# It's just a mask



## chic (Dec 13, 2021)

It's just a mask. It's just two weeks to flatten the curve. It's just a holiday, It's just a small sacrifice. It's just temporary. It's just a shot, or 2 or 3 or 4 or twice annually. It's just your job. It's just your career. It's just your home. They're just your kids. It's just a health pass, it's just segregation, they're just your friends and neighbors. It's just a detainment center. It's just for everyone's safety. It's just temporary. Until it's just permanent.


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## Aunt Bea (Dec 13, 2021)

It's just more noise.


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## chic (Dec 13, 2021)

Aunt Bea said:


> It's just more noise.


It's just endless compliance with only more to be complied with. It's just the end of freedom as we knew it. It's just a conspiracy theory unfolding before our eyes. It's just more lies being told to us. It's just rules for thee but not for me. It's just theater. It's just time to put an end to it. They just number in the hundreds. We just number in the millions.


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## Aunt Bea (Dec 13, 2021)

It’s sad to see the tragic toll that this virus has taken on your perception of reality.

There is no shadowy global cabal plotting to take away our freedom.

We need to accept the common-sense public health measures for what they are and not read things into them that are simply not there.

I’m afraid that these things will be a part of our lives until all of the people in the developing nations have been vaccinated.

_“Somehow, we each create our own prison, for which only we, hold the key to freedom.”_
- Sue J.  Daniels.


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## Sunny (Dec 13, 2021)

Well put, Aunt Bea. To which we could add that there's always been a certain degree of paranoia floating around, even before the pandemic. The pandemic just provided a target.

Once the idea was planted in those fertile minds that are receptive to this kind of thing, it became pretty much impossible to dislodge. So heels are dug in, and no amount of logic, common sense, statistical proof, or anything else will dislodge the nonsense that the paranoid "victims" want to believe. There is always somebody out to get them. When the pandemic finally passes, it will be something else.


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## Packerjohn (Dec 13, 2021)

chic said:


> It's just a mask. It's just two weeks to flatten the curve. It's just a holiday, It's just a small sacrifice. It's just temporary. It's just a shot, or 2 or 3 or 4 or twice annually. It's just your job. It's just your career. It's just your home. They're just your kids. It's just a health pass, it's just segregation, they're just your friends and neighbors. It's just a detainment center. It's just for everyone's safety. It's just temporary. Until it's just permanent.
> 
> View attachment 198752


All dictators rose to power by telling people that what they are doing is good for them and necessary.  Yes, the sheep in their countries allowed it to happen.  Hitler controlled inflation and got the country back to work.  Mussolini tried to rive the old Roman Empire by invading Ethiopia (of all places).  The Germans and the Italians allowed them to do this as they felt what the leaders were doing was for their own good.  Mmmmmmmmmmmm!


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## John cycling (Dec 13, 2021)

Why don't intelligent people just believe it without thinking?   

Like Sunny says, it's all so logical, based on common sense and statistical proof.


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## fmdog44 (Dec 13, 2021)

chic said:


> It's just endless compliance with only more to be complied with. It's just the end of freedom as we knew it. It's just a conspiracy theory unfolding before our eyes. It's just more lies being told to us. It's just rules for thee but not for me. It's just theater. It's just time to put an end to it. They just number in the hundreds. We just number in the millions.


My,...my,...my.


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## Gaer (Dec 13, 2021)

I love to see that someone  (Chis) has gumption enough to have original thought and stands up for individualism


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## Shero (Dec 13, 2021)

Packerjohn said:


> All dictators rose to power by telling people that what they are doing is good for them and necessary.  Yes, the sheep in their countries allowed it to happen.  Hitler controlled inflation and got the country back to work.  Mussolini tried to rive the old Roman Empire by invading Ethiopia (of all places).  The Germans and the Italians allowed them to do this as they felt what the leaders were doing was for their own good.  Mmmmmmmmmmmm!



Well they did not have vaccines then, so they sent people to die in the wars.


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## Shero (Dec 13, 2021)

It’s just a dream world that some people live in!

It’s just a few days to Christmas!

It’s just a few more nights before Santa arrives!

It’s just a great future for the vaccinated!!!






It’s just a mask….


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## Marie5656 (Dec 13, 2021)

*A mask is not the end of the world.  New York has re-issued a mask mandate for the state beginning today.  For about 5 seconds I was irritated because I was hoping we were moving past that.
But the reality is we are where we are because of general non compliance.  So yes, I spent yesterday checking my supply of disposable masks, and gathering up my cloth ones.  It is only for a few weeks. 

*


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## GeorgiaXplant (Dec 13, 2021)

Maybe it's just me, but...I cannot understand why on earth people refuse to wear masks. The mask isn't to protect the wearer. The mask is to protect others. You have the "right" to infect someone else? Sorry. Your "right" to go maskless ends at _my_ right to stay healthy. You do not have the right to make me sick.

_*People who refuse to wear masks are selfish and inconsiderate.*_ 

Those people are the same ones who refuse to be vaccinated. You want to get sick? Fine. Get sick. Join all those who dissed masks and the vaccine and got Covid, got very ill, died. There are news stories about them every day. 

