# I am sort of in the social phobia range.  It's difficult to have friends due to past betrayal/trauma



## Mlz827 (Jun 30, 2018)

First, I am sort of in the social anxiety range.  It is difficult for me to enjoy friends due to past betrayal and trauma. So, I choose to live alone.  

I have acquaintances, and siblings who live hundreds of miles away,  I do have phone, text, messaging, Facebook, etc. contact with them. Also, there are a couple of local ladies I sew with, with others who have passed away or are in rest homes.  I have two children.  A daughter who lives 1,000+ miles away, yet she makes almost daily contact.  Thank heavens for today's various types of technology.  Then, I have a son and his family who live 10 minutes away from me.  Calls or visits from them are seldom.  I know that they love me.  Also, I know we are on good terms when together.  They have jobs, two children, and their own lives.  I understand that.  

What I don't understand is if I do not go to them, (which I feel welcome when I do) they do not come to me.  I was sick, recently, for three weeks.  Not one visit to help me, or just a visit for a lonely person who was shut in until I was well.  This has me having mixed feelings of being upset , frustrated and most of all confused.  

I will not nag, but did bring this up and was met with avoidance until I decided to apologize for bringing it up and possibly looking needy to them.  They told me no problem, no worries, and that was it!

Again, I am confused.


----------



## Olivia (Jun 30, 2018)

When you say "social phobia" do you mean for yourself? Sometimes we alienate people when we don't mean to. Do you really want friends, the give and take of it all, or is it more of a want than a real need because it does take a lot of giving and attention to others. I don't mean it in a bad way, but sometimes it's just the way we are. And we need to take ourselves out of ourselves more, as hard as it sometimes is, just because of our introversion.


----------



## KingsX (Jun 30, 2018)

.

Since most murder victims are killed by people they know,  
being anti-social doesn't seem so bad.


----------



## Olivia (Jun 30, 2018)

KingsX said:


> .
> 
> Since most murder victims are killed by people they know,
> being anti-social doesn't seem so bad.



Social Phobia and being anti-social are not the same thing. In fact, an anti-social person might be more apt to murder someone than be murdered. layful:


----------



## Lara (Jun 30, 2018)

Miz, I totally understand how you feel and rightly so. Being sick and shut-in for 3 weeks with no visits from your children who live 10 minutes away is just not acceptable. You needn't apologize for "bringing it up". In fact, good for you. You should have because they should know. And the fact that they avoided you until you apologized was just wrong. 

Yes, this younger generation is busier with all their technology to keep up with but what's more important? I agree with you. They need to know that TLC for family comes first. No need to apologize for that.

Meanwhile, invite them over for dinner or offer to take the grandchildren one day a week to bake cookies and do arts & crafts and nature walks...but I know you can't do that when you're sick. That's when it's their turn to step up to the plate.


----------



## Mlz827 (Jun 30, 2018)

What I mean is that after years of girlfriends (yes several girlfriends) having affairs with my husband, I just don't like to open up and trust much anymore.  Keeping people at a arm distance seems to be more comfortable for me.  Do I want friends?  Sure, but I do realize that friendship comes with a price.  So, I prefer to keep it casual now.  I do give of myself (alot) to those I know, and much time to helping with the grandchildren.  I guess the old saying "the road is paved on both sides," is what I am confused about.  My car always has to go to the kids house, their's does not come this way.  

PS  I think that I keep my mind busy enough, and my faith sure enough,  that I would never think about murder... ha ha.


----------



## Marie5656 (Jun 30, 2018)

.*I am a bit social phobic myself.  I tend to alienate myself because of that.  I think sometimes family who are miles apart tend to get so involved with their own lives they forget to make time for family.  Sad, but true.   I have the same issues with my family, even those who are close, we tend not get together as much as we would like.
I try to force myself into social situations in small groups. Like at Senior center or library.  I learned something from a former co-worker that helped. He suggested I find someone also alone, and go over and make small talk.  Their responses and body language will let you know if you are welcome to visit.  If not, do not give up.
*


----------



## grannyjo (Jun 30, 2018)

I don't know if I'm on the other foot,  but I am actively trying to discourage a relative from moving too close to me.

She seems to be oblivious that her uninvited visits are not welcome.  Another relative,  when advised she was in the area and would be visiting said  "Oh shit - how long does she want to stay".

At the moment, she lives 700 K away,  and that's fine by me.

Now she wants to move within 200 K,  so she can visit more often.  She just  "loves to go for a drive".

