe that there is a loving Creator, who made this beautiful world for us, and wants us to follow that part of our heart that loves other people, and not the part that has no compassion for others.
I don't have the answer about good and evil, and think that Warrigal has done a wonderful job of explaining it. I don't know why so much hatred and cruelty exists, but it seems to me that some people have just lost that "spark" that connects us with God, who is LOVE.


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## SifuPhil (Mar 16, 2014)

SifuPhil said:


> I won't post anymore either. My apologies.



No, you know what? I'm NOT sorry.

The topic of this post wasn't about Ina's pain - it was about the concept of Good and Evil. Discussions of sociopaths and psychopaths fit into the defining of those terms. 

I'm tired of being pursued by Topic Police here, and until a Moderator or Admin tell me to cease and desist I'm going to keep posting what I want to post. If Ina has a problem with it she is more than welcome to come directly to me and tell me, but until that time I don't see that I've derailed this conversation at all, only added to it. I'm sorry Warri if you see it differently, but I'm also sad to see this board falling into the hands of a few self-appointed Guardians of the Public Good.

This is a Public forum - only the Admin, the Mods and the OP have the right to censure me.


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## That Guy (Mar 16, 2014)

SifuPhil said:


> No, you know what? I'm NOT sorry.
> 
> The topic of this post wasn't about Ina's pain - it was about the concept of Good and Evil. Discussions of sociopaths and psychopaths fit into the defining of those terms.
> 
> ...



Yay, Phil!


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## Ina (Mar 16, 2014)

HFL, I too believe in a creator. I have always felt the creator. That is how I knew all those people in my father's church were wrong. I don't hear "voices", but something inside kept telling me what was happening was wrong. I guess that is what I'm still looking for. I believe we are all part of the creator, even the bad guys.:dunno:


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## Warrigal (Mar 16, 2014)

Sifuphil said:
			
		

> A lesson is only as useful as a student's willingness to learn it.



:iagree:


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## SifuPhil (Mar 16, 2014)

Warrigal said:


> :iagree:



_Some_ students remain stubborn to the bitter end ...


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## Warrigal (Mar 16, 2014)

eace:

I've had my say and now I withdraw from the lists.
Bloodied, but unbeaten. And unrepentant.

Consider this an apology.

But I'm not really sorry.

:wink-new:


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## Denise1952 (Mar 16, 2014)

SifuPhil said:


> No, you know what? I'm NOT sorry.
> 
> The topic of this post wasn't about Ina's pain - it was about the concept of Good and Evil. Discussions of sociopaths and psychopaths fit into the defining of those terms.
> 
> ...




I'm standing with you on this as well Phil, I see where you are absolutely dead on.  I was thinking about it after I apologized and was bothered as well.  I'm glad I didn't say anything because you said it way better then I could have even thought of!


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## SifuPhil (Mar 16, 2014)

Warrigal said:


> eace:
> 
> I've had my say and now I withdraw from the lists.
> Bloodied, but unbeaten. And unrepentant.
> ...



:rofl:

I don't know what the Australian term for "character" is, but you've certainly got it.


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## Denise1952 (Mar 16, 2014)

Can't rep you again or I would too


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## Warrigal (Mar 16, 2014)

She who fights and runs away .....


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## Ina (Mar 16, 2014)

Ina said:


> I want to thank every one of you that has taken the time to ponder this question. I have run from anything that even resembled a religion, mainly because I couldn't find a nitch in which I could fit into, and my lack of education.
> I can feel my depression starting to lessen, and I think it will not be a long time before I return to my regular optimistic out look. I guess too much "stuff" just came at me all at once, and then kept coming. Your patience has been a life saver for me.
> I am quieting down I feel. I can't tell you how much you have helped me. Every one of you.
> Lately I've been doing a lot of just reading your posts, and just trying to post enough to let ya'll know I'm still here. I can't tell you how much you have help me put my thoughts back together.:bighug:




Hey everybody, I meant what I said above. No apologizes or defending are necessary. I just needed all of your thoughts. And it take a lot to offend me, and no one has come even close.:hide:


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## Happyflowerlady (Mar 16, 2014)

Even though technically you can say that discussing whether a movie was about a sociopath, or a psychopath, is okay on a topic about good and evil, and probably would have been fine any other time; I think that you are following the "letter of the law ", but missing the spirit of the conversation in this instance, Sifu.

We all know that Ina has been struggling with the recent loss of her son, and how hard it was for her to even share some of her life's pain with us (her best friends).  
If we were talking in person with her right now; I truly believe that your compassion for her would have kept the conversation on track to support Ina in this hard time; and you could have had a private/separate discussion about the movie character with NWLady in a more appropriate time.


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## Denise1952 (Mar 16, 2014)

Warrigal said:


> She who fights and runs away .....