_*People who refuse to get the vaccine are just plain stupid. *_

The bolded and italicized comments are my sweeping generalizations for the day.


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## win231 (Dec 13, 2021)

GeorgiaXplant said:


> Maybe it's just me, but...I cannot understand why on earth people refuse to wear masks. The mask isn't to protect the wearer. The mask is to protect others. You have the "right" to infect someone else? Sorry. Your "right" to go maskless ends at _my_ right to stay healthy. You do not have the right to make me sick.
> 
> _*People who refuse to wear masks are selfish and inconsiderate.*_
> 
> ...


Programmed robots are just plain stupid.


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## chic (Dec 13, 2021)

win231 said:


> Programmed robots are just plain stupid.


I won't say they're stupid, but they are refusing to see what is right before their eyes on this issue. They have doubts by now I am sure. The govt. clearly has no viable plan and they just don't know what to do about this. People awaken at different times.


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## chic (Dec 13, 2021)

GeorgiaXplant said:


> Maybe it's just me, but...I cannot understand why on earth people refuse to wear masks. The mask isn't to protect the wearer. The mask is to protect others. You have the "right" to infect someone else? Sorry. Your "right" to go maskless ends at _my_ right to stay healthy. You do not have the right to make me sick.
> 
> _*People who refuse to wear masks are selfish and inconsiderate.*_
> 
> ...


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## chic (Dec 14, 2021)

Shero said:


> It’s just a dream world that some people live in!
> 
> It’s just a few days to Christmas!
> 
> ...


It's going to be a great holiday for those not vaccinated as well. We still exist and we are humans whether you want to believe that or not. So a very happy holiday to everyone because I won't hate or be divided based on government propaganda or a person's individual health choices.


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## win231 (Dec 14, 2021)

chic said:


> It's going to be a great holiday for those not vaccinated as well. We still exist and we are humans whether you want to believe that or not. So a very happy holiday to everyone because I won't hate or be divided based on government propaganda or a person's individual health choices.
> 
> View attachment 198922


LOL - you are disappointing the dolts who are praying harder than they've ever prayed for anything, that unvaccinated people get sick.
Gives 'em that warm, fuzzy "Ahhhhhh" feeling.


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## chic (Dec 14, 2021)

win231 said:


> LOL - you are disappointing the dolts who are praying harder than they've ever prayed for anything, that unvaccinated people get sick.
> Gives 'em that warm, fuzzy "Ahhhhhh" feeling.


I hope not @win231


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## Jeni (Dec 14, 2021)

I want people to think about this....
a person goes out maybe they need to work on site or stop at a store, and perhaps a gas station... maybe they stop and buy take out .......... days later they do not feel well. 
you could not even narrow it down to where let alone who?      
work ..... didn't they mandate shots?    store what is their policy do you know?   
anywhere you go you may pass someone closer then 6 ft because even with masks some people are not staying a distance away 


Now pick out where you got it ........ those who wear masks incorrectly their nose hanging out too loose to hold any droplets if they were to sneeze ?   Those whom you just assume may not have had a shot? 

Do you feel safe you can pick out the *divergent *non shot taker?  
maybe you passed a few people who transmitted ??             which DNA could you find to place blame...... that is right YOU can't.

You can ASSUME it was a un- vaccinated..........but you can not be certain.
If it was passed to you from someone who had their shot would you be willing to accept that ?............ or insist it must  be those  who refused......like a good little sheeple.


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## Knight (Dec 14, 2021)

https://www.google.com/search?q=cor...i5i13i30l4.35911j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8


Statistics
 New cases and deaths
From Our World in Data · Last updated: 2 days ago
Deaths
Worldwide
All time
Feb 11, 2021
Deaths: 13,684
7-day avg: 12,644
Deaths7-day average
Each day shows deaths reported since the previous day·About this data
 Cases
 · Last updated: 2 hours ago
Total
Worldwide
Cases
271M
+622K
Deaths
5.31M
+6,237

It's just numbers, & just death. Just no need to panic or take precautions because governments world wide are just trying to scare people. Just believe those that know the truth.


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## win231 (Dec 14, 2021)

chic said:


> I hope not @win231


Some here have admitted it.  It's the only thing that gives them validation for their choice to get vaccinated.  And it also eases their own doubts about the vaccine's effectiveness.   _"Ha Ha....they got sick & I didn't....serves 'em right."_
They know who they are.


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## Shero (Dec 14, 2021)

chic said:


> It's going to be a great holiday for those not vaccinated as well. We still exist and we are humans whether you want to believe that or not. So a very happy holiday to everyone because I won't hate or be divided based on government propaganda or a person's individual health choices.
> 
> View attachment 198922



I do not wish any of you ill Chic. Actually, as a person of humanity I hope you anti vaxxers get to where you are going safely. I do not keep company with anyone who has not been fully vaxxed. They are not invited to my home,nor do I do business with them. 

Just letting you guys know, 40% of cases now as of today in the UK are Omicron related. There has been one death.

Is one death significant??  You bet your sweet.....  it is, because it is spreading and fast - this is the start -  and the only way to help yourselves is to* Get Vaxxed!!!
.*


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## Owlivia (Dec 15, 2021)

The Covid vaccines are supposed to make you less ill if you contract the virus.  That's it.  Hopefully, you would not be hospitalized and/or die. 

