# Some won't ever understand the stigmatization of African Americans



## AprilT (Jun 25, 2016)

I was posting about postal workers while collecting silly videos of their less than savory antice I happened on this video which just gave me serious stomach aches.  I just don't think many people will every understand how this kind of thing affects generations of people who see these things happen time and time again, no matter what one is doing or not doing we can always make up in our minds excuses for the behaviors of those in authority to act a certain way toward a people but it's sickening and hurtful to the core.  Some don't get it because they don't live it don't understand how it feels to be stigmatized just for the hue of their skin from the day they are born.  I have to say, there are times when I understand and sympathize with the police, I realize they have a hard job, but, I've also seen and experienced both sides of when what is happening is based on prejudices.  This hurt me to the core.  I expect some not to understand, but, I just had to purge this feeling I was having after seeing the video, I've seen many similar, but, today for some reason, this just made me post it.


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## Shalimar (Jun 25, 2016)

Oh April, how hideous. I am so sorry. Hugs.


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## Debby (Jun 25, 2016)

Obviously I've never experienced what 'you and yours' have experienced, but I can fully imagine the fear and anger and frustration.....it's just not fair and it is so cruel!


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## SeaBreeze (Jun 25, 2016)

I won't ever completely understand April, because I'm not black.  But, I know that things like this take place all the time, not only in NY, but all over the US.  I find it particularly disgusting when those in authority, like the police, use the power behind their badge to act out their racist tendencies. 

 Of course not all cops are that way, there are many good officers on the force, but the ones who do things like this _must _be stopped, with video recordings these days, steps are being taken even if baby steps.  It's long overdue, that's for sure!  My heart goes out to you, having grown up and lived around folks with all different racial and ethnic backgrounds, I know your feelings come from a true place...hugs.


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## AprilT (Jun 25, 2016)

Thank you all, I'm not angry at all people who work in this industry, I've said before, I've actually worked behind the scenes with people on the force, whom I've had great friendships co-worker relationships with in past years and I have family who wear the uniform, just sometimes seeing these things wears me down emotionally more than I care to let it or admit it.


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## Butterfly (Jun 25, 2016)

Hugs to you, April!  I'm so sorry stuff like this happens.


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## tnthomas (Jun 25, 2016)

April,  seeing these incidents pains me to no end, I am sorry for the impact that it has on you.   If wishes could come true, I would wish that racial violence would just no longer happen.

It's not the police, it's the person behind the badge...


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## AprilT (Jun 25, 2016)

tnthomas said:


> April,  seeing these incidents pains me to no end, I am sorry for the impact that it has on you.   If wishes could come true, I would wish that racial violence would just no longer happen.
> 
> *It's not the police*, *it's the person behind the badge*...



I know this is true, but it's also a particular environment in any given place that sometimes allows the behaviors to persist.  I don't want this to be about the police so much as it is that some just don't understand how deeply felt the pain of the prejudices regardless where they come from can affect individuals.  I've lived most of my life letting most of these things roll off my shoulder, but the internet has opened a whole new world of it that gets thrown in my face in ways I didn't have to witness each and every day instead of just experiences, off the net, in real life only occasionally or rarely.  The net experience of it has been a whole new ballgame.  I do my best to tune most of it out but it gets more and more difficult sometimes.  I didn't go looking for that video, I guess, in a way, it served me right to find it for poking fun at the postal workers.  :sentimental:


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## Ruthanne (Jun 25, 2016)

AprilT said:


> I know this is true, but it's also a particular environment in any given place that sometimes allows the behaviors to persist.  I don't want this to be about the police so much as it is that some just don't understand how deeply felt the pain of the prejudices regardless where they come from can affect individuals.  I've lived most of my life letting most of these things roll off my shoulder, but the internet has opened a whole new world of it that gets thrown in my face in ways I didn't have to witness each and every day instead of just experiences, off the net, in real life only occasionally or rarely.  The net experience of it has been a whole new ballgame.  I do my best to tune most of it out but it gets more and more difficult sometimes.  I didn't go looking for that video, I guess, in a way, it served me right to find it for poking fun at the postal workers.  :sentimental:


:bighug:


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## Guitarist (Jun 25, 2016)

There are some things, as you say, that some people will never understand.  

