# The Paleo Diet - Cravin' in the Cave



## SifuPhil

I'm not much of a diet person - more of an intuitive eater. I eat what my body craves. But my student loves to investigate new diets and he recently latched onto the Paleo Diet, also known as the Caveman Diet.

According to advocates, the *Paleolithic Diet* a.k.a. *Neanderthin * is the diet that we humans    are genetically adapted to eat. The paleolithic age is the same as the Stone    Age - so this is a stone age diet or life style. This has been humanity's preferred   diet for something like 2.5 million    years, and humans have only genetically changed 0.005% since the introduction    of agriculture (the Neolithic). As a rule, agricultural (and technological)    products are not healthy to eat, and we should predominantly try to eat only those whole foods that    are healthy in their raw state (though almost all humans, including hunter-gatherers cook their food). 

Here's a quick summary of the good and bad foods on the list - 

*Do eat:*


Meat (and fat, fish, eggs)
Vegetables (and berries)
Fruit (and nuts)
Dairy (milk, cheese, butter, etc) *

*Do not eat:*



Dairy (milk, cheese, butter, etc) *
Grains or corn (maize, wheat, barley, rice, etc.)
Starchy vegetables (potatoes, yams, Jerusalem artichokes, etc.)
Sugar (refined)
Legumes (beans, soy products, peanuts, cashew, lentils, etc.)
Chemical food additives

*Go easy on:*


Salt (can cause overeating and hypertension and dull the senses)
Processing of foods (nut flours/butters, pork rind flour, etc.) Eat simple      foods instead
Artificial sweeteners (don't dull your senses, and they cause insulin responses simply by being sweet on the taste buds)


The dairy products are listed in both the Good and Bad sections mainly for people with lactose intolerance. There is also a question of their health effects in general.

Some advocates of the Paleo Diet also allow "free days", in which you can eat whatever you want. I've found one, two, even three free-day diets in the literature but still see it as "cheating", although it's understandable at least in the beginning.

Would you ever consider a diet like this, or are you currently on it?


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## Knightofalbion

These fad diets are really just sleight of hand. The people behind them end up getting filthy rich. 
Doesn't matter who you are or what you are, cut out junk food, sugar and added salt and you WILL lose weight.

As for the Paleo diet. High protein diets place undue stress on the kidneys which can lead to long term damage. And high fat diets can lead to diabetes, amongst other things.

And as for being 'natural'. They all hawk expensive shakes and supplements to go with their 'wonder diets'. Not very 'caveman'...

The historical side of it is decidedly open to question too.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/94656/The-Comparative-Anatomy-of-Eating


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## SifuPhil

Great link, good Sir Knight - thanks!

Just think - on hundreds of forums, blogs and websites at this very moment guilty Paleo dieters are asking if they can please have a glass of milk or a candy bar. layful:

What I don't understand is, if the diet offers consumption of all sorts of meat why would you need to supplement with a protein shake / powder concoction? Is it just the obsessed bodybuilders that I see asking this question (granted, there ARE a lot of them)?


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## rkunsaw

Most people don't have the self control to lose weight (or keep from gaining it in the first place). That's why they keep trying diet after diet looking for some magical solution.

Any diet will help you lose a few or maybe many pounds at first because you are thinking about it and trying harder. None of them help in the long term.

Losing weight and maintaining the weight is really easy and no special diet is needed. What is needed is willpower and there is the catch. Lack of willpower is the reason people are trying diets in the first place.

You can eat all the foods you like, meats,fats, grains,dairy, fruits, vegetables. Just eat as large a variety as possible (not too much of any one type). And eat amounts according to your needs. If you need to lose weight, eat less.

Throw in some daily exercise and you're on your way to a healthy body.

The above is my not so humble opinion and it works for me.


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## SifuPhil

Saw, I agree 100% but you just KNOW there are tons of people (literally as well as figuratively) who cry that their thyroid is out of whack or that it's genetic or that they eat to suppress their bad memories of the time they were attacked by a Ronald McDonald clown or ...