The vaccine does not make you immune from the virus. The same as the flu vaccine, which year to year is only effective for a percentage of any flu in circulation. 

The current flu in my state is not even in the protection of the current flu vaccine.  Science can not keep up with viruses and flu, although they are trying.

It's a personal choice to take the shot or not and not an attack on society.  If the virus was not transmittable after vaccination, this would be a different scenario. 

The vaccinated and the unvaccinated can and may spread the virus.  People who have been vaccinated are spreading the virus.  At least that's what the news has been from those in charge.

If the virus was not transmittable after vaccination, this would be a different talking topic.

The vitriol and personal attacks in many of Covid threads has made me not post before.  Some people have their mind made up in this and in other subjects as we all know.

If someone wants to share their concerns, let them.  If you don't agree you can disagree with kindness, not condemnation, sarcasm can go too far.  Or, better yet, skip the thread.  It seems like trying to silence others is close to bullying, here.

There is so much uncertainty with Covid, it's a new pandemic, and the public were not prepared or even aware.  

Pfizer could help the situation by releasing info, instead of hiding for 75 years.  They are lawsuit protected, there is already sharing of data, so let's find out if there is something to be concerned about.  Hiding info for 75 years is you, your offspring, and their offspring.


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## Devi (Dec 15, 2021)

Owlivia said:


> Pfizer could help the situation by releasing info, instead of hiding for 75 years.  They are lawsuit protected, there is already sharing of data, so let's find out if there is something to be concerned about.  Hiding info for 75 years is you, your offspring, and their offspring.


IT seems highly suspicious to me; that's all.


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## Becky1951 (Dec 15, 2021)

Devi said:


> IT seems highly suspicious to me; that's all.


If there was nothing to hide they would want to get all that info out to the public immediately so there would be *no doubts* that it's a safe and does exactly as it's suppose to do.

And then people would be getting vaccinated in higher numbers.


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## chic (Dec 15, 2021)

Devi said:


> IT seems highly suspicious to me; that's all.


Me too. Let's wait til everyone is dead to release our findings.


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## chic (Dec 15, 2021)

Becky1951 said:


> If there was nothing to hide they would want to get all that info out to the public immediately so there would be *no doubts* that it's a safe and does exactly as it's suppose to do.
> 
> And then people would be getting vaccinated in higher numbers.


Of course you're right so they have something negative to hide and we know this.


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## Packerjohn (Dec 15, 2021)

GeorgiaXplant said:


> Maybe it's just me, but...I cannot understand why on earth people refuse to wear masks. The mask isn't to protect the wearer. The mask is to protect others. You have the "right" to infect someone else? Sorry. Your "right" to go maskless ends at _my_ right to stay healthy. You do not have the right to make me sick.
> 
> _*People who refuse to wear masks are selfish and inconsiderate.*_
> 
> ...


Some people, like me, hate wearing masks.   I wear glasses and I have hearing aids.  When I take that stupid mask off one of my hearing aids likes to fall on the ground.  Anyway, we breath in nitrogen (78%) and oxygen (21%) which is good.  Breathing out pushes out the same elements with some water droplets.  I don't relish breathing in the same air again.  Besides that if you have hearing aids it gets pretty frustrating trying to figure out what some people are saying "mumbling" behind their masks.  I can't read lips when there are no visible lips to read.   No, wearing a masks is not WONDERFUL for me.  Maybe the 20 year old like it; I don't know!


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## Sunny (Dec 15, 2021)

I doubt that anyone likes wearing a mask, Packerjohn. They are a nuisance, but the best we can do at the moment. Since I'm fully vaccinated, I'd probably catch, at most, a mild case of this disease. But who wants even that?

And if I happen to be carrying the virus, without any symptoms, I still wouldn't want to give the disease to anybody else.


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## Tom 86 (Dec 15, 2021)

What gets me, I have a couple of masks in my vehicle, in my coat pocket & other places that I can grab in a hurry.  I went into the pharmacy yesterday & I put on one of the masks from the vehicle.  The Pharmacist ask me where did you get that mask?  I told her it was one I had in my car for a while.  She said look at all that dirt.

  She said you know how dirty that mask is just laying around in a car or on a table in the house?  I said no I never gave it a thought.  She said you should put on a NEW mask every time you put one on.  She said not to use one of the cloth masks but one of the blue surgical masks.  She said the cloth ones do not stop anything from getting in.   

  She wanted to "sell" me a box of 25 masks so I will use a new one every time.  When she rang it up the cost of 25 masks was $50.00  I told her to take those off & I'll continue to use my old ones till I got to a Dr's office where they give you a new one for free. 

After that, I got to look at how many people were wearing the homemade cloth masks & some of the K95 was so dirty it looked like it was in a coal mine.    Now I'm wondering how good the masks really are?