Last time she chose to visit me,  she arrived with a packet of breakfast cereal and proceeded to eat me out of house and home,  while she stayed as an uninvited guest for 4 nights.

She ran the air conditioner non stop 24 hours a day.  Would not get up from her backside to help to cook any meals,  nor did anything to help around the house.  She didn't want to leave the house at all - not to do anything.

She binge ate while I was out shopping, and I came home to find that she had eaten every biscuit in the house,  and all of the cheese.  Things I knew I didn't need to shop for - I had enough for at least a month.

She self invited herself to another relative's place at Christmas,  and ended up staying a month!

The thing is,  she thinks she is  "loved"  by everyone.  She doesn't realise that she is dreaded.


----------



## Keesha (Jun 30, 2018)

Olivia said:


> Social Phobia and being anti-social are not the same thing. In fact, an anti-social person might be more apt to murder someone than be murdered. layful:


 Totally agree and thank you. 



Mlz827 said:


> What I mean is that after years of girlfriends (yes several girlfriends) having affairs with my husband, I just don't like to open up and trust much anymore.  Keeping people at a arm distance seems to be more comfortable for me.  Do I want friends?  Sure, but I do realize that friendship comes with a price.  So, I prefer to keep it casual now.  I do give of myself (alot) to those I know, and much time to helping with the grandchildren.  I guess the old saying "the road is paved on both sides," is what I am confused about.  My car always has to go to the kids house, their's does not come this way.
> 
> PS  I think that I keep my mind busy enough, and my faith sure enough,  that I would never think about murder... ha ha.



I DO understand what you mean. I’ve also got social phobias and it’s really difficult dealing with it. 
My fears however don’t stem from infidelity but the result is the same. I literally force myself to go out and face the world when most of the time I don’t want to. Keeping friends at arm distance becomes a habit cause getting too close can bring about unpredictable issues. Basically it’s a trust issue. It’s easier not getting close than trying to explain the phobias and issues to someone else. Being alone seems safer.


----------



## bingo (Jun 30, 2018)

you should sell out and move close to your daughter....your level of happiness and worth will improve....as your health degrades. ..the sons not gonna be there for you...probably the wifey


----------



## Mlz827 (Jun 30, 2018)

Thank you for your wisdom.  





Marie5656 said:


> .*I am a bit social phobic myself.  I tend to alienate myself because of that.  I think sometimes family who are miles apart tend to get so involved with their own lives they forget to make time for family.  Sad, but true.   I have the same issues with my family, even those who are close, we tend not get together as much as we would like.
> I try to force myself into social situations in small groups. Like at Senior center or library.  I learned something from a former co-worker that helped. He suggested I find someone also alone, and go over and make small talk.  Their responses and body language will let you know if you are welcome to visit.  If not, do not give up.
> *


----------



## Mlz827 (Jun 30, 2018)

bingo said:


> you should sell out and move close to your daughter....your level of happiness and worth will improve....as your health degrades. ..the sons not gonna be there for you...probably the wifey


My daughter and I have discussed this idea.  Since she lives in the Silicon Valley, San Jose, CA moving is not possible.  Nor is Santa Rosa, CA where I was born affordable. So, I stay where I am at.


----------



## Mlz827 (Jun 30, 2018)

my mother used to say there is a silver lining in every cloud.  I guess my issue is easier to handle than yours.  I have a relative that sounds like yours, and it would be difficult for me to think of her "dropping in" for a visit. More, it would be very difficult to worry about how i would get her to leave without a awkward situation developing.



grannyjo said:


> i don't know if i'm on the other foot,  but i am actively trying to discourage a relative from moving too close to me.
> 
> She seems to be oblivious that her uninvited visits are not welcome.  Another relative,  when advised she was in the area and would be visiting said  "oh shit - how long does she want to stay".
> 
> ...


----------



## Shalimar (Jun 30, 2018)

grannyjo said:


> I don't know if I'm on the other foot,  but I am actively trying to discourage a relative from moving too close to me.
> 
> She seems to be oblivious that her uninvited visits are not welcome.  Another relative,  when advised she was in the area and would be visiting said  "Oh shit - how long does she want to stay".
> 
> ...



I think I would tell her you have  health issues which preclude visits.  Being driven stresscrazy by such a person is a legitimate health concern.


----------



## gumbud (Jun 30, 2018)

social phobias can often become chronic and debilitating leading to sadness and depression. I know it is easy to give advice on these forums but that's what we are able to do 

my suggestion - find a suitable and well qualified therapist and start therapy - you need to gain a happy life style as soon as possible!! 

