# No booster = Unvaccinated?



## chic

Last spring, my brother was vaccinated. He did it because he believed it would make his life easier. In early summer SIL also got vaccinated. She did not want the vaccine, but her employer forced vaccination on his employees otherwise they would face dismissal.

Neither my brother nor his wife want booster shots. Getting vaccinated didn't uncomplicate their lives as they had believed they would and now they are both faced with seriously uncomfortable questions.

If vaccinated people refuse booster shots, will they be treated as unvaccinated?


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## Becky1951

chic said:


> Last spring, my brother was vaccinated. He did it because he believed it would make his life easier. In early summer SIL also got vaccinated. She did not want the vaccine, but her employer forced vaccination on his employees otherwise they would face dismissal.
> 
> Neither my brother nor his wife want booster shots. Getting vaccinated didn't uncomplicate their lives as they had believed they would and now they are both faced with seriously uncomfortable questions.
> 
> If vaccinated people refuse booster shots, will they be treated as unvaccinated?


I don't think the boosters fall under the current mandate........Yet.


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## CarolfromTX

It’s the camel’s nose under the tent.  What’s next? Flu shot mandates? Mandates on the number of children you can have? where does it end? My body, my choice.  I chose to get the vaccine. What anyone else does should not involve losing their job.


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## Alligatorob

chic said:


> If vaccinated people refuse booster shots, will they be treated as unvaccinated?


As Becky says, not so far as I can see, not yet anyway.


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## Buckeye

Good question!  I plan on getting the booster as soon as I'm allowed, SO says she isn't sure.  Wait and see.


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## Don M.

It appears that the effectiveness of these Covid shots wanes over time....depending upon the "brand".  I suspect these Covid shots will be much like the annual flu shots....in that last years flu shot is not very effective on this years strain of flu.  Perhaps in another couple of years, research will find a better, and longer lasting solution to Covid, but in the interim, boosters will probably be needed  to maintain the effectiveness.


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## mathjak107

there are now as many as a dozen covid mutations ... this virus is a monster and is very good at self preservation .

even natural immunity is unknown ... the two popular versions of covid are the alpha original and now delta but we are dealing with others too .

so unlike other vaccines like polio or small pox we are dealing with something far more complex


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## terry123

Buckeye said:


> Good question!  I plan on getting the booster as soon as I'm allowed, SO says she isn't sure.  Wait and see.


Me too!


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## Packerjohn

It wasn't so long ago that if you lived in Poland, the USSR or China you were forced to join the communist party whether you liked it or not.  How so?  Well, if you did not join, then you could not get any good jobs or if you had a decent job but did not join, forget about getting any promotion!  I am a believer in the vaccine and I have both of my shots.  However, I don't like the dictatorship way of forcing people to get the jab.  I wish there was so other way.  Canadians and Americans used to brag about our freedoms and look down on countries like North Korea, Russia or China.  Well, think again, mate!


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## Tom 86

Packerjohn said:


> It wasn't so long ago that if you lived in Poland, the USSR or China you were forced to join the communist party whether you liked it or not.  How so?  Well, if you did not join, then you could not get any good jobs or if you had a decent job but did not join, forget about getting any promotion!  I am a believer in the vaccine and I have both of my shots.  However, I don't like the dictatorship way of forcing people to get the jab.  I wish there was so other way.  Canadians and Americans used to brag about our freedoms and look down on countries like North Korea, Russia or China.  Well, think again, mate!


I agree.  I remember all of those.  Now there are places that won't let you in to see a movie or eat without showing your vax card.   Looks like we are going the way of the USSR & China very slowly. 

  A friend & I was going to go eat at a nice restaurant.  At the door is a sign. " You must show vax card or not get waited on".  So we turned around & left like so many others done also. I wonder how long they will be in business?


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## Sunny

Many things here now require the vax card. That includes hearing speakers on various subjects, club meetings, concerts, etc. Not sure about restaurants; I haven't encountered that yet. But most people are carrying around their vax card, just in case.

I don't mind showing it at all, and don't consider it an infringement on my freedom. Just the opposite, they're trying to keep us alive and healthy.


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## mathjak107

Tom 86 said:


> I agree.  I remember all of those.  Now there are places that won't let you in to see a movie or eat without showing your vax card.   Looks like we are going the way of the USSR & China very slowly.
> 
> A friend & I was going to go eat at a nice restaurant.  At the door is a sign. " You must show vax card or not get waited on".  So we turned around & left like so many others done also. I wonder how long they will be in business?


Restaurants here have lines to get in despite needing the vaccination proof.

we were at the Bronx zoo a few days ago and without proof you cannot go to the indoor exhibits ..you get a wristband that they check for


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## Sunny

This will continue until enough people get vaccinated to give us herd immunity.

I can't imagine people are calling it a dictatorship to require proof of vaccination.  Is it also a dictatorship to require a little plastic card in your wallet saying that you are allowed to drive?  Or to require that you register to vote before going to the polls? Or to require proof of vaccination against other contagious diseases before your kid is allowed to go to school?

Somehow, this disease seems to operate in a universe of its own.


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## Ruthanne

Buckeye said:


> Good question!  I plan on getting the booster as soon as I'm allowed, SO says she isn't sure.  Wait and see.


Why aren't you allowed now?


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## WhatInThe

Since the half vaxxed are considered unvaxxed until the 14 days after the final dose the boosters will be included in the definition of vaxxed in some businesses, entities, organizations and countries.

Israel now requires 3 shots to be considered vaxxed.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/03/world/israel-covid-booster.html

And they're working on their 4th.


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## Becky1951

Sunny said:


> This will continue until enough people get vaccinated to give us herd immunity.
> 
> I can't imagine people are calling it a dictatorship to require proof of vaccination.  Is it also a dictatorship to require a little plastic card in your wallet saying that you are allowed to drive?  Or to require that you register to vote before going to the polls? Or to require proof of vaccination against other contagious diseases before your kid is allowed to go to school?
> 
> Somehow, this disease seems to operate in a universe of its own.


It is dictatorship when a person is forced to get a vaccine they don't want and in some cases don't need when they have immunity from having had Covid in order to stay employed.


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## Becky1951

WhatInThe said:


> Since the half vaxxed are considered unvaxxed until the 14 days after the final dose the boosters will be included in the definition of vaxxed in some businesses, entities, organizations and countries.
> 
> Israel now requires 3 shots to be considered vaxxed.
> 
> https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/03/world/israel-covid-booster.html
> 
> And they're working on there 4th



And then................

https://ifunny.co/picture/waiting-in-line-for-your-56th-booster-shot-to-stop-JSvyLpOr8?s=cl


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## Pepper

CarolfromTX said:


> My body, my choice.


This saying has nothing to do with the vaccine and everything to do with a woman's right to discontinue a pregnancy.  Don't use it if you don't mean it the REAL way.  Don't appropriate Never Again, either.  So, you're from Texas..............where do you stand on the Real Meaning of this hard-fought phrase?


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## Buckeye

Ruthanne said:


> Why aren't you allowed now?


Only because it hasn't been 6 months since my second jab.  I think I did it in July, so I'll be ready in January


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## CarolfromTX

Pepper said:


> This saying has nothing to do with the vaccine and everything to do with a woman's right to discontinue a pregnancy.  Don't use it if you don't mean it the REAL way.  Don't appropriate Never Again, either.  So, you're from Texas..............where do you stand on the Real Meaning of this hard-fought phrase?


I’ll use that phrase whenever and however I choose, thanks.  Just as there are women who use that as a reason to be alowed to abort a fetus, people should be allowed to choose whether they want a foreign substance injected into them.  No one owns either of those phrases.


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## Ruthanne

My second one was April so I just got my 3rd on Thurs which was 6 mos.later.


Buckeye said:


> Only because it hasn't been 6 months since my second jab.  I think I did it in July, so I'll be ready in January


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## Pepper

One is "allowed" to say whatever one wants, despite it's hypocrisy, it's appropriation, It's misleading nature, it's unoriginality, it's lack of creativity, it's just plain wrongness.  As I am "allowed" to call out the one who uses it inappropriately.  And I Will.


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## Jackie23

I made an appointment this morning for my booster in two weeks, this will be my third shot.......I think these vaccinations and all the requirements that are being made are for the protection and well being of the citizens of this country.