Yet many people can trust that there is some things that are real, that exist, that other people are subject to. I think part of "respect" is accepting that just because one doesn't understand another person's issues one _can_ understand that they have those issues to deal with and that it is very very hard to do so.  One can honor them for how they are dealing with those issues, how they react to them, how they cope and survive and thrive in the face of them. 

It would be laughable for me to say, here, that as a woman I deal with issues and attitudes and behaviors a man would never understand.  

But I think that if one can't actually walk a mile in another person's shoes, one can accept that we all _have _shoes, and can pay more attention to how one's own shoes fit, and where they rub corns, and cause one to trip but hopefully not fall.


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## senile1 (Jun 26, 2016)

The real question should be, "where do we go from here?" What can we do about it? I grew up on the streets, you will have fight for any/everything you get; I am white. I have been harassed by the cops; tis not always racial; a lot of times it is over worked ,under paid, under trained officers who do not really care. The aforementioned incident could have just as well happened to a white / Hispanic/ Asian person; tis based on fear factor to prevent the victim from turning them in. There is discrimination, and minorities do not always get treated fairly, but everything is not racial. There does need to be better living conditions/ social programs, equal justice, the same justice for all. Black lives matter, all lives matter.


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## AprilT (Jun 26, 2016)

And there you have it the dismisiness; we all know the dozens of of possibilities of altinate situations where other people go through harassment, I myself have posted such videos and information,  I also made it clear this isn't about the police.  No surprise that what I feel would be reduced to anecdotal situations, like I said some wouldn't understand as you absolutely haven't a real clue of a day in the life in the skin.  Easy to trivialize what I felt.  I've never lived my life thinking everything was about race that wasn't how I was raised it has only been in recent years that my eyes have been more opened to see that other people see my color first more often than not and place me in a box. I've learned this from places like this as  much as anywhere else.  One only needs to read words like the blacks and those people their community so many times to get it it.  Of course I know this doesn't relate to all, but I heard enough to get the message.

BTW that last little bit "All lives matters" you having to say that to me speaks volumes.  That was quite insulting. What is it some people don't get or are so bothered by the fact that when people say black lives matter this just means black lives matter too just like everyone else not only, but also.


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## Ameriscot (Jun 26, 2016)

AprilT said:


> And there you have it the dismisiness; we all know the dozens of of possibilities of altinate situations where other people go through harassment, I myself have posted such videos and information,  I also made it clear this isn't about the police.  No surprise that what I feel would be reduced to anecdotal situations, like I said some wouldn't understand as you absolutely haven't a real clue of a day in the life in the skin.  Easy to trivialize what I felt.  I've never lived my life thinking everything was about race that wasn't how I was raised it has only been in recent years that my eyes have been more opened to see that other people see my color first more often than not and place me in a box. I've learned this from places like this as  much as anywhere else.  One only needs to read words like the blacks and those people their community so many times to get it it.  Of course I know this doesn't relate to all, but I heard enough to get the message.
> *
> BTW that last little bit "All lives matters" you having to say that to me speaks volumes.  That was quite insulting. What is it some people don't get or are so bothered by the fact that when people say black lives matter this just means black lives matter too just like everyone else not only, but also.*



I get annoyed at how often people will add on '...all lives matter'.  Do they think what is meant by Black Lives Matter is that *only* Black lives matter??

I can never say I understand because I'm white.  No one can ever truly understand what it is like to be in the shoes of someone unlike ourselves, no matter how hard we try. 

When we lived in Uganda we got into discussions on racism and had to explain it because, of course, someone in Uganda has never experienced it.  They knew about prejudice between tribes throughout the country - different languages, somewhat different in culture, etc.  I hated having to explain US racism to them and what it meant. They were totally shocked and horrified, as well they should have been.


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## Jackie22 (Jun 26, 2016)

I think racism and the inability to recognize it is the major obsteticals holding our country back....it has been made all too clear with the election of Barack Obama.

As others have said.....I can't possibly fully understand how you feel, April, but I
do recognize the unfairness.