NB: urgent attention required!

ps: we can't fix it here ; we can talk and listen and share but not really treat?


----------



## Shalimar (Jul 1, 2018)

Social anxiety in all its forms can be very difficult to treat. While some respond very well to treatment, others face chronic difficulties in dealing with severe trauma induced illness. Often, periods of normalcy are interspersed with setbacks of anxiety. Triggers are tricky things. Should the individual suffer from PTSD, or even worse, CPTSD, (complex post traumatic stress 

disorder,)  relapses are almost inevitable. Therapy is essential in my opinion in order for the individual to understand and learn to manage their illness, but a cure can prove elusive, it certainly has in my case. It is possible, however, with a great deal of hard work, and vigilance, to live a healthy and happy life most of the time.


----------



## C'est Moi (Jul 1, 2018)

You have probably heard the old rhyme, “A son is a son 'til he gets a wife, but a daughter is a daughter all her life.”       I find that our daughters seem more thoughtful than our sons, but I think that's a fairly common dynamic.  No biggie to me.   Our kids are all great people and are busy raising their young families.   

I have no social phobias but I have always been a loner.   I hate a lot of social interaction and usually prefer to skip "functions".


----------



## Shalimar (Jul 1, 2018)

C'est Moi said:


> You have probably heard the old rhyme, “A son is a son 'til he gets a wife, but a daughter is a daughter all her life.”       I find that our daughters seem more thoughtful than our sons, but I think that's a fairly common dynamic.  No biggie to me.   Our kids are all great people and are busy raising their young families.
> 
> I have no social phobias but I have always been a loner.   I hate a lot of social interaction and usually prefer to skip "functions".


Being a loner is normal. Not everyone yearns to be the life of the party.


----------



## gumbud (Jul 1, 2018)

shalimar - you just beat me to it! snap 





> _*​*_yes there are ranges and ranges - from chronic social  phobia which is painful to 'being a loner' by choice which can be 'fun' at times. There are some that just love socializing everyday and every week but for some this is not necessary and can be tiring.


----------



## Shalimar (Jul 1, 2018)

gumbud said:


> shalimar - you just beat me to it! snap


Lulz.


----------



## Olivia (Jul 1, 2018)

I'm kind of getting concerned that the term "Social Phobia" isn't getting mixed up with "Agoraphobia" which it seems now is being described which is a much more serious emotional disorder. If someone could explain the difference, it would make me feel that we are really talking about the same thing.


----------



## Shalimar (Jul 1, 2018)

Agoraphobia at its worst is an intense fear of leaving one’s home and venturing outside.  Some folks who live in an apt will not even set foot on the balcony. Panic attacks ensue when the person leaves their safe zone. It is almost always about places rather than people.


----------



## Meanderer (Jul 1, 2018)




----------



## Shalimar (Jul 1, 2018)

Meanderer said:


>


Loll.


----------



## Roadwarrior (Jul 1, 2018)

By no means am I an authority on mental health.  I just know what worked for me.  I live in the gloomy PacNW myself, suffer from SAD (yes I was diagnosed by a medical professional).  Finding natural sunlight was my salvation.  I was toxic come Feb-Mar before, found I could now accept the spring rains (Apr-May) with a brighter outlook. 

Went for the first time to SW AZ for the winter (2017-18).  Spent 5 months taking in at least 30 minutes of sunlight daily, attitude got better, health improved.  I'm not one to surround myself with many friends or need to be entertained, got out walked 1-2 miles daily, visited with other 'snowbirds' many, many from OR, WA, MT & ID.


----------



## Olivia (Jul 1, 2018)

I guess I had a strange kind of social phobia. I could for a time period not be able to drink liquid or eat a meal outside of home, usually in a restaurant.  I would feel that I would either drown on, for instance, coffee, or choke on food. This was in my twenties. I would take the food home where I could eat it in comfort. 

I also had panic attacks in stores. I would feel suddenly dizzy and feel I might faint. 

I don't know really how I got over those things, but I did. One thing that really helped me was to turning to think about something else as far as the panic attacks. That worked. Overall what saved me, was growing a spine. I don't what it is and how to express it, but getting to feel that you're just as important as anyone else and being able to realize you are somebody without having to get aggressive about it. You count just like everyone else does. I mean, just realizing it's okay to get mad. I really had a hard time with wanting everyone to like me. I got over that, too, when I realized it was not the end of the world and not dangerous to not be agreeable all the time.