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## win231 (Dec 15, 2021)

Tom 86 said:


> What gets me, I have a couple of masks in my vehicle, in my coat pocket & other places that I can grab in a hurry.  I went into the pharmacy yesterday & I put on one of the masks from the vehicle.  The Pharmacist ask me where did you get that mask?  I told her it was one I had in my car for a while.  She said look at all that dirt.
> 
> She said you know how dirty that mask is just laying around in a car or on a table in the house?  I said no I never gave it a thought.  She said you should put on a NEW mask every time you put one on.  She said not to use one of the cloth masks but one of the blue surgical masks.  She said the cloth ones do not stop anything from getting in.
> 
> ...


I have the regular paper blue & yellow masks.  I spray each one with alcohol on both sides & hang it up to dry after each use. I keep 5 in my car in the glove box.  They don't get very dirty since I only wear a mask where required - when shopping indoors.
No reason to replace every disposable mask after wearing it once.


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## Tom 86 (Dec 15, 2021)

Packerjohn said:


> Some people, like me, hate wearing masks.   I wear glasses and I have hearing aids.  When I take that stupid mask off one of my hearing aids likes to fall on the ground.  Anyway, we breath in nitrogen (78%) and oxygen (21%) which is good.  Breathing out pushes out the same elements with some water droplets.  I don't relish breathing in the same air again.  Besides that if you have hearing aids it gets pretty frustrating trying to figure out what some people are saying "mumbling" behind their masks.  I can't read lips when there are no visible lips to read.   No, wearing a masks is not WONDERFUL for me.  Maybe the 20 year old like it; I don't know!


I know I have to take my mask down a lot for the reason you explained above.  My Asthma Dr. said you can't wear a mask constantly.  As your breathe in some of your exhaled air & that will cause you to pass out.  Which I have almost done in restaurants & other places.  People give me hell because I take it off, then I explain if I don't you will be calling the ambulance & YOU will have to pay the bill as I just explained why I have to take it off.


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## Marie5656 (Dec 15, 2021)

*Interesting development in New York's new mask mandate. Some counties are choosing not to enforce it. That includes my own county..Genesee.  So, the manager of my building has told us it is up to each individual tenant if they want to wear masks in the common areas of the building,  But I went to the grocery store yesterday and a sign said masks must be worn. So, I will be keeping a couple in my car, and in my purse. Just to make sure I have them on hand.
I do not object to the mandate, but am kind of glad we can go mask free in my building*


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## MarciKS (Dec 15, 2021)

You guys can argue till hell freezes over but it's not gonna make Covid disappear. It's not gonna stop Covid from taking lives. It's not gonna get you back the freedom you want. Instead of sitting here bitching about it maybe you should consider doing what they asked us to do in the first place. But you're sooooooooo worried about conspiracies and your precious rights. I agree with what GeorgiaXplant said. You don't have the right to make me sick just because you're making poor choices out of the fear you claim we are living in. My mother died from this because she wasn't able to take the vaccine. Someone, somewhere, where my parents had to go, had Covid. Whether they masked or not doesn't matter to me. What matters is the fact that they had it and went out with it and spread it to my parents and because of my mothers health issues she was unable to survive it. It was probably someone who had their mask under their nose and refused to get the vaccine. Thanks to that person she is gone forever. Are you really ok with taking a chance of being responsible for the death of another person because you're afraid of a shot? And because you can't be bothered to wear a little mask because it's uncomfortable? If you're ok with murdering someone else then hey have at it. Given enough opportunity maybe it will come back to bite you in the ass and it will be you in that hospital bed with your lungs filling with fluid and death knocking at your door.


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## Jeni (Dec 15, 2021)

Tom 86 said:


> What gets me, I have a couple of masks in my vehicle, in my coat pocket & other places that I can grab in a hurry.  I went into the pharmacy yesterday & I put on one of the masks from the vehicle.  The Pharmacist ask me where did you get that mask?  I told her it was one I had in my car for a while.  She said look at all that dirt.
> 
> She said you know how dirty that mask is just laying around in a car or on a table in the house?  I said no I never gave it a thought.  She said you should put on a NEW mask every time you put one on.  She said not to use one of the cloth masks but one of the blue surgical masks.  She said the cloth ones do not stop anything from getting in.
> 
> ...


i see this all the time ..... 
some people are buying box after box of masks ........so some one is making money...... 
Every company that could got involved to get their logo on cloth ones .... People walking billboards with adverts for teams / companies / what ever.    I remember Fauci with a mask for the Washington Nationals 

I worked for a medical research company and once a mask is touched over and over they are basically useless.  we had to do Medical exams on people to see it they were healthy enough to wear all day. 

Look around store parking lots... sides of the road ..... etc all i see is discarded masks.   NOW are those a BIO hazard / medical waste ? 

i watched some overly zealous people with goggles masks and plastic gloves come out of a store wash each item with a clorox wipe and then discard wipes plastic gloves and masks in parking lot for store employees to pick up.
  Remember f*ront line hero *that did not last long..... 
I would get headaches after wearing for longer then 2 hours so as some showed me took a pin and poked holes in masks. 
For those who really think it is about OTHERS they are living in a placebo world.


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## MarciKS (Dec 15, 2021)

Tom 86 said:


> I know I have to take my mask down a lot for the reason you explained above.  My Asthma Dr. said you can't wear a mask constantly.  As your breathe in some of your exhaled air & that will cause you to pass out.  Which I have almost done in restaurants & other places.  People give me hell because I take it off, then I explain if I don't you will be calling the ambulance & YOU will have to pay the bill as I just explained why I have to take it off.