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## Debby (Jun 26, 2016)

April, Canada has also had it's own brush with the kind of racism that you're talking about here.  I found a website called Black History Canada and it opens with this:

'For example, it was “understood” that Black people attending a movie in New Glasgow, Nova Scotia should not sit on the main floor level. It was reserved for Whites only, so to ensure that would be the case, different rates were charged for tickets. Visiting New Glasgow on business, African-Canadian Viola Desmond’s car developed problems and needed repair. To pass time, she bought a movie ticket and sat on the main floor since she had accidentally left her glasses in her car. She was ordered to leave the theatre, because she had paid the “*****” rate but was sitting on the main floor. Although she offered to pay the difference, she was arrested, not allowed to consult a lawyer and fined. Her case, years before American Rosa Parks’ case, sparked an end to Nova Scotian segregation....'

Viola Davis was one of the possible women who might be on new Canadian bills.

Some of the pages on the link are not connecting properly but one that did (http://www.lsuc.on.ca/media/oct04_c2bbackhousespeech.pdf) is discussing black people who became lawyers in early Canada.  The following was written about a woman named Clara Martin, who managed, in 1891 to force her way through and into law practise:   '.....* Despite achieving so much on behalf of women, Clara Brett Martin participatedin acts of anti-Semitism along with many other members of the profession. There isevidence that she lobbied the Attorney General to have restrictions placed on those shereferred to as “foreign Jewish realtors.” Her acts underscore the complexity ofdiscrimination and remind us that proponents of equality do not always get it right...'

As I read the above,  I'm reminded too that one of the great's in the struggle for justice and fairness and peace, Mahatma Gandi, is also known historically as a racist against black people in South Africa.  I think the point that I'm trying to make is that throughout history, racism in one form or another and against a variety of groups (blacks, Jews, Romany gypsies, Irish, Japanese....) has existed.  But by golly, you'd think that by now, we'd finally be smart enough to realize that without the 'skin' to identify us (makes me think of that human body exhibitionlayful we're all the same basically.  We all have hearts and bones and blood vessels and muscles and 'souls' and love's and joys and fears and sorrows.....and yet even today, so many are willing to see only the outside.  Terribly sad.

But I also think that is why it is so important to be involved in discussions like this and to listen to the words of those who've lived these experiences and NOT take those words as personal attacks against us but instead to try to imagine how people like you April, must feel.  For example, my real awakening to a better understanding came when a First Nations chief was involved in a hunger strike that was supposed to get our Federal governments attention a few years ago.  Listening to the anger against her and to the angry support for her and for her cause, finally made me curious enough to actually look at some of the FN claims about how their lives are here in Canada and it was reading about their children's rotten education standards that finally got through to me.  I finally began to think, 'if my kids were going to those kinds of schools, would I feel that it was fair or right?'  I was finally beginning to understand the frustration and yes, the hostility of many of our FN's people.






http://www.blackhistorycanada.ca/topic.php?id=146&themeid=5


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## AprilT (Jun 26, 2016)

I thank those of you who hear my voice and recognize that I speak from a place of feeling a deep hurt b something experienced blatantly and subtly too frequently.  I grew up in a very diverse environment, my friends, dating partners people I broke bread with, even besties who I shared a bed with in various situations with wre always a mixed bag.  I never judged my friends or acquaintances based on their ethnicity, they were just people I liked or loved.  I admit even many times I might at times thought some people were to quick to blame their circumstances on their skin color and there can absolutely be occasions where that might be true but, the vast majority of times what I ve experienced in my layered years has taught me how easy it was for me to not see the truth of the situation as I wasn't or hadn't experienced it as others had because I lived in a bubble partly created by my parents and my own delutions but also having in earlier times having been granted the privilege of being exposed to some wonderful people,  At least in things related to race.  As far as I am concerned all people are my people regardless of skin color, it just saddens me we find so many reasons to hate one another for the simple purpose to feel superior and if not for skn hue we would find another reason to annihilate each other


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## Shalimar (Jun 26, 2016)

Hugs April.


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## AprilT (Jun 26, 2016)

Debby said:


> April, Canada has also had it's own brush with the kind of racism that you're talking about here.  I found a website called Black History Canada and it opens with this:
> 
> 'For example, it was “understood” that Black people attending a movie in New Glasgow, Nova Scotia should not sit on the main floor level. It was reserved for Whites only, so to ensure that would be the case, different rates were charged for tickets. Visiting New Glasgow on business, African-Canadian Viola Desmond’s car developed problems and needed repair. To pass time, she bought a movie ticket and sat on the main floor since she had accidentally left her glasses in her car. She was ordered to leave the theatre, because she had paid the “*****” rate but was sitting on the main floor. Although she offered to pay the difference, she was arrested, not allowed to consult a lawyer and fined. Her case, years before American Rosa Parks’ case, sparked an end to Nova Scotian segregation....'
> 
> ...