----------



## gumbud (Jul 1, 2018)

yep sometimes it can be worked through as you've explained but other times help is needed and useful ; perhaps lifesaving ??


----------



## Keesha (Jul 1, 2018)

My social phobia was mainly from a major traumatic event that lasted for an extended period of time as well as a physically issue that I couldn’t do anything about. For months I did have agoraphobia but my dogs had to be walked so I had to deal with it. 


My doctor put me on Effexor which helped with my depression but made me gain lots of weight so I walked more and more. Like Road Warrior I don’t need to be entertained or surrounded by friends since I’m a natural loner but I was doing more hiding from the world than I’d like to admit.


Like Olivia, I would get panic attacks sometimes while shopping which made my fear of going out worse so my husband had to do all the shopping for a few years.
Then I started to learn the art of self love and finally understood that I was just as important as anyone else. I used to cringe and avoid angry people which turned into compulsive people pleasing.  Then I learned that I could be respectfully assertive without being aggressive and that it was perfectly ok to disagree with others. I didn’t have to subservient with others. 


This , of course , took a period of about 10 years or more but I do make myself go out and endure the discomfort I might feel. There are days when I slip back some but I do the best I can at the time and remind myself often how far I’ve come.  


Like Olivia, I had to be ok with the thought that not everyone has to like me and that  it’s perfectly ok if people don’t.


----------



## hearlady (Jul 2, 2018)

Mlz827 said:


> First, I am sort of in the social anxiety range.  It is difficult for me to enjoy friends due to past betrayal and trauma. So, I choose to live alone.
> 
> I have acquaintances, and siblings who live hundreds of miles away,  I do have phone, text, messaging, Facebook, etc. contact with them. Also, there are a couple of local ladies I sew with, with others who have passed away or are in rest homes.  I have two children.  A daughter who lives 1,000+ miles away, yet she makes almost daily contact.  Thank heavens for today's various types of technology.  Then, I have a son and his family who live 10 minutes away from me.  Calls or visits from them are seldom.  I know that they love me.  Also, I know we are on good terms when together.  They have jobs, two children, and their own lives.  I understand that.
> 
> ...


Mlz, It seems you're not that unhappy with your life and are comfortable with technology so you do keep up with family and friends in that way. 
You're lucky in a way that even though your daughter is far away she contacts you daily.
If you're confused as to why your son doesn't visit why don't you ask him again? Sounds like there's no animosity there and you have a relationship. Could be as simple as you having a cat and one of the children is allergic. Busy is not a reason when they live 10 minutes away. You should find out. Once you face asking him directly it will give you confidence in asking others direct questions like "would you like to have lunch with me once a week?".


----------



## Keesha (Jul 2, 2018)

hearlady said:


> Mlz, It seems you're not that unhappy with your life and are comfortable with technology so you do keep up with family and friends in that way.
> You're lucky in a way that even though your daughter is far away she contacts you daily.
> If you're confused as to why your son doesn't visit why don't you ask him again? Sounds like there's no animosity there and you have a relationship. Could be as simple as you having a cat and one of the children is allergic. Busy is not a reason when they live 10 minutes away. You should find out. Once you face asking him directly it will give you confidence in asking others direct questions like "would you like to have lunch with me once a week?".



I think this is definitely worthy of consideration. Often issues are from a lack of proper communication . Misunderstandings can cause a rift between people. Once that distance is there , our perception can too. 
Great advice hearlady.


----------



## Catlady (Jul 15, 2018)

Mlz827 said:


> What I mean is that after years of girlfriends (yes several girlfriends) having affairs with my husband, I just don't like to open up and trust much anymore.



As for your girlfriends having affairs with your husband, I can understand how you feel, but surely you know that blame belongs to both friend and husband.  Your husband is just as guilty as the friends.  Are you still married to him?  If still together, why forgive him but not your friends?  Not having any female friends does not stop him from having affairs with other women not your friend.  My serial cheating husband had an affair with a friend of mine, it took me a while to find out, but he also tried (and failed) with my sister and another friend.  I divorced him and it was one of the best decisions of my life.


----------



## Kitties (Jul 16, 2018)

Yes, Mlz, you have had some real, valid trauma in your past. You shouldn't feel guilty for the way your are feeling. Not all people are good for you, even relatives. I'm at the end of it with my brother in fact.

Hopefully you can trust some people. I'm not social either and feel I'm better on my own though right now I have a great burden of my stepfather.