The proof that the vaccinations and the wearing of mask works is in the statistics...and that is good enough for me.


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## Becky1951

Pepper said:


> This saying has nothing to do with the vaccine and everything to do with a woman's right to discontinue a pregnancy.  Don't use it if you don't mean it the REAL way.  Don't appropriate Never Again, either.  So, you're from Texas..............where do you stand on the Real Meaning of this hard-fought phrase?


My health, MY choice. What happens to MY body is My choice, (My body My choice) not yours not the higher ups making the vaccine a mandate. Its *my body* its *my choice*.


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## Pepper

I knew you couldn't resist.


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## win231

Becky1951 said:


> And then................
> 
> https://ifunny.co/picture/waiting-in-line-for-your-56th-booster-shot-to-stop-JSvyLpOr8?s=cl


The boosters will never end until they've milked it for all the profit they can & people are through being programmed.
I'm reminded of the fuel "Shortage" of the early 70's.  As soon as gas prices were up over $1.00/gallon, suddenly there was no more shortage & we were swimming in gas.


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## WhatInThe

It's an emergency use substance which if they had studied it for several years they would've realized fading efficacy and could've tweeked or redid their work with something else. But know rather than admit they missed the mark they will tweek or replace with/under the guise of  boosters.


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## CarolfromTX

Pepper said:


> One is "allowed" to say whatever one wants, despite it's hypocrisy, it's appropriation, It's misleading nature, it's unoriginality, it's lack of creativity, it's just plain wrongness.  As I am "allowed" to call out the one who uses it inappropriately.  And I Will.


Don’t you just hate it when folks use your own words against you? Bless your heart. You’re the hypocrite here. Guess it’s only your body/choice when it involves killing a baby. Otherwise it’s the government’s prerogative ?


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## Alizerine

Pepper said:


> I knew you couldn't resist.


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## Shero

WhatInThe said:


> It's an emergency use substance which if they had studied it for several years they would've realized fading efficacy and could've tweeked or redid their work with something else. But know rather than admit they missed the mark they will tweek or replace with/under the guise of  boosters.


oh you clever scientist!!


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## Alizerine

It is hard for some people to grasp the concept that some choices like those about vaccinations can and do affect other people.


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## Shero

CarolfromTX said:


> I’ll use that phrase whenever and however I choose, thanks.  Just as there are women who use that as a reason to be alowed to abort a fetus, people should be allowed to choose whether they want a foreign substance injected into them.  No one owns either of those phrases.


The covid virus is also air bourne. Is the air you breathe a foreign substance?


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## Becky1951

Shero said:


> The covid virus is also air bourne. Is the air you breathe a foreign substance?


The air we breath goes through a natural order into our lungs then through our lungs into our bloodstream where it carries oxygen to all necessary organs.  Therefor it isn't a foreign substance. A virus is a foreign substance. So if your breathing air that has Covid particles in it your breathing air infected with Covid.  

The air isn't foreign with or without Covid.


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## Shero

Becky1951 said:


> The air we breath goes through a natural order into our lungs then through our lungs into our bloodstream where it carries oxygen to all necessary organs.  Therefor it isn't a foreign substance. A virus is a foreign substance. So if your breathing air that has Covid particles in it your breathing air infected with Covid.
> 
> The air isn't foreign with or without Covid.


Thanks for the "eye roll" Becky, it is cute!
Yes, in a charmed world, your assessment may be right, but, air is not a pure substance, as it's a mixture of various elements
Our air mainly consists of two gases: nitrogen (ca. 78%) & oxygen (ca. 21%). Besides those two, we breathe carbon dioxide, argon and traces of a number of other gases. If other substances are measurable in the air, those are called air pollution. So yes our air is filled with "foreign" substances, including the covid virus. Therefore wearing a mask is of very great importance.


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## Becky1951

Shero said:


> Thanks for the "eye roll" Becky, it is cute!
> Yes, in a charmed world, your assessment may be right, but, air is not a pure substance, as it's a mixture of various elements
> Our air mainly consists of two gases: nitrogen (ca. 78%) & oxygen (ca. 21%). Besides those two, we breathe carbon dioxide, argon and traces of a number of other gases. If other substances are measurable in the air, those are called air pollution. So yes our air is filled with "foreign" substances, including the covid virus. Therefore wearing a mask is of very great importance.


Your were talking about wearing a mask in your reply to Carol???  Funny it didn't seem that way.

I do agree about wearing a mask.


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## Shero

Becky1951 said:


> Your were talking about wearing a mask in your reply to Carol???  Funny it didn't seem that way.
> 
> I do agree about wearing a mask.


I was replying to your post Becky, your post about “air”


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## Don M.

WhatInThe said:


> It's an emergency use substance which if they had studied it for several years they would've realized fading efficacy and could've tweeked or redid their work with something else. But know rather than admit they missed the mark they will tweek or replace with/under the guise of  boosters.



Yes, IF they had studied this virus for Several Years, there might have been a single shot, or even a pill that would negate the effects of this virus.  However, at the speed with which this virus hit, and spread, the scientists Didn't Have Several Years to come up with a treatment.  Had these vaccines not been available for Several Years, the global deaths would probably number in the 10's to 100's of millions.   

If the original vaccines work for several months, and can be extended with a booster, that is probably the best we can hope for, at present.


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## Lara

Not everyone will need a booster shot. That's what I read.


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## Don M.

Lara said:


> Not everyone will need a booster shot. That's what I read.



It depends upon which "brand" of vaccine a person has received.  The Moderna shots seem to last the longest, whereas the J&J single shot doesn't seem to last nearly as long.  

Insofar as "Need" is concerned....that depends upon the individual, their lifestyles, how often they venture out in public, their general health, etc., etc.  There is No one size fits all, but the vast majority can benefit from the vaccines.


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## Lara

Thank you Don. Interesting about Moderna lasting the longest and J&J not-so-much.  I guess Pfizer falls somewhere in between the two. That's the one I got.


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## Warrigal

Jackie23 said:


> I made an appointment this morning for my booster in two weeks, this will be my third shot.......I think these vaccinations and all the requirements that are being made are for the protection and well being of the citizens of this country.
> 
> The proof that the vaccinations and the wearing of mask works is in the statistics...and that is good enough for me.


Australia started late with vaccinations and there was a priority rationed process. Over 70s were eligible fairly early in the process and I have been double vaxxed since July.  I did it on the advice of my trusted GP who was looking after all of his elderly patients. My vaccination status is recorded on my health record and when it is time to consider a booster I shall again listen to my GP. He keeps himself up to date with the latest developments in medicine. I have never had reason to question his expertise although I did refuse to take HRT when I was menopausal. I decided that I would not need to based on family history. He did not argue with my decision.


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## fmdog44

All this talk about _freedom_ is nonsense. If you don't want the shot fine but stay away from me and my family and friends. That means I don't want you at my work place or in businesses that I frequent. Long before this Covid all people with the flu were asked to stay away places where there were people so what logic are the Freedom Fighters of America applying to that?


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## CarolfromTX

Shero said:


> The covid virus is also air bourne. Is the air you breathe a foreign substance?


No, the air isn’t. But the COVID virus is, straight from a lab in Wuhan, China. And we don’t have a choice about whether or not to breathe, but we should have a choice about the jab. For me, this is about freedom of choice, and not about vaccines.


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## win231

fmdog44 said:


> All this talk about _freedom_ is nonsense. If you don't want the shot fine but stay away from me and my family and friends. That means I don't want you at my work place or in businesses that I frequent. Long before this Covid all people with the flu were asked to stay away places where there were people so what logic are the Freedom Fighters of America applying to that?


1.  Here's a better idea:  YOU stay away from others.  You have that choice.  You do not decide where others go; you only wish you had that authority.
2.  If you're vaccinated, you wouldn't care who went near you; you would be protected by your vaccine.  Why do you lack faith in it?  And since you lack faith in it, why did you get it?


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## win231

Shero said:


> The covid virus is also air bourne. Is the air you breathe a foreign substance?


"Airbourne" is an Australian rock band.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airbourne_(band)
Don't you mean "Airborne?"


