Big Band Jazz - Post 1950

JBR said:
How are you defining "big band"? My father used to maintain it had to be at least 15 musicians.
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To me, classic big bands comprise this setup:
  • 5 saxes (2 altos, 2 tenors, and bari)
  • 4 trumpets
  • 3 or 4 trombones
  • Piano
  • Bass
  • Drums
  • Guitar
But hey, somewhere in that neighborhood is also good! For example, Stan Kenton included a section of mellophones at one point and he also often had 5 trombones, one of which doubled on tuba. Sometimes there's no guitar, but Freddie Green played in the Count Basie band for 50 years. Let's just have fun with this! Lots of great music.
 
Ashley Alexander was a little-known, but well-respected music educator who formed his own "student" bands. Ashley played Superbone, slide trombone, and double-belled euphonium. This chart is a ballad named "Angelika", ideal for the euphonium as a solo voice.

 
One more chart from Ashley Alexander -- "Miscabah" (I have no idea what that means.) He opens the chart on Superbone, then plays melody with the flute. He takes the first solo on Superbone and then solos on double-belled euphonium in an incredible "statement and response" exchange with himself. He solos again on Superbone later in the chart.

The double-belled euphonium was an instrument fairly popular in the early 20th century but in no way were those musicians playing music like this. You can hear the difference in the sound between both bells.

Ashley Alexander died far too young in 1988.

The second tune in this audio "video" is "Little Girl Blue". Both charts were recorded in 1979.

 
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Eupher said:
Before the Steve Marcus era. The world's greatest drummer.
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You're right Buddy Rich was the greatest drummer of all time. Even today no one can play like he. He not only had drive, but crisp phrasing and patterns that are unique to this day. It also didn't hurt that he had a left hand and right foot from the gods. His ability with that left had has never been fully duplicated in anyone I've seen. Steve Smith was close. His West Side Story suite was one of the band's most popular.
 
ChiroDoc said:
You're right Buddy Rich was the greatest drummer of all time. Even today no one can play like he. He not only had drive, but crisp phrasing and patterns that are unique to this day. It also didn't hurt that he had a left hand and right foot from the gods. His ability with that left had has never been fully duplicated in anyone I've seen. Steve Smith was close. His West Side Story suite was one of the band's most popular.
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@ChiroDoc - actually, I was quoting Buddy himself, who did not at all lack for ego. I think for his era, he was the absolute best. But like anything else, the drummer world expanded. I would argue that Rush's Neil Pert (with his OMG battery of unbelievable kit) did more for complex rhythms than Buddy ever dreamed of. OTOH, Buddy's job was driving the entire band of 15 musicians rather than Rush's 4 or 5.

It's an argument that never has an end. For me, I have always appreciated Buddy's ability to memorize a chart and execute it almost flawlessly, night after night -- and also considering that he didn't read music. When rehearsing a new chart, he'd bring in a drummer who COULD read and then listen. Once he figured the chart out, Buddy had it mapped out.

Game over. HE drove the band, and God help the bass player that could not keep up.
 
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JBR said:
Gosh, I hope this sorta qualifies as "big band". It's good music with mixed instrumentation, anyway.
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I'd never heard of the band Manteca (other than the Dizzy Gillespie tune) until now. Very original take on Herbie Hancock's "Watermelon Man"! Sort of a Latin funky groove. I'm sure Dizzy would be very happy with this arrangement! I note this band is Toronto-based. Great stuff!
 
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Let's SWING!!!

An arrangement recorded in 2000 by Gordon Goodwin's Big Phat Band, based in LA. They're a contemporary band consisting of the creme de la creme of sidemen in LA. Album title: "Swingin' for the Fences". They're still smoking charts today.

Solos: Eddie Daniels, my favorite clarinet player; Arturo Sandoval, trumpet.

(Note: Arturo is a Cuban refugee who escaped to the U.S. back in the day -- maybe early 80s?. Notorious as an asshole in rehearsals and sometimes on stage, he could back up what he demanded from others. He seems to be much more of a colleague today in videos and recordings I've seen.)

 
Gordon's Big Phat Band again, this time in 2018. Eric Marienthal on clarinet (he's really an alto player) and Wayne Bergeron, trumpet. Any musician knows it's orders of magnitude more difficult to play outdoors, so this is a treat to see what they contend with:

 
Eupher said:
@ChiroDoc - actually, I was quoting Buddy himself, who did not at all lack for ego. I think for his era, he was the absolute best. But like anything else, the drummer world expanded. I would argue that Rush's Neil Pert (with his OMG battery of unbelievable kit) did more for complex rhythms than Buddy ever dreamed of. OTOH, Buddy's job was driving the entire band of 15 musicians rather than Rush's 4 or 5.
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Yes of course drumming did expand, just like every other instrument-- and for that matter every other endeavor-- just like it always does.

But just like arriving at a "greatest films of all time" list, the same can be done for instrumentalists. One has to take into account how the individual musician stacked up against the others from his era; his accomplishments, and so forth.

I believe a poll o the best of all time drummers, voted on by fellow drummers, Buddy would be at the top. Pert too was a great drummer. As a matter of fact he organized a competition some years back of a number of drummers who would play "West Side Story" with the same house band, to see who did best. I forget who came out on top. Some were way off the mark. But Neal himself did a great job in his sit in with the piece.
 

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