----------



## MarciKS (Nov 22, 2020)

Mlz827 said:


> First, I am sort of in the social anxiety range.  It is difficult for me to enjoy friends due to past betrayal and trauma. So, I choose to live alone.
> 
> I have acquaintances, and siblings who live hundreds of miles away,  I do have phone, text, messaging, Facebook, etc. contact with them. Also, there are a couple of local ladies I sew with, with others who have passed away or are in rest homes.  I have two children.  A daughter who lives 1,000+ miles away, yet she makes almost daily contact.  Thank heavens for today's various types of technology.  Then, I have a son and his family who live 10 minutes away from me.  Calls or visits from them are seldom.  I know that they love me.  Also, I know we are on good terms when together.  They have jobs, two children, and their own lives.  I understand that.
> 
> ...


this lady has more of a social group than i do. but i understand having to be the one to reach out but when you're in need you don't exist. been there done that. i no longer bother with any of my so called "friends" and they don't seem too upset about it. been almost a year since i heard a peep out of anyone. so no biggie.


----------



## Aunt Bea (Nov 22, 2020)

IMO you can't expect to get more out of a relationship with family and friends than you are willing to put in.

I don't put much in for a variety of reasons and I don't expect much in return.

For me it's not right or wrong good or bad it's just the way it is and I'm ok with it.


----------



## Nathan (Nov 22, 2020)

Expectations of what a person thinks others(particularly family members) "should'' be doing or saying is a mental health slippery slope.    Divorce made my relations with daughter and son rocky for a few years.  I've moved away from "what should be" to "what IS..." and have no worries.  My daughter calls weekly and talks for an hour.  My son is extremely busy and calls when he can.   Of course, I'd love to see them both more often, I _take it as it comes_.


----------



## MarciKS (Nov 22, 2020)

Aunt Bea said:


> IMO you can't expect to get more out of a relationship with family and friends than you are willing to put in.
> 
> I don't put much in for a variety of reasons and I don't expect much in return.
> 
> For me it's not right or wrong good or bad it's just the way it is and I'm ok with it.


well when you're the only one making any effort it's kinda pointless.


----------



## MarciKS (Nov 22, 2020)

Nathan said:


> Expectations of what a person thinks others(particularly family members) "should'' be doing or saying is a mental health slippery slope.    Divorce made my relations with daughter and son rocky for a few years.  I've moved away from "what should be" to "what IS..." and have no worries.  My daughter calls weekly and talks for an hour.  My son is extremely busy and calls when he can.   Of course, I'd love to see them both more often, I _take it as it comes_.


yeah once you get to the pov that this is the way it is...nothing else really matters.


----------



## Sassycakes (Nov 22, 2020)

*Looking back at my past experiences I should have learned many years ago that people don't treat you the same way you treat them. My Dad's family turned against my parents when they got married because they thought my parents were too young to get married. My Mom always made my Dad stay connected to them and then when me , my brother and sister came along she made us visit them every week. They treated us horribly also.Now, none of that remaining family are close to one another. All my cousins have cut either a brother or sister out of their lives.*


* My own brother cut me and my sister out of his life and now his 3 kids are not close to one another.*
*My husband and I moved about 2 yrs ago to be closer to my daughter and her family. I have no idea who any of my neighbors are and honestly after my experience with some of my old neighbors,who I was very good to,started to ignore me I don't need any more drama in my life. I have never been as contented as I am now. *


----------



## MarciKS (Nov 22, 2020)

sometimes people are just impossible no matter what you do.


----------



## grahamg (Nov 26, 2020)

MarciKS said:


> this lady has more of a social group than i do. but i understand having to be the one to reach out but when you're in need you don't exist. been there done that. i no longer bother with any of my so called "friends" and they don't seem too upset about it. been almost a year since i heard a peep out of anyone. so no biggie.


Ah, so you have "so called friends" too!
I do agree, its very barren ground to try to work, and yet what can we do, if there ain't owt else?


----------



## MarciKS (Nov 27, 2020)

grahamg said:


> Ah, so you have "so called friends" too!
> I do agree, its very barren ground to try to work, and yet what can we do, if there ain't owt else?


suck it up and do without? *tilts head and grins*


----------



## Blessed (Nov 10, 2022)

Shalimar said:


> Agoraphobia at its worst is an intense fear of leaving one’s home and venturing outside.  Some folks who live in an apt will not even set foot on the balcony. Panic attacks ensue when the person leaves their safe zone. It is almost always about places rather than people.