Thank you Debbie for that information.  I was aware of the history of how Gandhi felt and it was eye opening when I first read about it.  There   was a lot of ignorance and hatred between Africans and his people so when I delved more, for me there was no real surprise plus he was just a human being no different from many others who don't always walk the talk 100% though often believe they do as does their follows  doesn't dismiss a lot of the good he did for some thought.  As I said he was only human,

I am greatly aware of racial hatred, tribal, religious,self hatred the many other forms of hatred that exist throughout the world.  I don't think it will ever go away completely, but as you said it is beneficial that we have discussions and at least hear how people are affected.  There's been progress in the world, but there are those who live to see things go backwards a d they are working doubly hard at it.  5hose who stay silent have no idea just how happy that makes them.


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## Guitarist (Jun 26, 2016)

AprilT said:


> And there you have it the dismisiness; we all know the dozens of of possibilities of altinate situations where other people go through harassment, I myself have posted such videos and information,  I also made it clear this isn't about the police.  No surprise that what I feel would be reduced to anecdotal situations, like I said some wouldn't understand as you absolutely haven't a real clue of a day in the life in the skin.  Easy to trivialize what I felt.  I've never lived my life thinking everything was about race that wasn't how I was raised it has only been in recent years that my eyes have been more opened to see that other people see my color first more often than not and place me in a box. I've learned this from places like this as  much as anywhere else.  One only needs to read words like the blacks and those people their community so many times to get it it.  Of course I know this doesn't relate to all, but I heard enough to get the message.
> 
> BTW that last little bit "All lives matters" you having to say that to me speaks volumes.  That was quite insulting. What is it some people don't get or are so bothered by the fact that when people say black lives matter this just means black lives matter too just like everyone else not only, but also.



Sorry, thought this was a discussion thread.  Didn't realize it was just a soapbox for your posts.


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## Shalimar (Jun 26, 2016)

Really? Disagreement equals soapbox? What happened to civilised debate?


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## AprilT (Jun 26, 2016)

Shalimar said:


> Really? Disagreement equals soapbox? What happened to civilised debate?



I'm never surprised by that ones tone, to be expected.  I have had it on ignore, but saw you posted so unfortunately there it was.  That person love disharmony, pay it no mind and maybe it will go away.


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## Shalimar (Jun 26, 2016)

April, I shall follow suit. I am too distressed over the recent happenings around my vets to deal with too much negativity. Time to concentrate on the love and warmth in my life. Empaths need it for balance.


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## mitchezz (Jun 26, 2016)

Guitarist said:


> Sorry, thought this was a discussion thread.  Didn't realize it was just a soapbox for your posts.



Miaow!


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## senile1 (Jun 26, 2016)

AprilT said:


> And there you have it the dismisiness; we all know the dozens of of possibilities of altinate situations where other people go through harassment, I myself have posted such videos and information,  I also made it clear this isn't about the police.  No surprise that what I feel would be reduced to anecdotal situations, like I said some wouldn't understand as you absolutely haven't a real clue of a day in the life in the skin.  Easy to trivialize what I felt.  I've never lived my life thinking everything was about race that wasn't how I was raised it has only been in recent years that my eyes have been more opened to see that other people see my color first more often than not and place me in a box. I've learned this from places like this as  much as anywhere else.  One only needs to read words like the blacks and those people their community so many times to get it it.  Of course I know this doesn't relate to all, but I heard enough to get the message.
> 
> 
> 
> ...






One may call it "dismissiveness", one may claim to have been  "insulted", playing always the victim, choosing to remain the victim. All life, lifestyle/ religions matter, until we see our selves as one, the issues will remain. Whilst there have been great strides in racial/social acceptance, we still have far to go, but no matter the progress, one choosing to be a "victim" will always remain the "victim. " Many of my brothers will say the "victim" mentality is a defeatist mentality and will never further the cause for neither themselves or their "cause." We can banter this back and forth, but the facts will not change. There appears the need for you to be insulted to further YOUR  personal cause. I will continue to read your post in the event you happen to say something. Peace my friend.