Excuses are easy. Just doing it is hard. That must be why Nike used "Just Do It" as their ad phrase back in the '80's. 

Everyone wants a magic pill - it's SO much easier than taking personal responsibility.


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## Happyflowerlady

After my heart procedure, and the possibility that I will now have a "second chance" at a stronger heart ; I decided that I needed to find the best things to eat, not only to help my body to heal; but also to try and lose some of the weight that has piled up from not being able to exercise much any more.
The first thing I started looking at was anti-inflammatory foods, to help with the swelling around my heart, and speed up the healing process.
 I made a decision to eliminate as many as possible of the inflammatory foods, as well. 
This process has me eating a lot of the green vegetables, and fresh, raw fruit (especially cherries and pineapple) that are anti-inflammatory. 
I also add some turmeric to my food, and have been taking supplements of vitamin C, and MSM, as well as spraying on the DMSO to help with healing.

Then, I was talking to a close friend in Idaho, and she told me that she and her husband were on the Paleo diet, not to lose weight; but to help with their health. 
I had heard of it before, but just thought it was similar to Atkins, and never really researched Paleo, per se.
So, now I did. 
I read about it online, and watched several informative videos on youtube. Everything that I saw looked not only helpful with my goals, but do-able by me. 
I have been on Paleo food for almost two weeks now, feel wonderful, and have lost about 12 lbs besides. And this is before my doctor has even given permission for me to do more exercise than just walk around the house ! 

Paleo is NOT  just a high-protein diet. The optimal percentage is 2/3 vegetables and greens, 1/3 meat and fruit, more fruit if you are not trying to lose weight.
 All the meats are allowed, except processed. Eggs are fine. Nuts are fine (not peanuts).
Vegetables, except for starchy ones are fine.  Potatoes have toxins, so they are out completely, but sweet potatoes and squash in moderation are ok.
NO dairy !  NO grain products. NO legumes. 
Since dairy and grain are highly inflammatory, I had pretty much stopped those anyway. Now, I stopped legumes, as well.
I have a little dab of cream in my morning cup of coffee, and a little cheese on my taco salads. (Life has to have some pleasures)

I don't have arthritis pain to speak of anymore. I can bend my knees to get in and out of my car for the first time in years ! 
Since there are "cheat meals" allowed, I know that if something is really important for me to eat off-diet foods; I can do so, and not feel bad about it. 
I am looking forward to the heart doing well enough that the doctor says I can use the Gazelle, and then want to start exercising and getting more muscle on my body again. I have always been an active person, and used to walk several miles each day, until the heart stopped all of that. 

Now, I am hoping that at least some of that will become possible to me again. I would totally recommend this diet plan to anyone with arthritis, diabetes, or just wanting to lose weight or become healthier.


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## Falcon

I still say, eat half of what you normally do AND take twice as long eating it.  Give it time to catch up.

It's like a guy TRYING to get drunk...he keeps swilling drink after drink until he winds up on the bar floor

between two bar stools counting  the tiles on the floor.

Take your time eating.  Nobody's gonna steal it away from you.


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## Shamhat

Diets...My take.  I was on weight watchers for about a year.  I lost 81lbs and was proud as could be.  At first, it was a pain counting points and stuff, but after about 2 weeks, I began craving the healthier foods and in lesser amounts.  Then all He-- broke loose.  I was prescribed Seroquil for my depression.  About an hour after taking it, my appetite was out of control and my rational mind stopped working.  That was about 8 months ago.  I've finally gotten the munchies under control, but I gained back 40 of those pounds.  I didn't just crave food, I craved sugar.  Is anyone else on medication that increases the appetite?


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## Happyflowerlady

Thank you , Falcon ! 
If this was just a thing of losing weight, then limiting food would probably do the job. However, that is just a secondary benefit in what I want to achieve here. 