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## terry123

fmdog44 said:


> All this talk about _freedom_ is nonsense. If you don't want the shot fine but stay away from me and my family and friends. That means I don't want you at my work place or in businesses that I frequent. Long before this Covid all people with the flu were asked to stay away places where there were people so what logic are the Freedom Fighters of America applying to that?


Stay away from all of me and my family too.  Crazy that nobody gives it a second thought that when your children start school they have to have their shots, etc.  I had the Moderna and will get my booster too.  I care about myself, my family and those around me.


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## Shero

CarolfromTX said:


> No, the air isn’t. But the COVID virus is, straight from a lab in Wuhan, China. And we don’t have a choice about whether or not to breathe, but we should have a choice about the jab. For me, this is about freedom of choice, and not about vaccines.


See my post #34 to Becky. I won’t repeat myself but will say again, freedom of choice is not valid during a pandemic to not have a vaccination. The choice is clear cut to me, do I want to live or not, do I want my family to live or not? That is what is important.


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## CarolfromTX

Shero said:


> See my post #34 to Becky. I won’t repeat myself but will say again, freedom of choice is not valid during a pandemic to not have a vaccination. The choice is clear cut to me, do I want to live or not, do I want my family to live or not? That is what is important.


This is a false choice, as though if you do not get the jab, you are doomed to die, period.  You are not.  And if Shero gets the jab, Shero should be safe.  I got the jabs, so I feel safe. What anyone else does is up to them.  There may be many valid reasons not to get the vaccine.


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## Shero

CarolfromTX said:


> This is a false choice, as though if you do not get the jab, you are doomed to die, period.  You are not.  And if Shero gets the jab, Shero should be safe.  I got the jabs, so I feel safe. What anyone else does is up to them.  There may be many valid reasons not to get the vaccine.


Maybe we agree to differ?


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## Sunny

win231 said:


> The boosters will never end until they've milked it for all the profit they can & people are through being programmed.
> I'm reminded of the fuel "Shortage" of the early 70's.  As soon as gas prices were up over $1.00/gallon, suddenly there was no more shortage & we were swimming in gas.


Hey Win, your customary paranoia is going way over the top, even for you.

Who are "they," and how are all the medical professionals encouraging booster shots milking profits from it? Are all the prescriptions and medical procedures they advise "programming," or does it only apply to this disease? Do you ever go to a doctor for anything?  Have you ever taken any medication produced by a pharmacy? If so, aaagh, you are being programmed!

Last week, while at the doctor's office (on another matter), I asked him if he thought I should get the booster. He answered, "Yes, probably you should, in spite of the fact that you felt lousy after your second vaccine shot. The efficacy does seem to wear off after a while, so boosters are probably a good idea. And probably the side effects won't be as bad from the smaller booster shot."  (Not his exact words, but that was the gist of his answer.)

I asked where I should go to get the booster, and he said he didn't know, but I could look up providers of the boosters on my county web site. He thought some of the pharmacies near my home probably have it.  He didn't recommend anyone, and I can't see how he is personally getting rich from "programming" me. He was just giving the best advice he could.  He has heartbrokenly seen several patients die of Covid, and is trying to prevent any more deaths.

And btw, he looked pretty exhausted and grim about it. Not at all like some hotshot getting rich off all those naive fools who believe medical advice.


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## rgp

CarolfromTX said:


> It’s the camel’s nose under the tent.  What’s next? Flu shot mandates? Mandates on the number of children you can have? where does it end? My body, my choice.  I chose to get the vaccine. What anyone else does should not involve losing their job.



 Agree strongly here !


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## chic

Tom 86 said:


> I agree.  I remember all of those.  Now there are places that won't let you in to see a movie or eat without showing your vax card.   Looks like we are going the way of the USSR & China very slowly.
> 
> A friend & I was going to go eat at a nice restaurant.  At the door is a sign. " You must show vax card or not get waited on".  So we turned around & left like so many others done also. I wonder how long they will be in business?


It's happening fast I think. Not so subtle at all. Over a year ago we were told this year we would be back to normal. This year you can't work unless you submit to a vaccine and the U.S. is becoming Australia - Fast!


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## fmdog44

win231 said:


> 1.  Here's a better idea:  YOU stay away from others.  You have that choice.  You do not decide where others go; you only wish you had that authority.
> 2.  If you're vaccinated, you wouldn't care who went near you; you would be protected by your vaccine.  Why do you lack faith in it?  And since you lack faith in it, why did you get it?


This is why you are not very smart. Read more than once because you understand very little the first time around. People that are vaccinated CAN STILL GET SICK from the idiots that think they have the God given right to spread the disease. The difference is they will not die and will not need intensive care like the unvaccinated morons will (and never pay for it if they survive). Funny how you nonbelievers run to hospitals for help after you catch the Covid while denying science prior. How many people with non-Covid illnesses were denied intensive care beds because of nonvaccinated fools claiming it is their right to treatments _*after*_ claiming it is their right to ignore medical science?


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## win231

fmdog44 said:


> This is why you are not very smart. Read more than once because you understand very little the first time around. People that are vaccinated CAN STILL GET SICK from the idiots that think they have the God given right to spread the disease. The difference is they will not die and will not need intensive care like the unvaccinated morons will (and never pay for it if they survive). Funny how you nonbelievers run to hospitals for help after you catch the Covid while denying science prior. How many people with non-Covid illnesses were denied intensive care beds because of nonvaccinated fools claiming it is their right to treatments _*after*_ claiming it is their right to ignore medical science?


^^^^ Programmed Robot.
You understand _absolutely nothing_ the first time around.
Or the second, third & fourth.


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## Packerjohn

I would like to know when enough is enough.  Are we going to force 100% of the population to get vaccinated before we don't have to wear those masks?  Then how many vaccines is enough?  Two and a boaster shot?  Three shots?  Four?  Five?  Six?  When are we going to reach this so called "herd immunity" or is this just some sort of media fairy tale?  The drug companies must be laughing all the way to the banks.


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## win231

CarolfromTX said:


> It’s the camel’s nose under the tent.  What’s next? Flu shot mandates? Mandates on the number of children you can have? where does it end? My body, my choice.  I chose to get the vaccine. What anyone else does should not involve losing their job.





Packerjohn said:


> I would like to know when enough is enough.  Are we going to force 100% of the population to get vaccinated before we don't have to wear those masks?  Then how many vaccines is enough?  Two and a boaster shot?  Three shots?  Four?  Five?  Six?  When are we going to reach this so called "herd immunity" or is this just some sort of media fairy tale?  The drug companies must be laughing all the way to the banks.


That's exactly what they're doing.
When I saw my Dr. in January so I could refill my Rx for Insulin, he said, _"Well, after we're all vaccinated, we can stop wearing these silly masks."_
I said, "I'm not interested in the vaccine."
He said, "You know, there's something to be said for that."


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## Tom 86

win231 said:


> That's exactly what they're doing.
> When I saw my Dr. in January so I could refill my Rx for Insulin, he said, _"Well, after we're all vaccinated, we can stop wearing these silly masks."_
> I said, "I'm not interested in the vaccine."
> He said, "You know, there's something to be said for that."


I just saw my Dr last week.  We got to talking about the booster shots.  Since I've only had the one Maderna shot & it put me in the hospital for 4 days.  Also, a pulmonary Dr. at the hospital told me to NEVER get any more Conav-19 shots as my lungs will not take them.

  My P.C. Dr. last week *said if I didn't have to take the shots to work here I wouldn't take them either.*  He said he's seen too many older people die just from one shot.

  So again I asked what should I do since they're now wanting vax cards to get into places.  He told me to NOT get the shots or boosters or I could die.  He & other Drs are trying to get the CDC to approve a Dr's card that will exempt people from the shots if they have other health problems.


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## win231

Tom 86 said:


> I just saw my Dr last week.  We got to talking about the booster shots.  Since I've only had the one Maderna shot & it put me in the hospital for 4 days.  Also, a pulmonary Dr. at the hospital told me to NEVER get any more Conav-19 shots as my lungs will not take them.
> 
> My P.C. Dr. last week *said if I didn't have to take the shots to work here I wouldn't take them either.*  He said he's seen too many older people die just from one shot.
> 
> So again I asked what should I do since they're now wanting vax cards to get into places.  He told me to NOT get the shots or boosters or I could die.  He & other Drs are trying to get the CDC to approve a Dr's card that will exempt people from the shots if they have other health problems.