That's understandable. I have asthma and COPD and I have to get air every so often. But I have coworkers who run around all day with theirs down despite our company mandate. They just don't give a shit. At least you make the effort. Good for you!


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## win231 (Dec 15, 2021)

MarciKS said:


> You guys can argue till hell freezes over but it's not gonna make Covid disappear. It's not gonna stop Covid from taking lives. It's not gonna get you back the freedom you want. Instead of sitting here bitching about it maybe you should consider doing what they asked us to do in the first place. But you're sooooooooo worried about conspiracies and your precious rights. I agree with what GeorgiaXplant said. You don't have the right to make me sick just because you're making poor choices out of the fear you claim we are living in. My mother died from this because she wasn't able to take the vaccine. Someone, somewhere, where my parents had to go, had Covid. Whether they masked or not doesn't matter to me. What matters is the fact that they had it and went out with it and spread it to my parents and because of my mothers health issues she was unable to survive it. It was probably someone who had their mask under their nose and refused to get the vaccine. Thanks to that person she is gone forever. Are you really ok with taking a chance of being responsible for the death of another person because you're afraid of a shot? And because you can't be bothered to wear a little mask because it's uncomfortable? If you're ok with murdering someone else then hey have at it. Given enough opportunity maybe it will come back to bite you in the ass and it will be you in that hospital bed with your lungs filling with fluid and death knocking at your door.


_"It was *probably *someone who had their mask under their nose and refused to get the vaccine."_
Thank you for clearly illustrating what the problem is.  You are _desperatel_y looking for someone to blame  because anger is easier to deal with than grief.   And you are using that misdirected anger to wish ill on others to try to justify it.
You are wrong on both counts.


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## chic (Dec 15, 2021)

I never could wear a mask do to a medical issue. Now I'm unapologetic about it. Wear one, don't wear one. If the vaxx worked, which it doesn't we wouldn't even be having this conversation.


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## Becky1951 (Dec 15, 2021)

I've known of vaccinated people who think they don't need to wear a mask, which is dangerous as those vaccinated people may very well be asymptomatic and spreading Covid. 

So if someone dies who had had no known contact to someone with covid, it could very well be that the deceased person came in contact with a fully vaccinated asymptomatic person.

It's not always the unvaccinated who spread Covid.


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## Shero (Dec 15, 2021)

Jeni said:


> i see this all the time .....
> some people are buying box after box of masks ........so some one is making money......
> Every company that could got involved to get their logo on cloth ones .... People walking billboards with adverts for teams / companies / what ever.    I remember Fauci with a mask for the Washington Nationals
> 
> ...



No!!! it is you and people like you who are living in a "placebo" world.
You comment on other people protecting their health?
Why?  Does it make you feel guilty?
.


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## Shero (Dec 15, 2021)

chic said:


> I never could wear a mask do to a medical issue. Now I'm unapologetic about it. Wear one, don't wear one. If the vaxx worked, which it doesn't we wouldn't even be having this conversation.
> View attachment 199127
> 
> View attachment 199128



*Very sad Chic. Remember this:  No one is immune, no one!*


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## Jeni (Dec 15, 2021)

Shero said:


> No!!! it is you and people like you who are living in a "placebo" world.
> You comment on other people protecting their health?
> Why?  Does it make you feel guilty?
> .


I have zero idea what your talking about ...
I am *aware *what placebos these masks are ...........and i am not pretending it is otherwise like so many are.   

If they give people a false sense of security and they look around and see masks and think all is right in the world let them chase unicorns and butterflies all day

People forcing others to mask etc  is NOT protecting their health.....


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## dseag2 (Dec 15, 2021)

I hate having a cold.  I wear a mask to most places (unless I'm outside) and haven't had a cold in 2 years.  To me, that's worth having my glasses fog up.


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## dseag2 (Dec 15, 2021)

I hate having a cold.  I wear a mask to most places (unless I'm outside) and haven't had a cold in 2 years.  To me, that's worth having my glasses fog up.  I don't consider this a loss of freedom but a decision to avoid illness.


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## chic (Dec 16, 2021)

Shero said:


> *Very sad Chic. Remember this:  No one is immune, no one!*


Actually, some people are more immune to diseases, even deadly ones, than others. This is how humanity has survived plagues and diseases for millennia without being wiped out. There weren't always masks or vaccines to treat everything.


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## Shero (Dec 16, 2021)

chic said:


> Actually, some people are more immune to diseases, even deadly ones, than others. This is how humanity has survived plagues and diseases for millennia without being wiped out. There weren't always masks or vaccines to treat everything.



You are very welcome to take your chances then. Bonne chance !!!


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## Alice November (Dec 16, 2021)

The Wuhan virology labs have been going since the 70's with their study of bats from a cave near there. They have studied and studied Sars Covid disease in over hundreds of variations for years. Americans and many countries have been involved. So, they know a whole lot about these virus's. I assume they know a whole lot more than they are allowed to say. Clearly governments let the information out to us a little bit at a time. You know it's like when you slowly let the air escape from a baloon it makes that terrible irritating even excruciating squeaking sound. So torturing and painful. 