My primary goal is to heal my heart the best that I can, so I want to eliminate "garbage" foods from my diet, and eat things that will expedite healing in my heart.
 If God is willing to give me a second chance, then I sure don't want to spoil it ! ! 

The second thing I want is to be able to be more active again, and that means not being crippled up with arthritis, and having to use a walker to get around on "bad days".   I want to be able to get out and do things in my garden again, maybe even get a bicycle ! 
My thought is that if I can accomplish those goals, I should also keep losing weight as I become more and more healthy.    
 So far, eating this way is helping me to get closer to all of my goals and dreams for the future. (And I am actually eating less, since veggies do a good job of filling you up, without adding a lot of calories .)


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## Ina

Yes Shamhat, six years ago after surgery for diverticulitis, they said my thyroid was trashed, so they put me own meds for it. I went from 130 to 230 in just months. Then they decided I was pre-diabetic, and I decided no way, so I went on a less than 800 calorie a day diet. I had to stop after losing over 80 pounds in less than six months. The rest came off slowly, and now there is no sign of diabetes. :woohoo:


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## SifuPhil

Falcon said:


> Take your time eating.  Nobody's gonna steal it away from you.



Evidently you don't live with a cat and dog ...


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## SeaBreeze

More on Paleo...http://www.healthyfellow.com/294/paleo-diet/


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## d0ug

Diets are interesting that most fail over time because they miss one important thing.
What causes us to eat is the body needs nourishment and when the nourishment is not met it will increase the need for more food. Veterinarians know that very well good animal food contains many minerals and when the farmer want to fatten the animals he stops the good food and increases the high calorie foods and because the animals are not getting the minerals it causes them to eat more. If the animals are craving things that are not food a farmer will put out a salt block[mineral block]

An interesting thing happens when a women get pregnant they start craving things the reason the baby is robbing the minerals out of the mother causing the cravings. 
There are different supplements on the market that have 60 minerals in them and the one I used I found myself losing weight very fast without a diet just a loss of appetite. I have heard others making the same claim. 

The thread Knight put in was interesting and incite full but did not take into effect the animals that eat things to grow their own food. Leaf cutter ants cut leaves but eat fungus grown from the leave. Animals with four stomachs [cow] eat grass but through the digestion system in the forth stomach it is all microscopic animals which the cow lives off are they vegetarian ???


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## Bettyann

I want to put out not a 'scary' but a hopefully kindly taken warning to people about certain diets. I nearly ended up in the hospital, and became sicker than I have ever been before  .... all because I went on a "Grain Free" diet. This is not far removed from the Paleo diet.

The so called "GOOD" part of this diet was: yes, it DID get rid of my IBS...for the first time in 15 years! However, I gradually became sicker and weaker...This was toward the end of my 5th month going grain free...we are talking ALL grains...not 'just wheat.' Nothing to eat but meat, fruit and veggies...and oh yes, occasional dark chocolate and wheat free ice cream!

I am NOT one to run to the dr... ever...but I actually made an appt.
My full blood panel showed I was "Dangerously low" on Sodium and Chloride. I also had lost a LOT of weight...this happens on this diet.
Well, the doc and I couldn't really come to terms with anything 'alternative'... he thought it HAD to be due to 'something else more physiological'...oh well. He told me to drink less fluids. I politely didn't roll my eyes.

My daughter fixed up a concoction called sole' pro: so LAY ... made of pink Himalayan salt... within ONE WK's time by salt and chloride levels were up to normal...just by taking one teasp. of that per day... I slowly regained my strength and am feeling so much better... when you get older, it takes a wee bit longer!  
I had NO IDEA that I was receiving my badly needed sodium and chloride from all the grains (and foods made of grains)... and so now, even though I shy away from wheat...I include a modest amt of grains.