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## AprilT (Jun 26, 2016)

senile1 said:


> One may call it "dismissiveness", one may claim to have been  "insulted", playing always the victim, choosing to remain the victim. All life, lifestyle/ religions matter, until we see our selves as one, the issues will remain. Whilst there have been great strides in racial/social acceptance, we still have far to go, but no matter the progress, one choosing to be a "victim" will always remain the "victim. " Many of my brothers will say the "victim" mentality is a defeatist mentality and will never further the cause for neither themselves or their "cause." We can banter this back and forth, but the facts will not change. There appears the need for you to be insulted to further YOUR  personal cause. I will continue to read your post in the event you happen to say something. Peace my friend.



Alright, see it as you choose to with eyes and mind closed it tells me you listen more as the victim for you can't see beyond feeling insulted yourself.  That's OK, you have plenty of company.  A victim I've never lived my life in such a way nor have those I choose to associate with, but it doesn't stop people from trying to geuse words such as yours to label those of us who speak out against certain acts as being such.  Just one more method to try to silence the voices of truth that some refuse to acknowledge.  Please don't feel obligated to read my post I do think you've made your mind up about the matter long ago.  I didn't post this thread to change minds I posted to get some feelings I was struggling with off my chest, but, it appears I'm being told my feeling s are invalid, that I take issue with.  How is it having feelings playing victim is beyond me.  I've never let any pains stop me from having sucesses in life and I've encountered pains of such that would have put many down long before they reached their teens, so yes labeling me victim jus one more insult.  Sweetness, but doesn't mean I'm hurting from it.


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## Shalimar (Jun 26, 2016)

We all have our causes. But imho, it is dangerous to inflict our white experience on people of colour, and try to say it is the same. Colour, like gender, changes the power dynamic all too often. Also, as a therapist the whole victim thing frosts my shorts. It can so easily be used to dismiss and demean those whose 

opinion clashes with our own. We are affected by prejudice/abuse, etc, whatever negative crap that rains down on our heads. To acknowledge this is not playing the victim, but standing tall, having our voice, my experience is different than April's, but it 

in no way invalidates hers. It would be arrogant of me to state differently. There is no competition here. We are all on the same level, I have no right to dispense wisdom from some mythical mountaintop. Life is a learning curve after all. Conversion to doubt can lead to amazing growth.


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## senile1 (Jun 26, 2016)

AprilT said:


> Alright, see it as you choose to with eyes and mind closed it tells me you listen more as the victim for you can't see beyond feeling insulted yourself.  That's OK, you have plenty of company.  A victim I've never lived my life in such a way nor have those I choose to associate with, but it doesn't stop people from trying to geuse words such as yours to label those of us who speak out against certain acts as being such.  Just one more method to try to silence the voices of truth that some refuse to acknowledge.  Please don't feel obligated to read my post I do think you've made your mind up about the matter long ago.  I didn't post this thread to change minds I posted to get some feelings I was struggling with off my chest, but, it appears I'm being told my feeling s are invalid, that I take issue with.  How is it having feelings playing victim is beyond me.  I've never let any pains stop me from having sucesses in life and I've encountered pains of such that would have put many down long before they reached their teens, so yes labeling me victim jus one more insult.  Sweetness, but doesn't mean I'm hurting from it.





I am neither hurt, insulted, nor have I "tried  to silence your voice", this is in your imagination . I never feel I have to read anyone's post, I do so in the interest of intelligent conversation; when there is a point to be conveyed. Peace


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## AprilT (Jun 26, 2016)

senile1 said:


> I am neither hurt, insulted, nor have I "tried  to silence your voice", this is in your imagination . I never feel I have to read anyone's post, I do so in the interest of intelligent conversation; when there is a point to be conveyed. Peace


 

No problem continue as you see fit to do.


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## Butterfly (Jun 26, 2016)

Hugs to you, April T.


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## Shalimar (Jun 26, 2016)

We love you April.