You're lucky.  I just lost a friend of mine who had health issues & he got a flu shot on his doctor's advice "Due to his preexisting condition."  After it put him in the hospital with breathing problems, his doctor then said, "No flu shots; No Covid shots."  He died anyway.  He was only 66.


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## chic

Tom 86 said:


> I just saw my Dr last week.  We got to talking about the booster shots.  Since I've only had the one Maderna shot & it put me in the hospital for 4 days.  Also, a pulmonary Dr. at the hospital told me to NEVER get any more Conav-19 shots as my lungs will not take them.
> 
> My P.C. Dr. last week *said if I didn't have to take the shots to work here I wouldn't take them either.*  He said he's seen too many older people die just from one shot.
> 
> So again I asked what should I do since they're now wanting vax cards to get into places.  He told me to NOT get the shots or boosters or I could die.  He & other Drs are trying to get the CDC to approve a Dr's card that will exempt people from the shots if they have other health problems.


Now that is a sensible idea, but it will probably never happen because there is such a push to stick a needle in everyone's arm. I wish them luck though.


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## Sunny

win231 said:


> That's exactly what they're doing.
> When I saw my Dr. in January so I could refill my Rx for Insulin, he said, _"Well, after we're all vaccinated, we can stop wearing these silly masks."_
> I said, "I'm not interested in the vaccine."
> He said, "You know, there's something to be said for that."


Insulin!  Insulin!  Aagh!  You're being programmed!  You're an insulin-using robot! Eek!


----------



## Don M.

Here's how much the vaccinations are costing the government/taxpayers.....for the single shot, $28.39, and for the 2 shot vaccines, $45.33.  Compared the the 10's of thousands a hospital stay is costing, these vaccines are a Real Bargain.

https://www.cms.gov/medicare/covid-19/medicare-covid-19-vaccine-shot-payment


----------



## Becky1951

Packerjohn said:


> I would like to know when enough is enough.  Are we going to force 100% of the population to get vaccinated before we don't have to wear those masks?  Then how many vaccines is enough?  Two and a boaster shot?  Three shots?  Four?  Five?  Six?  When are we going to reach this so called "herd immunity" or is this just some sort of media fairy tale?  The drug companies must be laughing all the way to the banks.


100% vaccinated? Vaccinated people can still get Covid and spread it to other vaccinated people. There have been fully vaccinated people infected with Covid and hospitalized and died. So even with 100% vaccination which realistically won't happen, are troops going to go into the Amazon jungle and hunt down the indigenous people and inject them? Or in other sparse populations extremely remote when only seldom they interact with others?


----------



## Becky1951

Don M. said:


> Here's how much the vaccinations are costing the government/taxpayers.....for the single shot, $28.39, and for the 2 shot vaccines, $45.33.  Compared the the 10's of thousands a hospital stay is costing, these vaccines are a Real Bargain.
> 
> https://www.cms.gov/medicare/covid-19/medicare-covid-19-vaccine-shot-payment


I agree they are a Real Bargain for anyone wishing to be vaccinated.


----------



## chic

Becky1951 said:


> 100% vaccinated? Vaccinated people can still get Covid and spread it to other vaccinated people. There have been fully vaccinated people infected with Covid and hospitalized and died. So even with 100% vaccination which realistically won't happen, are troops going to go into the Amazon jungle and hunt down the indigenous people and inject them? Or in other sparse populations extremely remote when only seldom they interact with others?


My point exactly Becky. There will always be unvaccinated people. It isn't even realistic to think otherwise! 

The problem with this vaccine is it's not a "sterilizing" vaccine such as we had for polio, small pox and measles. A sterilizing vaccine does provide immunity for the vaccinated and nontransmission once inoculated. Respiratory viruses don't respond to vaccines as other diseases do. It seems we should just learn to live with this and that may eventually happen. But what will be left of society as we have known it before people finally say "enough"!!! Not much I fear.


----------



## Buckeye

Here's what some unvaxxed have to look forward to:

5 kids left behind


----------



## win231

Hey, what happened to those free tacos, free hot dogs & cash drawings for getting vaccinated?


----------



## chic

win231 said:


> Hey, what happened to those free tacos, free hot dogs & cash drawings for getting vaccinated?


I hear the vaccine lottery didn't do well. I think it's defunct now but not sure.


----------



## Buckeye

Would you give up a $3 million/year job to remain unvaxxed? 

Washington State University

Glad to see WSU sticking to their guns, and doing the right thing


----------



## Tom 86

*Don't be so harsh on people that are not vaccinated.* *There are underlying problems so they can't get it.* *You are not walking in their shoes*.  My one G.S. 9 years old has some medical problems so the Drs said NO vaccine for him.

  I'm going for a blood test this Wednesday for my Dr. I see next Monday.  He wants to see what Conav-19  ?? is floating in my blood for the virus. Since I'm still very sick from the shot.  Before the shot, I was doing everything I wanted to do.  Now I can't even clean my house, I'm too weak. To walk 62 ft from one end of my house to the other with a walker I get winded & can hardly breathe.


----------



## chic

Tom 86 said:


> *Don't be so harsh on people that are not vaccinated.* *There are underlying problems so they can't get it.* *You are not walking in their shoes*.  My one G.S. 9 years old has some medical problems so the Drs said NO vaccine for him.
> 
> I'm going for a blood test this Wednesday for my Dr. I see next Monday.  He wants to see what Conav-19  ?? is floating in my blood for the virus. Since I'm still very sick from the shot.  Before the shot, I was doing everything I wanted to do.  Now I can't even clean my house, I'm too weak. To walk 62 ft from one end of my house to the other with a walker I get winded & can hardly breathe.


You're right. Every single person here who is not vaccinated has a health issue which prevents them from being so. Some have tried one shot and been so sickened by it they were told by their doctor not to get the second shot and another lost an immediate family to the vaccine so enough with this division and hatred and wasted energy. 

There are going to be unvaxxed people in this world because of the reasons stated above and no one can change that fact. Period.


----------



## hollydolly

There's a great deal of places in the uk where you will not be permitted entry unless proof of double vaccination is shown ..or a Covid lateral test  Pass...


----------



## Buckeye

Tom 86 said:


> *Don't be so harsh on people that are not vaccinated.* *There are underlying problems so they can't get it.* *You are not walking in their shoes*.  My one G.S. 9 years old has some medical problems so the Drs said NO vaccine for him.
> 
> I'm going for a blood test this Wednesday for my Dr. I see next Monday.  He wants to see what Conav-19  ?? is floating in my blood for the virus. Since I'm still very sick from the shot.  Before the shot, I was doing everything I wanted to do.  Now I can't even clean my house, I'm too weak. To walk 62 ft from one end of my house to the other with a walker I get winded & can hardly breathe.


The coach in the article I posted has not claimed to have any medical issues that would prevent him from getting the jab.  He did apply for a religious exemption, but it was denied.  If he had any "underlying problems" he should have come forward with them to the University, but he did not.  I suspect he was counting on the University giving him a pass, because, well, coach.  He took a $3 million gamble and lost. 

The number I've seen for those truly at medical risk when taking the shot is 1% or less of the population.  We are all very aware of your issues, and are certainly sympathetic.  Just keep in mind that over 404 million doses have been administered in the US and over 95% of us seniors have had at least one jab.


----------



## Sunny

More and more, it's obvious that the same small group on this forum are posting endlessly about how "dangerous" the vaccine is, how any vaccine mandates are an infringement on human rights, and so on. They love any statistics that show breakthrough cases (even though they are nearly always mild and uneventful), and joyfully come up with very dubious stories about people dying after receiving the vaccine. (Even though the vaccine had nothing to do with their death; everybody eventually dies of something). 

This is the same contingent that loves to make fun of scientists, physicians, and pharmaceutical companies, all of whom are working overtime to keep us alive.  There is a strong element of paranoia in this ("they are injecting poison into our bodies!")  and a pathological fear of injections comes through. With some it's political, with others it's trolling (looking for fights) via constant sneering and taunting. And with some, there is a belief in horse deworming substances instead of the amazingly effective and safe vaccine.