This business of 'no salt' is being reviewed in a new light...for awhile it was trendy to have no added salt...and now its being found out that a 'regular amt...sensible in other words) does NOT give you high BP or edema...Moderation is ALL THINGS truly is a sensible idea.


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## SeaBreeze

Good post Bettyann, thanks for sharing!


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## Bettyann

Thanks, SeaBreeze.... a person need to be sensible and use caution when attempting ANY new 'diet.' For the first couple of months I felt GREAT on the No Grain diet... but little did I know that things would change.


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## d0ug

sodium and chloride is salt and you could have done well on a grainless diet but not on a salt less diet. Salt is needed by your body.


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## Vivjen

With you all the way, Bettyann....


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## Denise1952

Hey Phil

This is the basic foods that allowed me to shed 10 lbs.  I'm also maintaining on the same foods, since I've not been able to hike since I had the surgery July 7th.  But, I did cut back on the protein/meats/beans, just because I wasn't that hungry.  When I am exercising 40 min to an hour a day, I ate like a horse, and still lost 10 lbs.

I knew about the Paleo from a roomie back in Roseburg.  I just decided to cut out the white flour foods like pasta, white taters (still eat the sweets, hate yams though, lol) and white, jasmine rice.  With that said, I still have those things, but only once or so a week.  I also still have at least toast (5 seed), or a bagel/english muffin a day.  I do eat most of my vegies raw with ranch dressing, and lots of fruits.  Yesterday I had a snack of chunked watermelon, peaches, and pink-lady apples.  

What I love is not counting calories, I eat when I'm hungry but for me, it's been "what" I eat, not how much.  I do owe Paleo some credit, that is what got me started on eating mostly these foods:

Proteins (pork, chicken, lots of fish (mostly salmon) and I do eat red-meat about once a week)
Beans, lentils
Sweet Potatos
Vegies (I like them raw)
Fruits 
Eggs, bacon, breads/grains
sunflower & pumpkin seeds, raw unsalted
No low fat, or non fat anything (forget about it)
Olive Oil & real butter

Lots of water, well, about 6 a day or more.  Again, if I want anything else I have it, I just don't pig out on the goodies.  Since I've been here, I've stayed at 131, ate choc. chip cookies, pies (blueberry cream and apple), bbq tater chips, deep fried shrimp on an evening out  I think it is most moderation, but I did see a huge change, and quick loss of the 10 lbs when I upped my water, and stopped the pasta I was eating like 5 times a week, or more.

Denise


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## Denise1952

Hi Falcon, 

I've never been a really, fast eater, but I have eaten in a hurry for one reason or another at times.  What I notice is, I get hungry a lot faster, sooner, when I do that.  I eat slow, most of the time, and if the food is good, real food, it stays with me longer denise


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## Denise1952

d0ug said:


> sodium and chloride is salt and you could have done well on a grainless diet but not on a salt less diet. Salt is needed by your body.



True, what is neat is to see how much salt is in healthy foods, like spinach for instance It gets interesting when you start researching for yourself  I think every body has the same basic needs for all our organs to function properly.  But after years of abuse eating a lot of the wrong food & drink, there is where it really gets rough.  Also, there are always those that have certain conditions that are not able to eat like others.  Always exceptions, but like some of my family/friends love saying "once you pass such and such age" you can't ever slim down or get your shape back.  That hasn't been true for me, and a few other gals I know.


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## Falcon

nwlady said:


> Hi Falcon,
> 
> I've never been a really, fast eater, but I have eaten in a hurry for one reason or another at times.  What I notice is, I get hungry a lot faster, sooner, when I do that.  I eat slow, most of the time, and if the food is good, real food, it stays with me longer denise


Denise,  That's exactly what I said in my post (above).


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## Denise1952

Falcon, I was agreeing with you


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## Meanderer

nwlady said:


> Hi Falcon,
> 
> I've never been a really, fast eater, but I have eaten in a hurry for one reason or another at times.  What I notice is, I get hungry a lot faster, sooner, when I do that.  I eat slow, most of the time, and if the food is good, real food, it stays with me longer denise


Denise, didn't they used to say "chew each bite 32 times"?