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## oldman (Jun 28, 2016)

AprilT----My son adopted two bi-racial girls about 5 or 6 years ago. They had already adopted their little sister right out of the hospital and she is white. The mother of all three girls has about a dozen different (races) kids, Three or four of them are white and the remainder are different races. The mother is obviously a person that likes to run around and also is a person of ill repute. 

Before my son adopted the two older daughters, they were living in West Virginia and the husband and wife that were keeping the two girls as foster kids told the agency that they no longer wanted to do fostering. A year ago this past fall, the oldest daughter enrolled in college (Penn State) and is studying to work with children coming from the same situation as she did. The next girl down in age is now a senior in high school and wants to try to go to Johns Hopkins University, which costs about $60,000.00 per year, to also learn Child Psychology. 

The two bi racial girls blended right in with our family and it was like they were a member of our family right from the beginning. The two girls were never shy or reserved. Both have had while boyfriends and they lean heavily towards wanting to be considered as white. My question is, "How do they see themselves, white or black, or color to them is unimportant, or does not exist?" I don't know why, but this question really bugs me at times. The best part is that they called me Grandpa from day one.


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## QuickSilver (Jun 28, 2016)

Humans are visual creatures.. and keenly aware of differences in appearances.  Intellectually we can accept that this is superficial and unimportant..   Viscerally, I'm not so sure..   If it was that easy and uncomplicated there wouldn't be all this angst over it.


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## AprilT (Jun 28, 2016)

QuickSilver said:


> Humans are visual creatures.. and keenly aware of differences in appearances.  Intellectually we can accept that this is superficial and unimportant..   Viscerally, I'm not so sure..   If it was that easy and uncomplicated there wouldn't be all this angst over it.



? Is this even a question? There's are of course  visual differences, QS, it would be naive of anyone to not expect people to take note just as there are differences in body size, hair color certain cultural differences, I sure take not when I go out dancing there are major differences.  .  I'm just trying to understand your point with bringing that up.  I would think you of all people understand there are other issues at hand that I was speaking on.  

The color of someones skin may be different, but, it never in my life was what influenced how I interacted with or approached anyone in my childhood or as an adult, their color just didn't register to me.  That may seem strange to some, but, it just wasn't what was the first thing I noticed about anyone.  Maybe because I was always around people of various skin colors from day one, so it just never seemed like anything to focus on.  It is only in the past few years that I now have moments of apprehension in some situations because of all I've heard and encountered these days that I even give anything a thought as to how I'm being perceived in any given situation, but, this doesn't happen often, but, sad to say it happens at all.  Not something I think on that affects me on a daily basis, just something I'm more aware of since outside forces bring it to me. 

 Don't get me wrong, I'm not stupid enough to think over the years I wasn't being focused on, I had many bad experiences throughout the years, but, I paid them little mind and just brushed them all off, even having been called the N word when walking out of a club, being grabbed by a Walmart security guard when the person they wanted was my housemate, the white guy, who actual had done nothing wrong, and came back inside to see what was holding me up and was ready to rip them a new one but I said let it go, no big deal, I may have been a little more affected when having my child crying in tears when told she and one of her best friends should play together because they were of different races.  I have dozens of stories like these, but, never let those get to me, they were in the past, as I've said, it was only recent years of more harassment and reading the words of so many on the net that just turns my stomach, but, no, I won't let it affect how I interact, judge the majority of people or live my life going forward, I know those are just the ignorant with their own issues, insecurities and misunderstandings.

 I am human and entitled to feel sad ever so often, I may not let it burden me and I will do what I can to affect change for the better for all of the people regardless of the cause where I can, but, I'll be damn if I stew in silence and do nothing even if the means just letting some steam off now and then.  No one wants to have to encounter an angry black woman, so good to let her get stuff off her chest.    Yes, I know it's a stereotype, but ya know some of you were thinking it.  LOL!  Even if no one was, it was funny to me in the moment when I thought of it just letting you know, I have a sense of humor, I laugh at myself all the time, don't get mad, it's good for your health.


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## QuickSilver (Jun 28, 2016)

I'm sorry if for some reason my post offended you.. It was not my intention.  It seems to me that no matter what people are posting, you are taking offense to it..    I'm not responding to this thread again, as I don't want to upset you further.

NO none of us understand what it feels like to be Black..  we get it. At least I do..  But you brought up this topic and it seems like everyone is offending you..  Just what exactly do you want people to say?