Most of this stuff was promulgated and is continued by Fox News and other right-wing media. We all listen to, read, and believe whatever makes sense to us. If utter nonsense, and frequently lies, fit in with our belief system, we believe them anyway, and see ourselves as heroes in further spreading the lies.  And that's where the Internet and its social media can be very dangerous. People who are a little bit naive can be led down very dangerous ways of thinking, and it spreads exponentially, much as the virus does.

If someone has underlying health issues that prevent them from tolerating the vaccine, I sympathize. But it seems to me that someone in that situation would keep it to themself, as a private health matter. Maybe it's appropriate to discuss it with their family, immediate friends, and their doctor.  Maybe mention it once in a forum, if helpful to other people. If you are allergic to, say, penicillin and other antibiotics, would you conduct an endless campaign against the medical use of antibiotics?  Why the constant propaganda-spreading against the vaccine that the great majority of us can and do get, thankful that we are protected against a horrible death from this killer disease?  It's like a soapbox that this tiny  segment never seem to get off.

I should add that by now, the majority of Americans (and probably most of the developed world) have received the vaccine, and many are also getting boosters.  So what is there to still argue about?  The rate of new cases, and the rate of death from Covid-19 keeps going down, very much in sync with the rate of vaccination going up. And for anyone who has harbored doubts about the effectiveness of this vaccine, that statistic should be enough to convince you.


----------



## chic

Sunny said:


> More and more, it's obvious that the same small group on this forum are posting endlessly about how "dangerous" the vaccine is, how any vaccine mandates are an infringement on human rights, and so on. They love any statistics that show breakthrough cases (even though they are nearly always mild and uneventful), and joyfully come up with very dubious stories about people dying after receiving the vaccine. (Even though the vaccine had nothing to do with their death; everybody eventually dies of something).
> 
> This is the same contingent that loves to make fun of scientists, physicians, and pharmaceutical companies, all of whom are working overtime to keep us alive.  There is a strong element of paranoia in this ("they are injecting poison into our bodies!")  and a pathological fear of injections comes through. With some it's political, with others it's trolling (looking for fights) via constant sneering and taunting. And with some, there is a belief in horse deworming substances instead of the amazingly effective and safe vaccine.
> 
> Most of this stuff was promulgated and is continued by Fox News and other right-wing media. We all listen to, read, and believe whatever makes sense to us. If utter nonsense, and frequently lies, fit in with our belief system, we believe them anyway, and see ourselves as heroes in further spreading the lies.  And that's where the Internet and its social media can be very dangerous. People who are a little bit naive can be led down very dangerous ways of thinking, and it spreads exponentially, much as the virus does.
> 
> If someone has underlying health issues that prevent them from tolerating the vaccine, I sympathize. But it seems to me that someone in that situation would keep it to themself, as a private health matter. Maybe it's appropriate to discuss it with their family, immediate friends, and their doctor.  Maybe mention it once in a forum, if helpful to other people. If you are allergic to, say, penicillin and other antibiotics, would you conduct an endless campaign against the medical use of antibiotics?  Why the constant propaganda-spreading against the vaccine that the great majority of us can and do get, thankful that we are protected against a horrible death from this killer disease?  It's like a soapbox that this tiny  segment never seem to get off.
> 
> I should add that by now, the majority of Americans (and probably most of the developed world) have received the vaccine, and many are also getting boosters.  So what is there to still argue about?  The rate of new cases, and the rate of death from Covid-19 keeps going down, very much in sync with the rate of vaccination going up. And for anyone who has harbored doubts about the effectiveness of this vaccine, that statistic should be enough to convince you.


Exactly right Sunny. There is nothing left to argue about so let's all just stop.


----------



## hollydolly

I've literally just booked my 2nd Vaccine dose.... Everyone here  presumes when I mention I'm booking my Vaccine, that I'm booking the Booster jab.. but no.. I was just late coming to the table.. and hopefully I won't need the Booster jab later

It's much harder to book a jab now in England....right up until September of this year there was places just about everywhere to just walk in or book if necessary.. now at least in this part of England. those places no longer exist and we have to book in advance at places much further  from our own town... .I suspect this may be off-putting  to those who have difficulty travelling especially those who are vulnerable ...and may therefore not getting their necessary Vaccination


----------



## StarSong

My son is traveling in France and Italy for business.  He needed to obtain a special card proving his fully vaccinated status.  He said he's needed to show it at most indoor places he went to in France and that it is required throughout Italy.


----------



## hollydolly

StarSong said:


> My son is traveling in France and Italy for business.  He needed to obtain a special card proving his fully vaccinated status.  He said he's needed to show it at most indoor places he went to in France and that it is required throughout Italy.


it's also required everywhere in Spain.. and has been for very much longer than the UK


----------



## chic

hollydolly said:


> There's a great deal of places in the uk where you will not be permitted entry unless proof of double vaccination is shown ..or a Covid lateral test  Pass...


I th


hollydolly said:


> There's a great deal of places in the uk where you will not be permitted entry unless proof of double vaccination is shown ..or a Covid lateral test  Pass...


I thought England wasn't going to do a vaccine passport? Guess they are huh?


----------



## hollydolly

chic said:


> I th
> 
> I thought England wasn't going to do a vaccine passport? Guess they are huh?


well given that there's already many places that disallow entry without proof of vaccination..I wouldn't believe the govt if they said it was raining and I could see the window was wet...


----------



## win231

Vaccine incentives are comin' back.
News just reported that if you're fully vaccinated, you get free tickets to a UCLA football game.
Yeeeeeehaw!!!!!!!!
I'd rather have a free taco.


----------



## CarolfromTX

Ironically, while the US government is demanding vaccine mandates, it is also letting thousands of UNvaccinated foreigners across our southern border. No mandate for them. Be interesting to know how many of the hospital beds are filled by illegals.


----------



## win231

CarolfromTX said:


> Ironically, while the US government is demanding vaccine mandates, it is also letting thousands of UNvaccinated foreigners across our southern border. No mandate for them. Be interesting to know how many of the hospital beds are filled by illegals.


One of many things that don't add up........to thinkers.


----------



## chic

win231 said:


> One of many things that don't add up........to thinkers.


Exactly!


----------



## kssf

I did have the covid but a light case for a week - didn't feel that sick at all but lost my taste.  Had my blood checked 90 days later for antibodies and I didn't have any so I got both the 1st and 2nd shot of Moderna.  Was sicker with the vaccines for a day or so but now don't know what to do about a booster.  This is going to possibly continue on and on as there is so much unknown and the Communist China is not telling us the whole truth.  Very troubling what to do.  It may go like booster 1, booster 2, and booster 3 and 4 - when does it end?  I think again we have to know all the TRUTHS about this covid.  I still don't have my taste back 100% - may 80% but I used to smell very good and taste very good.  It will be a year in November.  The future is unknown to all of us for covid.  I sure wish I knew whether this covid was an accident or was deliberate.  If it was deliberate we are in big trouble I feel with China.  But no one seems to want to get to know and yet it affected the entire world - this is big - maybe pandemics are the only way to have a war?  Nuclear wont work - but pandemics?????? This is a big mystery.


----------



## hollydolly

CarolfromTX said:


> Ironically, while the US government is demanding vaccine mandates, it is also letting thousands of UNvaccinated foreigners across our southern border. No mandate for them. Be interesting to know how many of the hospital beds are filled by illegals.


same here.. hundreds of illegal immigrants  arriving from Eastern Europe every  single day on boats.......