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## Denise1952

Yes, "they" say that chewing is a really good thing because if you don't, it is really hard when it comes to getting rid of it, LOL!!


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## SeaBreeze




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## Petula

Interesting, am trying a similar diet, but did not know about the paleo diet, thanks for posting, I think it is hard to go wrong, if you eat real food.


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## Denise1952

I agree Petula, 

I really don't restrict anything, more the moderation thing, but I don't even do that "on purpose".  Best way I've found to avoid things like too much candy, chips, things like that, is to not buy them.


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## Happyflowerlady

Not buying treats is definitely the best way to not be wanting to eat them. If they are right there in the house, it is a lot harder to just say no than if they are down the road at the grocery store. 
I was working on eating the anti-inflammatory foods, and staying away from the ones that cause inflammation and pain, even before I heard about the Paleo eating plan. This simply makes it easier for me to do. I still use salt, but it is sea salt; and I get a lot of the vitamins and minerals that I need from the vegetables and greens that I eat. 
My friend (that told me about Paleo) does not like vegetables; so she uses paleo recipes to make things like pancakes and muffins, because that is what she enjoys eating. Since she is only eating meats, fruits and nuts mostly; I think she is missing out on the important part that the greens and veggies provide. She has a lot of trouble staying on the plan, because she is always wanting to eat sweets. 
My take on it is that it is important to have a well-rounded diet, and one that is made up of healthy, nourishing foods.


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## Denise1952

I agree HFL,

Funny, but vegies weren't easy for me either until I started eating them raw, or in stir-fries mostly.  I eat a lot of avocado, carrots, broccoli, celery, and fruits.  Fruit was my least fave thing, now I eat some every day.  My sis and I take a cantaloupe or watermelon and we cut it into chunks right away because we will eat it up way better.  I don't know about the anti-inflammatory types but will look that up.  Sis has osteo-arthritis, and I am getting a bit of arthritis, just in a couple spots.  I do the gelatin every day as you know too.

I still can't stop thinking how you suffered for 10 years with that shortness of breath etc  I hope mine improves eventually.  I did a post on my situation.  Geez, seems like an "organ" recital around here doesn't itlayful:


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## Happyflowerlady

Here is a link to a short list of the best anti-inflammatory foods, and if you include more of these in your diet, plus stop eating the inflammatory foods (dairy, legumes, potatoes, sugar, grains); you should notice a difference in how you  feel right away. 
The first time I tried pineapple, I could barely stagger around, I was in so much pain from the arthritis. By the second day of my "pineapple fast", I was walking good again, and could even skip around !  
After that, when I started hurting (usually after eating what I now know are inflammatory foods) , I would buy some fresh, ripe pineapple, and just eat that until the pain went away again. 

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/top-10-anti-inflammatory-foods.html


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## Denise1952

I thought I posted to this, but looks like I didn't.  Wanted to let you know I sent it to my sis because she could use it to maybe help her with her osteo arthritis.  I will use it as well with a teenie bit of arthritis I've got goin on  Thanks so much!  

I still use the gelatin, and think some of mine is gone because of that.  I had it bad in one knuckle but not at all now.  Other areas hurt rarely, but I'll keep on using the gelatin denise


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## Debby

SifuPhil said:


> Saw, I agree 100% but you just KNOW there are tons of people (literally as well as figuratively) who cry that their thyroid is out of whack or that it's genetic or that they eat to suppress their bad memories of the time they were attacked by a Ronald McDonald clown or ...
> 
> Excuses are easy. Just doing it is hard. That must be why Nike used "Just Do It" as their ad phrase back in the '80's.
> 
> Everyone wants a magic pill - it's SO much easier than taking personal responsibility.