I'm still waiting to see if the reason they aren't telling us very much is motivated by greed, power, other ...? I guess they just like to feel they have the control over the masses. Clearly Nature is the bigger powe as SarsCov rolls out.


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## Alice November (Dec 16, 2021)

chic said:


> Actually, some people are more immune to diseases, even deadly ones, than others. This is how humanity has survived plagues and diseases for millennia without being wiped out. There weren't always masks or vaccines to treat everything.


Yes Florence Nightengale was one and so many others particularly preists and nuns who were immune were running the hospitals. They have found some people have a natural immunity to bat virus diseases. I guess maybe those kids played under certain trees maybe? Well, who knows really, however they got it good on them.


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## Alice November (Dec 16, 2021)

dseag2 said:


> I hate having a cold.  I wear a mask to most places (unless I'm outside) and haven't had a cold in 2 years.  To me, that's worth having my glasses fog up.  I don't consider this a loss of freedom but a decision to avoid illness.


If I were to go out I would wear one. My husband got some super masks with copper filters made by a professional, they completely seal around the face, so no air gets in and are washeable. He looks alittle like a WW1 bomber pilot. Only goes out to start the car once a month and take the trash out. He even wears it when he opens  the door to pick up the groceries we have delivered after they have sat for 20 minutes. I haven't been outside for nearly two years.


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## win231 (Dec 16, 2021)

Alice November said:


> If I were to go out I would wear one. My husband got some super masks with copper filters made by a professional, they completely seal around the face, so no air gets in and are washeable. He looks alittle like a WW1 bomber pilot. Only goes out to start the car once a month and take the trash out. He even wears it when he opens  the door to pick up the groceries we have delivered after they have sat for 20 minutes. I haven't been outside for nearly two years.


To each his own - including your own level of caution or fear.


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## Alice November (Dec 16, 2021)

I'm cautious because I don't believe what authorities are saying. Their contradictions are a red flag to me that either they could care less about seniors or they are intentionaly stirring fear and keeping the truth from everyone, possibly to avoid hystria. On the other hand it seems they stir fear because they know people buy more of everything when they feel vulnerable and afraid, more food, clothes, houses, cars and take mor holidays. Which we don't do, minimalism agrees with us these days. I have learned a lot over these last two years about how much less is more than enough.

I can't do what they are telling us about vaccinating. I am now at an age where I do know the last few times I got bronchitis from flu it became difficult to breathe whereas 10 years ago I didn't feel that unwell with flu virus and bronchitis. Hwmbo has asthema and some overactive immune responses, so we know we should try not to catch anything with respiratory inflammation. 

We decided to isolate because we can, so far so good. 

@win231 I appeciate all your comments. It is always good to read your solid reasoning.


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## Jules (Dec 16, 2021)

Alice November said:


> I haven't been outside for nearly two years.


Do you have a backyard/garden that you can go to for fresh air and exercise?  Those are the things that keep us reasonably sane.  We don’t wear masks when walking.  People are very polite and immediately separate when they see someone else approaching.  Granted, we don’t live in a metropolitan areas where it would be more difficult.


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## Tom 86 (Dec 16, 2021)

Becky1951 said:


> I've known of vaccinated people who think they don't need to wear a mask, which is dangerous as those vaccinated people may very well be asymptomatic and spreading Covid.
> 
> So if someone dies who had had no known contact to someone with covid, it could very well be that the deceased person came in contact with a fully vaccinated asymptomatic person.
> 
> It's not always the unvaccinated who spread Covid.


On our local news here in Indiana.  The hospitals are full & they are transferring patients to other hospitals as far away as Evansville of 250 miles from my hospital.  My Retina Dr. that gave me a shot in my eye this past Monday, said he was in my hospital where I need to go for my knee replacement.

  He said there were beds in the halls, the pre-opp was full so the patent he was doing eye surgery on was in the OR as there was no other place to pre-opp her. 

 He asked nurses about these transferring patents?  They said yes we are moving them to other hospitals that still have open beds.  One nurse said you know Dr. V.  There are about half & half the patients here that have NOT been vaccinated they are in ICU.  The other half have been vaccinated two times & they are in regular rooms because they have lung problems.  

 He said there must be something wrong with the shots for so many to still get sick & end up in the hospital & now they are thinking of a 4th booster shot??  So it looks like I won't get my knee replaced till "maybe" February.


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## Alice November (Dec 16, 2021)

Jules said:


> Do you have a backyard/garden that you can go to for fresh air and exercise?  Those are the things that keep us reasonably sane.  We don’t wear masks when walking.  People are very polite and immediately separate when they see someone else approaching.  Granted, we don’t live in a metropolitan areas where it would be more difficult.


We live in a vey densly populated urban area. It is typical of a lot of european countries that in the older areas streets are very narrow and sidewalks are just barely wide enough for one person with the curb and traffic on one side of you and the buildings on the other side. Passing is negotiated by walking on the street and if its a busy time of day, its diffcult even without a pandemic. 

I have done a lot of walking in the apartment, its ok. I'm considered underweight by NHS bmi charts for my age, but just one point, so not worried on that account.