----------



## Shero

Sunny said:


> More and more, it's obvious that the same small group on this forum are posting endlessly about how "dangerous" the vaccine is, how any vaccine mandates are an infringement on human rights, and so on. They love any statistics that show breakthrough cases (even though they are nearly always mild and uneventful), and joyfully come up with very dubious stories about people dying after receiving the vaccine. (Even though the vaccine had nothing to do with their death; everybody eventually dies of something).
> 
> This is the same contingent that loves to make fun of scientists, physicians, and pharmaceutical companies, all of whom are working overtime to keep us alive.  There is a strong element of paranoia in this ("they are injecting poison into our bodies!")  and a pathological fear of injections comes through. With some it's political, with others it's trolling (looking for fights) via constant sneering and taunting. And with some, there is a belief in horse deworming substances instead of the amazingly effective and safe vaccine.
> 
> Most of this stuff was promulgated and is continued by Fox News and other right-wing media. We all listen to, read, and believe whatever makes sense to us. If utter nonsense, and frequently lies, fit in with our belief system, we believe them anyway, and see ourselves as heroes in further spreading the lies.  And that's where the Internet and its social media can be very dangerous. People who are a little bit naive can be led down very dangerous ways of thinking, and it spreads exponentially, much as the virus does.
> 
> If someone has underlying health issues that prevent them from tolerating the vaccine, I sympathize. But it seems to me that someone in that situation would keep it to themself, as a private health matter. Maybe it's appropriate to discuss it with their family, immediate friends, and their doctor.  Maybe mention it once in a forum, if helpful to other people. If you are allergic to, say, penicillin and other antibiotics, would you conduct an endless campaign against the medical use of antibiotics?  Why the constant propaganda-spreading against the vaccine that the great majority of us can and do get, thankful that we are protected against a horrible death from this killer disease?  It's like a soapbox that this tiny  segment never seem to get off.
> 
> I should add that by now, the majority of Americans (and probably most of the developed world) have received the vaccine, and many are also getting boosters.  So what is there to still argue about?  The rate of new cases, and the rate of death from Covid-19 keeps going down, very much in sync with the rate of vaccination going up. And for anyone who has harbored doubts about the effectiveness of this vaccine, that statistic should be enough to convince you.


Great post Sunny and I agree!


----------



## Shero

chic said:


> Exactly right Sunny. There is nothing left to argue about so let's all just stop.


YES!


----------



## Ruthanne

chic said:


> I hear the vaccine lottery didn't do well. I think it's defunct now but not sure.


They are starting it in OH again soon.  It was successful here.  It raised our vaccination rate a good deal and we are going to raise it even higher.  I applaud our Governor.


----------



## AnnieA

Lara said:


> Not everyone will need a booster shot. That's what I read.



Best case scenario is that a person will have antibodies tested to determine need.   Humans medically aren't cookie cutter.  Some people will retain antibodies longer than others.  A subset will never produce them no matter how many boosters they get.


----------



## Ladybj

chic said:


> Last spring, my brother was vaccinated. He did it because he believed it would make his life easier. In early summer SIL also got vaccinated. She did not want the vaccine, but her employer forced vaccination on his employees otherwise they would face dismissal.
> 
> Neither my brother nor his wife want booster shots. Getting vaccinated didn't uncomplicate their lives as they had believed they would and now they are both faced with seriously uncomfortable questions.
> 
> If vaccinated people refuse booster shots, will they be treated as unvaccinated?


If that is the case, that would be AWFUL!!!!!  I have a friend that got the booster - she shared with me that she regret getting it.  She got very sick - much like the flu.  She said she would not recommend it to anybody but people do what they feel is best for them.


----------



## Ladybj

Tom 86 said:


> I agree.  I remember all of those.  Now there are places that won't let you in to see a movie or eat without showing your vax card.   Looks like we are going the way of the USSR & China very slowly.
> 
> A friend & I was going to go eat at a nice restaurant.  At the door is a sign. " You must show vax card or not get waited on".  So we turned around & left like so many others done also. I wonder how long they will be in business?


Not long....JMO.


----------



## Ladybj

Sunny said:


> This will continue until enough people get vaccinated to give us herd immunity.
> 
> I can't imagine people are calling it a dictatorship to require proof of vaccination.  Is it also a dictatorship to require a little plastic card in your wallet saying that you are allowed to drive?  Or to require that you register to vote before going to the polls? Or to require proof of vaccination against other contagious diseases before your kid is allowed to go to school?
> 
> Somehow, this disease seems to operate in a universe of its own.


We are not asked for our drivers license when you visit stores, etc. (not unless you are under age and trying to buy alcohol, etc.,) you do not have to show your registration card to vote, you do not have to show your childhood vaccine card showing proof you got your vaccines when going shopping or going out to eat. 

They are pushing the vaccine too hard - several  vaccinated people that I know agree.. they are pushing it too hard. What's next, showing your kids birth certificates, how many calories you ate each day, etc., just trying to make sense out of non-sense.  I thank God/the Universe that I am retired.  Having a vax card or not, will not stop me from living my life. Where there is a Will, there is a Way


----------



## chic

kssf said:


> I did have the covid but a light case for a week - didn't feel that sick at all but lost my taste.  Had my blood checked 90 days later for antibodies and I didn't have any so I got both the 1st and 2nd shot of Moderna.  Was sicker with the vaccines for a day or so but now don't know what to do about a booster.  This is going to possibly continue on and on as there is so much unknown and the Communist China is not telling us the whole truth.  Very troubling what to do.  It may go like booster 1, booster 2, and booster 3 and 4 - when does it end?  I think again we have to know all the TRUTHS about this covid.  I still don't have my taste back 100% - may 80% but I used to smell very good and taste very good.  It will be a year in November.  The future is unknown to all of us for covid.  I sure wish I knew whether this covid was an accident or was deliberate.  If it was deliberate we are in big trouble I feel with China.  But no one seems to want to get to know and yet it affected the entire world - this is big - maybe pandemics are the only way to have a war?  Nuclear wont work - but pandemics?????? This is a big mystery.


Really you don't have your taste back? How long has it been? I got mine back after 4 or 5 days. Several months is too long.


----------



## CarolfromTX

I’d like to ask someone how she feels about requiring people to show a vaccine card (and of course an ID so they know it’s you) to get into a restaurant , as is being done in San Fransisco. Then I would ask her how she feels about showing a drivers license to vote.  Bet I’d get two different answers.


----------



## Jules

We have vaccine passports.  On the 24th we’ll need to be double vaxxed.  

There are no medical or religious exemptions.

Simply put, they’re necessary to enter a licensed restaurant/bar/casino, sporting or fitness facility, organized event.  People can get takeout or go to a fast food place with no table service.

We have to wear masks basically everywhere inside.  It doesn’t seem to be an issue, most people have adjusted.


----------



## Tom 86

Buckeye said:


> The coach in the article I posted has not claimed to have any medical issues that would prevent him from getting the jab.  He did apply for a religious exemption, but it was denied.  If he had any "underlying problems" he should have come forward with them to the University, but he did not.  I suspect he was counting on the University giving him a pass, because, well, coach.  He took a $3 million gamble and lost.
> 
> The number I've seen for those truly at medical risk when taking the shot is 1% or less of the population.  We are all very aware of your issues, and are certainly sympathetic.  Just keep in mind that over 404 million doses have been administered in the US and over 95% of us seniors have





hollydolly said:


> There's a great deal of places in the uk where you will not be permitted entry unless proof of double vaccination is shown ..or a Covid lateral test  Pass...


Interesting, as here to get a lateral flow test you get it in a special place or Dr's office.  It takes 5 to 8 days for that test to come back.    So the 48 hrs listed would not work.


----------



## Alizerine

CarolfromTX said:


> This is a false choice, as though if you do not get the jab, you are doomed to die, period.  You are not.  And if Shero gets the jab, Shero should be safe.  I got the jabs, so I feel safe. What anyone else does is up to them.  There may be many valid reasons not to get the vaccine.


I try to drive carefully but who cares what those maniacs do out on the road? Oh, wait a minute. Their carelessness could affect me and others.


----------



## HoneyNut

For purposes of avoiding going back to work in the office I declared to my manager that I had reverted to 'unvaccinated' status by being 65 yrs old and passing the threshold of beyond 6 months from the initial set of shots.  He told me he would support me for as long as he could.  I then got my booster (which by the way did not cause any fever or anything, I hope the booster worked, did anyone else who had a fever after the second shot not have any effects from the booster???), and it has been over a week so I hope no one at work notices I'm still working from home.  One of my coworkers sent an email to the group saying his car needed extensive repairs that would take a month so he wouldn't be able to come to the office for another month.  Another is having renovations to their basement.  It is fun to see how we are all trying so hard to avoid going back to the office.