I realize this is a very old post but just wanted to share my experienc. I have suffered from anxiety from childhood, way be for it was recognized in a child.  As I got older, in my teens, I began to have the panic attacks and the fear of large crowds, open places, anywhere really.  I did have the full teenage experiece to me.  Once I could drive I realized just to take my own car.  I could leave at anytime if I was uncomfortable.  I did not go places that I did not know how to get to, I did not want to be lost anywhere, I had to be able to get to a safe place,

I met my husband when I was fifteen.  I told him all about it.  He said don't worry, I will take care of you.  He always did, if I was uncomfortable we left.  If afraid or having a panic attack he go me thru it.

I finnally went into therapy for the condition.  I was worried by condition would have some effect on my little boy.  I did not want that.

I was mostly fine at work, shopping and family events. When things are common place or function, you do so much better.

I did learn to overcome it somewhat and have done a lot I never thought I could.  Of course the biggest push came when my husband got sick.  We had to travel for clinical trials,  I became a better flyer.  I learned to get around the town, medical facilities, the lay of the land.  There was not choice.

Now that my husband has passed I do find myself withdrawing.  It is harder now without his love and support.

If you have these kinds of issues and you want to do better, feel better, talk to your doctor about finding a good clinic or therapy group that specializes in agoraphobia, panic attacks and social phobias. I went thru one on one therapy, group therapy so I could meet others strubbling with the same issues.  I also did exposure therapy, my therapist actully went with me to work on those things.

There is no reason to suffer.  At the least you meet some nice people that could be friends with.


----------



## officerripley (Nov 11, 2022)

Blessed said:


> If you have these kinds of issues and you want to do better, feel better, talk to your doctor about finding a good clinic or therapy group that specializes in agoraphobia, panic attacks and social phobias. I went thru one on one therapy, group therapy so I could meet others strubbling with the same issues. I also did exposure therapy, my therapist actully went with me to work on those things.
> 
> There is no reason to suffer. At the least you meet some nice people that could be friends with.


Wonderful advice. I just wish I didn't live in a therapist "desert." (What I get for living in the middle of nowhere, sigh; then again, it wasn't my choice to move here.)


----------



## Paco Dennis (Nov 11, 2022)

I have been noticing some difficulty in communicating in our ever increasing complicated world. I hear mainly opinions, not facts,. I know how hard it is to ascertain the facts, and how easy it is to express our opinions. People usually don't change their opinions. I have withdrawn from talking and meeting with others because after the initial hello and reminiscing the conversation is less than interesting, so I leave the scene. It is a form of fear...in that if I express something and all I get is someone's different opinion, why even try?


----------



## NorthernLight (Nov 11, 2022)

Mlz827 said:


> What I don't understand is if I do not go to them, (which I feel welcome when I do) they do not come to me.  I was sick, recently, for three weeks.  Not one visit to help me, or just a visit for a lonely person who was shut in until I was well.  This has me having mixed feelings of being upset , frustrated and most of all confused.


This is the story of my life. I've lived in many beautiful and interesting places. My sister would plaintively say that she missed me, and ask when I was coming "home." She was not averse to travel, but she wouldn't travel to see me, even though it meant free lodging in paradise.

Similarly, in the rural area where I lived previously, several women I was acquainted with would get all pouty and ask why I never came to see them. Why didn't they ever come to see me? I lived in a more convenient location than they did.

I've come to the conclusion that it's a hierarchy thing. Some people hold court, and expect the vassals to come to them.


----------



## Alligatorob (Nov 11, 2022)

NorthernLight said:


> I've come to the conclusion that it's a hierarchy thing. Some people hold court, and expect the vassals to come to them.


An interesting observation.  I know I would rather have folks come to me than to visit others...  Never thought of it this way.

I do visit others, friends and relatives, just not always my first choice.


----------



## officerripley (Nov 11, 2022)

NorthernLight said:


> it's a hierarchy thing. Some people hold court, and expect the vassals to come to them.


This. Is. So. True! OMG, I've always thought about someone I know who always does this and have always said to myself that they are the kind of person who thinks that hierarchy is a good thing, that the world, workplaces, etc. run best in a strict hierarchical fashion. I guess a lot of people do this, maybe not all the time but in social situations certainly.


----------



## win231 (Nov 11, 2022)

KingsX said:


> .
> 
> Since most murder victims are killed by people they know,
> being anti-social doesn't seem so bad.


LOL - when I heard that most accidents happen within 10 miles of home, I moved 11 miles away.


----------