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## fmdog44 (Dec 17, 2021)

chic said:


> View attachment 198895


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## Tom 86 (Dec 18, 2021)

Just now on our local news, the Governor is putting National Guard medics in all our hospitals here in Indiana because of so many new cases of Conav.  We are getting 5,900 new cases every day.  They showed beds in halls, On a floor that was used for storage. They said nurses are working 12 to 14 hr shifts 7 days a week & they need some R & R. to recuperate from all the stress. 

  National Guard is setting up tents connected to the hospitals & putting beds & equipment in them.


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## chic (Dec 18, 2021)

Tom 86 said:


> Just now on our local news, the Governor is putting National Guard medics in all our hospitals here in Indiana because of so many new cases of Conav.  We are getting 5,900 new cases every day.  They showed beds in halls, On a floor that was used for storage. They said nurses are working 12 to 14 hr shifts 7 days a week & they need some R & R. to recuperate from all the stress.
> 
> National Guard is setting up tents connected to the hospitals & putting beds & equipment in them.


Why do they need national guard medics and extra nurses for people who test positive for covid? Testing positive doesn't require hospitalization or have I missed something?


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## Tom 86 (Dec 18, 2021)

chic said:


> Why do they need national guard medics and extra nurses for people who test positive for covid? Testing positive doesn't require hospitalization or have I missed something?


These are ones that need hospitalization to be treated for the Conav.  Some are put on ventilators & some just need strong medicine (like I got when I was admitted for not being able to breathe) to get over the Conav. without a ventilator. They are in the hospital for 3 or 4 days then home.


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## Butterfly (Dec 19, 2021)

MarciKS said:


> You guys can argue till hell freezes over but it's not gonna make Covid disappear. It's not gonna stop Covid from taking lives. It's not gonna get you back the freedom you want. Instead of sitting here bitching about it maybe you should consider doing what they asked us to do in the first place. But you're sooooooooo worried about conspiracies and your precious rights. I agree with what GeorgiaXplant said. You don't have the right to make me sick just because you're making poor choices out of the fear you claim we are living in. My mother died from this because she wasn't able to take the vaccine. Someone, somewhere, where my parents had to go, had Covid. Whether they masked or not doesn't matter to me. What matters is the fact that they had it and went out with it and spread it to my parents and because of my mothers health issues she was unable to survive it. It was probably someone who had their mask under their nose and refused to get the vaccine. Thanks to that person she is gone forever. Are you really ok with taking a chance of being responsible for the death of another person because you're afraid of a shot? And because you can't be bothered to wear a little mask because it's uncomfortable? If you're ok with murdering someone else then hey have at it. Given enough opportunity maybe it will come back to bite you in the ass and it will be you in that hospital bed with your lungs filling with fluid and death knocking at your door.


Well said, Marci!  And I completely agree with you.  I'm very sorry you lost your mother; losing one's mother is a terrible loss.


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## hollydolly (Dec 19, 2021)

Alice November said:


> If I were to go out I would wear one. My husband got some super masks with copper filters made by a professional, they completely seal around the face, so no air gets in and are washeable. He looks alittle like a WW1 bomber pilot. Only goes out to start the car once a month and take the trash out. He even wears it when he opens  the door to pick up the groceries we have delivered after they have sat for 20 minutes. I haven't been outside for nearly two years.


Apologies if I've missed the reason  Alice..but why haven't you been out for 2 years ?... why don't you or your husband go out now?..


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## Packerjohn (Dec 19, 2021)

It's a crazy world.  Some folks believe that the make believe world is real.  At the same time some folks believe that the real world is totally made up.  Think on this:  There are a group of people who believe that there really is no pandemic.  That this is all made up to control people.  At the same time they believe that there really is a Santa Claus and they go crazy to celebrate this so called Christmas by shopping with their credit cards in maddening crowds.  Strange and crazy in many ways.


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## win231 (Dec 19, 2021)

John cycling said:


> Why don't intelligent people just believe it without thinking?
> 
> Like Sunny says, it's all so logical, based on common sense and statistical proof.
> 
> View attachment 198836


And get a vasectomy if your neighbor has too many kids.


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## chic (Dec 19, 2021)

Packerjohn said:


> It's a crazy world.  Some folks believe that the make believe world is real.  At the same time some folks believe that the real world is totally made up.  Think on this:  There are a group of people who believe that there really is no pandemic.  That this is all made up to control people.  At the same time they believe that there really is a Santa Claus and they go crazy to celebrate this so called Christmas by shopping with their credit cards in maddening crowds.  Strange and crazy in many ways.


I don't believe in Santa but I do believe the pandemic is not all they would like us to believe it is.


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## Alice November (Dec 20, 2021)

hollydolly said:


> Apologies if I've missed the reason  Alice..but why haven't you been out for 2 years ?... why don't you or your husband go out now?..




We can't have the vaccine because we aren't registered ( have a certain number ) with the French health system. The French Government in an address by the President issued directives from the French Health Ministry at the beginning of the SarsCov2 Pandemic and for people over 70 years it was required to isolate at home, this was before the vaccine was invented.