----------



## win231

fmdog44 said:


> This is why you are not very smart. Read more than once because you understand very little the first time around. People that are vaccinated CAN STILL GET SICK from the idiots that think they have the God given right to spread the disease. The difference is they will not die and will not need intensive care like the unvaccinated morons will (and never pay for it if they survive). Funny how you nonbelievers run to hospitals for help after you catch the Covid while denying science prior. How many people with non-Covid illnesses were denied intensive care beds because of nonvaccinated fools claiming it is their right to treatments _*after*_ claiming it is their right to ignore medical science?


This is what makes you a programmed robot.


----------



## fmdog44

win231 said:


> ^^^^ Programmed Robot.
> You understand _absolutely nothing_ the first time around.
> Or the second, third & fourth.


eat a banana


----------



## chic

CarolfromTX said:


> I’d like to ask someone how she feels about requiring people to show a vaccine card (and of course an ID so they know it’s you) to get into a restaurant , as is being done in San Fransisco. Then I would ask her how she feels about showing a drivers license to vote.  Bet I’d get two different answers.


In and Out Burgers in San Francisco rejected the requirement to ask patrons for covid passports. It's a step in the right direction. I wish more businesses would stand up to this new form of govt. medical manipulation.

I went out to dinner with BF last weekend and no proof of vaxx was required. We don't have that yet except in certain big city venues and for sporting events. I hear it is coming. If asked for a vaxx passport, I must refuse and would go elsewhere. It's no biggie.


----------



## Ladybj

kssf said:


> I did have the covid but a light case for a week - didn't feel that sick at all but lost my taste.  Had my blood checked 90 days later for antibodies and I didn't have any so I got both the 1st and 2nd shot of Moderna.  Was sicker with the vaccines for a day or so but now don't know what to do about a booster.  This is going to possibly continue on and on as there is so much unknown and the Communist China is not telling us the whole truth.  Very troubling what to do.  It may go like booster 1, booster 2, and booster 3 and 4 - when does it end?  I think again we have to know all the TRUTHS about this covid.  I still don't have my taste back 100% - may 80% but I used to smell very good and taste very good.  It will be a year in November.  The future is unknown to all of us for covid.  I sure wish I knew whether this covid was an accident or was deliberate.  If it was deliberate we are in big trouble I feel with China.  But no one seems to want to get to know and yet it affected the entire world - this is big - maybe pandemics are the only way to have a war?  Nuclear wont work - but pandemics?????? This is a big mystery.


VERY WELL STATED!!!!!!


----------



## Ladybj

Alizerine said:


> I try to drive carefully but who cares what those maniacs do out on the road? Oh, wait a minute. Their carelessness could affect me and others.


No matter how Careful you drive... you could cause an accident and affect others as well.  Accidents are not all caused my maniacs - some are caused by careful drivers such as yourself.


----------



## Aneeda72

Ladybj said:


> If that is the case, that would be AWFUL!!!!!  I have a friend that got the booster - she shared with me that she regret getting it.  She got very sick - much like the flu.  She said she would not recommend it to anybody but people do what they feel is best for them.


I got very sick with the booster as well, but I recommend getting it.  Still better than getting delta Covid.


----------



## Alizerine

Ladybj said:


> No matter how Careful you drive... you could cause an accident and affect others as well.  Accidents are not all caused my maniacs - some are caused by careful drivers such as yourself.


If you are saying that someone who is vaccinated might pass on the virus I agree but it is more likely passed on by the unvaccinated.


----------



## Ladybj

Alizerine said:


> If you are saying that someone who is vaccinated might pass on the virus I agree but it is more likely passed on by the unvaccinated.


Ok... your belief is your belief and you have a right as to what you believe.


----------



## Alizerine

Ladybj said:


> Ok... your belief is your belief and you have a right as to what you believe.


Just learning from the experts.


----------



## SeaBreeze

Ladybj said:


> Ok... your belief is your belief and you have a right as to what you believe.


Not a belief, it's fact.

https://www.seniorforums.com/threads/vaccinated-people-less-likely-to-spread-covid-19-virus.65177/


----------



## Ladybj

SeaBreeze said:


> Not a belief, it's fact.
> 
> https://www.seniorforums.com/threads/vaccinated-people-less-likely-to-spread-covid-19-virus.65177/


How do you know its fact?  I do not click on links.


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## Ladybj

Alizerine said:


> Just learning from the experts.


Who are the experts?  Where do they get their info from??


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## SeaBreeze

Ladybj said:


> How do you know its fact?  I do not click on links.


Maybe that's why you're woefully misinformed.  I think you do click on links, from conspiracy sites and other questionable sources.  The link I posted is a thread from this forum.  Don't worry, you won't get infected by it.  The sky isn't falling Ladybj, you should stop having a meltdown about it.


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## Alizerine

Ladybj said:


> Who are the experts?  Where do they get their info from??


I am not your encyclopedia. Do your own research.


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## Ladybj

Aneeda72 said:


> I got very sick with the booster as well, but I recommend getting it.  Still better than getting delta Covid.


My hubby said he will pass on the booster and at one point he said he will definitely get it but changed his mind.   He is trying to get through other health issues.  As I always say, we all do what is best for us.


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## Alizerine

Alizerine said:


> I am not your encyclopedia. Do your own research.


I didn't mean to be rude.  Just thought you would trust your own investigation better than mine.


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## Ladybj

SeaBreeze said:


> Maybe that's why you're woefully misinformed.  I think you do click on links, from conspiracy sites and other questionable sources.  The link I posted is a thread from this forum.  Don't worry, you won't get infected by it.  The sky isn't falling Ladybj, you should stop having a meltdown about it.


No meltdown here - are you speaking for yourself?   I rarely click on or post links on the site.  You strongly have your opinion and I am open to things that do not make sense and make sense to me.  You are right in how you feel and I am right in how I feel.. it don't take a link or rocket science to figure that out.


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## Aneeda72

Ladybj said:


> How do you know its fact?  I do not click on links.


I rarely click on links as well cause I just am not interested enough to do so, but that’s just me


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## SeaBreeze

Ladybj said:


> No meltdown here - are you speaking for yourself?   I rarely click on or post links on the site.  You strongly have your opinion and I am open to things that do not make sense and make sense to me.  You are right in how you feel and I am right in how I feel.. it don't take a link or rocket science to figure that out.


Your opinions are just that, opinions of the uninformed.  Most people who are *not *spreading disinformation provide a link to support their opinions, which is what I do.  You are being fed false information, and as long as you choose to keep your blinders on, the longer you will remain in the dark and lack facts being provided by medical experts and scientists.


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## Ladybj

Alizerine said:


> I am not your encyclopedia. Do your own research.


And you are not my encyclopedia with the links.  I have done my research and will continue to do so.  I hear first hand from family and friends how the vaccine has effected them.  One size does not fit all.  We all do what is best for us.


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## Alizerine

Ladybj said:


> And you are not my encyclopedia with the links.  I have done my research and will continue to do so.  I hear first hand from family and friends how the vaccine has effected them.  One size does not fit all.  We all do what is best for us.


Over and out.


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## Aneeda72

SeaBreeze said:


> Your opinions are just that, opinions of the uninformed.  Most people who are not spreading disinformation provide a link to support their opinions, which is what I do.  You are being fed false information, and as long as you choose to keep your blinders on, the longer you will remain in the dark and lack facts being provided by medical experts and scientists.


Well I am no expert on anything.  But I do know, unfortunately, a few facts about Delta Covid.  The vaccinated and unvaccinated spread it.  It spreads like wildfire in the disabled population.  The sheltered workshop had to be closed because of the outbreak.  Everyone there was vaccinated. 

Even though fully vaccinated with pfizer, my son got delta and was hospitalized.  I was able to visit him in his hospital room.  No asked to see my vac card.  He was sent home from the hospital on oxygen and must remain isolated, to his room, for 21 days.  He was sent home because the hospital could do nothing else for him.

I can’t provide a link.  I supposed I am the link.  .


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## Ladybj

SeaBreeze said:


> Your opinions are just that, opinions of the uninformed.  Most people who are *not *spreading disinformation provide a link to support their opinions, which is what I do.  You are being fed false information, and as long as you choose to keep your blinders on, the longer you will remain in the dark and lack facts being provided by medical experts and scientists.