I know this didn't quote anything by me, but it was after what I posted.  If this is to me, would you mind telling me what you mean by it?  I truly don't get the connection, if it was a shot at me.  My apologies if I misunderstood, Denise


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## SifuPhil (Mar 16, 2014)

Warrigal said:


> She who fights and runs away .....



... in America would probably get a 9mm slug in her back, but I suppose Down Under she lives to fight another day ...


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## Warrigal (Mar 16, 2014)

Watch it!


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## Warrigal (Mar 16, 2014)

nwlady said:


> I know this didn't quote anything by me, but it was after what I posted.  If this is to me, would you mind telling me what you mean by it?  I truly don't get the connection, if it was a shot at me.  My apologies if I misunderstood, Denise



Not aimed at you at all, NWLady.
I was verbal jousting with Phil but some other posts came between his and mine.
We've buried the hatchet and peace has broken out.

eace:


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## SifuPhil (Mar 16, 2014)

Hey! Hey! We're getting off topic here!!!


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## SeaBreeze (Mar 16, 2014)

Ina said:


> Young Michael's birthday would have been tomorrow, but I think I'm ready for it.



My thoughts will be with you tomorrow Ina, this must be very difficult for you. Hugs. :girl_hug:


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## Ina (Mar 16, 2014)

Love and laughter are the best medicine!!! :hatoff: fftobed: :shussh: :sleeping:


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## Denise1952 (Mar 16, 2014)

Oh, I see now, I was hoping it wasn't at me.  Thanks again Phil, I wish I was just a little bit smarter, ok, maybe a lot:lofl:


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## Denise1952 (Mar 16, 2014)

Ina said:


> Love and laughter are the best medicine!!! :hatoff: fftobed: :shussh: :sleeping:



They can be for sure  I love that little smilie in the jammis one of my faves.  See you in the morning Ina, I'll be around here for you most likely, unless I get called over to the coast, hugs, Denise:love_heart:


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## Denise1952 (Mar 16, 2014)

Warrigal said:


> Not aimed at you at all, NWLady.
> I was verbal jousting with Phil but some other posts came between his and mine.
> We've buried the hatchet and peace has broken out.
> 
> eace:



Ok, I didn't see this til after I saw Phil's below, good that you buried the hatchet and it wasn't in anyone's skull  Have a good eve, and prolly see you around for St. Patrick's day Denise


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## Denise1952 (Mar 16, 2014)

SifuPhil said:


> Hey! Hey! We're getting off topic here!!!
> 
> View attachment 5995



now if no one else is suppose to play "forum police" neither can you,so get your jammies on and have a snack, go ni'nite, fftobed:


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## SeaBreeze (Mar 16, 2014)

Warrigal said:


> :stop1:
> 
> I'm sorry to say this, Phil and NWLady, but I don't think this side issue is really helping the OP all that much. Ina has spoken of her pain in this thread and first it was derailed by mention of male nipples and now it is wandering off course in an abstract discussion of the difference between psychopaths and sociopaths.
> 
> Did you both miss the revelation that tomorrow is the birthday of the son whom she still  mourns? Take off the emotional blinkers and think before you keep going in this thread. Start another if you want to explore these ideas any further. Enough is enough on this one.



I disagree Warrigal, there was no intention here to be insensitive to Ina or her thread.  I just read her post now about her son's birthday tomorrow, and my heart goes out to her, as I know this is a very sad and difficult time for her.

There are no topic police here, and conversations can lead anywhere on a forum with numerous people participating in the conversation.  The psychopath and sociopath discussion was related to good and evil to be sure.  You can certainly say how you feel, but the stop sign, guilt trip, and instruction to start another thread is over the line here.


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## SeaBreeze (Mar 16, 2014)

SifuPhil said:


> No, you know what? I'm NOT sorry.
> 
> The topic of this post wasn't about Ina's pain - it was about the concept of Good and Evil. Discussions of sociopaths and psychopaths fit into the defining of those terms.
> 
> ...



I agree.


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## SeaBreeze (Mar 16, 2014)

Glad the peace has been made here, and good night Ina. :sentimental:


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## Warrigal (Mar 16, 2014)

SeaBreeze said:


> I disagree Warrigal, there was no intention here to be insensitive to Ina or her thread.  I just read her post now about her son's birthday tomorrow, and my heart goes out to her, as I know this is a very sad and difficult time for her.
> 
> There are no topic police here, and conversations can lead anywhere on a forum with numerous people participating in the conversation.  The psychopath and sociopath discussion was related to good and evil to be sure.  You can certainly say how you feel, but the stop sign, guilt trip, and instruction to start another thread is over the line here.



Mea culpa, Seabreeze, and for the record, we've all shaken hands and made up.


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## SeaBreeze (Mar 16, 2014)

I saw that Warrigal, thanks!


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## That Guy (Mar 17, 2014)

All the best, Ina.  I know we are all thinking of you.


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