That directive was not changed here in France even after the vaccinations began to be available.  Families have been cautioned to 'look after their elderly family' by the President several times in special broadcasts. I like Macron, he does his best with what he has to work with.

Just last week it was put over that All Unvaccinated People are to "stay at home until further notice.

Families were specifically asked to protect their elderly from the beginning of the Pandemic because here in France we are one of the worst countries in EU for a high death toll compared to just having Covid, and because almost all of those deaths are in people over 65 years of age it was thought they should be as protected as possible.

That has not changed in principle, so the advice since vaccines became available is still for people ( now I think it changed to people over 65 ) to stay at home as much as possible even with all of the vaccinating and the boosters. I guess they don't expect the high death toll in the elderly here in France to stop just because of the Omicron variant.

The latest French Travel requirements have now got the same rules, tests, and isolating mandates for both vaxed and unvaxed people.

Obviously they lost faith in the vax but governmental advice from Health Ministry is still to get the boosters.


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## chic (Dec 20, 2021)

Alice November said:


> We can't have the vaccine because we aren't registered ( have a certain number ) with the French health system. The French Government in an address by the President issued directives from the French Health Ministry at the beginning of the SarsCov2 Pandemic and for people over 70 years it was required to isolate at home, this was before the vaccine was invented.
> 
> That directive was not changed here in France even after the vaccinations began to be available.  Families have been cautioned to 'look after their elderly family' by the President several times in special broadcasts. I like Macron, he does his best with what he has to work with.
> 
> ...


Can they legally do this to people? Are there lawyers who could advise you what to do and help you? Staying in all the time is no life at all.


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## Alice November (Dec 20, 2021)

chic said:


> Can they legally do this to people? Are there lawyers who could advise you what to do and help you? Staying in all the time is no life at all.


I'm not at all unhappy staying at home and having groceries delivered.  We live in a very densly populated urban area but we have very large windows, nearly floor to ceiling, high ceilings and a little balcony. It don't think it is illegal to go out. Most seniors in my neighborhood only go out for groceries. Several small shops are available within a few blocks. Most of the older folks wear masks. 

France has a larger elderly population than most countries. People suffer more hospitalizations for lung problems such as the flu, pneumonia and lung cancer here than a lot of other countries. 

The mandates and advice is appropriate for France, as all viral conditions are going to have an impact on hospitals during flu season in this country. Smoking is pretty comman as well, so there is that.  

It's most unfortunate that the vaxed people feel so confident in going out and spreading Covid imo.


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## hollydolly (Dec 20, 2021)

Alice November said:


> I'm not at all unhappy staying at home and having groceries delivered.  We live in a very densly populated urban area but we have very large windows, nearly floor to ceiling, high ceilings and a little balcony. It don't think it is illegal to go out. Most seniors in my neighborhood only go out for groceries. Several small shops are available within a few blocks. Most of the older folks wear masks.
> 
> France has a larger elderly population than most countries. People suffer more hospitalizations for lung problems such as the flu, pneumonia and lung cancer here than a lot of other countries.
> 
> ...


I am Double vaxxed, and  I wear a mask anywhere indoors  while I'm out..in stores, malls, bars  or where there's a deep concentration of people, and I'm still careful to keep a distance from people ..I don't feel as a vaxxed person I'm spreading the pandemic to anyone. If I felt like I was, I would have remained un-vaccinated..


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## Alice November (Dec 20, 2021)

hollydolly said:


> I am Double vaxxed, and  I wear a mask anywhere indoors  while I'm out..in stores, malls, bars  or where there's a deep concentration of people, and I'm still careful to keep a distance from people ..I don't feel as a vaxxed person I'm spreading the pandemic to anyone. If I felt like I was, I would have remained un-vaccinated..


Holly, I think you are an exception. Where I am so many people are not careful. One of my major difficulties is just getting down the stairs which are narrow. Not everyone masks or cares about social distancing. 
I'm sorry, my comment wasn't directed at you, as I am unvaxed I wish that people were not feeling so overconfident that because of Omicron, there is no more Sars victems.

I think time will tell if the pandemic is over and we can go on as we were. 

Everyone be safe especially during the coming few weeks!

🕊🕊


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## Alice November (Dec 20, 2021)

chic said:


> Staying in all the time is no life at all.



I have a lot of things that I can only do at home. Piano, flute, painting. 

I consider my life worthwhile, wholesome, healthy and happy atm.


 🕊   🕊


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## chic (Dec 20, 2021)

Alice November said:


> I have a lot of things that I can only do at home. Piano, flute, painting.
> 
> I consider my life worthwhile, wholesome, healthy and happy atm.
> 
> ...


You have great inner strength. I would never be able to stay in all the time no matter what dangers were out there.


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## Marie5656 (Dec 21, 2021)

Got my newest mask in the mail today


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## Sunny (Dec 21, 2021)

Where I live, nearly everyone is vaxed, and literally everyone wears a mask when indoors in a public space.  We have to, by law, but most of us would anyway. I wonder where the unvaxxed crowd is finding all these uncaring people who got vaccines and boosters themselves, but are deliberately walking around spreading the disease?

Sounds pretty much like a desperate, last-ditch rationalization to me. I haven't seen any such people, and I get around quite a lot.


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