I'm in the dark????  How do you know FOR SURE you are not spreading disinformation and in the dark???  Links are just that, links.  We have no idea what is what... even doctors are confused and do not want to touch on this at all.  Why do you think they had people go to pharmacies and other places to get the vaccines?  And people had to sign a waiver if anything happen to them, they will not be liable. In the dark???  When it comes to this, I feel we all are.


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## Aneeda72

Ladybj said:


> I'm in the dark????  How do you know FOR SURE you are not spreading disinformation and in the dark???  Links are just that, links.  We have no idea what is what... even doctors are confused and do not want to touch on this at all.  Why do you think they had people go to pharmacies and other places to get the vaccines?  And people had to sign a waiver if anything happen to them, they will not be liable. In the dark???  When it comes to this, I feel we all are.


My sons Covid doctor said that there is still a lot they do not know or understand about Covid.  But they are sure of one thing, which could change of course.  The vaccinated who get Covid, do not get long covid.  At least there is that, but as soon as he is well enough, the doctor said he needs the booster.

My older son has had Covid, has had two vaccination and will get the booster.


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## Ladybj

Aneeda72 said:


> Well I am no expert on anything.  But I do know, unfortunately, a few facts about Delta Covid.  The vaccinated and unvaccinated spread it.  It spreads like wildfire in the disabled population.  The sheltered workshop had to be closed because of the outbreak.  Everyone there was vaccinated.
> 
> Even though fully vaccinated with pfizer, my son got delta and was hospitalized.  I was able to visit him in his hospital room.  No asked to see my vac card.  He was sent home from the hospital on oxygen and must remain isolated, to his room, for 21 days.  He was sent home because the hospital could do nothing else for him.
> 
> I can’t provide a link.  I supposed I am the link.  .


Sorry to hear about your son Anneda.  I pray full recovery for him.  I agree, vaccinated can spread it as well.  Sooo much info just do not make sense to me.  I am no longer trying to make sense out of non-sense...it's impossible.


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## Shero

Lord give me patience with the fools who refuse to help humanity by refusing to get the covid vaccine. Forgive them for they know not what they do. However, Lord, they are like the blind leading the blind and it would be so nice if they fall into the pit


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## SeaBreeze

Aneeda72 said:


> Well I am no expert on anything.  But I do know, unfortunately, a few facts about Delta Covid.  The vaccinated and unvaccinated spread it.  It spreads like wildfire in the disabled population.  The sheltered workshop had to be closed because of the outbreak.  Everyone there was vaccinated.
> 
> Even though fully vaccinated with pfizer, my son got delta and was hospitalized.  I was able to visit him in his hospital room.  No asked to see my vac card.  He was sent home from the hospital on oxygen and must remain isolated, to his room, for 21 days.  He was sent home because the hospital could do nothing else for him.
> 
> I can’t provide a link.  I supposed I am the link.  .


I was talking to Ladybj, Aneeda.  Like you, I'm no expert on anything, but you have much more experience with the virus than I do, mainly due to your experience with your son.  I hope he continues to hold steady in his recovery and feels better with each day.  Thinking of both of you through your difficult time.


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## Ladybj

Shero said:


> Lord give me patience with the fools who refuse to help humanity by refusing to get the covid vaccine. Forgive them for they know not what they do. However, Lord, they are like the blind leading the blind and it would be so nice if they fall into the pit


Awwww... be careful in digging a pit for someone. ..they won't be the one that fall in.   As we stated, there are those that are not able to take the vaccine due to medical reasons.


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## Shero

Ladybj said:


> Awwww... be careful in digging a pit for someone. ..they won't be the one that fall in.   As we stated, there are those that are not able to take the vaccine due to medical reasons.


*Those not being able to take the vaccine for medical reasons, has already been established and accepted.*


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## SeaBreeze

Aneeda72 said:


> My sons Covid doctor said that there is still a lot they do not know or understand about Covid.  But they are sure of one thing, which could change of course.  The vaccinated who get Covid, do not get long covid.  At least there is that, but as soon as he is well enough, the doctor said he needs the booster.
> 
> My older son has had Covid, has had two vaccination and will get the booster.


This is a _new _coronavirus, and we're all learning as we go on, including the doctors. When new variants appear, we will have to learn new information about them. So unfortunate that this has lasted so long already, I still encourage all to get vaccinated, and I will be getting my booster as soon as possible. If it helps to avoid long Covid or serious sickness and death, that is good enough for many of us.


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## SeaBreeze

Shero said:


> *Those not being able to take the vaccine for medical reasons, has already been established and accepted.*


Exactly.  No matter how many times we say that, it falls on deaf ears.


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## Ladybj

Shero said:


> *Those not being able to take the vaccine for medical reasons, has already been established and accepted.*


This is where you have NO idea.  I say this mainly because of your post.


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## Ladybj

SeaBreeze said:


> Exactly.  No matter how many times we say that, it falls on deaf ears.


It's because of the post,  Everyone do not post if they fall in the category of not being able to take the vaccine. They feel it will fall on deaf ear.  Everyone do what is best for them.


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## SeaBreeze

Ladybj said:


> As we stated, there are those that are not able to take the vaccine due to medical reasons.


Why do you keep repeating that?  Nobody here is disputing that!


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## Ladybj

SeaBreeze said:


> Why do you keep repeating that?  Nobody here is disputing that!


Because I do not think it makes a difference to those that have strong beliefs that everyone need to take the vaccine.  I stated I know several people that have had horrible side effects from the vaccine which is ignored.  Everyone has a right to their opinion and beliefs.  Again, we all do what is best for our health... that is the bottom line.


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## SeaBreeze

Ladybj said:


> Because I do not think it makes a difference to those that have strong beliefs that everyone need to take the vaccine.


Of course it makes a difference!  I'm one of those who think everyone should be vaccinated, *unless they have a valid medical reason verified by their doctor.  *Many of us here have said that over and over again! If you still think it doesn't make a difference, then that is your problem for not listening.


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## Ladybj

SeaBreeze and Shero - great conversation.  Getting ready for bed...have to get up a bit early and go to the hospital with my hubby for more test.  You guys have a great night.


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## SeaBreeze

Ladybj said:


> SeaBreeze and Shero - great conversation.  Getting ready for bed...have to get up a bit early and go to the hospital with my hubby for more test.  You guys have a great night.


Sleep well, regards to your hubby.


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## dseag2

Well said, Sunny.  I had Covid in February 2020.  It took forever to get rid of the congestion and I don't wish to have it again.  I'm not sure where people who think having Covid builds sufficient long-term antibodies get their information.  If they still sell Cracker Jacks maybe it is inside the box.

I've had both of my vax shots. And I will get a booster when I'm in the right group.  And as cold as this may sound, when I see a story about some anti-vax radio host (and there are quite a few) who has died from Covid I just throw up my hands and say "too bad".  They have access to the same information I do.  Anyone who refuses to be vaccinated absolutely has his/her freedom... to be hospitalized or die of Covid.  Enjoy the freedom.


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## win231

Alizerine said:


> If you are saying that someone who is vaccinated might pass on the virus I agree but it is more likely passed on by the unvaccinated.


^^^^ Classic example of creating your own reality based on what you want to believe.


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## dseag2

Studies have shown that vaccinated people are less likely to shed the virus but you can believe what you want to believe.  I would post facts, but you clearly aren't interested.  I am vaccinated, but I still wear a mask indoors because I am not selfish and don't want to spread it to someone with a compromised immune system.  You clearly don't care.  Good for you.


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## AnnieA

Shero said:


> Lord give me patience with the fools who refuse to help humanity by refusing to get the covid vaccine. Forgive them for they know not what they do. However, Lord, they are like the blind leading the blind and it would be so nice if they fall into the pit



Please remember that we have a longstanding member whose son died from the vaccine.  He is also a man of faith.


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## Irwin

*New River Valley mom loses battle with COVID*
“My wife would still be here if we took it seriously," said new father Eric Robinson after his unvaccinated wife lost her life to COVID-19.
https://www.5newsonline.com/article...ated/527-34279503-339d-4abd-a68f-56ca38ed30b2

There have been 100s of these types of stories throughout the year.


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