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## AprilT (Jun 28, 2016)

oldman said:


> AprilT----My son adopted two bi-racial girls about 5 or 6 years ago. They had already adopted their little sister right out of the hospital and she is white. The mother of all three girls has about a dozen different (races) kids, Three or four of them are white and the remainder are different races. The mother is obviously a person that likes to run around and also is a person of ill repute.
> 
> Before my son adopted the two older daughters, they were living in West Virginia and the husband and wife that were keeping the two girls as foster kids told the agency that they no longer wanted to do fostering. A year ago this past fall, the oldest daughter enrolled in college (Penn State) and is studying to work with children coming from the same situation as she did. The next girl down in age is now a senior in high school and wants to try to go to Johns Hopkins University, which costs about $60,000.00 per year, to also learn Child Psychology.
> 
> The two bi racial girls blended right in with our family and it was like they were a member of our family right from the beginning. The two girls were never shy or reserved. Both have had while boyfriends and they lean heavily towards wanting to be considered as white. My question is, "How do they see themselves, white or black, or color to them is unimportant, or does not exist?" I don't know why, but this question really bugs me at times. The best part is that they called me Grandpa from day one.



I can't answer for the children in your family, my sister's daughter self identifies as black, my childhood friend who was blond, looked as much white to many identified as black, some identify as white, bi-racial, black, white, it's entirely up to the individual.  Not easy for some easier for others to decide.  It doesn't have to be as difficult as people make it, but, the adults are the ones who put upon the children by not instilling in a strong sense of self no matter what.  Some 

I could roll out a list of famous people who do or don't identify with one or the other or both their birth parent's culture groups and are living full happy lives, some who identify.  I'm sure many of the celebs you don't know are bi-racial who don't make a big deal of it, you would be quite surprised to know so.

There are many books one can read or offer to children to help them learn about themselves on the matter if one chooses to go that route.  If a child is really having issues and children can have issues regardless of what the cause, no reason to not seek some source to help them cope better.  But letting them express themselves and not dismissing them and just saying they'll get over this or that is important.

Listen, I'm black, but, for a variety of reasons, I had to contend with being called white girl my whole life and I am not bi-racial in the least.  Not funny even more horrified when one of my childhood besties repeatedly would tell me she was blacker than I'd ever be, she being Italian-black, that's the blond I mentioned earlier.  I still loved her to death, we stayed friends well into adulthood.  One of the friends I miss to this day.  I'm a bit of a nerd, a cute sexy one so I don't fit anywhere, so I have my own angst.


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## AprilT (Jun 28, 2016)

QuickSilver said:


> I'm sorry if for some reason my post offended you.. It was not my intention.  It seems to me that no matter what people are posting, you are taking offense to it..    I'm not responding to this thread again, as I don't want to upset you further.
> 
> NO none of us understand what it feels like to be Black..  we get it. At least I do..  But you brought up this topic and it seems like everyone is offending you..  Just what exactly do you want people to say?



QS, no, not offended, I was just trying to understand your point.  I wasn't quite sure what you meant by your statement and was just asking, the rest of my posting wasn't directed at your, that was just dribble.  I'm sorry if I'm starting to miscommunicate my own feelings.  Sigh!  I really wasn't offended by what you said, just didn't understand.


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## AprilT (Jun 28, 2016)

To all of you I have insulted, not let you state your position without my own feelings being put upon, I apologize.  This subject is just too sensitive to me and obviously I may not be seeing some people's views with a totally open heart.  Please don't let my over sensitivity to the matter hinder you from participating, even if I may take pause.  Though, I myself am good if the thread is done with.nthego:


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## QuickSilver (Jun 28, 2016)

AprilT said:


> QS, no, not offended, I was just trying to understand your point.  I wasn't quite sure what you meant by your statement and was just asking, the rest of my posting wasn't directed at your, that was just dribble.  I'm sorry if I'm starting to miscommunicate my own feelings.  Sigh!  I really wasn't offended by what you said, just didn't understand.



Thank you April..  I was just pointing out the obvious I guess in my post.  Probably for lack of anything else to say.


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## AprilT (Jun 28, 2016)

For you oldman

https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_...l+children+books&sprefix=birac,stripbooks,193











*Gotta love Walmart*


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