Hate to say it, but I'm 'crying that my thyroid is out of whack'.  But due to watching what I eat my weight is pretty much the same as it was when I was 20.  And with studies suggesting that 8 out of 10 women having undiagnosed thyroid issues, it's not really a feeble excuse. 

 What's more, a problem that few seem to know about is the presence of obesogens in our diet and environments.  For example, the plastic (BPA) lining inside food cans has been shown to cause DNA changes in developing fetus's.  Those changes are causing children who were born a normal weight from normal size parents to begin putting on weight as they mature.  And in turn, they are eating foods lined with BPA and now they are further aiding in the DNA changes of their unborn babies.  And then there are the obesogens that result from the use of pesticides on our food.  It's a perfect storm that is taking down the western world via diet.

Sure, lots of people knowingly eat the wrong foods and too much in some cases, but those are only a couple of the many reasons why people are running into dietary problems.


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## Debby

Falcon said:


> I still say, eat half of what you normally do AND take twice as long eating it.  Give it time to catch up.
> 
> It's like a guy TRYING to get drunk...he keeps swilling drink after drink until he winds up on the bar floor
> 
> between two bar stools counting  the tiles on the floor.
> 
> Take your time eating.  Nobody's gonna steal it away from you.




So eat half as many cookies, half as many potatoes, half as much......I really think there's a little more to it than that.  The types of food are also important.


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## d0ug

The whole problem is so simple the soils have been mineral deficient for almost 100 years it was reported in 1934 and as minerals become deficient in the body things start to break and cravings start. The medical system says just cut down on what you eat and exercise. Well how is that working for you? Yes no one was over weight in the prison camps in Germany so it has to do with how much you eat. In an open market you always can find food and to control your cravings is another thing. Lack of minerals cause cravings. Exercise helps burn through the few minerals you have in your body which makes the problem even worse


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## Denise1952

Hi Doug,

I think it's interesting how my weight has been maintained, even when I stopped exercising because of my heart situation.  I lost the 10 lbs (from 142 down to 132) and that was directly after I met you on here and started the gelatin.  But also, my roomie was yacking about the paleo thing.  Well, I'm the type that takes what I think is significant, or useful, and leave the rest.  So I took the "common sense" (imo) and did the protein, vegies, fruits, oils/butter, nuts, seeds, dairy (eggs, small amt of milk since I don't like it all that much) and water being my main drink.

I never felt stronger in my life, and the heart issue was from long ago, who knows what caused that. But a pacemaker was put in and so I was sort of bionic, but I had no restrictions so I pushed myself hard hiking, loved it, and again, never felt better or stronger.  Anyway, to sum it up, I don't count calories, I eat when I'm hungry, and I don't have major cravings anymore.  Once a week or so I may get into something like pie, cake, icecream, a bag of m&m's or potato chips, but when 99% of the time I eat good, that stuff has not effect on me.  I think it's about "what" I eat, and I think it's about "how much" crap I "don't" eat.

Everyone is different, so the above is just what works for me  Oh, by the way, no arthritis pain in my hand, ZERO, since the gelatin, and no other areas (where I had much less pain) are hurting anymore either


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## d0ug

Congratulation  NWLADY you are one of those people that are willing to try something different and find out if it works. Keep up the good work and have fun doing it.


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## Denise1952

d0ug said:


> Congratulation  NWLADY you are one of those people that are willing to try something different and find out if it works. Keep up the good work and have fun doing it.



It's funny, but it is fun for me  I noticed how my day isn't centered around "when do I eat", or "what shall I eat now".  My foods do taste good to me, or I wouldn't eat them, but it is more about "fuel" then being my main, source of happiness, know what I mean  In fact, some days I find it a big pain to take time out to eat  With the water in between meals, I don't get the hunger-pangs I used to.  That had a lot to do with the non-nutritional things I was eating.  I think I was actually having withdrawels in between meals, so I would grab an unhealthy snack just to "fix" that


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